Debates of Oct. 20th, 1997

Infrastructure Program

[Guy St-Julien, Liberal, Abitibi, QC]

Mr. Speaker, once again, the Government of Quebec and the separatist MNA from Val d'Or in Abitibi-Est, André Pelletier, are taking their time approving projects under part II of the Canada-Quebec infrastructure rehabilitation program.

There are over $7 million in projects from the riding of Abitibi-Est on the desk of Minister Rémi Trudel. Separatist MNA André Pelletier is still holding up approval of these 1997 projects. He is playing hide-and-seek with the people of the municipalities of Val d'Or, Barraute, Senneterre, Sullivan, and Malartic and area, making joint announcements of these projects difficult.

The people of Abitibi-Est would like the Government of Quebec to give more than 50% approval for these projects worth $7 million.

Éboulements Tragedy

[Gérard Asselin, Bloc, Charlevoix, QC]

Mr. Speaker, on Monday, October 13, all of Quebec was shaken by the terrible accident in the riding of Charlevoix, more specifically in the small municipality of Éboulements, in which a bus plunged into a ravine.

In my own name and on behalf of the entire population of Charlevoix, I would like to extend sincere condolences to the families of all the victims devastated by this tragedy, and to all the inhabitants of Saint-Bernard, who have been sorely tested these last few days.

As well, we wish the five survivors the strength and courage to overcome this ordeal and to make a speedy recovery.

I would also like to pay tribute to the first aid workers and to all those who helped rescue victims, and to the solidarity of the people of Charlevoix and of the town of Saint-Bernard.

It is a shame that it took an event such as this to focus our attention on the changes needed to this section of highway in order to prevent a recurrence of such an accident.

Atlantic Canada

[Peter Mancini, NDP, Sydney—Victoria, NS]

Mr. Speaker, I rise in the House to address the prime minister's recent remarks in Moncton about tough love. The prime minister was quoted as being unrepentant about the severe effects of his government's deep cuts and boasted that the Atlantic region was better off as a result of these cuts. It looks like the tough love has resulted in the children leaving home.

The east coast population is shrinking. In recent census data, 2,700 people between the ages of 18 and 24 left Cape Breton over a five year period and have not returned.

The number of young families leaving Cape Breton and Atlantic Canada echoes Steinbeck's depression era novel The Grapes of Wrath . I would submit that if unemployment is down then it is due to the fact that the population is leaving the region.

Liberal policies have created a nation of migrant workers. I call on the government to wake up and take immediate action to implement a real economic strategy for Atlantic Canada—

[The Speaker]

The member for Beauport—Montmorency—Orléans.

Commission Nationale Des Parents Francophones

[Michel Guimond, Bloc, Beauport—Montmorency—Orléans, QC]

Mr. Speaker, the Bloc Quebecois wants to pay tribute to the hundred or so francophone parents from outside Quebec who met in Ottawa over the weekend to work on putting in place a French language education project in provinces where English is the language of the majority.

These parents are showing unfailing determination in spite of the major difficulties they face: continuing to send their children to French schools, obliging them to take long bus rides to school, uprooting them, investing time and energy in trying to compensate the lower level of education provided. These are the kind of problems francophone parents and their children are facing daily if they want to continue living in French in a predominantly English speaking country.

This is another attempt by the Commission nationale des parents francophones to give parents the tools they need to have their children educated in French in Canada. The Bloc Quebecois salutes the tenacity and perseverance of the Commission nationale des parents francophones and its members.

Stornoway

[Denis Coderre, Liberal, Bourassa, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I feel very sad today. One of my deepest dreams, one of my main goals in life was to play bingo with the Leader of the Opposition at Stornoway.

In the past I believed the Leader of the Opposition when he proposed that great passe-temps.

My dream almost became reality when he spent over $60,000 to redecorate that place.

But now I am depressed. The man who proclaimed himself l'homme du peuple, the populist, wants to be alone.

He decided to build a huge fence around Stornoway to isolate himself so nobody would bother him. The Leader of the Opposition can't stand people anymore.

We should organize a chain letter to make him change his mind, but I think that won't work. Stornoway will never be the same.

Small Business

[John Herron, Progressive Conservative, Fundy Royal, NB]

Mr. Speaker, today marks the beginning of small business week.

This government can say all it wants about helping small business but the fact remains that the tax burden is higher in Canada than in most competing jurisdictions.

High payroll and corporate taxes form a barrier to jobs and growth because they tax business for every new job created. Small and medium enterprises are struggling in today's global economy and this means fewer jobs and opportunities for all Canadians.

The government could do a lot more for job creation if it actually allowed small business to grow. But its high EI payroll taxes, its whopping increases to CPP payroll taxes and its high small business and corporate tax rates only stifle growth and job creation.

The Progressive Conservative Party believes small and medium businesses are the real job creation engines of this country. When it comes to taxation less really means more, more growth and more jobs for all Canadians.

Durham In Bloom

[Ovid Jackson, Liberal, Bruce—Grey, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I rise today to congratulate the town of Durham for winning the national Communities in Bloom competition this year. This achievement is all the more noteworthy considering that the town of Durham suffered a devastating flood that caused more than one million dollars in damage last year.

