House of Commons Hansard #54 of the 37th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament's site.) The word of the day was iraq.

Topics

AgricultureOral Question Period

2:55 p.m.

Prince Edward—Hastings Ontario

Liberal

Lyle Vanclief LiberalMinister of Agriculture and Agri-Food

Mr. Speaker, until the Prime Minister and I made the announcement last June, the farmers had $600 million from the federal government for business risk management, and then we went on an ad hoc basis each year. The farmers, the provinces and the producers did not know what other support was there.

We now have $1.1 billion a year there for each of the next five years, and that security is there. I can assure the hon. member that if he takes a look at that he would see that for farmers to have a 70% coverage of a $100,000 production margin, they only need to put $3,500 down on the--

AgricultureOral Question Period

2:55 p.m.

The Speaker

The hon. member for Yukon.

HealthOral Question Period

2:55 p.m.

Liberal

Larry Bagnell Liberal Yukon, YT

Mr. Speaker, given the unique circumstances and special conditions in the north and the fact that the territorial governments did not agree with the health care accord yesterday, could the government please tell us how it plans to solidify this important partnership for the effective delivery of health care in the north.

HealthOral Question Period

2:55 p.m.

Edmonton West Alberta

Liberal

Anne McLellan LiberalMinister of Health

Mr. Speaker, let me reassure the hon. member that we are very aware of the unique circumstances of the three territories. One is dealing with very small populations over very large areas and some unique and pressing health issues.

I have made the commitment to my three health minister colleagues, as well as the three territorial leaders, that as soon as they want to sit down with me to talk about how we can implement this accord in the territories to serve the interests of their people, I will be happy to do so at their convenience.

Aboriginal AffairsOral Question Period

2:55 p.m.

Canadian Alliance

Brian Pallister Canadian Alliance Portage—Lisgar, MB

Mr. Speaker, it has been about a year now since Dakota Tipi first nation was put under federal government management. Since that time, incidents of violence, including stabbings and beatings, have increased. There has been a case of arson. Last week the school was set ablaze. At the root of the problem are allegations of corruption and mismanagement in the handling of millions of dollars.

The minister's avoidance response thus far has been to refuse to launch any investigation. The Canadian Alliance's first concern is the safety of the residents of Dakota Tipi.

Will the minister commit today to launching a public inquiry that will get to the bottom of the problem and perhaps prevent--

Aboriginal AffairsOral Question Period

2:55 p.m.

The Speaker

The hon. Minister of Indian Affairs and Northern Development.

Aboriginal AffairsOral Question Period

2:55 p.m.

Kenora—Rainy River Ontario

Liberal

Bob Nault LiberalMinister of Indian Affairs and Northern Development

Mr. Speaker, as the member knows very well, a number of months ago this first nation was brought under section 74 of the Indian Act, which includes the requirement to have an election on reserve. That election took place not too long ago.

This is the first time this community has had an election in over 20 years. It is a new structure for them. Because of that, there are some significant issues of healing that need to take place in the community. It is the objective of the government through mediation to work with the community to ensure that happens.

Aboriginal AffairsOral Question Period

2:55 p.m.

Canadian Alliance

Brian Pallister Canadian Alliance Portage—Lisgar, MB

Sweeping this under the rug will not do, Mr. Speaker.

According to a band councillor the mediator just called off his investigation this morning, so mediation will not work and the minister knows that. We have to get to the bottom of the root of the problem. The problem is the mismanagement of millions of dollars. Without an investigation, the facts will not be revealed and the healing cannot begin.

Again, let me ask the minister this. We are calling for a public inquiry. The only person who does not seem to want a public inquiry is the minister. The band council does and we do. Will the minister launch a public inquiry?

Aboriginal AffairsOral Question Period

3 p.m.

Kenora—Rainy River Ontario

Liberal

Bob Nault LiberalMinister of Indian Affairs and Northern Development

Mr. Speaker, that is news to me. I have not heard from the council or any member of the community saying that they are in favour of a public inquiry. What they are in favour of is good governance, working toward building a community through the work of mediation and the work of healing.

