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Crucial Fact

  • His favourite word was finance.

Last in Parliament September 2007, as Bloc MP for Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot (Québec)

Won his last election, in 2006, with 56% of the vote.

Statements in the House

Federal Investments October 29th, 1996

Mr. Speaker, the Minister of Intergovernmental Affairs does not know what he is talking about and the Prime Minister is afraid to answer the questions put by the Leader of the Opposition.

The Minister of Intergovernmental Affairs talks about political programs, when billions of dollars are being invested annually by the federal government, but not in Quebec.

When opposition members, with figures to back them up, say that Quebec has not received its share of federal government and Crown corporation investments, the government can create all the diversions it wants, but one fact remains: according to the government's own figures, Quebec has missed out on over seven billion federal dollars over the last 15 years.

My question is for the Prime Minister, if he dares to answer it. Will the Prime Minister admit that the seven billion dollars not invested by the federal government in Quebec over the last 15 years that should have been invested there given the size of its population represents over 8,100 jobs a year lost to Quebec through his fault?

Federal Investments October 29th, 1996

Yes, it hurts.

Bell Canada Act October 29th, 1996

Madam Speaker, my hon. colleague from Portneuf has taken the words right out of my mouth. I had written, to conclude my response to our colleague from the Reform Party, that the Reformers might consider joining us in our pursuit to ensure that all our fellow citizens may enjoy the benefits of the deregulation process as soon as possible and have their rates cut.

I am reaching out to the Reform Party. If ever you experience in your rural communities the same unfair situation my fellow citizens of Saint-Pie and Saint-Damaze are facing following Bell Canada's recent decisions, I urge you to join forces with us, and I will be pleased to join with you on this issue.

On other issues, it may be a different story, but on this one, I must say that we think alike and that is a good thing. The purpose of this coalition was to get the minister to yield, so that there will not be first-class and second-class citizens in Quebec and Canada, but only one class of citizens served by these large corporations and also by medium sized communications companies.

Your analysis, which you shared with us earlier, hon. colleague from the Reform Party, is exactly along the same lines as our analyses and those of the Bloc member for Portneuf. If our parties can, for this once, join forces in the interest of our fellow citizens, we will do so.

In the meantime, let me tell you that, over the next few weeks, the CRTC will be hearing representations from various groups on the application for rate increase presented by Bell Canada on September 6. I urge you to do as some of us have done and write the CRTC, asking that the system be modernized without rates being raised.

Bell Canada Act October 29th, 1996

Madam Speaker, I welcome my Reform colleague's comments and questions. We must set the record straight: we are not against deregulation, except when it has such perverse effects, when, instead of the promised rate reductions, we end up facing rate increases. Another perverse effect is that-to get back to my Reform colleague's remark-competition benefits major centres and big consumers.

However, in rural and semi-rural regions, Bell and its competitors are not so eager to provide good services to their customers. That is why deregulation should be followed up to determine its impact on local communities. I can tell you that the deregulation of telephone services has not been good to rural communities so far.

It is up to the minister responsible for communications to ensure that rural communities can benefit from the positive impact of competition in the area of telephone and communications services-and there is indeed a positive impact. Under the current policy, there are now two types of citizens: the people living in densely populated areas, who receive good communications services, and those who live farther away from major centres, who are poorly served by communications companies.

There is no need to go very far. Saint-Pie and Saint-Damase are only about 50 kilometres away from Montreal and some 10 or 15 kilometres from Saint-Hyacinthe. But just because of this short distance, telephone companies are not so eager to provide good services to the population, and that is not normal.

I agree that deregulation can bear fruit, but the fruit has started to rot even before the tree has reached maturity. This is the minister's fault. We are asking the minister to remedy the perverse effects of deregulation and ensure that Bell Canada and its competitors provide the same high quality services to all citizens, whether they live in cities or in rural communities. That is not the case today.

Bell Canada Act October 29th, 1996

Madam Speaker, I am pleased to speak today to the second reading of Bill C-57, an act to issue a broadcasting licence to Bell Canada to allow it to compete in the cable industry.

What is at stake here with the bill is not the principle of deregulation as such, but the results obtained as opposed to the results expected by the minister responsible for the communications sector.

You will recall that, when the Liberals formed the federal government in 1993, they promised to pursue the deregulation objective in the telephone industry and the communications sector. They promised especially that, with this deregulation, consumers in Quebec and Canada as a whole would end up benefiting from reduced rates. However, since this deregulation objective has been set into motion, the effects have been totally the opposite.

Far from arriving at a reduction of these rates, we were confronted with rate increases, even in the sector where they had promised the most reductions in communications rates, that is long distance rates.

