Yes.
Evidence of meeting #30 for Veterans Affairs in the 40th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was care.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Evidence of meeting #30 for Veterans Affairs in the 40th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was care.
A recording is available from Parliament.
9:45 a.m.
Service Bureau Director, Dominion Command, Royal Canadian Legion
I think we have to take some measures now. For example, on giving away priority access beds in long-term care facilities because of normal attrition, if we don't look at that and say that in the coming years we will still need a basic minimum of beds in these facilities, those beds won't be there. There is action that has to be taken now to guarantee that access later on. Even if those beds are not filled right now, that's not a problem; if we have reserved those beds for future use, then at least we have put a marker on the system.
9:50 a.m.
Conservative
Greg Kerr Conservative West Nova, NS
Also, because Ste. Anne's is being reviewed, it's very timely that this be up front.
9:50 a.m.
Service Bureau Director, Dominion Command, Royal Canadian Legion
Our point of view is that all those beds should be reserved.
9:50 a.m.
Conservative
Greg Kerr Conservative West Nova, NS
Reserved--I see.
I'll end on this point for now. It's the eligibility chart, which I don't understand. I'm only a layman. I don't understand the process. If you do, you can help me out here.
9:50 a.m.
Service Bureau Director, Dominion Command, Royal Canadian Legion
No, I don't.
9:50 a.m.
Conservative
Greg Kerr Conservative West Nova, NS
You've talked about simplification or making it a simpler process, but could you elaborate on that a bit? I look at that as a real challenge that causes a lot of trouble.
9:50 a.m.
Service Bureau Director, Dominion Command, Royal Canadian Legion
I think the basic solution is embedded in some of the things I've said here. We're looking at 18 different criteria that are further amplified or whatever.
Reduce it to four, okay? Make it simple. That was part of what the department was thinking of back in 2002, 2003, and 2004. That was the logic behind the “Keeping the Promise” report submitted by the Gerontological Advisory Council, which included, in negotiations with the department, providing access to long-term care for modern veterans and improving their funeral and burial benefits.
If we had somehow responded more positively to the “Keeping the Promise” report, I think we would have taken care of this grid. We would have simplified it and we would have provided greater services, which all in all over the life course of the individual probably would have delayed their institutionalization and would have given greater access to VIP, etc., on a needs-based approach. That report was a tremendous report.
By the way, because the government didn't do anything about the report, the Royal Canadian Legion retracted their membership in that august group. Basically, we were offended that the report was not receiving any follow-up.
9:50 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative David Sweet
Thank you, Mr. Kerr and Mr. Allard.
That concludes our first round of seven-minute questions. We're now going to the second round with the Liberal Party.
We have Madam Sgro for five minutes.
9:50 a.m.
Liberal
Judy Sgro Liberal York West, ON
Thank you very much.
It's great to see you again. We very much appreciate your frankness and honesty when it comes to some of the issues that our veterans clearly are facing, issues that we want to improve on.
I want to ask you first about the issue of access, whether it's to Ste. Anne's or the Pavilion in Nova Scotia and so on. At the moment, access is restricted to veterans of World War I, World War II, and the Korean War. I can't help but wonder about when that decision was made, as it was not recognizing the combat situations that many of soldiers are in today.
Don't you think we should have access for many of these soldiers coming from Afghanistan who require it today? There's a case in Nova Scotia, I think, of an individual who is in a mental health institute and wants access to the Pavilion, as they call it. Why was that decision made that way?
9:50 a.m.
Service Bureau Director, Dominion Command, Royal Canadian Legion
Like I said, we have been arguing that at least the modern veterans who have served in special duty areas or special duty operations like Afghanistan, or those who have been medically released, should have access to long-term care. There are some right now who need that access and are not eligible.
In addition, in a number of the facilities that Veterans Affairs Canada calls their primary or large contract facilities, there are special wards paid for by Veterans Affairs in order to take care of high-needs veterans, such as people with dementia or whatever. They have provided money for these wards, yet if we don't preserve some form of access for the future, they will lose that investment. That has to be looked at as a priority.
You're quite right when you say that today there are some people who have suffered traumatic brain injury, etc., and who need access to these specialized care wards. Veterans Affairs should do it not on a one-on-one basis, but on a program approach. It's not sufficient to tell you that we're looking after this veteran because he has this special need. We should be looking after all veterans who have this special need, so we should embed it in a program.
9:50 a.m.
Liberal
Judy Sgro Liberal York West, ON
Number one, there is the VIP issue and the issue of widows or widowers. You didn't say a lot about that issue. Certainly this summer when I was doing some travelling and meeting people in the Legions and so on, I heard a lot about the frustration of widows in applying for benefits, about difficulty in obtaining them, and I also heard about the frustration with case management and all of those things you've mentioned today.
What are your comments specifically when it comes to widows applying for support, not only for the VIP, but in regard to the whole issue of them applying for a pension?
9:55 a.m.
