Veterans Affairs Committee on Dec. 12th, 2024

[Randeep Sarai, Liberal, Surrey Centre, BC]

Thank you.

I am going to ask a question quickly of the Last Post Fund.

It's been five years since the Last Post Fund introduced the indigenous veterans initiative. Could you share some key facts and figures on the impact of that program in its first five years? How do you hope the program will evolve over the next five years?

Go quickly, by the way, because I only have 60 seconds.

[Maria Trujillo, Project Coordinator, Indigenous Veterans Initiative, Last Post Fund]

We've worked so far with 45 indigenous communities throughout Canada. We work with researchers too. Out of those 45 communities, we've worked with 25 local researchers from the community. That has led to over 270 grave markers being placed on previously unmarked graves of indigenous veterans.

Another component of the program is that we add the traditional names of veterans on new tombstones, but we'll go back retroactively, too, and add any traditional names we missed. That has also been quite popular.

While we hope that for the next five years we get more interest in the program, the difficult thing is outreach. We're hoping that for at least the next five years, the goal will be 500 more tombstones for previously unmarked graves.

[The Chair, Liberal, Emmanuel Dubourg]

Thank you very much.

Mr. Champoux, the floor is yours for six minutes.

[Martin Champoux, Bloc, Drummond, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thanks to the witnesses for being with us today. I was not there when they testified before the committee the first time, so I was not fortunate to hear their opening remarks, which might have given me a bit more context. I would ask them to forgive me if I ask them questions that seem a little repetitive.

My questions will be for Ms. Notarianni or Ms. Benlamri, from the Atlas Institute for Veterans and Families.

Just now, you told my colleague Ms. Wagantall that your organization was funded primarily by Veterans Affairs Canada. What are your organization's other funding sources?

[MaryAnn Notarianni]

Veterans Affairs Canada is our primary funder. We have had modest amounts of funding through a couple of partner agreements for specific initiatives we've undertaken.

[Martin Champoux, Bloc, Drummond, QC]

Is that funding public or private?

[MaryAnn Notarianni]

It's public.

[Martin Champoux, Bloc, Drummond, QC]

Can you tell us what public organizations these were?

[MaryAnn Notarianni]

We've done a partnership with the Canadian Institute for Public Safety Research and Treatment, which had funds through the Public Health Agency of Canada. I think it was related to some of the COVID-19 funding that went out. That's one example and is, I believe, another similar centre in the public sphere.

[Martin Champoux, Bloc, Drummond, QC]

You also said that your funding sources, such as Veterans Affairs Canada, did not require that your research examine certain topics and that you yourselves determined what topics you considered to be useful.

Have you done any research that is directly connected with the current study concerning indigenous and Black veterans?

If so, can you tell us about that? What were the findings?

Again, forgive me if you have already answered these questions when you testified earlier.

[MaryAnn Notarianni]

No apology is necessary.

We don't have a specific study of research on indigenous veterans or Black veterans. We are doing some knowledge mobilization work about first nations, Inuit and Métis veterans. Meriem is on the call, and she can speak more to that if there's some time.

[Meriem Benlamri, Director, Knowledge Mobilization, Atlas Institute for Veterans and Families]

Thank you.

Brought to our attention early on was the need for targeted, culturally relevant, psycho-educational information that's specific to the unique experiences of first nations, Inuit and Métis veterans and their families. In response, the Atlas Institute initiated a project through which we're hoping to codevelop knowledge products in collaboration with a first nation, Inuit and Métis advisory group.

At the moment, we are coleading this work with two senior strategists: Tim O'Loan, a veteran from the Sahtu Dene first nation, and Shauna Mulligan, a Métis Ph.D. student in indigenous studies and a retired CAF reserve corporal. We've been working quite closely with these folks to learn what our role might be in supporting the development of informational resources and in learning how we can facilitate the co-creation. We started this work in 2023, and we're hoping that it will keep going past 2027, so we want to take the time to make sure we do this work in a culturally relevant and informed manner.

[Martin Champoux, Bloc, Drummond, QC]

If I understand correctly, you are not close to finishing. You say that the study will keep going to 2027. So it is going to be pretty thorough.

That said, have you determined specific needs at this point? Have you focused on specific aspects that will probably be part of your report or your recommendations? What information has come out of this study to date?

[Meriem Benlamri]

Just to clarify, it's not a research study. It's a knowledge mobilization project. The hope is that by the end of the project we will have co-created informational resources that do a few things: honour the sacrifices of first nation, Inuit and Métis veterans; identify some of their mental health knowledge needs; and address them through information.

That being said, we did host a round table in October with a focus on access to mental health care in rural and remote locations. We hosted an in-person event where we asked veterans and family members, alongside policy-makers, researchers, service providers and some other system-level players, to share their experiences on the barriers, the success factors and the potential areas for change in relation to their experiences and understanding of accessing mental health care in rural and remote areas.

We heard three themes, which we spoke to in our earlier testimony, but I can go over them again. The first theme that came through, as we heard from folks, was about the importance of culturally relevant care and models of healing. We heard that many first nation, Inuit and Métis veterans find that accessing cultural and traditional ways of healing can support their well-being journeys. Unfortunately, oftentimes these are not considered health care, so they are not covered. In some cases, they are also not available. Community leaders have shared that they'd like to see Veterans Affairs Canada adopt a policy that allows for traditional healing approaches within communities, with those costs covered.

That was the first theme.

[Martin Champoux, Bloc, Drummond, QC]

We have about 30 seconds left to address the other two themes.

I would ask you to be brief.

[Meriem Benlamri]

The second theme we heard was that trust needs to be built and earned.