Data have been checked out. Since 1992, most residential subscribers, mainly those of Stentor, which is a partner of Bell Canada, have not seen one cent of reduction in the long distance rates. Not one cent of reduction since 1992, while they were promised, especially in the long distance market, a substantial reduction of these rates.

The only ones whose long distance bills went down are the major consumers, most of which are large corporations concentrated in major urban centres such as Montreal and Toronto.

Everywhere else, all regular customers in Quebec, all the people who voted for this government in Canada and for the Bloc Quebecois in Quebec did not see a penny in reduction in long distance rates. As for local rates, the situation is almost disastrous. Not only has there been no reduction in rates but, by deregulating left and right and promising just about anything, they compromised the basic principle of cross-subsidizing telephone services.

Under the cross-subsidization principle, operating surpluses generated in major urban centres, especially for long distance, were used to subsidize local service, which, in some small communities throughout Canada, costs more than in major centres.

The cross-subsidization principle was replaced by that of rate rebalancing. What was the result of this rate rebalancing? Since 1994, basic telephone service rates have risen by $2 per month, per year, over three years. In other words, in three years, the monthly bills of consumers in Quebec and Canada will be $6 higher than if the principle of cross-subsidization had been maintained.

The most outrageous in all of this is that Bell Canada is taking advantage of these CRTC rulings, which Bell Canada itself contributes to since it provides documentation to the CRTC. Bell has a range of experts who do not carry as much weight as consumers or their representatives. But, instead of using these higher revenues taken from the pockets of consumers to remain competitive or modernize, Bell uses them to increase its stockholders' rate of return.

Mr. McLennan, the president of Bell Canada, made no bones about it. He was quoted in the December 21, 1995 edition of Le Devoir as saying as that the rate increases approved by the CRTC would result in a 1 per cent increase in the rate of return of stockholders' equity for the year 1996.

This is not modernization. Bell Canada is taking advantage of increases authorized by the CRTC to dig into the pockets of consumers and increase the return on investment of its shareholders. In fact, a spokesperson for the Fédération nationale des associations de consommateurs had this to say at the time: "Canadian households will have to pay more than $1 billion in increases over the next three years for the telephone companies to achieve the level of profits they are hoping for".

In other words, deregulation, CRTC decisions, what the minister says, his policies and directions, all that is not designed to serve consumers, as he claimed, nor to reduce long distance rates for the average consumer or local rates, but to increase all these rates and take out of the pockets of consumers the money Bell Canada needs to sweeten the package offered to its shareholders.

I find that absolutely despicable. Especially given that Mr. McLennan was going around this year forecasting $700 million in net profits for Bell Canada, or a 40 per cent increase over last year's profits.

Now, they have the gall to ask for more rate increases to be approved, so that they can fill their pockets even more, with the blessing of the minister, who keeps talking about abstract and vague concepts and does not bother to monitor the impact of his decisions and directions.

When you are looking to deregulate and ensure that communications systems meet the needs of the 1990s, into the next century, as my hon. colleague so aptly pointed out, you must ensure at the same time that a procedure is in place to follow up and monitor what is going on in terms of price increases. Soon, with such increases for basic telephone services, andother services too, communications will become a luxury item. Average families will no longer be able to afford these services.

Bell Canada and its competition offer an incredible range of services. But, as the hon. member for Portneuf said, who will be able to use these services?

This issue raises a lot of questions. Here is another example of rate increase based on deregulation without monitoring, as applied by by the minister responsible for communications: Last spring, Bell Canada asked the CRTC to increase the rates of its business clients located in small rural communities.

Some small businesses, referred to as VSBs or very small businesses, located in rural communities saw their basic rate jump from $44 to $54 per month, a $10 increase. This puts small businesses located in rural communities at a further competitive disadvantage, since the increase in densely populated areas, that is in major urban centres, was only $5. The increase imposed on small businesses located in rural communities is more than twice that of their competition in major urban centres.

This is not normal, particularly from a government that claims to support small rural communities and regional development. The government is killing entrepreneurship by playing a part in such decisions.

This is a serious matter. The Quebec vice-president of the Canadian Federation of Independent Business, Mr. Cléroux, condemned this decision made last spring regarding small businesses in rural communities. He said the situation of a number of these businesses is precarious, adding that such an increase would adversely affect their performance and could even threaten their survival. Such are the effects of this government's deregulation, a process which does not involve any monitoring and which is irresponsible.

When the industry asks the government to support deregulation, as we do, the government must monitor the situation and provide a framework. It must not let the situation turn into a free for all. It must not let anarchy set in. More importantly, it must not let the shareholders of Bell Canada, Stentor and all the others raid the pockets of consumers in Quebec and Canada. That is not the purpose of deregulation. The purpose is to have better service, service that is competitive and is more concerned with what consumers can afford than with making money for the richest shareholders in Bell Canada. It is not right.