There is a process to deal with wrongdoing. It is called the RCMP and the police forces. If there is corruption and/or allegations of that nature, I say to this member and any member of the House, bring that information to the proper authorities.

ImmigrationOral Question Period

February 6th, 2003 / 3 p.m.

Bloc

Madeleine Dalphond-Guiral Bloc Laval Centre, QC

Mr. Speaker, the restoration of the mechanism of temporarily returning asylum seekers to the United States has meant that a number of them have been jailed in that country while awaiting a meeting with an officer of Immigration Canada. The department is no longer demanding the assurance that these people will be able to make it to their appointments.

Given Canada's international commitments on the protection of refugees, will the minister commit to reinstating the directive requiring U.S. authorities to ensure that any asylum seekers in custody will indeed be able to attend their interview with Immigration Canada?

ImmigrationOral Question Period

3 p.m.

Bourassa Québec

Liberal

Denis Coderre LiberalMinister of Citizenship and Immigration

Mr. Speaker, first, if the hon. member had followed developments at all, she would have been aware that those who have an appointment with Immigration Canada, if detainees, have for the most part been released by the American authorities.

No formal agreement is required. The U.S. government, which is after all a signatory of the Geneva Convention, has its own way of doing things.

Our position, informally, is that those who have an agreement to come to Canada should be allowed to return. So I do not see—

ImmigrationOral Question Period

3 p.m.

The Speaker

The hon. member for Erie—Lincoln.

Firearms RegistryOral Question Period

3 p.m.

Liberal

John Maloney Liberal Erie—Lincoln, ON

Mr. Speaker, the House has been seized with the issue of gun control and public safety for some time now.

Following the report of the Auditor General and given the concerns expressed over cost, are there any measures that can be introduced to reduce these costs while maintaining the high level of public safety that Canadians currently receive?

Firearms RegistryOral Question Period

3 p.m.

Outremont Québec

Liberal

Martin Cauchon LiberalMinister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank the hon. member for that very important question. As everyone knows, at the beginning of the week, reports were tabled with regard to the situation in the gun control program. If we look at Mr. Hession's report, for example, there are 16 recommendations that will have to be taken into consideration to prepare our plan of action.

One thing that is very important as a first step is the implementation of the amendment of Bill C-10A. Bill C-10A would streamline the process and at the same time would reduce the cost of the program. I need the support of the House because we believe in public safety.

Presence in GalleryOral Question Period

3 p.m.

The Speaker

I draw the attention of hon. members to the presence in the gallery of a distinguished Canadian, Ms. Barb Tarbox, a lifetime smoker diagnosed with lung cancer, who is on a Canada-wide anti-smoking crusade aimed at getting teenagers to stop smoking.

Presence in GalleryOral Question Period

3 p.m.

Some hon. members

Hear, hear.

Business of the HouseOral Question Period

3 p.m.

Canadian Alliance

John Reynolds Canadian Alliance West Vancouver—Sunshine Coast, BC

Mr. Speaker, I would like to ask the government House leader what the business is for the rest of this week and next week and if there is anything new coming along?

Business of the HouseOral Question Period

3 p.m.

Glengarry—Prescott—Russell Ontario

Liberal

Don Boudria LiberalMinister of State and Leader of the Government in the House of Commons

Mr. Speaker, I will start with the rest of this day and then go on with the future agenda.

If the opposition follows through with its offer, as promised during question period, to withdraw its motion today on the strength of the commitment made by the Prime Minister to, on the first day following military deployment should there be one which we all hope of course there would not be, call a votable opposition day that would free up the rest of the day.

Following that, this afternoon we would then deal with Bill C-19. Should there be any time left we would call Bill C-22, although I suspect that there would not be that much time, and perhaps Bill C-19 would take us close to the end.

Tomorrow we shall begin the third reading stage of Bill C-6, the Specific Claims Resolution Act, followed by Bill C-2, an act to establish a process for assessing the environmental and socio-economic effects of certain activities in Yukon.

Monday next, and Thursday as well, shall be allotted days.

