Transport Committee on April 2nd, 2019

[Kathleen Fox]

Again, I can only speak to the recommendation that we made following the OC Transpo-VIA Rail accident in 2013. We recommended that Transport Canada should enact crashworthiness standards for commercial passenger buses that would fill the gaps that we identified with respect to frontal and side impact crush and rollover protection. Transport Canada is slowly working its way through that recommendation.

But, yes, as the RCMP sergeant has indicated, the crash dynamics are very different depending on whether it's a frontal crash or a side crash, depending on the mass of the vehicles involved, depending on their speeds and so on. Really, it's up to the experts to analyze those situations and determine when it is best to require seat belts, for example.

However, we believe that, overall, the actual structure of the bus needs to be reinforced, even though it's a large vehicle and it may be larger than anything else it meets on the road.

[Churence Rogers, Liberal, Bonavista—Burin—Trinity, NL]

Thank you for that.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Are there any further questions?

[Churence Rogers, Liberal, Bonavista—Burin—Trinity, NL]

Yes, I have a quick question for Madam Superintendent on school bus issues around seat belts.

Obviously, you have talked about investigations around different incidents and so on. From a safety perspective, do you think having seat belts would add any value to school buses versus not having seat belts? Do you have any opinions on that?

[Supt Jamie Solesme]

I have no opinion, and I'm definitely not the right expert to weigh the pros and cons for both sides of the argument.

[Churence Rogers, Liberal, Bonavista—Burin—Trinity, NL]

Okay. Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

We will move to Mr. Jeneroux.

[Matt Jeneroux, Conservative, Edmonton Riverbend, AB]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I have just a quick question for you, Ms. Fox. You mentioned the crashworthiness standards submitted in 2015 and the need to expedite some of those.

What are some of the holdups now—in hopes that the committee can help to push through some of those?

[Kathleen Fox]

Well, I would say two things. First of all, that is a question for Transport Canada. It has recently provided us with an update on its action plan. We reassess our recommendations on a regular basis. We've just completed the reassessments of the five OC Transpo-VIA Rail 2015 recommendations. We haven't made them public yet. We will be doing that in the coming weeks, so there will be more details forthcoming.

What I can tell you is that the board is concerned by the slow progress on addressing crashworthiness standards. A year ago we assessed Transport Canada's responses as having a satisfactory intent, meaning a satisfactory plan. Now we're concerned that it's taking a lot of steps to try to address the issue of bus safety, but it's not moving fast enough on the issue of crashworthiness, so we have downgraded our response to satisfactory in part.

I can say that within the next few weeks we'll be able to provide more details. Right now we're going through the editing and translation process on our specific...and we will be publishing our assessments or reassessments publicly.

[Matt Jeneroux, Conservative, Edmonton Riverbend, AB]

Good.

I imagine you've raised it with the minister. We'll certainly have the opportunity to do so here at this committee, as well as with Transport Canada.

Do you have a formal response at this point in time as to when to expect some of that response?

[Kathleen Fox]

As I have indicated, the board has officially approved the reassessments, but now they just have to go through internal editing and translation. We expect to post them very soon.

Transport Canada's response to us should already be in the public domain. I believe it posts its responses. Ours will come, certainly, in a matter of weeks, our reassessment, but I have given you the bottom line.

[Matt Jeneroux, Conservative, Edmonton Riverbend, AB]

Great. Thank you.

I have a quick question for our friends in the RCMP before perhaps turning it over to my colleague, Mr. Liepert.

First of all, Sergeant Entwistle and Superintendent Solesme, thank you for your service. I'm sure you've seen certain things on the highways and the roads that none of us in this room can even fathom, so again, thank you for what you do for our country.

I have a quick question for you. Is it within the RCMP's mandate to make policy recommendations to the federal or provincial governments?

[Supt Jamie Solesme]

I think that, if there's a national issue that can't be resolved, we would engage with Transport Canada or others to try to resolve the issue, and if warranted, then move it up for policy decisions to our appropriate minister.

[Matt Jeneroux, Conservative, Edmonton Riverbend, AB]

Would it be provincial as well, or would that just be...?

[Supt Jamie Solesme]

I would say provincial, because most of the highway traffic acts that we deal with are in the provincial realm.

[Matt Jeneroux, Conservative, Edmonton Riverbend, AB]

Right. Thank you.

I guess I have a minute left for Mr. Liepert.

[Ron Liepert, Conservative, Calgary Signal Hill, AB]

I'm not quite sure how two organizations work together. Are you involved in this task force on school bus safety that the minister announced in January?

[Kathleen Fox]

The Transportation Safety Board? No, we're not involved in that.

[Ron Liepert, Conservative, Calgary Signal Hill, AB]

I'm trying to figure out where the line is between transportation and yourselves.

[Kathleen Fox]

Our mandate is to advance transportation safety by conducting investigations into occurrences in the federally regulated modes of transportation. Specifically cited in our act are air, rail, marine and pipeline. To the extent that a bus hits one of those or interacts with one of those modes, trains typically, we would conduct an investigation. We have conducted investigations, and in those cases, we made findings. In the case of the OC Transpo-VIA Rail collision, we have made specific recommendations to address bus passenger safety.

[Ron Liepert, Conservative, Calgary Signal Hill, AB]

So Humboldt is not one. You have no jurisdiction.

[Kathleen Fox]

That is correct, because it was strictly a road accident.

[Ron Liepert, Conservative, Calgary Signal Hill, AB]

Yes. I understand.

I have one quick question. I guess it always concerns me why it's left up to government to implement regulations, laws and standards. Anyone who wants to answer this, does it make sense why bus companies wouldn't on their own make this a standard policy?

[Sgt Trent Entwistle]

I can't speak to anybody's thought process when they go along with that. As an organization, we're just mandated to uphold the laws and conduct our investigations in the collisions we happen to be called to. I can't speak to anybody else.

[Ron Liepert, Conservative, Calgary Signal Hill, AB]

Are there any thoughts from the Transportation Safety Board as to why that wouldn't make sense?