Service Bureau Director, Dominion Command, Royal Canadian Legion
I think Mr. Stoffer is probably an expert on that. He has pointed out some fallacies that we are painfully aware of. Again, we see a program that was designed with the best of intentions to provide pre-1981 widows with access to VIP benefits. That's number one. We probably exaggerated the financial demand for this program. We can see that by the uptake.
Number two, Veterans Affairs Canada ensured that the criteria for accessing VIP for pre-1981 widows are relatively stringent. Having said that, I will note that these pre-1981 widows whose husbands did not have VIP benefits can actually access the housekeeping and groundskeeping programs. As for the post-1981 widows whose husbands may have thought they would only take groundskeeping because their spouses could look after housekeeping and could continue to do that--they didn't ask for the housekeeping because they thought their spouses were doing a good job--those widows cannot access the housekeeping.
It doesn't make sense. We basically have two classes of widows. By the way, I'm not covering the fact that frail veterans who also are on their own still don't have access to VIP. Their only gateway to VIP is to prove that they have a disability.
The minister has actually said that in a number of councils, either in Parliament or in the Senate, and he has recognized himself it doesn't make sense that to get VIP a person should apply for a disability for hearing loss. It simply doesn't make sense.
9:55 a.m.
Liberal
Judy Sgro Liberal York West, ON
I think there's a variety of things that don't make sense. That's exactly the exercise we're going through right now.
9:55 a.m.
Liberal
Judy Sgro Liberal York West, ON
Thank you very much. I appreciate your comments and I look forward to another round.
9:55 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative David Sweet
We'll go back to the Conservative Party for five minutes.
Mr. Lobb.
9:55 a.m.
Conservative
Ben Lobb Conservative Huron—Bruce, ON
Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, gentlemen, for taking the time to come in today. I'd like to report back to you that the Legion branches in Huron and Bruce counties in Ontario are doing a fine job. I was in Exeter on Sunday and have a number of different events lined up in the next couple of weeks. They do great work and a great job, so I'm passing that information back to you folks.
Again, I'm relatively new to the committee and have been here for under a year. Out of curiosity, what is the Royal Canadian Legion's relationship with Veterans Affairs like? How is the dialogue done? Is it on a monthly basis or a daily basis? Can you give me an idea of how that works?
9:55 a.m.
Dominion President, Royal Canadian Legion
I'm not going to say that we're sitting in the same bed, but I can certainly say that the cooperation we've had with the present minister has been very good in my tenature as Dominion president. We even deal day to day, rather than week to week or month to month.
As occasions or discussions arise--I shouldn't say problems--that affect veterans in any way, we are assured of getting directly to our service bureau to make sure they double-check with the government in regard to what the situation is and to clarify it so that there's no misunderstanding. I guess the media will grab onto an awful lot of items that are related to veterans, and we have to ensure that if we're going to comment in any way, we have the proper information prior to supporting or rejecting something.
October 29th, 2009 / 10 a.m.
Service Bureau Director, Dominion Command, Royal Canadian Legion
I will just add that because we have a service delivery arm, a service bureau that represents veterans at all levels of the disability process, we're very well informed on policies and business processes, which helps our advocacy.
We have a good relationship. If I were allowed to say it, I think that within the department a lot of the staff, and even the leadership level, realize that there are gaps in the new veterans charter. I suspect the minister realizes that. What we have to do is find a way ahead to solve those gaps.
10 a.m.
Conservative
Ben Lobb Conservative Huron—Bruce, ON
That makes sense. In my own domestic responsibilities, my wife reminds me of my gaps quite often. I can appreciate that, for sure.
There's another question I have for you. This must be truly a daunting task. Just in my riding alone there are over 10 Legion branches and just under 300 veterans. How do you get consensus? From coast to coast, how do you understand or how do you know what's good and what's bad under Veterans Affairs? It must be a huge responsibility. How do you get to that point?
10 a.m.
Dominion President, Royal Canadian Legion
I guess our biggest thing in regard to contacting each branch is our form of communication. One of our biggest assets is our Legion Magazine, which contains, as many of you are aware, a lot of information on what's being transacted between the veterans and the benefits people and so on.
At the present time, our new secretary-treasurer is putting out a monthly newsletter that I'm sure will be quite informative for any of the members here who are dealing with veterans themselves. It's a summarized version of what we have transacted in the Royal Canadian Legion on a monthly basis. I think that certainly would be made available to you if you so wish.
10 a.m.
Conservative
Ben Lobb Conservative Huron—Bruce, ON
I have one final quick question to do with long-term care. On page 4, in the second paragraph, you say:
The longer one delays transition into LTC, the bigger the needs will be. In some cases, institutionalization is the only choice.
In some ways, I see where you're coming from there, but I'm pretty sure that in the Province of Ontario, they're committed to keeping seniors--if I can generalize seniors--in their homes as long as possible to ease the burden on our retirement facilities. Is that generally the way you see this? Let's just use the VIP. Is that generally the way you see it or am I reading backwards here?