Debates of May 13th, 2020

Canadian Dairy Commission Act

[John Barlow, Conservative, Foothills, AB]

Mr. Speaker, the minister said this legislation was not needed before because the dairy commission had the borrowing capacity to deal with what was a pandemic that resulted in having to dump milk.

What has changed in the future that it needs this extra borrowing capacity? Is this to deal with COVID, or the additional imports allowed from the United States as a result of the USMCA?

[Marie-Claude Bibeau, Liberal, Compton—Stanstead, QC]

Mr. Speaker, it is directly related to COVID. With the closure of restaurants and hotels, the demand for milk and cheese has decreased significantly. The Canadian Dairy Commission will be using its normal tools, but will also have a higher capacity to buy milk and cheese to store them and resell them later when the demand comes back.

[Richard Lehoux, Conservative, Beauce, QC]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the minister.

Earlier, I neglected to thank her for introducing the bill to increase the borrowing capacity of the Canadian Dairy Commission.

My question concerns processors and dairy production.

There are people working in the dairy processing industry right across Canada. They are currently having to deal with the impact of COVID-19. They have to rework their product processing and come up with new products. Moreover, the fact that CUSMA comes into force on July 1 rather than August 1 only increases the problems they have to contend with.

Having one month rather than one year to transform their production process for goods that will go to market is a catastrophe, and on top of that there are the problems caused by COVID-19.

Has the minister come up with any solutions to help these dairy processors?

[Marie-Claude Bibeau, Liberal, Compton—Stanstead, QC]

Mr. Speaker, we have already announced a $1.75-billion compensation package for dairy farmers for the trans-Pacific free trade deals. We are also committed to continuing to deliver compensation for the agreement with the United States and Mexico.

The free trade agreement being ratified and entering into force earlier than we would have liked has had an impact on the dairy sector. However, when we are talking about the free trade deal with the United States and Mexico, we need to look at the Canadian economy as a whole. That is a plus.

For dairy sector processors, such as manufacturers of skim milk powder, it obviously makes a difference in terms of export capacity, over a five-year period, but that was part of our negotiations for the Canadian economy as a whole.

[Yves Perron, Bloc, Berthier—Maskinongé, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I would like to pick up on what my colleague from Beauce was saying earlier. He talked about the dairy industry and compensation. The minister frequently reminds us that the government has started to pay out compensation, a move hailed by all members. However, many supply-managed sectors have yet to receive compensation. The announcements have not been made yet, but these sectors are calling for modernization programs, among other things.

Given that we are in the midst of the COVID-19 crisis, would the minister not agree that now is a great time to inject funds into agricultural businesses in urgent need of cash? It would not count as new spending because the money has already been promised, on top of any other assistance that could be provided.

[Marie-Claude Bibeau, Liberal, Compton—Stanstead, QC]

Mr. Speaker, as my colleagues well know, we are currently in emergency mode.

We have introduced programs aimed at helping as many Canadians and businesses as we can. We have also begun implementing more targeted measures for each sector, including agriculture, for example.

Right now we need to respond to the more urgent needs. Our commitment to poultry and beef producers remains very firm. As my hon. colleague has suggested, what they want is investments. We will move forward once this crisis is over and we get a chance to look toward the future and begin our economic recovery.

[John Barlow, Conservative, Foothills, AB]

Mr. Speaker, I will be sharing my time with the member for Beauce.

It is my pleasure to rise today to speak to Bill C-16. I know we are all going to be supporting this bill today, and that goes to show we are supporting Canada's agriculture sector. However, there are some issues with how this was brought about and it highlights many of the issues we have been trying to shine a light on with the government's approach to agriculture as a whole and the industry within Canada.

What is being proposed today, which I feel will be supported by all the parties in this House, is, again, additional loan capacity. It is not an injection of funds or a program that would give liquidity to the agriculture sector as a whole.

I did ask the minister if this was a response to the COVID-19 pandemic, or if it was more a response to what Canada's dairy sector will be facing as a result of the increased imports that will be coming from the United States as part of the USMCA.

