Debates of Dec. 4th, 1998

Montreal Convention Centre

[Some hon. members]

Oh, oh.

[Sheila Copps, Liberal, Hamilton East, ON]

On the one hand, they say they want money invested in infrastructure, on the other hand, they are saying, as the member for Rimouski—Mitis mentioned in the report, that they oppose such investments. I hope the two members will consult each other so they will speak with a single voice for once.

Agriculture

[Charlie Penson, Reform, Peace River, AB]

Mr. Speaker, on December 6 American farmers will be blockading the Canada-U.S. border. This will only add to the economic problems faced by Canadian farmers.

For the past two months the government has been telling us that its trade working panel will resolve all these issues. We find out today that it is a total sham. It is resolving nothing.

Will the minister finally get out from under his desk, talk to the Americans and tell them that we will not take this harassment any more? Or, does he have to ask the Minister of Canadian Heritage for permission to do that?

[Ralph Goodale, Liberal, Minister of Natural Resources and Minister responsible for the Canadian Wheat Board]

Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to confirm today that we have signed an understanding with the Americans. It is a good result from the Canadian perspective.

There are no quantitative limitations, no caps, on Canadian exports. There is no new audit of Canadian grain marketing systems. It is agreed that all sanitary issues at our border will be resolved on the basis of sound science and sound science alone. There will be no political interference.

We have built in insulation against U.S. trade harassment possibilities, either self-initiated by the administration or provoked by individual states. We want to diffuse the border tensions and facilitate—

[The Acting Speaker (Mr. McClelland)]

The hon. member for Okanagan—Shuswap.

[Darrel Stinson, Reform, Okanagan—Shuswap, BC]

Mr. Speaker, we know the border is to be closed. You know the border is to be closed. The minister has sat and done absolutely nothing.

[The Acting Speaker (Mr. McClelland)]

I would ask the hon. member to direct his question through the Chair.

[Darrel Stinson, Reform, Okanagan—Shuswap, BC]

Mr. Speaker, the minister has done absolutely nothing with regard to this issue.

Will the minister finally do his job, or does he want me to go down there? If I have to, I will take the hon. member for Wild Rose with me and get it straightened out.

[Ralph Goodale, Liberal, Minister of Natural Resources and Minister responsible for the Canadian Wheat Board]

Mr. Speaker, more specifically Canada and the United States reaffirmed their commitment as contained in the international trade agreement to ensure that all necessary measures were taken to meet the obligations contained in the agreement, including their observance by state and provincial governments.

The United States has an obligation to ensure that its citizens obey the law.

Ice Breaking Policy

[Yves Rocheleau, Bloc, Trois-Rivières, QC]

Mr. Speaker, eight days ago, the Minister of Fisheries and Oceans met with officials from the Canadian shipping industry regarding the ice breaking issue. He promised he would contact them again in seven days to inform them of his intentions. But industry officials have yet to hear from the minister.

If the minister did not bother to keep his word, will he at least inform the House of what he intends to do with the industry's counterproposal?

[David Anderson, Liberal, Minister of Fisheries and Oceans]

Mr. Speaker, I do keep my word. As I told the House over the past two weeks, we carefully considered the alternate proposal made by the shipping and industrial coalition of the Great Lakes and the St. Lawrence.

I am pleased to announce today that we have accepted the coalition's request to reduce fees. The new fees will come into effect on December 21. The objective will be to reduce the fees by 50%.

[Yves Rocheleau, Bloc, Trois-Rivières, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I must say we are very pleased with the minister's decision. However, since the industry's counterproposal does not expressly deal with the specific issue of the ferries, which are a public service, will the minister immediately pledge to exempt St. Lawrence ferries from any type of fees?

[David Anderson, Liberal, Minister of Fisheries and Oceans]

Mr. Speaker, as I often said over the past two weeks, I intend to take a close look at the fees for ferries. I will reduce the fees by 50% for the coalition, and by at least 60% for ferries.

Aboriginal Affairs

[Myron Thompson, Reform, Wild Rose, AB]

Mr. Speaker, accountants hired to probe apparent financial irregularities as a result of complaints by grassroots natives of the Stoney Indian Reserve have now referred 43 cases to the RCMP for criminal investigation.

Many other natives across the country are calling for forensic audits on their reserves. Does the minister not believe that grassroots natives know when things are wrong on their reserves?

