Evidence of meeting #20 for Veterans Affairs in the 40th Parliament, 3rd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was medal.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Acting Manager, Collections, Canadian War Museum
The museum experts are allowed to appraise an item of $1,000 or less. If it seems to be above $1,000, we must have an outside appraiser review it.
Liberal
Rob Oliphant Liberal Don Valley West, ON
Could we get for the committee some kind of outline for a year of that? Donations are not free to the public, because if we give a tax receipt, there is a loss of general revenue. There is a cost to taking a donation. I think it would be helpful for us to see what that market is. The appraisers are giving a market value, I guess, but there isn't a true market, so it's hard to know.
I think that would be a helpful written submission. I don't know whether that would come from you or from the heritage department.
Director General, Canadian War Museum
I would imagine, Mr. Oliphant, it would come from both parties. To be a little more precise, the museum is able to use a charitable tax regime to issue tax receipts.
Director General, Canadian War Museum
The other process, though, is that if objects are certified as cultural property, a tax certificate is issued by the Department of Canadian Heritage.
Liberal
Rob Oliphant Liberal Don Valley West, ON
So there are two possibilities. You get a better tax break if it's actually deemed heritage than you do if it's a charitable donation.
Director General, Canadian War Museum
Yes. There are two different processes and different criteria are involved.
Liberal
Rob Oliphant Liberal Don Valley West, ON
This is sort of a value judgment, but do you think this bill is a disincentive for people to donate to museums...if they think they can get paid?
Director General, Canadian War Museum
Again, it's difficult for me to comment on that for a number of reasons. One is that we simply can't predict what a market might look like. There doesn't appear to be a disincentive now. There are already incentives for people to either donate or sell objects that many donors and collectors and people active in the field are well aware of.
I think there will still be a sizable number of Canadians and others who will wish to make donations to museums, because they understand the importance of these objects.
Director General, Canadian War Museum
We don't.
Museums are very careful to make potential donors aware that there can't be strings attached to a donation. In other words, they can't say, “We will give you this object but you must do the following with it and you must exhibit it in a certain way”.
Generally speaking, we don't turn down a donation as long as we can determine a fit to our military heritage mandate. We don't ever turn down any Canadian medals, frankly.
Conservative
Conservative
Brian Storseth Conservative Westlock—St. Paul, AB
Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman.
Thank you, gentlemen, for coming here today. All of you do excellent work.
In regard to Mr. Stoffer's comments, I don't think any of us really have any problem with the principle of what he's saying, but in reality, medals are being sold today, are they not?
Conservative
Brian Storseth Conservative Westlock—St. Paul, AB
If the Government of Canada decided to put legislation in place that said it would be illegal to sell medals, any kind of Canadian war medal, do you believe they would stop being sold?
Director General, Canadian War Museum
I don't know. I really can't comment on that. There's always a market for these kinds of medals.
National President, Canadian Association of Veterans in United Nations Peacekeeping
No, it would not stop them from being sold.
Conservative
Brian Storseth Conservative Westlock—St. Paul, AB
In talking to the sponsor of the bill and in listening to him, it is my understanding that medals 50 years and older have some protections that medals younger than 50 years don't have. Is that correct?
Conservative
Brian Storseth Conservative Westlock—St. Paul, AB
In doing my research for this, I came across some of the Victoria Cross recipients, such as Captain John Foote, Sergeant Aubrey Cosens, and Private Ernest Smith, and some of their tremendous stories and the bravery they displayed on behalf of our country and the principles we espouse. As you said, we have legislation to protect those medals.
In your opinion, do people such as Private Robert Costall, Francisco Gomez, and you, Mr. Griffis, who have displayed gallantry in action in Afghanistan or Cyprus or in other parts of the world, not deserve to have their medals receive the same protection as medals 50 years and older?
Director General, Canadian War Museum
I'm careful to comment on that, Mr. Storseth...
I guess I'll answer the question by saying to you that if those medals were made available to the Canadian War Museum, we would be greatly pleased to have them. They would be acquired into the national collection of the country.
We have exhibits now in the museum, as you may be aware, that focus on much more recent military operations. For example--this is perhaps not as recent--we've recently modified an exhibit on Cyprus.
So we would gladly collect those medals. They would be preserved and presented in the museum in very creative ways.
National President, Canadian Association of Veterans in United Nations Peacekeeping
I think there's an historic value to them and then there's a personal value to them, and I think that has to be weighed very carefully.
Let me give you the example of the gentleman I was speaking to before, Colonel Ethell. He's Canada's most decorated peacekeeping veteran. What will happen with those medals, at the end of the day? Once again, it's a personal thing.
Interestingly enough, one of Colonel Ethell's sons—I believe it's his oldest son—lives in California. Once again, if they're left...if you get my drift, they're out of the country. Yet they are of significance in that he's Canada's most decorated peacekeeping veteran.
Conservative
Brian Storseth Conservative Westlock—St. Paul, AB
I actually had the pleasure of doing an event with Colonel Ethell, the new Lieutenant Governor of Alberta, this weekend at our military base there.