The minister said in her response that the Canadian Dairy Commission had the loan capacity and the line of credit to deal with the COVID pandemic when it was at its peak, when restaurants and schools were closed, and many of the traditional customers of Canada's dairy producers were closing their doors and were temporarily on lockdown. As a result of those closures, many of our producers, especially in eastern Canada, had to dump millions of litres of milk, which is not something that any Canadian wants to see.

It was certainly good to see Canadians from across the country step up and do everything they could to help our producers, whether they were food banks, schools, or anyone who was willing to take their product and then donate it to those who had a use for it.

However, what that response says to me is that this is more a response to what will happen with the USMCA. The dairy industry in Canada is going to be taking a hit as a result of that.

We have given up a great deal of our trade sovereignty in signing that USMCA. Not only will it increase imports of American dairy products, but it will also limit Canadian dairy producers' opportunities to access foreign markets and it will limit the growth of certain products that are produced right here in Canada.

The other issue that comes to mind is how long it took for the Liberal government to address a problem that was highlighted very early on in Canada's agriculture sector. That has been an ongoing issue with the current government.

Let us take a step back to what was announced last week with the agriculture assistance package of about $250 million. To put that in perspective, the Canadian Federation of Agriculture asked for $2.6 billion as the amount needed to be a tangible relief for Canadian agriculture.

When that announcement came out to be less than 10% of what is deemed by the industry, by producers, food processors, our ranchers and farm families as what is needed for them to be able to keep their heads above water during this pandemic, it was extremely frustrating for our producers.

Let us put that in perspective. This is $250 million to Canadian agriculture, when the President of the United States has given $19 billion. That is putting our industry at a considerable competitive disadvantage.

We look at all the other programs that have been announced for Canadian businesses, and Canadian agriculture is getting a fraction of that. It is extremely difficult when the Prime Minister is saying, time and again, that Canadian agriculture is an essential service and that it is a critical pillar of our food security and of our economy. To say that in one breath, and then not offer the resources the people in that sector need to be successful, does not make a lot of sense. We are seeing the clear frustration of Canadian farmers, producers and food processors who have voiced their displeasure and frustration over the past week since the announcement from the Minister of Agriculture and Agri-Food.

Even today, the Minister of Agriculture and Agri-Food has said that there are business risk management programs in place that agriculture can access. Those business risk management programs were never designed to deal with a pandemic like COVID-19. They were designed to deal with other variables that impact various sectors of agriculture, certainly not a global pandemic. She talks about the $1.6 billion in AgriStability, so let us use AgriStability as an example. Less than 35% of farmers have actually subscribed to AgriStability, because it is not efficient and it is not timely. They may not see a payment for months or even years down the road. By that time they could be bankrupt.

Let us take a look at AgriInvest. She said there is another billion dollars in AgriInvest, but producers have asked who has that money, where is it, and who has access to it. In many cases those dollars have already been spent, or they are being put aside for transition to the next generation.

In no other program, such as CEBA, for example, has the government told small business owners to drain their bank account before they can have access to or qualify for the emergency business account. However, that is exactly what the Minister of Agriculture is asking farmers to do.

Many of these farmers have maybe $5,000 or $10,000 in their AgriInvest account. It is not a huge amount of money we are talking about here, but the Minister of Agriculture is telling those producers they had better drain their savings accounts, and then maybe the government will look at other programs that may be of assistance to them. The government is not asking that of any other sector in Canada's economy, and it is not fair.

The ramifications of that are quite profound. Dr. Sylvain Charlebois, one of the Canadian experts on food security, has said 15% of Canadian farms are in jeopardy of going bankrupt if there is no federal assistance. That is 30,000 family farms in jeopardy. That is a huge number, and we cannot possibly fathom the impact that will have on our rural economies.

More important, what impact is that going to have on Canada's food security? What kind of impact is that going to have on the price of groceries on the store shelves?

I know that for many of us in this room, never in our lifetime have we gone to a grocery store and seen empty shelves, until now. I am hopeful that as a result of this Canadians across the country now have a much better appreciation of where their food comes from, who makes it, how we do it and why we do it.