Finally, last September 6, and I tell you this because it is a matter of great importance to me, Bell Canada had good news for us. I said to myself that any good news in the matter of deregulation brings with it news that is not so good, and I was right. Last September 6, Bell Canada announced that it was modernizing all its telephone and communication facilities in small municipalities in Quebec and Ontario.

I believe some 500 or 550 municipalities, including 300 in Quebec, were involved. This was good news, excellent news, because for years, municipalities and economic development corporations, as well as the federal government, have been pushing Bell Canada to modernize its exchanges. Why? You would be surprised.

At a time when the focus is on telecommunications, the very latest in service, the information highway, all these ultramodern services, you would be surprised to learn that over 300 municipalities in Quebec and over 200 in Ontario do not even have 9-1-1 service.

The networks are so antiquated that they do not have 9-1-1, and conference calls are not possible. The vast array of services offered by Bell Canada is not to be found in these municipalities. But the advertising is.

It is frustrating for people to receive advertising on a range of services with a 30 per cent discount on 10 ultramodern communications services offered by Bell Canada and to be told by head office that they are not entitled to these services, that they may not take advantage of the 30, 40, 50 and 70 per cent discounts because their system is completely behind the times, ready for the junk heap.

We were happy last September 6 at the marvellous news that Bell Canada was going to modernize its networks. At last, no more lives will be at risk. It is a serious matter when you do not have access to 9-1-1 service in communities. Situations can arise where citizens' lives are in danger and Bell Canada is doing nothing.

They are happy, except that there is a hitch, and it is this: Bell Canada will be passing on to these small communities the cost of modernizing the network in the form of a major hike in rates for local service. In other words, three municipalities elsewhere in Quebec, as in Ontario, located in urban or semi-urban areas, had their modernization paid for by all Bell customers, but those remaining, small rural communities, will have to cover the cost themselves. This is no small matter.

If I look at my riding, where two municipalities and parishes have these outmoded communications systems, monthly rates will increase by approximately $4. In addition to this $4, there are the increases already planned by Bell. I would remind you that they are talking of a $2 hike in 1996, $2 in 1997, $2 in 1998, which makes $6 more on local rates. Now another $4. Do you realize what this means over 25 months for telephone service charges? A rise of close to 100 per cent.

Is such a situation normal, when everywhere else with a high population density systems were modernized from the funding of the entire client base? Now they will be demanding a rate increase on a case by case basis to meet the costs of such modernization.

Small rural communities are required to be cost-effective, to fit in with the movement toward market globalization, to compete with major centres, as well as internationally, and so we end up with situations of discrimination such as this.

About a year and a half ago, a coalition for the modernization of Bell Canada service was formed in my riding. I would like to take this opportunity to acknowledge the hard work of that coalition, which may have prompted Bell Canada's decision to speed up modernization. No rate increases were called for, mind you.

Today, I would like to single out the following for their excellent work: the mayor of Saint-Hyacinthe, Claude Bernier, who is also reeve of the regional county municipality and one the key players in the coalition; Jean Messier, Mayor of Saint-Damase; Mr. Guillet, Mayor of the Parish of Saint-Damase; Mr. Adam, Mayor of the Village of Saint-Pie; Rosaire Martin, Mayor of the Parish of Saint-Pie. I salute, as well, Mario de Telly, Director of the Saint-Hyacinthe economic development corporation. I am grateful for their support and the strong stands they have taken in this matter for the greater good of their fellow citizens.

As I have said, this coalition had only one purpose: to obtain for a population marginalized by Bell Canada the broad range of modern services which technological advances have now made available.

Bell was not, however, ever asked to increase rates inordinately, as it did in the plan it submitted to the CRTC this past September.

We are calling for the government to get a little more involved in this situation, not only for the sake of Saint-Pie and Saint-Damase, but also for the other 300 Quebec and 250 Ontario municipalities. In the name of its deregulation policy, in the name of its communications policy, the government must require the CRTC not to allow any anomalies such as there are in Saint-Pie and Saint-Damase in my region, and in more than 300 other municipalities in Quebec and Ontario.

The government has to act responsibly, because you cannot treat people in rural areas like second class citizens. They have the same rights as everybody else, and they are entitled to the basic service provided by Bell Canada and other telephone companies. And they also have the same right as anyone else to the services provided by Bell Canada.

I was astonished to see Mr. McLennan announce at a press conference that Bell Canada would make a profit of $712 million this year and probably even more next year, which will mean more money for the shareholders. Meanwhile, after announcing this increase in profits and increased dividends for shareholders, he announced that in the course of the next 25 months, basic service rates in small rural municipalities would go up by 100 per cent.

