Veterans Affairs Committee on Nov. 20th, 2018

[Faith McIntyre]

We can send you the web link, yes.

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

The second question is very important.

Our government has worked on a national housing strategy. Is there a connection between the national housing strategy of our government and the work you're doing on homelessness?

If so, please share a few quick points.

[Faith McIntyre]

Yes, there is definitely a connection. We work very closely with our colleagues at Canada Mortgage and Housing Corporation, as well as Employment and Social Development Canada, to ensure that veterans are looked at as a particular population in developing the strategy, both for homelessness on the ESDC side and housing on the CMHC side. The answer is yes.

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

Thank you. I really appreciate that answer.

The third question, quickly, concerns the transition. Is the service card going to help in the transition and tracking, and to what extent? Answer quickly, please.

[Faith McIntyre]

Yes. The service card was recently announced. It's there as an identity and recognition, to provide individuals, when they're released from the Canadian Armed Forces, an ability to show a card, to give them an ownership and an identity post-release, which is one of the challenges in transition that we've heard from many veterans. They no longer feel that attachment and that identification to the military. The card will help them do that.

In terms of data and tracking, there is more to come as the card moves forward.

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

Thank you. I've heard that as well with my veterans.

My final question is a very important one as well. What we say in French is par et pour, which means the people who are in that situation should govern that situation. How are we involving veterans to help veterans? They are the ones who can best help and they are the ones who have that trust.

Please elaborate.

[Faith McIntyre]

You're certainly bang on.

Many of the organizations, like Veterans Helping Veterans, Soldiers Helping Soldiers, VETS Canada and the Legion, are all made up of individuals who have served, who are veterans. They are the peer support, which is key to being able to find, assist and do the outreach. It's critical.

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

Of all the ones that you've identified on that map across the country, would you say that most of them have veterans in those organizations?

[Faith McIntyre]

Yes, in some capacity.

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

Could we identify how many have them and how many do not?

[Faith McIntyre]

We can certainly take a look at that.

I think that by their titles themselves it's quite self-evident when you look at the organizations, but that is something we can certainly follow up on.

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

I believe that they would more than willingly join to help because they are the ones who are in the field and who are—

Do I have more time?

[The Chair, Liberal, Neil Ellis]

You have one minute.

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

I have one minute, wow. You're doing quite well in answering the questions.

Back in 2014, we said there were approximately 2,250 individual homeless veterans. What is the estimate of Veterans Affairs today, and has that number increased or decreased?

[Faith McIntyre]

Again, counting homeless individuals across the country is not easy to do. Homeless veterans are even more challenging because many of them don't even want to self-identify as veterans. A lot of times it depends on who asks the question and how they ask the question.

The most recent statistic we have comes from the point-in-time counts, where it's a particular point in time at a homeless shelter, counting how many of those individuals were homeless veterans, and it was 5% of the total point-in-time count across various geographical cities.

The statistic that you're mentioning was a study done by Employment and Social Development Canada, which was a sampling of information. Back then, we looked at the magnitude—

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

They were only at three-point-something per cent.

For a final question, homeless female veterans—

[The Chair, Liberal, Neil Ellis]

Sorry, you're out of time.

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

Is there an increase in female veteran homelessness?

You might have an opportunity later.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Neil Ellis]

Ms. Ludwig, you have six minutes.

[Karen Ludwig, New Brunswick Southwest, Lib.]

Thank you.

Thank you, both, for your very informative testimonies.

You spoke, Faith, about vet to vet. I know when I was doing some work in the Fredericton area, they were not going to disclose anything about themselves, even whether they were a vet, to someone who was not a vet.

Certainly, the characteristics and some of the challenges that they face are unique to their community.

When we look at affordable housing for veterans, is there a model that's a little different from a different community of people in need?

[Faith McIntyre]

Yes.

I think veterans helping veterans is an important theme.

My colleague spoke about building trust and how Veterans Affairs Canada has to be patient. We have to be persistent, and we have to build that trust.

I've heard many anecdotes from veterans who, because they've served together, can make a connection, and that trust is automatic. By having that door opened by their peers, we can come aboard, work with them and find them the best way forward.

We did pilot studies on housing models a few years ago with Employment and Social Development Canada in various cities across the country. For the most part, the most successful models were ones that had veterans housed with veterans, where that peer support and that culture was available as part of that housing model.

[Karen Ludwig]

Thank you.

My next question is about the transition. Knowing what you know now, does the Department of Veterans Affairs work with DND to help on that transition with a veteran? We think of people who retire. There's always the person in HR who gives the explanation. However, that person hasn't retired yet.

If we're looking at people making the transition from the Canadian Forces into the community, are there veterans involved not only in explaining the transition before they leave but also with family resource centres and the families to explain it?

The other part of that is that I spoke with someone earlier today about why there is an increasing number of homeless veterans. The person said that for those who suffer from PTSD, often the symptoms don't show for five to seven years. Knowing that, how do we better prepare veterans and their families before they leave the military?

[Faith McIntyre]

I'll take the second part of that question. I think Robert, my colleague, can speak directly about that transition work, which he and his area offices do.

On the second part of your question, I think that first of all, we know statistically that the majority of veterans come to Veterans Affairs Canada much later after release, after the 10-year mark, for many reasons. One certainly could be that mental health conditions tend to appear much later.

Certainly that's one of the key pieces we identify as well. Homeless vets tend to be homeless much later post-release, again, tied to mental health conditions, which are statistics I shared in my opening remarks.

Having said that, we need to ensure that the supports are available to them pre-release and that we can target any triggers. We're doing a road to civilian life project where we're identifying risk factors and a checklist. We've seen that with mental health first aid-type training as well, asking how they're feeling that day and what's their mood.

I'm simplifying it, but when you look at a transition checklist, would any “reds” appear for these individuals? How should we be able to support them, for example, if they've been to conflict many times or if they've witnessed very challenging situations, and be proactive in providing those supports, particularly in a mental health framework, prior to five or 10 years later where it may be apparent?

I'll turn to Robert to answer the first part of your question.

[Karen Ludwig]

Thank you.

[Robert Tomljenovic]

I think we've come a long way in terms of the transition. In my area alone we work very well at the three IPSCs. I'm particularly thinking of Borden right now, where many more of our releasing members are coming through from southwestern Ontario.

Definitely now everyone gets a transition interview upon release with one of the Veterans Affairs Canada staff members who are working out of the IPSC full time on base. The reason we try to give everyone a transition interview is we recognize that if we don't look at what's going on now—you're right—seven to 10 years down the line, they find themselves homeless.

It's that slow progression of mental illness taking effect. Then they lose their job; then their family falls apart, and all that kind of stuff. We try to identify that early. You look for the key things. Have they done a special duty area? Are they suffering from physical injuries? If that's the case, then we can do two things. We can immediately apply for a disability award. Then upon release we can look at things like the rehabilitation program, getting them treatment. We can have an initial assessment of what's going on so we don't want them not to pass through us.

The other thing is that even if people don't identify—they're feeling fine and things are going well—we want to at least give them the knowledge of our programs and services, and to know if ever they feel that things aren't going well or something's changed, to give us a call. It's setting the stage for trying to fix whatever is occurring now. However, if in the future things aren't going so well, they should come back to us then. There's no time limit.