Every single day we are asking Canadians across the country to stay home, to protect themselves and stay healthy. At the same time, because they are deemed an essential service, we are asking farmers, ranchers and employees at food processors to get up every single day, go to work and work hard to make sure we have food on our tables and on our grocery store shelves.

Those people are asking for respect, and that respect comes from being a priority to the current government and the programs it is putting forward. It is very clear that Canada's food security and our supply chain is not a priority for the government with $250 million being given to farmers through various programs.

The other frustration with this is that these are not new programs and this is not new money. For the government to come out and say it has taken these steps to address the COVID-19 pandemic, even with changing this Dairy Commission legislation, they are still not addressing the pandemic.

These are not extraordinary measures to deal with an unprecedented challenge within our agriculture sector. These are just reannouncements of existing programs. What message does that send to Canadian agriculture?

They are saying that the farmhouse is burning down and the Liberal government is standing by and offering them a bottle of water as assistance. That is just not good enough. It is not good enough for Canadian agriculture. It is not good enough for our farmers, our ranchers and our processors, who are working hard every day to do their jobs, and who do it with pride.

All they are asking for is that the Liberal government stand beside them and show that the work they are doing means something. I think the question the government has to ask itself is this: Is the Liberal government's food security plan to ensure that we have to import food from other countries to feed Canadian families?

[Randy Hoback, Conservative, Prince Albert, SK]

Mr. Speaker, I am really concerned, being on the trade committee, with what happened with respect to the USMCA regarding our sovereignty and how the U.S. now gets to dictate where we can or cannot export our milk products. I am a little concerned when the member says that this funding has come about not necessarily because of the COVID crisis but because of the possibility of that agreement and other agreements the government has signed on to.

Do you think it is using the COVID crisis to hide the mistake it made in its trade agreement?

[The Speaker, Liberal, Anthony Rota]

The hon. member for Foothills, and I want to remind hon. members that when they ask a question to place it through the Speaker, not directly to the member.

[John Barlow, Conservative, Foothills, AB]

Mr. Speaker, I think there is no doubt about it when we have seen over the last several weeks that the United States has asked Canada to make sure that 100% of our TRQs go to retailers and when the dairy processors and producers are asking for those TRQs to be as close to the farm gate as possible.

The Liberal government has seen that in no other trade agreement in our history has Canada surrendered its trade sovereignty to another country, but that is exactly what has happened in the USMCA. Now the United States can get involved in any trade negotiations we have with new non-market trading partners. They also now control the growth of critical dairy products that are produced right here in Canada. In no other trade agreement is that possible, but that has happened under the Liberal government with the USMCA.

[Yves Perron, Bloc, Berthier—Maskinongé, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I thank my hon. colleague for his great speech. I agree with him on many points.

I would like to hear his thoughts on the support being offered to the agricultural industry across Canada, compared to what is being done globally, including in the United States, for example.

What does he think will happen to our food security over the medium and long term if more is not done?

The agricultural sector is calling for urgent, essential measures.

[John Barlow, Conservative, Foothills, AB]

Mr. Speaker, my colleague is exactly right.

Canada has fallen well behind our allies and our competitors around the world when it comes to assistance for our agriculture sector. Bob Lowe, the president of the Canadian Cattlemen's Association, said in committee last week that it is very clear that Canadian agriculture is not getting the respect it deserves from the current government when compared to the assistance that is being given in other countries.

There is no question that there are incredible opportunities for Canadian agriculture, but it is going to be struggling through this as a result of the policies and the inaction of the Liberal government. The impact of that will be that Canadians are going to see higher grocery store prices this fall, or many products are not going to be available, unless we import them from other countries. That would be a shame, when we can be producing these products right here at home.

[Tony Van Bynen, Liberal, Newmarket—Aurora, ON]

Mr. Speaker, my understanding is that the Conservative government cut $400 million in 2013 from the AgriStability fund and the business risk management programs. Why is it now, when we are improving the program, that this is such a significant improvement?

[John Barlow, Conservative, Foothills, AB]

Mr. Speaker, I am so happy my colleague asked that question. When we made those changes to the business risk management programs, there was no carbon tax. We had not lost $5 billion in foreign market access for our commodities. We did not have illegal blockades, CN rail strikes, and grain backlogs.