[Jane Stewart, Liberal, Minister of Indian Affairs and Northern Development]

Mr. Speaker, yesterday we saw the results of a forensic audit at the Stoney First Nation. This was an extraordinary measure taken in extraordinary circumstances.

I can confirm that 43 files were referred to the RCMP for review. We got other recommendations which will help that first nation work toward building a strong, accountable and transparent government.

[Roy H. Bailey, Reform, Souris—Moose Mountain, SK]

Mr. Speaker, I have a supplementary question. Why does the minister only listen to the chiefs and councils when the grassroots people report injustices?

Why does the minister talk only to the chiefs and councils? Why does the hon. minister not listen to the people who are really in need?

[Jane Stewart, Liberal, Minister of Indian Affairs and Northern Development]

Mr. Speaker, I ask hon. members opposite why they think the appropriate response is to start at the extreme.

A forensic audit is an extreme measure. Our view and our belief is that we have to work in partnership with first nations communities so that we can build sustainable resolutions to very difficult problems.

Water Contamination

[Ghislain Fournier, Bloc, Manicouagan, QC]

Mr. Speaker, on October 20, the Minister of Transport acknowledged his department's responsibility in polluting the water table around the beaches in Sept-Îles.

To date, he has offered only weak excuses and bottled water.>

What is preventing the minister from making a firm commitment to resolve quickly and completely the problems his department caused? People's health is at risk.

[David Collenette, Liberal, Minister of Transport]

Mr. Speaker, we recognize that the Department of Transport was part of the problem and we have put measures in place to improve the situation.

We are working with local authorities to resolve the problem, and I think that in the future there will be a solution for everyone in the region.

Foreign Affairs

[Ted McWhinney, Liberal, Vancouver Quadra, BC]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Foreign Affairs.

The International Court of Justice has ruled today that it does not have the jurisdiction to hear Spain's complaint on Canada's arrest of the Spanish fishing vessel Estai in 1994 just outside our 200 mile territorial zone.

What are the implications of that decision?

[Lloyd Axworthy, Liberal, Minister of Foreign Affairs]

Mr. Speaker, we very much welcome the decision of the court which respects Canada's reservation in terms of the conservation of stock outside the 200 mile limit.

The position we have taken all along is that negotiation is a much more effective way of dealing with the problem. Negotiation has paid off. We now have agreement with the European Union on quota allocation. Negotiations have led to the straddling stocks convention at the United Nations.

I look forward very much to consideration by the House of the legislation to implement the straddling stocks convention so we can pursue that good arrangement to conserve fishing stocks around the world.

Human Rights

[Bob Mills, Reform, Red Deer, AB]

Mr. Speaker, after crying for the release of convicted kidnappers in Brazil, the foreign affairs minister is begging for the release of a convicted murderer in Texas, is helping this convicted murderer.

Why has the minister ignored Mr. Michael Kapoustin, a Canadian citizen who has been held without charges in a Bulgarian jail for the last three years?

[Lloyd Axworthy, Liberal, Minister of Foreign Affairs]

Mr. Speaker, the tone of the hon. member's question is quite offensive. We are not going around begging from anybody.

All we are saying to country after country is that there is a Vienna convention on consular agreements which makes every country responsible for ensuring that nationals arrested in another country have access to that government, access to their families and certain rights that must be respected.

We will do everything to ensure that Canadians who are arrested in other countries have their rights under international law properly respected by any country that wants to turn them over.

Atlantic Canada Opportunities Agency

[Rob Anders, Reform, Calgary West, AB]

Mr. Speaker, the list of ACOA failures grows. Taxpayers can kiss another cool million of their hard earned dollars goodbye because the Atlantic Canada Opportunities Agency has failed again.

Now Planta Dei, a herbal remedy company in New Brunswick, is closing its doors after announcing it cannot pay its bills. Marthe Boissonnault, an ACOA employee, says that writing off bad loans is the nature of ACOA's business. Will the minister for ACOA admit that he is going to write off the money and he is going to write off the jobs?

[Fred Mifflin, Liberal, Minister of Veterans Affairs and Secretary of State (Atlantic Canada Opportunities Agency)]

Mr. Speaker, the tone and the context of the hon. member's question do not at all indicate the work ACOA does. We take risks and in certain areas where high technology is involved the funding is very difficult to—