Transport Committee on June 1st, 2017

[Alain Rayes, Conservative, Richmond—Arthabaska, QC]

I am referring to the public areas. Are there not other police services or security officers who also work in the areas where the SPVM patrols?

[Philippe Rainville]

The SPVM patrols on both sides. Our people are on both sides as well.

[Alain Rayes, Conservative, Richmond—Arthabaska, QC]

You might not have the figures, but for how long has there been the equivalent of six police officers on patrol? Has it been for five years, 10 years, or is it something recent?

[Philippe Rainville]

That has been the case for a long time.

Mr. Pharand, perhaps you can elaborate on the work of the SPVM and the number of officers on patrol.

[Pierre-Paul Pharand, Vice-President, Airport Operations, Infrastructure and Air Services Development, Aéroports de Montréal]

Hello everyone.

The police presence actually dates back to 1998. When Transport Canada announced a change in its security program and the devolution of certain responsibilities to airport operators, we signed agreements with local police services. When I say “we”, I am referring to ADM and other airports that are subject to the same regulations.

I would like to pick up on something that was mentioned. The six police officers who are on contract at the Montréal-Trudeau airport are not the only law enforcement officers present. They are the officers we hired on contract to perform certain specific tasks. The Montreal police is still responsible, however, for crimes committed at the airport. During their shift, officers from the local police station also come to patrol the public areas of the airport, because that is their normal patrol area.

If something happens, the SPVM is of course the first to respond and has primary responsibility. Officers of the RCMP, the Sûreté du Québec, the CBSA, and private security officers—it is not just ADM that has security personnel—are all part of a plan and have a role to play. So you should not just think of six officers as to the protection measures in place.

[Alain Rayes, Conservative, Richmond—Arthabaska, QC]

That's perfect.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Thank you very much.

We move on to Mr. Iacono.

[Angelo Iacono, Liberal, Alfred-Pellan, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I would like to thank the witnesses for being with us this morning.

Thanks also to the clerk for inviting these witnesses again. I am a bit surprised, and even a bit disappointed, that Mr. Berthold was not able to be here today, since he was so adamant about inviting these witnesses. It is unfortunate.

My questions are for either one of you; it is up to you.

As to the incidents reported in the media about employees whose access to the restricted areas was revoked, is that not proof that the system in place is working very well?

[Philippe Rainville]

Quite right. From our point of view, if this did not happen, we could certainly wonder.

You have to remember that ADM is just the operator. We are accordingly notified that the passes had to be taken away from those people. We are informed directly by Transport Canada and we can carry out those orders. So that is proof that there is monitoring.

It is not because we reported something. It comes to us from the intelligence service.

To our minds, this really proves that the system is working.

[Angelo Iacono, Liberal, Alfred-Pellan, QC]

Mr. Pharand, do you have anything to add?

[Pierre-Paul Pharand]

No, not really.

The system does indeed work because the coordination among the agencies works. You have to remember that there are a lot of stakeholders in aviation. There would be reason to question this coordination if there were no such incidents to prove that the stakeholders talk to each other and coordinate their efforts.

[Angelo Iacono, Liberal, Alfred-Pellan, QC]

Very well.

In the media reports about the incident in Montreal, the spokesperson for your airport said he did know the identity of the employees whose access had been revoked.

How can it be that the airport itself does not know the identity of the persons who can access restricted areas? Who has that information? Is it well enough communicated to ensure that no one can inadvertently access those areas?

[Philippe Rainville]

I need to explain what we're talking about.

Without our knowledge, all of a sudden, we're notified that there is a pass holder whose licence we need to revoke. When we say that we don't know, it's because we didn't know in advance that we had to revoke this person's licence. Obviously, we know who it is as soon as we receive the order to go and get the licence from the person concerned. It's not as if all this was done behind our backs. We're the operator; it's up to us to revoke the pass.

It could be an employee of one of our subcontractors, for example. Obviously, we don't know all of them. Not all of them are ADM employees. In this case, we don't know them personally. However, since we administer the passes, certainly, the moment we're notified, we'll collect the pass.

I think Mr. Pharand answered the question about employee identities.

Mr. Pharand, I think I explained what you meant when you said that we didn't know those employees. Have I?

[Pierre-Paul Pharand]

Absolutely. If we aren't the ones to report it, we don't know when an investigation is launched.

Basically, we're at the end of the chain. At first, there's someone who makes a disclosure. Then there's an investigation and risk assessment process. Transport Canada then processes the information and, if there is any action to take, we are informed of the person's identity. That's when we revoke the pass.

[Angelo Iacono, Liberal, Alfred-Pellan, QC]

Improvements can always be made when it comes to safety. What priority aspects of airport safety do you think should be focused on? Do you have any specific recommendations for the committee?

[Philippe Rainville]

I think we are satisfied with the level of security in place because of the risk management practised and the committees that Mr. Pharand oversees at Aéroports de Montréal.

There may be improvements that could be made to some processes, but I think that has already been brought to the committee's attention. For instance, the waiting period for file assessment, when people apply for temporary passes, varies from three to five months, depending on the case. We feel that period is a little long.

Some previous speakers have made some statements about this, and we recognize the facts. When they said that some airports had added a security measure for temporary passes, they were actually talking about us. Aéroports de Montréal added a criminal background check of people before a temporary pass was issued, because we thought it was a bit too long. I think it was discussed in committee.

So, the efficiency of the process for issuing temporary permits stemming from an application could be improved.

[Angelo Iacono, Liberal, Alfred-Pellan, QC]

Perfect. Thank you.

During one of our meetings, your colleagues from the Canadian Airports Council mentioned that the improved program conferred more credibility on Canada with its international partners.

Could you explain what the difference is between the improved program and the former one? What aspects give us international credibility?

[Philippe Rainville]

I'm not sure.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Make it as a short response to that difficult question, sir.

[Philippe Rainville]

As for the improved program, I imagine that we may be talking here about non-passenger screening. This was an ICAO recommendation that Transport Canada began implementing in 2016. We have just completed this implementation. There is now much tighter control of non-passengers. This is clearly an improvement, but at a really high cost. We are still talking to CATSA about who should pay the bill. However, the security measures have basically been considerably strengthened because, obviously, all the employees—

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Thank you very much, Mr. Rainville.

Monsieur Aubin.

[Robert Aubin, NDP, Trois-Rivières, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I'd like to welcome the two ADM representatives.

I would like to mention that it really was the unanimous desire of the members of this committee to receive them as part of this study. So I thank them for being with us. The absence of one of the committee's permanent members in no way changes our desire to want to hear from them.

Mr. Rainville, in your opening remarks, you mentioned $50 million for the construction of four screening points. Are these four screening points in addition to others, or are they screening points you've modernized? Were there fewer, too few or none before?

[Philippe Rainville]

There were screening points, but they were markedly strengthened. We are now doing much more systematic and meticulous searches.

Mr. Pharand, I'll let you explain about the non-passengers.

[Robert Aubin, NDP, Trois-Rivières, QC]

In fact, I have another question for you that may guide your answer. It was my next question.

When airport employees go through one of the screening points to a secure area, do you systematically search or check each pass, or is the search random, like a person presses a button for instance and, if the light turns green, they are exempt from the check and, if it turns red, they have to stop? How does it work?

[Pierre-Paul Pharand]

The non-passenger screening program was established in 2014. The process was implemented slowly starting in 2014. Today, regulations require that employees have their identities validated and then undergo a random search. That's the case for permanent pass holders. People waiting for a pass or with a temporary pass systematically have their identities validated and undergo a full search.