The third one was that there needs to be more clarity around the provision of mental health care. It's not always clear to indigenous veterans who is responsible for coverage. Is it federal entities or is it provincial or territorial health coverage? It would be helpful for folks to get more clarity and support in navigating the system.

[Martin Champoux, Bloc, Drummond, QC]

Thank you, Ms. Notarianni and Ms. Benlamri.

[The Chair, Liberal, Emmanuel Dubourg]

Thank you, Mr. Champoux.

Ms. Rachel Blaney, you have the floor for six minutes, please.

[Rachel Blaney, NDP, North Island—Powell River, BC]

Thank you, Chair.

I will go first to the Last Post Fund.

Thank you for being here. I really appreciate the work being done. I think it's really sacred work. Thank you for doing that.

I'm wondering if you could talk to us a bit about what work you've done on creating a culturally safe framework for the processes that unfold. I think it's really important for us to see how indigenous-led projects are addressing issues so that we can talk about how other organizations might do the same. That would be really helpful for us.

Second, how do the connections get built to identify where the unmarked graves are? I know that a lot of communities are very remote. I imagine the funding to get to some of those locations might be challenging. Could you talk a bit about that and about whether that limits your ability to do the work?

[Maria Trujillo]

I'll start off with your second question, because I have more in mind to say about that, and then I'll move on to the first one.

The way we have contacted communities so far, mostly as a result of COVID, has been through phone and online meetings. I first approach the band office, and usually it's the lands department. There's a lot of work being done on cemeteries in communities. It varies, of course, in each community, but it tends to be done by the lands department. Usually they have a plan in place for where the veterans might be buried, and they share that with us.

One of the components of the indigenous veterans initiative is that we provide an honorarium for a member of the community or the band office itself to carry out the research on identifying the unmarked graves of a veteran on our behalf. Out of the 45 communities we've worked with, about half have had a researcher. That person is crucial to the work we do, because they identify who is missing a grave marker. They'll also help us find the traditional name of the veteran when it's available.

Thanks to technology, it's kind of worked so far. We haven't necessarily had to go to any community so far to let them know about this work. I would say we're lucky when a community has veterans, as there tends to be a veteran culture in that community. We're connected with people who already work on the Remembrance Day committee or somebody who honours the veterans. Usually that person is already interested in the work we do, so we've been lucky in that sense.

Where it's been tricky, I think, is if there's less of a culture of Remembrance Day in a community. There isn't really a key person to go to, so that's one of the challenges, even though there might be veterans buried in an unmarked grave in that community.

That's in regard to the second question.

As for the first question, when we started this work, families were asking us for.... One of the components is that, if there's a culturally relevant symbol, the family has the choice to add it on the tombstone. This is different from non-indigenous veterans, where we usually offer the cross or a military crest. For indigenous veterans, if the community has a symbol or if the family themselves belong to a clan or have a family symbol, then we definitely allow and encourage the family to go with that symbol if they like.

One of the gaps we noticed is that the families were asking for a certain type of symbol, but we didn't really have any in stock. One of the ways we tackled this was by hiring a Cree artist, who created seven symbols based on the seven sacred teaching symbols. These are offered to family as one of the choices they have if they would like to add them. It's been popular. Many families ask for eagles or a feather, and those are already available through the symbols we offer.

Related to culture and a big component of the program is adding the traditional name of the veteran. It's retroactive, so if we've placed a tombstone in the past and did not add the traditional name, we'll go back and add it. It's for any new tombstones as well. The family also gets the choice of where that name is placed. Usually we follow the name, rank and unit, but sometimes the family wants the traditional name above the English name, and that's completely fine as well.

We try to work with families so the tombstone is as beautiful as they envision it to be. I would say that's how we tackle that.

[Rachel Blaney, NDP, North Island—Powell River, BC]

That's perfect.

I have only a few seconds, so I'll ask one quick last question.

In B.C., a Cree designer wouldn't necessarily be the right style. If a clan emblem has been made by the community, is that something you can add to the tombstone?

[Maria Trujillo]

Yes, definitely. We had a family that did their own drawing, a pencil drawing. We digitalized it for them. We had a really beautiful one installed in a cemetery in Victoria, and it was drawn by a nephew of the veteran. We were super honoured to have that emblem on the tombstone.

[The Chair, Liberal, Emmanuel Dubourg]

Thank you very much, Ms. Trujillo.

Now let's start the second round of questions. I'm pleased to start with MP Terry Dowdall for five minutes.

[Terry Dowdall, Conservative, Simcoe—Grey, ON]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

I want to thank all of the witnesses for being here today. It's great to have all of you back.

My first question goes to the Last Post Fund.

There was an article out in November, basically a month ago, and your past president, Derek Sullivan, was quite concerned about how the National Field of Honour was going to continue the way it is. It said, “Since 2020 there’s been a push for VAC to assume ownership of the site.” On September 4, your organization sent a letter to Minister Petitpas Taylor basically outlining, “the future of this Veterans' cemetery is now in serious jeopardy; current operating deficits mean that the LPF can sustain operations for only a short period of time.”

The letter went out September 4. There was no strike at that time, and you were hoping to have an answer by November 11. You thought that was a good time, with it being Remembrance Week, but no letter was received. The only time there was contact with her office was after CTV News phoned and followed up on that, and they were told that she was looking at and assessing feasibility.

Number one, I'm just wondering what that says about urgency and respect. Number two, has there been any follow-up as of yet to see exactly what that study of feasibility is about?

[Maria Trujillo]

I specifically take care of the indigenous veterans initiative. I am aware that for the cemetery, the National Field of Honour, a request for transfer has been put through, but I can't really speak to it because it's not in my domain. That would be for the Last Post Fund president or the executive director, but they're not present. I don't want to say anything that is for them to speak to. I'm sorry about that.