Evidence of meeting #47 for Canadian Heritage in the 39th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was cbc.
11:40 a.m.
Secretary, ACTRA (Manitoba)
Indeed, I took part myself in several of these productions either as an actor or as director. What the local Radio-Canada did at the time was simply film the play put on by the Cercle Molière either in the theatre or sometimes in a studio, according to the type of production.
11:40 a.m.
Bloc
Diane Bourgeois Bloc Terrebonne—Blainville, QC
In the other places we visited where francophones came to testify, we were told that you did not necessarily have access to the news in French, perhaps because of the different time zones.
So there is news being produced in Quebec, but nothing else is happening here. The problem may be due to time zone differences. Is that a possibility or not?
11:40 a.m.
Secretary, ACTRA (Manitoba)
No, I can't see that. As you say, the only French-language television production broadcast by Radio-Canada here is the news bulletin. Occasionally, there is a special musical radio program that features local talent but that is the exception.
11:40 a.m.
Bloc
Diane Bourgeois Bloc Terrebonne—Blainville, QC
If I understand correctly Radio-Canada is not fulfilling its mandate to offer the same number of programs in both official languages. Are you criticizing the current mandate or the fact that Radio-Canada is not fulfilling its mandate?
11:40 a.m.
Secretary, ACTRA (Manitoba)
I am criticizing Radio-Canada's lack of will. Montreal gets all of the money and the production is done in Quebec. You know as I do that there are a large number of television productions, but the majority of English-language programs that reach us are American programs. In Quebec, there is a great deal of production being done. As you know, Quebec has its stars. What is being done there is extraordinary, but it is entirely Quebec-based. There seems to be no will to go outside those boundaries nor even any interest in knowing what is happening outside Quebec. There is just no interest.
11:40 a.m.
Bloc
Diane Bourgeois Bloc Terrebonne—Blainville, QC
Has your association or another association from Manitoba discussed this with Radio-Canada? Have you ever made any representations in this regard?
11:40 a.m.
Secretary, ACTRA (Manitoba)
As it happens, this afternoon I believe you will also be hearing from a representative from the Société franco-manitobaine, our political voice. He will surely be able to give you numerous examples of the work they have done with Radio-Canada to try and break this deadlock. He will be able to give you more concrete examples than I can.
11:40 a.m.
Bloc
Diane Bourgeois Bloc Terrebonne—Blainville, QC
We will be listening carefully. That's all, thank you very much.
11:40 a.m.
NDP
Charlie Angus NDP Timmins—James Bay, ON
Thank you for a very interesting presentation.
It's depressing to hear of the on-the-ground programming disappearance we're seeing here in Manitoba, especially in terms of radio drama.
You talked about there being no funding envelopes regionally. My sense is that with radio, even if we are seeing a loss of dramatic production coming out of the regions, at least they do seem to make a concerted effort to move certain national shows into various areas, particularly things like holiday specials. They've always moved out of Toronto or Vancouver. You hear Halifax. You hear Edmonton. Even provincially, in my area, Sudbury gets its own chance to do at least provincial and sometimes national shows. We don't see any of that in terms of television.
Would you have a recommendation for how television could start to move beyond the idea that all the good ideas come from south of Bloor and Danforth?
11:40 a.m.
Vice-President, ACTRA (Manitoba)
One of the challenges for the CBC is to take a position of taking risks. It's one of the things missing in terms of the programming, and it would actually bolster that idea of producing from regional envelopes.
If you are looking for your surefire bet, if you are looking for a production that is commercially viable, I think you're going down the wrong path. Just two days ago in The Globe and Mail, there was an article about the CBC's upcoming season. It was beyond bland. Though very safe, it was, as a result, very bland, and perhaps not even very representative of our need to express our culture and to, as a result, have a unity and an understanding across the country.
By taking a position that the CBC is uniquely able to take—to take risks in their programming—you will start to see more interest from the public. I think you will see an increase in the number of people watching the CBC.
Also, if there is a recognition across the country—“Oh, I recognize that writer”, or “Oh, my goodness, there's my cousin on television”—you will have more success. People tune out when they see a national broadcaster that seems to have one centre or two centres.
11:45 a.m.
NDP
Charlie Angus NDP Timmins—James Bay, ON
You talked about the need to be ready for high definition. I'm concerned about our inability to be ready for low definition.
For example, my kids don't watch TV, they watch YouTube, and what they watch on YouTube are BBC productions. They are very funny, very edgy. The quality is terrible, but it doesn't matter. My kids watch these in ten-minute segments and have to find the next one. The entire BBC catalogue is now online, and ours isn't. I know that ACTRA has just come through a strike on remuneration on Internet services.
When I put the question to CBC management about why our back catalogue is not out there for people to watch in the digital universe, I was shocked by their answer, that they wouldn't be able to get the rights. There are so many competing rights holders for various shows, and with the ultimate in technological protection measures, the shows are locked in a vault. Nobody sees them there.
What recommendations do you have to ensure that in a changing medium, where we don't know how to fully monetize, we are going to get our shows out there and ensure that people are remunerated?
11:45 a.m.
Secretary, ACTRA (Manitoba)
Perhaps you should suggest to the CBC that they ask the BBC how they did it. That would be a start.
11:45 a.m.
President, ACTRA (Manitoba)
But also, because we've just settled that part of the agreement in terms of the new media, I think any new media now is protected--
11:45 a.m.
A voice
He's talking about different rights.
11:45 a.m.
Branch Representative, ACTRA (Manitoba)
On that question, I don't think it's our job to tell the CBC how to get their programs on the air. If they're a professional company, shouldn't they be able to work this out? If there are competing rights, you negotiate the rights with the owners. I don't think it's our job to tell them how to get it on the air.
11:45 a.m.
NDP
Charlie Angus NDP Timmins—James Bay, ON
Well, I guess I'm looking for an answer on this because I believe that all of our talk about cultural sovereignty is going to be irrelevant if we're not on the air in a new medium. One of the criticisms we've heard about the Canadian Television Fund is that because it's all done through independent production houses, getting the secondary rights to get it on the Internet is not worth it. So they show it on TV and then it sits there. Meanwhile, the Internet services are happening elsewhere. BBC has the rights to its shows, so it's putting them on, but our production shows are mostly independent productions.
What is ACTRA's position on this?
11:45 a.m.
Branch Representative, ACTRA (Manitoba)
If you're talking about Internet broadcast for CBC-owned productions, we're actually in negotiations with them on that right now. But my understanding is that currently there's nothing stopping them from broadcasting it. I don't believe we have specific words in an agreement around it. I know they're negotiating it now. I don't believe ACTRA is in a position of stopping them from broadcasting it.
11:50 a.m.
NDP
Charlie Angus NDP Timmins—James Bay, ON
No, I'm not saying ACTRA is; I'm asking what your recommendations would be to ensure that the productions you're part of are being seen after their first shot on television, that they're going onto a digital platform so that you're also being remunerated. It seems we haven't made that step.
11:50 a.m.
Branch Representative, ACTRA (Manitoba)
We just negotiated terms in the independent production agreement--this isn't with CBC but with other producers--whereby we'll get a separate remuneration the day it goes onto the Internet, based on what we call distributors' gross revenue, the amount of money they make from distributors and broadcasters. We will get a separate percentage of that amount, which we've negotiated out, which ACTRA will get and disburse to the performers.
So with regard to independent production, that's what we've worked out. We've agreed to it. I'm sure something in terms of what the CBC and ACTRA will be doing will be very comparable. But I'm wondering if that's the real issue or if it is instead around co-ownerships, not really the ACTRA contract.