The people of Durham have courage and character. They maintained the beauty and quality of their town despite the adversity.

I know my colleagues in the House join me in congratulating the town for a job well done.

Taxation

[Preston Manning, Reform, Leader of the Opposition]

Mr. Speaker, the finance minister threw himself a little party last week, but many Canadians don't feel much like celebrating.

The budget is almost balanced but 1.4 million Canadians are still out of work. The average Canadian family is making $3,000 a year less after taxes than it did before the Liberals took over.

My question is for the finance minister. He set out a future spending plan with dollars and details attached. He set out a plan for increasing payroll taxes by 73%. When will he set out a specific detailed plan for substantive tax relief?

[Paul Martin, Liberal, Minister of Finance]

Mr. Speaker, one slight correction in terms of the Canada pension plan. I set out a program not only to preserve the Canada pension plan but to preserve all its qualities. I also set out a premium increase that is substantially less than any independent analysis of the Reform Party program.

One should understand that. I would hope the leader of the Reform Party would take that into consideration. In addition—and I notice I only have five seconds left—we also set out a very clear plan stating that we would reduce taxes when the country—

[The Speaker]

The hon. Leader of the Opposition.

[Preston Manning, Reform, Leader of the Opposition]

Mr. Speaker, the truth is that the Liberal government starts taxing the incomes of Canadians at a lower level than any other government of the G-7. It starts taxing the incomes of single people as soon as they make around $6,500 a year. The government collects almost $2 billion a year from people who earn $15,000 a year or less, many of them old people, many of them young people and many of them poor people.

My question is for the tax man. How can he ignore the calls for tax relief when the government is taxing lower income people more heavily than any other government in the G-7?

[Paul Martin, Liberal, Minister of Finance]

Mr. Speaker, let us understand the tax plan of the Reform Party. It has said that for a single family with an income of about $30,000 a year it would reduce its taxes by $175. For a family with an income of $250,000 it would reduce its taxes by $4,000 a year.

Let it be very clear. We will reduce taxes for Canadians and we will begin with lower and middle income Canadians.

[Preston Manning, Reform, Leader of the Opposition]

Mr. Speaker, it is the Reform Party's tax relief plan that takes 1.3 million people off the federal government's—

[Some hon. members]

Hear, hear.

[Preston Manning, Reform, Calgary Southwest, AB]

Ordinary Canadians cannot afford to hire tax accountants and lawyers. They cannot relocate their assets in low tax countries. They cannot fly their assets under flags of convenience to escape overtaxation in this country. They cannot escape the tax man. If the minister does not provide them with tax relief there will be no tax relief.

One million families in Canada make $30,000 a year or less. Most of them pay federal income tax. When can—

[The Speaker]

The hon. Minister of Finance.

[Paul Martin, Liberal, Minister of Finance]

Mr. Speaker, let us examine again what Reform would do to pay for those taxes.

It would cut the CHST by $3.5 billion. Middle income Canadians depend on health care which Reform would cut. A lot of those people live in Manitoba and Saskatchewan. Reform would cut equalization by $3 billion a year, driving up income tax in those provinces.

Reform would cut old age pensions by $3 billion a year. What would happen to the senior citizens on fixed incomes?

Why will Reform not tell us—

[The Speaker]

The hon. member for Edmonton North.

Rcmp Investigations

[Deborah Grey, Reform, Edmonton North, AB]

Mr. Speaker, let us examine some Liberal scandals.

Back when Mulroney's government was committing crimes with its fundraising group, the Liberals absolutely blew a fuse. The present government House leader when in opposition said “Whether or not there is an RCMP investigation does not mean that this minister is no longer responsible for the administration of his own department”.

Hear, hear, Mr. Speaker.

Let me ask the same government House leader the question today. Why was the Tory scandal back in 1989 so terribly unacceptable to him but a Liberal scandal in 1997 is just business as usual?

[Herb Gray, Liberal, Deputy Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, the Reform member is doing what she did last week, making insinuations and innuendoes that are totally not based on the facts.

Last week she failed to apologize after misinforming the House—and I am not saying deliberately—that somebody got a grant in the prime minister's riding after making a donation. That was wrong. Then she went on to insinuate that the companies involved in the investigation were located in the prime minister's riding. That was wrong, and she still has not apologized.

I say that anything the hon. member says is nothing more than Reform rubbish.

[Some hon. members]

Hear, hear.

[Deborah Grey, Reform, Edmonton North, AB]

Mr. Speaker, let us look at the facts for just a minute.

The fact is that companies were told to pay up to the Liberal Party or they would not get government contracts. The fact is that, even after the RCMP were alerted to the shakedown that was going on, the Liberals kept their fraudulent fundraiser on the payroll until well after the election.

[Some hon. members]

Oh, oh.

[The Speaker]

Sometimes I do not know exactly where an hon. member is leading in a preamble. I ask you to be very judicious in your choice of words in the question period and in the answers.

I would like the hon. member to go directly to her question.