The landscape facing Canadian agriculture now is very different than it was under the Conservative government. There were no demands for improvements for the BRM under the Conservative government because agriculture was doing well. It was a priority under agriculture minister Gerry Ritz, and our trade minister, the member for Abbotsford, who found 50 new global markets for our agriculture products. However, in the last five years under the Liberal government, agriculture has been an afterthought. It has been neglected, and this is the result we are seeing because of that.

[Richard Lehoux, Conservative, Beauce, QC]

Mr. Speaker, today I rise in the House to speak to government Bill C-16, which seeks to amend existing legislation on the loan capacity of the Canadian Dairy Commission.

Although this amendment is welcome and important, I wonder what took the government so long to get around to it. A little over a month ago, Canadian dairy producers were forced to dump 12.5 million litres of milk in just a week. I received many calls from producers and processors in my riding, including major industry stakeholders. When I asked these stakeholders what the best course of action would be, they all said that they wanted the government to expand the loan capacity of the Canadian Dairy Commission from $300 million to $800 million, or an increase of $500 million in loan capacity.

After speaking with the minister's office, I was informed that the Canadian Dairy Commission experts think the $200-million increase is good enough. The point I want to make here is that this bill took an awfully long time to come into existence, considering that it amends just a line or two of the Act. Why did the government drag its heels on this file?

It is very important to note that many industry stakeholders have told me this legislative change is about two weeks too late. Many of them have already found their own way out of this mess with no help from the government. While it is clear to me that this bill is nevertheless important to the agricultural sector because it will protect our dairy industry, I am left wondering about money for the rest of Canada's agriculture and agri-food sector. This government likes to pat itself on the back for announcing various funds and loans for the sector, but it does not have a solid plan for saving the industry that feeds our country.

For example, the other day in committee, a representative from the Canadian Federation of Agriculture said that without immediate assistance, Canada could lose up to 15% of our farms because of COVID-19. That is about 30,000 farms. I cannot even begin to express how devastating that is to hear. Canada has had a very weak response to COVID-19 in the agriculture and agri-food sector.

Just look at our neighbours, the United States. Their government announced a $19-billion assistance program for the agriculture sector, while our government has done nothing after offering our sector $252 million.

The government provided $50 million in assistance to the beef and pork industries. The Canadian Cattlemen's Association told us the other day in committee that the money was appreciated, but that it was used up two weeks ago to cover the extra feed needed because of the pandemic. The government does not seem to understand that we are in a crisis and that our national food security and our sovereignty are in jeopardy. According to the Canadian Cattlemen's Association, it would cost about $135 million to implement an adequate set-aside program.

Meanwhile, the pork industry is suffering through a nightmare in terms of slaughter capacity. It does not have the option of using a set-aside program like the beef sector, and the government seems content to keep watching animals be euthanized, while telling these farmers to use the existing business risk management programs. I have news for the government: These programs do not work. Changes need to be made to these programs now to help our producers ASAP. The minister keeps boasting about the amazing online calculator for these programs. Could it be that the true purpose of the calculator is to calculate when our businesses will have to fold?

Getting back to this bill, it is very hard to debate it here today. I think I speak for all my colleagues when I say that it is definitely a step in the right direction, but when will the rest of the aid for the agriculture and agri-food sector be announced?

The Prime Minister and the Minister of Agriculture both said that the agricultural industry would be given additional assistance, but when will that be announced? Do they not realize that this industry is having a hard time staying afloat?

Every day, I turn on the television and I hear the Prime Minister announcing new programs and several billion dollars in funding for other industries. I have come to expect no new announcements for agriculture.

Right now, the Prime Minister seems to be, whether consciously or unconsciously, pitting the various industries in our sector against each other, the eastern provinces against the western provinces, or supply managed sectors against non-supply managed sectors. The division is clear, as are the Prime Minister's allegiances.

I would also like to remind the House that the Canadian dairy industry was led to believe that the coming into force of the CUSMA would be delayed in order to give the sector time to prepare for the reformed agreement. Unfortunately, the dairy industry now has only one month to prepare rather than a full year.