Here we do not find compassion nor any concern for dealing fairly with the various regions in this country.

Sure, we want Bell Canada to modernize its equipment. Sure, we want deregulation which, if the minister does his job and if this government does its job, might improve rates for the consumer, but at the same time, we do not want small municipalities which are already at a disadvantage because of their location, compared with more centrally located areas, to be charged more by a big corporation that is federally regulated.

We hope the CRTC will respond to appeals from the coalition in my riding, and I mentioned some prominent members of the coalition earlier, and that it will require Bell Canada to use part of its $700 million in profits to modernize its equipment without gouging the consumer. I also speak on behalf of Quebec's 300 rural municipalities which are in the same boat as the municipalities of Saint-Pie et Saint-Damase in my region, since the UMRCQ, at its last convention, voted almost unanimously to pass a resolution along the lines of the coalition founded in Saint-Hyacinthe against rate increases to pay for updating facilities.

Federal Investments October 28th, 1996

Mr. Speaker, the minister did not get the meaning of my question. Since the Liberals took office, public investments in Quebec have decreased, in relation to the rest of the country. Federal investments have decreased in Quebec in the last three years. This is what we are saying.

The Prime Minister tells us this is related to the bidding process. Maybe once or twice, but after 15 years one begins to wonder. This is systematic discrimination.

This is what my supplementary is about. Does the Prime Minister or the Minister of Industry find it normal that, for the past 15 years, again according to this recent study by Statistics Canada, federal investments in Quebec have accounted for only 16.4 per cent of federal spending, instead of 25 per cent, thus resulting in a shortfall of close to $4 billion for Quebec? This is a lot of money and a lot of jobs that the Liberal government, and its Conservative predecessor, deliberately refused to create in Quebec.

Federal Investments October 28th, 1996

Mr. Speaker, according to Statistics Canada, since the Liberals took office in Ottawa, federal investments in Quebec have constantly been decreasing, going down from 19.7 per cent of total Canadian investments in 1993 to 15.4 per cent this year. Normally, Quebec should have been entitled to one quarter of federal investments.

How can the Prime Minister, who bragged this past weekend about what he had in store for Quebec, explain this decrease in federal investments in Quebec since he took office?

Taxation October 24th, 1996

Mr. Speaker, I want to congratulate the Government of Quebec, because it is doing its job and gives the people real information. It does not shamefully waste one billion dollars on political compensation for an agreement entered into locally with the maritimes. That is what I have to say. I cannot congratulate the Minister of Finance.

My supplementary is also directed to the Deputy Prime Minister.

In the red book, the Liberal government also promised to make the tax system more equitable. Will the Deputy Prime Minister admit that by refusing for more than three years to initiate a thorough tax reform, as the Bloc Quebecois asked it to do, the government has reneged on its promises in the red book and even perpetuated inequities through its shameful cover-up of the family trust scandal?

Taxation October 24th, 1996

Words, words, words, Mr. Speaker. We do not want words, we want action. We want job creation.

In their notorious red book, the Liberals promised more justice, fairness and transparency in the Canadian tax system. But remember the Minister of Finance, when he said he would not eliminate the GST as his government had promised and naively admitted to misinforming the entire population of this country.

My question is directed to the Deputy Prime Minister. Now that her government has offered a bribe of nearly one billion dollars to three maritime provinces so they will harmonize their sales tax with the GST, will the Deputy Prime Minister have the courage to admit that her government did not abide by its campaign promise-and here it comes, in case she forgot-to eliminate the GST, not harmonize it, not hide it in the sale price, not shamefully waste one billion dollars of Canadian taxpayers money?

Supply October 24th, 1996

I thank the hon. member for Outremont and minister in charge of regional development. But if he really wants to work, I urge him to show his unflagging faith in Montreal's future and to publicly undertake to oppose the project for a Canada-wide securities commission.

The answer he gave when he quoted the Minister of Finance is far from satisfactory, and I will tell him that no Quebecer believes in that statement from the Minister of Finance that, if Quebec refuses to participate in the activities of the Canada-wide securities commission, the Quebec Securities Commission will remain, and there will be two commissions.

Nobody believes that, for two reasons. First, when there is a securities commission for all of Canada, a national commission, it takes precedence over all of the others. Financial circles will turn to the Canada-wide securities commission, which will probably be established in Toronto, because all this government's financial decisions revolve around Toronto. Second, the government wishes to increase efficiency, yet it will agree to maintain provincial securities commissions in addition to a national commission. This is absolutely inefficient and not in the interest of the financial circles, which are looking for stability and certainty.