Thank you, Madam Chair and members of the committee.
It's a great pleasure to appear in front of the committee once again. On behalf of the dominion president of the Royal Canadian Legion, Comrade Patricia Varga, we offer our support to your continuing advocacy on behalf of all the veterans of all ages and their families.
You have a copy of our presentation in French and English. We will answer your questions in either language.
At this point in time the Legion is not in a position to support Bill C-473, or Bill C-208 for that matter. However, the Legion does recognize and support the need and particularly the desire to retain historically and culturally significant military orders, decorations, and medals within Canada. This is a noble but perhaps unachievable objective.
The two main reasons for not supporting the bill are as follows. First, it will not be effective. In order for legislation such as this to work, the barn door has to be fully closed. There are too many loopholes that can be opened up and too many medals can slip out. How do you account for them all? This bill leaves it partially open, so significant orders, decorations, and medals will be able to leave Canada. If enacted, Bill C-473 would likely drive the sale of significant medals underground and all visibility of transactions would be lost. These medals are bought and sold every day in large quantities and in international markets. All you have to do to really verify it is check on eBay, where basically the run-of-the mill medals, and not the high-end items, can be found at any point in time.
Enacting Bill C-473 would infringe on the rights of Canadians to own and dispose of their own private property as they see fit. This is a right that should not be trampled upon lightly. This right is already restricted to a degree by the Cultural Property Export and Import Act. If it is not sufficient to retain historically and culturally significant medals within Canada, then that specific act needs to be amended. We do not feel that additional overlapping legislation such as this is required.
There are a number of other problems with Bill C-473 that have been identified previously but have somehow not been addressed in the present version of this private member's bill. Some of these, in no particular order of importance, are as follows.
One is terminology. In common parlance, only orders have insignia. Decorations such as the Victoria Cross and medals are simply referred to as medals. We should be discussing orders, decorations, and medals, ODM.
Another problem is responsiveness to the feedback. In December 2009 we received confirmation that amendments would be made to the bill in response to the comments that we in the Legion made and forwarded. This included the definition of “near relatives”, the transfer of medals outside of Canada, the expansion of the list of museums and organizations that these medals could be offered to, and the addition of a maximum amount of any penalty imposed. It does not appear that any of these recommendations have been followed up on in the present bill.
We're also concerned about acceptable museums. Only the Canadian War Museum, the Canadian Museum of Civilization, and the Department of Canadian Heritage are deemed acceptable recipients for these types of medals. This overlooks a large number of provincial, regional, and local museums, as well as military museums and commands and branches of the Royal Canadian Legion. Other museums or veterans organizations that might have museums, such as ANAVETS, might be interested in acquiring these types of medals, by purchase or otherwise.
Funding is another issue. Most, if not all, museums have very limited acquisition budgets. To be effective, this bill would need to ensure that there is a well-funded national acquisition budget policy. Otherwise, these medals offered for sale might well leave Canada because there are no funds to purchase them.
And then there's the obligation to acquire. Most, if not all, museums have limited storage and display space. Just because an offered medal may be historically or culturally significant, a museum should not be obligated to purchase it if it does not fit into its collection mandate.
Finally, there's the market for the current orders, decorations, and medals. There is a perception that modern medals do not have much value and therefore perhaps would not be affected by legislation such as this. This is incorrect. Should they come onto the open market, modern medal groups, especially those with gallantry awards from Afghanistan, would command high prices.
Examples of the new British Conspicuous Gallantry Cross, which was introduced in 1993, have been sold at auction with a suggested value of £6,000 to £8,000, or $9,500 or $12,700 Canadian funds. Similar Canadian medal groups containing new gallantry awards could be expected to command very similar prices. Modern groups should be included in any legislation.
There was an observation in the ACVA minutes of June 17 that the Cultural Property Export and Import Act only applied to items that were over 50 years old, and therefore would not be included in this legislation. If this is correct, then the act should be amended to include them as well.
In summary, at this juncture, unless the above issues can be resolved, the Royal Canadian Legion cannot support or offer its support to Bill C-473. We recommend instead that the Cultural Property Export and Import Act be amended to achieve these objectives in the proposed legislation in a less confusing and restrictive manner.
For your information as well, we have gone out to other veterans organizations. I would offer that the views expressed above by the Royal Canadian Legion are also shared by the Army, Navy and Air Force Veterans in Canada Association; the Canadian Naval Air Group; the Royal Canadian Naval Association; the Naval Officers' Association of Canada; the Hong Kong Veterans Commemorative Association; the Royal Canadian Mounted Police Veterans' Association; the National Aboriginal Veterans Association; the Canadian Association of Veterans in United Nations Peacekeeping; and finally, the Gulf War Veterans Association.
That concludes our presentation today. We would be more than glad to accept your questions.