I would also like to point out that many of Canada's supply-managed industries are still waiting for announcements regarding their sector. It is wonderful to see assistance for dairy farmers today, but when will the government help other sectors?

Take Canada's poultry producers, for example. Like beef and pork producers, poultry producers will likely have to cull their flocks and absorb revenue losses associated with not processing their birds, but the Prime Minister and the Minister of Agriculture have not announced any help for that sector.

We keep hearing that the AgriRecovery program will fix things for this sector. Unfortunately, the program covers only cull costs, not the value of the birds themselves. Plus, this program does not help processors if culling happens at the plants.

I am so tired of hearing that the government is working with the provinces to find a solution. Why can the government not take the initiative, show some real leadership and make a significant contribution of its own to the agricultural sector?

I could spend a lot more time quoting many very eloquent industry stakeholders. The consensus is simple: The government's COVID-19 pandemic response for the agricultural sector is not nearly good enough. The sector needs help fast, but I think the government's clock is broken.

I look forward to answering my colleagues' question.

[Yves Perron, Bloc, Berthier—Maskinongé, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I thank my colleague from Beauce for his remarkable intervention. He hit the nail on the head. We are rarely on the same wavelength, but there is little we disagree on these days.

I would like him to quickly talk about how the current programs, which the minister keeps reminding everyone to use, do not work. What are some of the criticisms of these programs?

[Richard Lehoux, Conservative, Beauce, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I thank my hon. colleague for the question.

I think it has been proven for several years now that these programs do not work. I am sure that the minister is aware that people have been saying for more than five years now that these programs are not working because people have to exhaust all their resources before they can access them.

For the past two and a half years, these programs have apparently been undergoing an overhaul. Last week, we were told that people have to draw from these programs even though they have to exhaust all their resources first. That does not work.

We had a clear example of that during a meeting of one of the House committees when representatives of the agricultural sector clearly demonstrated that these programs do not work. I do not understand why the government keeps saying that these programs are important and that they have a role to play.

[Gérard Deltell, Conservative, Louis-Saint-Laurent, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank my colleague from Beauce for his remarks, which were very relevant as always, particularly with regard to agricultural issues. Heaven knows that the member knows what he is talking about since he was once a farmer himself. In another life, he ran a family farm for many years.

One of the things that upset me the most over the past two months when it comes to agriculture and food is the euthanasia of animals.

I know we are in a crisis situation, but how can we waste food like that?

I would like the member to explain how that situation played out in his riding of Beauce.

[Richard Lehoux, Conservative, Beauce, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I thank my colleague for his comments.

In my riding, there is an agri-food processing firm, a slaughterhouse, that employs 1,200 people. Many of these employees had to leave the production line due to the public health measures. These measures ought to be respected, to be sure, but as a result the plant's processing capacity has been significantly reduced.

I can tell you that there are more than 100,000 hogs in Quebec farmers' hog barns. In Canada, there is a processing backlog of more than 140,000 hogs.

Pork production is unique and quite unlike other types of production. When piglets enter the pork barn, older hogs are taken away to be slaughtered. We currently have a problem that is only going to get worse with time and, unfortunately, we will have no other choice but to resort to euthanasia. Although this is being put off for now, we will never be able to deal with the backlog at these slaughterhouses. The summer holidays are not far off and it will be very difficult to achieve.

Since this government took so long to take action, animals will have to be euthanized in the cattle industry, not to mention the poultry sector, where hatching eggs have already had to be thrown out, on top of the 200,000 chicks that have been destroyed in Canada.

The saddest part of it all is that this food will not make it to our dinner tables. There is a certain degree of lag time in farming. It is inconceivable to think we can shut down the system today and turn it back on tomorrow and all the meat, dairy and farm products will be on store shelves the next morning.

That is the challenge facing the sector. If we want to maintain our food sovereignty, we are running out of time.

[Yves Perron, Bloc, Berthier—Maskinongé, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I will be sharing my time with my colleague from La Prairie.