Tuesday morning, we shall be resuming consideration of Bill C-13 on assisted reproduction. After oral question period, we shall begin consideration of Bill C-24 on political financing. Wednesday, we shall resume consideration of any unfinished business, with the possibility of continuing debate on Bill C-24.

Business of the HouseOral Question Period

3:05 p.m.

Canadian Alliance

John Reynolds Canadian Alliance West Vancouver—Sunshine Coast, BC

Mr. Speaker, if the government House leader would like to put his recommendation for this in writing, we could probably negotiate the next little while. If the government is prepared to guarantee us a votable opposition day the day after the government makes a decision on going to war and if he would also guarantee us that if the House is not sitting the Speaker would be allowed to call it back so we could have that vote, we would then certainly be prepared to do that. If the government House leader wants to make that recommendation, we will certainly listen to it.

Business of the HouseOral Question Period

3:05 p.m.

Liberal

Don Boudria Liberal Glengarry—Prescott—Russell, ON

Mr. Speaker, we will get into that in the debate, but even the motion that was proposed by the opposition does not do that. It was totally unprepared to get yes for an answer today. It did, and now it absolutely does not know what to do about it.

Points of OrderOral Question Period

3:05 p.m.

The Speaker

I am now prepared to rule on the point of order raised on January 27 by the hon. government House leader concerning written questions and the difficulties experienced by the government in responding to them within the 45 day deadline established pursuant to Standing Order 39(5)(a).

I would like to thank the hon. government House leader for having raised this matter as well as the hon. House leader for the official opposition and the hon. member for St. John's West for their interventions.

In presenting his case, the hon. government House leader stated that Questions Nos. 59 to 71 and 77, placed on the Notice Paper on November 20 and 21, 2002, requested a significant amount of information related to government grants, loans, contributions and contracts awarded in certain constituencies over an eight year period. He went on to argue that the very nature of the questions made it virtually impossible for the government to respond within the 45 day deadline set for its responses.

The hon. government House leader presented several facts in support of that position. He noted that information of this nature is kept on file for a maximum period of six years. He also mentioned that government departments are not required to keep such records on a constituency basis. Furthermore, he pointed out that all the information collected for such a government response requires translation pursuant to S.O. 32(4), which stipulates that any document distributed or laid before the House must be in both official languages.

To remedy the dilemma he described, the hon. government House leader went on to suggest amending Standing Order 39(6) that currently allows certain questions to be transferred to Motions for the Production of Papers, so that it could provide another avenue for the government to respond to longer questions.

In concluding his remarks, the hon. government House leader also suggested that the Clerk, who is responsible for reviewing and accepting written questions for publication on the Notice Paper, should reject any question that was “unreasonable” or that was so poorly drafted that it requires multiple clarifications.

First, let me clear up one point. The hon. government House leader complained that the disputed questions sought information from the government about non-governmental organizations. However, as I read these questions, information is sought about “quasi non-governmental organizations funded by the government”. These quangos, as they are known in the United Kingdom, are in fact public bodies, defined as bodies having a role in the processes of government and, though not reporting to a minister, bodies for which ministers are ultimately responsible. Thus, it seems to me that the questions do, in fact, seek this information from the appropriate source.

Now let us return to the matter at hand. I should first say that since January 27, when this point of order was raised, the government has tabled responses to all the questions dealt with in the complaint.

Strictly speaking, the responses were tabled after the deadline provided for in Standing Order 39(5)( a ) had passed.

Since the Chair took this point of order under advisement on January 27, the designation of these questions and their reference to committee were held in abeyance, pending my ruling. Now, since the responses are in, the Chair will not designate these questions nor will these questions be referred to committee. However, I want to be very clear on this. This is a relatively new procedure and I am prepared to give the government the benefit of the doubt in this instance. In the future though, the application of deadlines will be strictly applied and a non-response to a question will not mitigated by the fact that a point of order has been raised about the question and that the House must await a ruling.

In summary then, there is no longer an immediate problem with regard to this particular set of questions. However, the Chair is nevertheless prepared to share its conclusions on the point of order raised in the hope that it may prove helpful in future situations.

