Evidence of meeting #45 for Veterans Affairs in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was training.
A recording is available from Parliament.
5 p.m.
Conservative
5 p.m.
Conservative
The Vice-Chair Conservative Blake Richards
That's the end of that round.
We'll move now for the next five minutes to Sean Casey.
April 17th, 2023 / 5 p.m.
Liberal
Sean Casey Liberal Charlottetown, PE
Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.
Let me add to the comments that you've heard from all of the colleagues around the table. This has been a remarkably courageous, touching and moving session. For all of you to come forward in a public forum and go into such depth and detail on obvious trauma is something that I hope and I expect will bear fruit in our reports.
Thank you for that.
I want to bring Ms. Douglas into the conversation a little more. There are a couple of things I want to ask you about.
Maybe I can start with.... I know you were a long-time employee of the federal Department of Justice, and you fairly recently succeeded in getting them to agree to produce about 15,000 pages of information in connection with the purge.
Can you tell us a bit more about that?
5 p.m.
Executive Director, LGBT Purge Fund
It took the LGBT Purge Fund a really substantial, challenging effort to work with the government to uncover an additional 15,000 pages of purge-related documents. A court settlement gave us access to 10,000 pages, but we knew there were a lot more. It was a difficult journey, but eventually there was a settlement. The court has now approved it, and we're in the process of finding those documents.
These are historical documents that will tell the story of why this happened, and why the government targeted 2SLGBTQ folks in particular and looked at us as being somehow more fundamentally weak and unable or unworthy to serve our country. We're getting those documents.
We believe that if we don't have access to those documents and make them public, people will hardly believe this could happen in Canada. If we think that they might not realize it could happen in Canada, then they'd probably say it didn't happen in Canada at all. After that, we know it gets forgotten altogether.
We really think that veterans, people who have served their country, deserve to be remembered and to have their full history be known. We're publicizing these documents.
Just recently, through research, we uncovered the story of a young man whose name is on the Vimy Ridge memorial. He was a gay man. He's there. He made the ultimate sacrifice for our country.
We have to tell these stories, and that's what we're doing.
5 p.m.
Liberal
Sean Casey Liberal Charlottetown, PE
Thank you.
Ms. Park, you talked about the 2021 apology, the $850-million suit and the deficiencies in the apology. I'd like you to speak a bit more about that.
What should have been there? How should it have been there? Is there any way now to make it right?
5:05 p.m.
Lieutenant-Commander (Retired), Founder, Servicewomen’s Salute Canada
Mr. Chair, what I find interesting is that the absence of women in that apology has not been identified. I was listening several months ago, and I realized that, whoa, we are not there.
I contrast that to the government's apology to the LGBTQ purge. We have not been invited to the Prime Minister's Office, and we have not sat in the House of Commons upper balcony to have that statement said: “We're sorry.” This lack of acknowledgement that we have served.... We did not volunteer to be harmed. It's long overdue. Women, because of that, feel that somehow it isn't deserved.
How does one correct that? With the Queen's University portal project, we've been quietly operating for five years. We have not been identifying or advocating for demanding that this must change.
It's a very good question. Does it make a difference? There are some who are in the class action who have said that it does. There are others who say just drive on. I don't have a good answer for that, but it's a good question for discussion.
Thank you.
5:05 p.m.
Conservative
The Vice-Chair Conservative Blake Richards
We're well over the time, so thank you, Mr. Casey.
Mr. Desilets, you now have the floor for two and a half minutes.
5:05 p.m.
Bloc
Luc Desilets Bloc Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Ms. Wood, after you left the military, how many claims did you file in the first month, in the year after you left?
5:05 p.m.
Veteran Advocate, As an Individual
None. I left. I knew I was damaged, but I ran. I was permitted to move before my release. It is a real thing that it took time for some of the symptoms to really appear.
5:05 p.m.
Bloc
Luc Desilets Bloc Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC
When you submitted a first and second claim, were they denied or accepted?
5:05 p.m.
Veteran Advocate, As an Individual
The first three applications I put in at the same time for PTSD and two other conditions, and all three were rejected that first time.
5:05 p.m.
Bloc
Luc Desilets Bloc Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC
So you submitted three claims, which were denied.
How long after that did it take for you to request a review and go to court for at least one to be granted?
5:05 p.m.
Veteran Advocate, As an Individual
It took two years, sir.
Mr. Chair, it took two years for the appeal for PTSD to go through. I used the Bureau of Pensions Advocates for assistance. All they did was include one piece of paper saying that I was mandated to sleep at that base because I was there for training. That's how they finally connected it to my military service; otherwise, I had just been raped.
5:05 p.m.
Bloc
Luc Desilets Bloc Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC
Beyond these three claims, have you submitted any others?
5:05 p.m.
Bloc
Luc Desilets Bloc Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC
Were there seven claims in total, or seven additional claims?
5:10 p.m.
Veteran Advocate, As an Individual
No. My fibromyalgia claim, which is.... It came in 2019. It took two years to diagnose. I put in a claim on June 15, 2021, and I am still awaiting a decision.
It's not about getting the compensation; it's getting the treatment. That's what I need. That's why it's so frustrating. Wait times are not everything, but they result in a lack of treatment and in conditions going untreated and undertreated for years.
5:10 p.m.
Bloc
Luc Desilets Bloc Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC
Ms. Wood, the chair is signalling that my time has expired.
5:10 p.m.
Conservative
The Vice-Chair Conservative Blake Richards
Mr. Desilets, you will have the opportunity to speak with Ms. Wood after the meeting. I thank you for your understanding.
We have two and a half minutes for Ms. Blaney, for some questions.
5:10 p.m.
NDP
Rachel Blaney NDP North Island—Powell River, BC
If I could come back to you, Donna, if we had a world that was more survivor-focused, it would provide a lot more support, a lot more coming forward, and a lot more of a deterrent, so it's something for all of us to think about in our lives.
You talked a lot, and a few people have mentioned this, about the need to have more trauma-informed training for the VAC people who are working so closely with veterans. I'm curious, because it makes me think about.... If you discuss your experiences with any kind of sexual assault, or harassment.... When you were in the CAF, it was never addressed. It was swept under the table, or you didn't feel safe enough to come forward. How does VAC deal with that information? Is the veteran provided any sort of supports to figure out how to come forward with that story? Is there any information?
I'm curious about how that communication happens between the CAF and VAC.
5:10 p.m.
Major (Retired), As an Individual
That's a really good question. Whenever people disclose to me, I treat it as if it's the first time they've disclosed, because it could be. I know people are disclosing to VAC case managers, and I know that, again, similar to anything else, if you're trained, great, you're confident in how you're going to support that person, but if you're not, you can fumble it, and you cause more damage.
It's tough, and I know it's tough. The system tries to protect your identity, because it doesn't want to cause you trauma, but at the same time, there needs to be a much more open conduit and a way for people to come forward and self-identify in a way that doesn't have any repercussions. I'm not sure what the answer is.