If we claim that agriculture and agri-food are essential services, then we have to put our money where our mouth is. We know that agriculture is an important pillar of our economy. In fact, $68 billion in annual revenues come from farms. Every year we lose 5% to 7% of our farms. As my colleague said earlier, it is predicted that this year we might lose 15%. The losses are huge. Millions of litres of milk were dumped, and millions of eggs and chicks were destroyed. The poultry sector has posted losses of $115 million. These figures represent the losses to date.

Right now, there is a backlog of approximately 100,000 slaughter-ready pigs. Day by day, as my colleague said, euthanasia is being put on hold, but it is going to happen eventually. The pigs are growing too fast and cannot be kept in their facilities. This is a highly complex issue.

As for beef, the Canadian Cattlemen's Association is projecting nationwide losses of $500 billion. The beef sector also has a backlog of 100,000 cattle. Grain farmers are facing a loss of $86 million. The government recently announced an investment of $77.5 million to help slaughterhouses upgrade their facilities. However, the food processing industry says those upgrades would cost $860 million. The funding is nowhere near enough.

Slaughterhouses are operating below capacity and sometimes close for days at a time. The restaurant market has collapsed. We need to be aware of these things. Many small eateries will not survive the crisis. Demand will stay low. The agriculture sector is urging us to take action and improve the ongoing programs while taking into account the unfortunate fact that the crisis is going to last longer than a year. I am sorry to be the bearer of bad news. All this uncertainty is putting us under tremendous pressure and threatening our food self-sufficiency, our food security and our national security. It is that bad.

There are also labour problems. We need to talk about foreign workers and seasonal workers. From the numbers we were given, about 85% or 86% of workers have arrived. However, many of those seasonal workers were already here. The more time passes, the harder things will be. There will be a labour shortage of more than 15%. This is not a criticism of immigration officials. On the contrary, I think they are doing a good job. However, we need to be aware of the problems and help our agricultural sector.

In his announcement, the Prime Minister said that it was an initial investment and that if more needed to be done, he would do it. Today I want to let him know that, yes, more is needed, and I hope I am not the last person to say so.

Of course we are here to talk about Bill C-16. Our party has been recommending this solution for several weeks. It has taken a long time, but we are very pleased to see it today. Clearly, we support the bill. It will make it possible for the Canadian Dairy Commission to store additional amounts of products that have a longer shelf life to absorb market fluctuations. This may result in less dumping of milk. Unfortunately, it is a little late, since a lot of milk has already been dumped, but things will be better in the future.

We have a positive attitude and are looking to the future. We are pleased to support the bill, but more must be done. I will compare our situation to what is happening in the United States. In Canada, several measures totalling $252 million have been announced for the agricultural sector; in the United States, producers have received $19 billion in aid. Of course, we do not have the same population. This represents 12 times the amount of assistance. According to OECD estimates, every year, year after year, the U.S. provides twice as much support for its agricultural sector than Canada.

Farmers are strong, proud and good people who get up in the morning to work so that they can feed our people. At some point they also have to grapple with international issues, and they are facing competition. In a hockey game, the players need to be on equal footing. If my stick is too short, I will not be able to win the game. We need to give our farmers the tools and support they need, and what is going on now is outrageous.

I will calm down a bit, but it is unacceptable. Of the $252 million in assistance, $125 million is not new money. The government can have fun with creative bookkeeping, twist definitions and call it unused money, but at the end of the day, this $125 million is not new money. The government can make announcements, but it should not be presenting this money as new money, when that is untrue. That is misleading.

We are talking about the $50 million that Canada is allocating to buy back food surpluses, but the United States allocated $3 billion for that same purpose just this week. I do not know what it will be later, but the situation is totally surreal.

The government keeps saying that it is working hard to find solutions. I have a simple solution to propose to the government. Once again, I am reaching out and offering my help. I think that the other parties are interested in doing the same. We are here to work, but the government needs to listen to our constituents.

In her remarks earlier today, the minister said that we need to give people what they are asking for. To that, I say let's do it. We are ready. What are these people asking for? They are asking for a targeted emergency fund and quick action.

Small businesses are in trouble. The Fédération de la relève agricole du Québec said that it did not get any answers regarding practical measures to enable small agricultural businesses to be eligible for emergency loans. Sadly, these small businesses do not have a payroll of $20,000. They get paid differently, with dividends, but that does not count. Sadly, that does not fit into the right column on the form. I do not know whether that can be inputted in the much-talked-about calculator, but these businesses are not eligible.