Having reviewed the issues raised by the hon. government House leader, I must confess a certain reluctance to intervene in the matter. Let me explain.

I would refer hon. members to the ruling made by Mr. Speaker Fraser on June 14, 1989, referred to by the hon. government House leader in his arguments. Specifically, let me cite what I believe is a succinct statement of the continuing problem regarding written questions, and I quote:

The dilemma is this: we must find a balance between the urgent requirements of Members who need information in order to function and the equal imperative of a rational and fair use of the limited resources available to provide answers.

The ruling continues:

There is also a procedurally quite acceptable practice simply to respond by saying that the question cannot be answered because of the time and the human or financial resources involved. The Government may continue the practice of simply declining, with an explanation, to answer questions which it finds are too burdensome. It should be understood that there is no obligation on the Government to provide a perfect answer, only a fair one.

Mr. Speaker Fraser continues with a very important caveat:

A Member in framing his or her question would accept part of the responsibility for the quality of the answer.

In short, our procedure permits the government to respond to a question or questions by stating that the question cannot be answered because of the time and the human or financial resources involved.

Perhaps ironically, this is what the hon. government House leader did, even as he presented his point of order. In making his case, he stated that the government could not respond to Questions Nos. 59 to 71 and 77, because of certain ambiguities in the line of questioning, because of the time involved in compiling the information requested, and because of the human and financial resources involved.

On another front, the hon. government House leader posits that one remedy to the current situation he faces is that the Clerk's staff should exercise greater rigour in accepting written questions for the Notice Paper.

I cannot agree with this argument for, no matter what degree of rigour is applied to the process, it is not possible for House staff to form any accurate assessment of the resources necessary to prepare a reply. There will always be differences of opinion between the government and members of the opposition as to the way questions are formulated as well as to whether adequate information is provided in response.

Staff under the aegis of the Clerk review written questions submitted as to form and whether they conform with our guidelines, but they cannot be charged with assessing the merits of these questions, or whether the government will or will not be in a position to respond to them.

Marleau and Montpetit at page 441 makes the following point:

Acting on the Speaker's behalf, the Clerk has full authority to ensure the questions placed on the Notice Paper conform with the rules and practices of the House. Given that the purpose of a written question is to seek and receive a precise, detailed answer, it is incumbent on a Member submitting a question for the Notice Paper “to ensure that it is formulated carefully enough to elicit the precise information sought”.

Similarly, as hon. members know, there is no provision in our rules for the Speaker to review the content of responses, nor would that be appropriate. In this regard I would simply state that any member not satisfied with the response provided by the government may raise supplemental questions either orally or in written form.

I should mention that the current situation may well be rooted in the frustration that members experience with regard to the constraints imposed on them with regard to written questions. I can remember a time when members were not limited in the number of questions they could place on the Order Paper whereas today Standing Order 39(4) limits members to four questions at any one time.

It is perhaps not entirely surprising that members have shown their usual ingenuity in coping with this constraint and have taken to crafting multipart questions of the kind that are the subject of the minister's complaint.

Where there might have been pointed questions each addressed to a particular department or agency, there is now one question which blankets all departments and agencies and throws in quangos for good measure. The minister is left with a rather thankless task of compiling all this information within the 45-day limit if he is to respect the deadline for responses.

As I stated at the outset, I have concluded after reviewing this situation that the Chair cannot adjudicate on the merits of written questions asked of the government any more than it can judge the merits of the responses the government provides.

The Clerk and his officials are entrusted the task of ensuring that written questions are permissible as to form only; it falls to the government to determine whether it can offer a response, given the nature and scope of the question.

Since responses to the specific questions that gave rise to this point of order have now been tabled in the House, the Chair considers this particular case to be closed and trusts that this decision will help to clarify the situation in the future.

If hon. members remain concerned about the current rules relating to written questions, I would suggest that the matter be taken up by the Standing Committee on Procedure and House Affairs or by the Special Committee on Modernization and Improvement of the Procedures of the House of Commons which is also currently tasked with reviewing our procedures.

