Veterans Affairs Committee on June 14th, 2018

[Victor Sanderson]

I believe so, because we're in a day and age full of electronics, and my people are learning more about the world than I did. When I first joined up, I was naive about the world. We had only two channels, and they weren't of much interest to me. All I wanted to do was get outside and be a part of something bigger, and I did. When I came back, I was full of false hope. There was no veterans' transition. There was nothing in place for anybody when they got out. Offices finally opened up, after we lost 160, 164 men and women to suicide—men and women who had served this country.

The new Veterans Charter has a lot of holes in it that do not benefit the veterans. The old charter had a lot going for it, but the Liberal government back in the nineties decided to change it with the new Veterans Charter. Then when the Liberals left, the Conservatives moved in and implemented it. They pushed it forward while we were at war.

Now the war is over, and these men are damaged and broken, just like me. It took me 20-plus years to start talking again. The reason I did was that Veterans Affairs was harassing me and attacking me and my family. I had one front-line worker attack my wife, saying that they were going to cut off services because they couldn't contact me. Where is the professionalism in that?

[Gord Johns, NDP, Courtenay—Alberni, BC]

I really appreciate your testimony, Mr. Sanderson. It's very powerful, and I'm glad you're talking. I'm glad you're here right now sharing your thoughts with us.

There's one thing I've been wondering about, and maybe I'll go to both panels on this. In the United States, 30% of caseworkers are former veterans. They have veterans who understand veterans' issues working with veterans. Would something like that help veterans in Canada, if we could get to that threshold? Also, would you see a benefit if there were indigenous veterans who could be caseworkers or work for VAC and would understand the culturally appropriate supports that you need?

[Victor Sanderson]

Oh, yes, definitely.

[Gord Johns, NDP, Courtenay—Alberni, BC]

Great. Excellent.

What about you, Ms. Smith or Ms. Davoren?

[Lissa Smith]

Yes, absolutely. That would be a huge benefit for cultural purposes and for mental health. I was thinking about the health authorities throughout the province of B.C. and how they're all working on their cultural safety plans and their aboriginal health plans and things like that, so it definitely needs to be addressed in an aboriginal context.

[Gord Johns, NDP, Courtenay—Alberni, BC]

Mr. Sanderson, did you want to add to that?

[Victor Sanderson]

No. It's straightforward.

[Gord Johns, NDP, Courtenay—Alberni, BC]

Okay.

You talked about getting resources for things that you need—outreach, regional meetings. Is there anything that you would prioritize, Ms. Davoren and Ms. Smith?

[Tanya Davoren]

Travel is definitely one. Our regions are large. Just as Ontario's a large province, B.C.'s a very large province as well, and there are a lot of remote areas. Travel is a huge component in reaching out to our veterans and getting into those smaller communities.

[Gord Johns, NDP, Courtenay—Alberni, BC]

Yes, Mr. Sanderson identified that too. Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Neil Ellis]

Thank you. Mr. Bratina is next.

[Bob Bratina, Liberal, Hamilton East—Stoney Creek, ON]

Thank you very much.

Mr. Sanderson, I'm concerned by your testimony, and we're listening intently, believe me.

I don't know if you remember the name “Ron Lancaster”. He was a quarterback for the Rough Riders, and he was the manager of the Tiger-Cats. We had many conversations. One of the things he said about the young players coming in was that they should start thinking about their futures right away.

Do you see any benefit for young recruits having some sort of consultation opportunity throughout their careers and as they approach...? Everybody's going to be a veteran at some point. Were you completely out of the loop in terms of what the next step would be when you were doing your service? Would there be some help in a discussion with somebody who would say, “You have to look at this, and you have to look at that”?

[Victor Sanderson]

My time in was supposed to be 30 years. I wanted to be a lifer. That was my calling. That's what I wanted. That's why I fell down and felt disgusted and humiliated and hurt, because I lost my career.

What was the question again?

[Bob Bratina, Liberal, Hamilton East—Stoney Creek, ON]

With young recruits, they don't get any advice on the next step after service.

[Victor Sanderson]

When I was a sapper private when I first got in, the older guys always talked about the end of life. That's pretty much what they talked about, their career. They suggested to us to start thinking about what we should be doing early on, and what they didn't do.

[Bob Bratina, Liberal, Hamilton East—Stoney Creek, ON]

Right.

[Victor Sanderson]

It was always a lesson learned from the older to the younger guys in the combat engineer trade. Like I said, we're family. We're a breed apart from other combat arms trades or other trade groups in the Canadian Armed Forces. They always tried their best to do things for us, to keep our eyes open and see the big picture.

[Bob Bratina, Liberal, Hamilton East—Stoney Creek, ON]

Right.

[Victor Sanderson]

When we had someone who didn't look out for himself, we understood and we left them alone.

[Bob Bratina, Liberal, Hamilton East—Stoney Creek, ON]

Tanya, in your career, it must have been interesting sometimes for you to appear out of your Cougar. Would somebody look at you and say, what are you doing here?

[Tanya Davoren]

That's correct.

Certainly playing with the boys, so to speak.... I served from 1990 to 1997. When I was pregnant with my first child, I decided, “Well, this was a lot of fun, but I'm done.”

I want to bring up something. Our earlier witness, Randi, mentioned toiletries out in the field. I ended up being diagnosed in 1995 with toxic shock syndrome because there was no opportunity in the middle of Wainwright, Alberta, to take care of what I needed to take care of at the time. It is a very real concern for serving females, for sure.

I thoroughly enjoyed my time. It was camaraderie. It is family, I agree. I was a reservist, but not fully in, doing my nursing at the same time. If I'd been intelligent, I would have done it through the army, but instead I chose a student loan.

I definitely enjoyed my time. It was different being a female amongst mainly men, especially because I was not in an administration or medical unit; I was in an armoured unit.

[The Chair, Liberal, Neil Ellis]

Mr. Eyolfson is next.

[Doug Eyolfson, Liberal, Charleswood—St. James—Assiniboia—Headingley, MB]

First of all, I thank all of you for your testimony.

Mr. Sanderson, I have a question for you. Obviously, what you're describing is very difficult. I know I would certainly have a difficult time relating the things that you're telling us.

Can we be of any help to you personally right now? Is there anything we can do for you that would help you?

[Victor Sanderson]

In what way?

[Doug Eyolfson, Liberal, Charleswood—St. James—Assiniboia—Headingley, MB]

That's what I'm asking you. Do you feel you need help right now?