Processors are sounding the alarm over cold storage. They need support because they are storing a lot more inventory than before. Must even more food go to waste?

The government says the AgriStability program works and is asking farmers to use the existing programs. Let's talk about that.

First off, telling farmers to use the AgriInvest program is like telling students that they are going to get help because there will not be any jobs this summer, but only if they empty their bank accounts first. The same is happening with farmers. These programs are investments in case of need. It is appropriate to treat farmers like any other group in society. This is about saving money. I am sure the government will get up and tell me that this is what emergency measures are for. Yes, but this is an exceptional situation.

Marcel Groleau, president of the Union des producteurs agricoles, appeared before the committee this week. He was wondering if decision-makers even understand these programs, and he explained how AgriStability works. The example he shared was of a typical farm that brings in $250,000 per year, spends $100,000 and nets $150,000. As it stands, the program requires the program year margin not to exceed 70% of the reference margin. This year, if such a farm were to lose $80,000, or more than 50% of its revenue, it would not collect a cent from the existing program. Clearly, this program is not working. Without that margin, the program would pay the farm $24,500 to compensate it for the $80,000 loss. Ever since before the crisis, the agricultural sector has been asking the government to change the rate to 85%, which would result in a $40,250 payment. That would be a program that works, just as it did before the 2013 cuts.

People are asking us to take action in a targeted way. I am going to set the rest of my notes aside because I am almost out of time and I want to appeal to parliamentarians to work together. Yes, we are all members of different political parties that each have separate objectives. However, with this COVID-19 pandemic, now is not the time to sound like a broken record or to toe the party line. It is time to work on behalf of farmers, who need us to take action.

If our response was appropriate, I do not think that, two days later, a large group of farmers would indicate publicly that it is no good. It takes a couple of days to read a document, conclude that it is no good, call one's friends and organize a meeting.

[Randy Hoback, Conservative, Prince Albert, SK]

Mr. Speaker, as we see these farms across Canada face financial hardship going into spring planting and in putting their cattle to pasture and things like that as they transition to the summer months, there is definitely a huge cash flow requirement at this point in time.

With the bill we are talking about today, the Liberals are looking at this fund and saying that, because of COVID, the government is injecting these funds into this organization. The reality, in fact, is that it is because of bad decisions made by the government in the past that our farmers are in such bad shape that they are not able to withstand stress such as COVID or anything else.

Does the member think that there needs to be more help provided to farmers who face this financial crunch as they go into the season?

I can tell the member that Costco in Saskatoon did not have beef this week, and that is a real thing.

[Yves Perron, Bloc, Berthier—Maskinongé, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I thank my colleague for the question.

As I said earlier, I am not here to criticize past actions by any government. I am here as part of a call to action.

Let's put ourselves in the shoes of a vegetable producer for example. He has to invest between $850,000 and $1 million to sow his field. It should be noted that agriculture has never been easy and nor will it be two years from now. There are external factors such as the weather and a surprise strike at CN last fall. On top of all that, this year farmers do not know if they will have enough workers at harvest time.

Producers are telling me they are going to plant soybeans and harvest it mechanically; that way, they will be okay for a year. They will lose hundreds of thousands of dollars, but they will still be there next year. If they sow their fields with the current guarantees, they risk losing more than $1 million and going bankrupt. They will not do that because agricultural producers are entrepreneurs. Keep in mind that they have to assess the risk.

As a result, there will be a food shortage in the fall and products will be a lot more expensive. We will be dependent on foreign imports provided, of course, that foreign countries will want to send us their goods. Some recent examples might lead us to believe they will not. By the fall it will be too late. We have to act now.

[Richard Lehoux, Conservative, Beauce, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I want to congratulate my colleague on his excellent speech. He is always so passionate and engaging. I think we agree on some points.

I do not understand why we are still debating this today. For more than three weeks now, we have been calling on the government to take substantial action for Canada's agri-food sector. I do not know whether my colleague has an opinion on this matter.