Points of OrderOral Question Period

3:15 p.m.

The Speaker

I am now prepared to rule on the point of order raised on January 29, 2003 by the hon. member for St. Albert concerning the government's response to a question that he had placed on the Order Paper.

The hon. member for St. Albert argued that the answer provided by the government was, by its own admission, incomplete and that this constitutes a failure by the government to reply within the 45-day period provided for in Standing Order 39(5)(a). He therefore requested that the matter of this failure be referred to the appropriate standing committee as provided for in Standing Order 39(5)(b).

I have examined the remarks made by the hon. member for St. Albert with care but can find no grounds for proceeding as he suggests. Our procedure in such matters is clearly stated in the House of Commons Procedure and Practice at page 443:

There are no provisions in the rules for the Speaker to review government responses to questions.

It is not within the powers of the Chair to judge the adequacy of an answer. The government, in providing the response which was tabled on January 27, 2003, has complied with the requirements of the standing order and I am therefore not in a position to instruct that the matter be referred to committee.

The hon. member has indicated that the government intends to present further material with respect to this question. This, too, is in keeping with our practice. On page 443 of Marleau and Montpetit, which I referred to just a moment ago, it is also stated that:

On occasion, the government has supplied supplementary replies to questions already answered.

That is, apparently, what is intended in the present case.

I thank the hon. member for St. Albert for having drawn this matter to the attention of the House. If he wishes to seek further information from the government on this topic, or on any other matter, he is free to place further questions on the Order Paper.

The Chair has noticed a further intervention on a question to be raised by the hon. Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Canadian Heritage.

PrivilegeOral Question Period

3:15 p.m.

Laval East Québec

Liberal

Carole-Marie Allard LiberalParliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Canadian Heritage

Mr. Speaker, first, I want to thank the Chair for giving me this opportunity to address the question of privilege on the premature and unauthorized disclosure of the minority report of the Special Committee on Non-Medical Use of Drugs, which was tabled before Christmas by the hon. Bloc Quebecois member for Hochelaga—Maisonneuve.

The hon. member claimed that, based on a number of newspaper articles, of which I did not receive a copy, it is clear that certain members of the committee gave interviews which, to a large extent, enabled reporters to learn the contents of the report before it was tabled in the House of Commons.

I asked to see these articles, and yesterday I was sent a three paragraph article published in the daily Le Droit . I do not know if you have other articles in your possession, but I assume that this is the only one that was tabled to support the motion of the hon. member for Hochelaga—Maisonneuve.

The first two paragraphs do not quote anyone, but in the third paragraph my name is mentioned and I am said to have made the following statement:

The committee wanted to send a clear message to young people aged 12 to 18 that it is not legal to smoke marijuana.

First, I want to say that I am extremely proud of the work done by the Special Committee on Non-Medical Use of Drugs. We had our work cut out for us because, as you know, right in the middle of our public consultations, the House referred a bill to us on the legalization of marijuana. From the outset, we set this hot button issue aside to allow the Senate committee, which was finishing up its report on the matter, to publish its recommendations.

You will recall that the conclusions of the Senate report were quite controversial and left us with a hot potato in our hands.

As a result, our committee was well aware of the importance of properly defining the priorities in the area of addictions. It therefore decided to split the committee report into two parts to be made public.

We decided to publish the first 39 recommendations in an interim report on December 9 and to save the last two recommendations for the final report, made public on December 12.

On December 9, the interim report was greeted with a great deal of attention from the media. We proposed 39 recommendations on addictions and our approach to solving the problem in Canada.

Each and every one of us, including the member for Hochelaga—Maisonneuve, was interviewed on television and had journalists ask every possible and relevant question, as their job requires them to do.

All week, they tried to fit the pieces of the puzzle together so they could break the news about marijuana before the report was tabled on December 12.

I gave interviews all week long, and I felt it was my duty to do so. I even took part in a television show with the member for Hochelaga—Maisonneuve. Then, on December 12, our committee tabled its final report. The report contained the first report and also the two final recommendations that dealt with cannabis. Allow me to read the recommendations out loud.