What will we have to do?

Earlier I mentioned that we are running out of time. What is the government waiting for?

The $250 million announced last week will not fix the problems in the coming weeks and months for Canada's agriculture and agri-food industry. As my colleague said, there will be supply problems in the fall. This disruption will not disappear and will catch up to us.

What does my colleague suggest that we do?

[Yves Perron, Bloc, Berthier—Maskinongé, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I thank my colleague for his question and comments. I really appreciate it.

Before answering the question, I would like to share my personal interpretation of this notion of time. We are not just running out of time. We are most definitely out of time. It is now or never.

The member for Beauce asked what we should do. We all need to sit down together to figure out a solution. We need to know what kind of wiggle room the government has and how much it can invest. Then we need to see what stakeholders think of our solution. We need to do something, even if it means working weekends and around the clock, so we can announce a fund next week. That is where we are at. We need to adapt our programs.

A lot of money has been thrown at the problem so far. I am not criticizing; we agreed with that. We had to take action. The government injected over $252 billion. I do not for a second believe that there is no money for agriculture. What use is health care if people have nothing to eat?

[Alain Therrien, Bloc, La Prairie, QC]

Mr. Speaker, we are in the midst of a health crisis. Everyone knows that. A health crisis affects the health of the population. More demands are being put on the health care systems of the various regions of Canada. Unfortunately, Quebec is no exception. We know that the Quebec health care system has been sorely tried by the COVID-19 crisis. Seniors' residences in Quebec are a good example of the major difficulties being faced by the Quebec government and the Quebec health care system in particular.

What are the solutions?

We know that the government is trying to find solutions to the problems facing Quebec and Canada, but it is relying on an old habit. It is the old habit of thinking that big brother in Ottawa knows better than everyone else, that big brother in Ottawa will solve the problem for the provinces and Quebec and will tell everyone else to step aside, because big brother has the solution. The problem is that, based on the slapdash way it managed the border closure at the beginning of the pandemic and the way it managed the Phoenix pay system, I am a bit worried when I hear the government saying that it has all the answers and it knows what to do.

The NDP leader made it very clear today that he thinks the federal government just needs to meddle in the jurisdictions of the provinces and Quebec. It just needs to shove the provinces aside. However, everyone in the National Assembly in Quebec's Parliament and everyone across Quebec agrees that Quebec's jurisdiction must be respected, more specifically with regard to health. I am not the one saying this. This comes from the National Assembly and the various political parties.

As a solution, the Liberals initially tried to take over the long-term care homes. However, they were promptly informed that it was none of their business. I think they got the message.

There are always roundabout ways of doing things. The federal government said earlier that the jurisdictions of the provinces and Quebec must be respected, yet the Minister of Health said it wants to provide money for mental health, home care and so on. It cannot do that. That is a roundabout way of doing something it is not allowed to do directly. It cannot offer money to sectors that are managed by the provinces and Quebec with strings attached.

What is the solution, then? I can say that the NDP's solution is completely off base. It is not surprising that the NDP, which had 59 MPs from Quebec in 2011 has just one left. The Liberals' solution is no better. The Conservatives have proven that they cannot maintain consistent measures over time and were not able to manage the health care systems in the provinces and Quebec.

The solution is set out in the British North America Act, that famous document that created Canada. The solution is right there in black and white. This document states that the provinces have jurisdiction over health, and this document is sacred to many. It is simple: Health care belongs to the provinces and Quebec.

The Constitution also covers how government services are funded. Since the Canadian provinces and Quebec start off with fewer financial means to manage their jurisdictions, the Constitution was written to include a system in which the federal government would transfer funds to the provinces and Quebec. They knew that the money was in Ottawa but the needs were in Quebec. The fiscal imbalance dates all the way back to 1867.

Let's look back in history. At the time, this was not a major issue because health was often managed by religious orders. However, it became a problem when the responsibility for health was transferred to the welfare state in 1960.

Quebec was going to manage the health care system and would obviously call on Ottawa to lend a hand by providing program funding and federal transfers. It was thought that Quebec and the federal government would fund the system fifty-fifty, but such was not the case.

What happened was that—