Recommendation number 40 specifies:

The Committee recommends that the possession of cannabis continue to be illegal and that trafficking in any amount of cannabis remain a crime.

Recommendation 41 stipulates:

—that the Minister of Justice and the Minister of Health establish a comprehensive strategy for decriminalizing the possession and cultivation of not more than thirty grams of cannabis for personal use.

This strategy should include:

Prevention and education programs outlining the risks of cannabis use and, in particular, the heightened risk it poses to young persons; and

The development of more effective tools to facilitate the enforcement of existing Criminal Code prohibitions against driving while impaired by a drug.

This is the full text of the recommendations set out in the committee's final report released on December 12. So, it would seem that the allegation made by the hon. member for Hochelaga—Maisonneuve does not hold. Let me explain why.

Although I am in fact quoted in the article, I do believe, with all due respect, that what I said was nothing new. The headline of the article I received from your office simply said “30 grams of pot, no more!”

I have sent to your office two other newspaper articles where the quote about the 30 grams is attributed to another member of Parliament. A number of articles were published during that week. I would remind the House that any reporter who had read the interim report would have easily come to the conclusion that we were not about to legalize marijuana; it was right there in black and white.

That is the first part of my answer. I am referring to the article I sent to your office, which says:

As a member of the special committee, the member from the Canadian Alliance... supported the cultivation of not more than 30 grams—

I would also point out that an anonymous source is quoted in this article. Would that be the hon. member for Hochelaga--Maisonneuve? Or maybe the Alliance member right across from me? They just mention an anonymous source.

The article also mentioned that on December 9, the minister and member for Outremont indicated his intention to go ahead with a bill on decriminalization. Moreover, the Minister of Justice and member for Outremont has never stopped—since taking up his duties at the Department of Justice—saying that he is for the decriminalization of marijuana for recreational use. In the Speech from the Throne, there was a reference to this measure, which was felt to be imminent.

I also remember having heard the member for Hochelaga—Maisonneuve on a program on RDI, revealing—on the subject of marijuana—the basic position we would all take as a committee, which is, and this is my recollection of what he said, that it should remain illegal, but that recreational users of small quantities should no longer have criminal records.

My colleague from Hochelaga—Maisonneuve also published two articles in Quebec last summer setting out his position.

I agree with my colleague, the member for Langley—Abbotsford, that we are not prohibited from talking to journalists in circumstances such as I described. Nor does it in any way constitute divulging the contents of a report.

From the moment an interim report is tabled, the eyes of the media are on us. As a member of the committee, the Alliance member opposite knows that we did all we could to publicly reflect the recommendations contained in the special committee's interim report.

At no time was the text of recommendations 40 and 41, in the form they appeared in the report, made public, which demonstrates that there were no leaks of the report before it was published.

I therefore submit that the report was not leaked. My comments reflected my concerns about the use of marijuana among young people, aged 12 to 18. This is a concern, incidentally, that I expressed publicly on numerous occasions during the committee's public hearings.

If I am guilty, then the other members of the committee are equally so, because each and every one of them, unless I am mistaken, was quoted in newspapers, starting with the member for Hochelaga—Maisonneuve.

I am tabling the article from December 12, which I brought to your attention, where the member for Vancouver East is mentioned. In it, she is quoted as saying:

But another member of the committee, New Democrat, Libby Davies, believes the opposite, that the committee, made up of a majority of Liberals, does not go far enough, because possession of cannabis is still considered illegal—

PrivilegeOral Question Period

3:25 p.m.

The Speaker

Order, please. I believe that the hon. member may not have understood the point raised by the hon. member for Hochelaga—Maisonneuve. At any rate, her explanation is a little too lengthy and I hope she will immediately conclude her comments on this matter.

PrivilegeOral Question Period

3:25 p.m.

Liberal

Carole-Marie Allard Liberal Laval East, QC

Mr. Speaker, for all these reasons, I am asking you not to entertain the request by my colleague for Hochelaga—Maisonneuve.