Citizenship and Immigration Committee on Sept. 26th, 2023

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Yes, I was identifying that study and referring to the study about the closed work permits, the UN rapporteur, the officials' comments and the minister's comments, etc. That is the study that I am referring to.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

Is there any further discussion? Should we take...?

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

Can we have it read so we can understand it?

[The Clerk]

In the minutes, it would appear as “that evidence received in the context of the study on closed work permits and the United Nations Special Rapporteur”—the study will need a name eventually—“be included in the study of people with temporary status and undocumented individuals”.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

Is it all good?

(Motion agreed to)

Madam Kwan, again the floor is yours.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Thank you very much.

I have a new motion, Mr. Chair. I would like to move:

That pursuant to Standing Order 108(2), the committee invite the newly appointed Minister of Immigration, Refugees, and Citizenship to appear before the committee for one hour to brief the committee on the Minister’s priorities and objectives for the department, and that, in the context of the committee’s study of the exploitation scheme targeting certain international students, the committee request that the task force officials from Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship Canada and the Canada Border Services Agency subsequently appear before the committee for one hour, for a total of two hours, to update this committee on actions taken to address the exploitation scheme.

The purpose of this, of course, is that we now have a new minister appointed to the portfolio, and I think it would be very good for committee members to understand, from the new minister's perspective, what his priorities are so that we would have discussion here with the committee.

Committee members will also recall that in the last session there was a significant international student fraud scam that took place, impacting many international students. The former minister appeared before this committee and indicated that he would initiate a task force to address the issue, particularly to ensure the students who had been impacted would receive protection and they would not be subject to deportation as a result of the fraud scheme to which they were subjected.

We have not had any updates from officials with respect to this. In fact, I talked to the minister's office and asked for an update, and the minister's office promised me that there would be an update, but to date I have not received one. I suspect that's the case for all other committee members as well, so it would be important for us to get that update while the minister is present for this appearance.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

Thank you.

Mr. Redekopp, the floor is yours.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

These two pieces of this motion are good. I like them. I think the reason I like them is that the first piece actually came from Tom Kmiec and the second came from me. I appreciate that you've incorporated our ideas into your motion.

I'm not sure that they should be in one big motion. I don't really know why we would connect them. I guess I'd have to understand if there's an implication to connecting them or not.

Certainly, on the exploitation scheme, I, like you, have not been updated by the department. In the summer, I did visit with some of the students in Toronto and learned some disturbing things. That's why I suggested this initially. I really do want to understand what's going on, because there are things I learned in talking to these students—in August, I believe it was—that concerned me. There were definitely things that maybe hadn't transpired the way they were supposed to. I think it's important that we have the officials come in and talk to us. It's part of the study we are undertaking and that is ongoing at the moment anyway.

I guess my question is maybe for us: Is there a downside to combining these two motions together? Should we have separate motions? Do we have to schedule them on the same day, for example? How does that work?

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

Thank you, Mr. Redekopp.

Parliamentary Secretary Chiang, go ahead, please.

[Paul Chiang, Liberal, Markham—Unionville, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Just to give you an update, there was a study done on the task force over the summer. They are ready to give us an update on it as we proceed with the committee. The minister and IRCC are ready to come in and speak about that. Whenever we schedule them in, an update will be provided.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

Thank you, Mr. Chiang.

I have Madam Kwan next.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

We won't rehash that with respect to the motion that was passed in my name prior to the end of the last session with respect to the international students. On the question around why I would want to....

It's customary, by the way, for new ministers to appear before committee. That's been the case previously, and certainly it's the case now. That's why I have it in this motion.

I thought it would also be important, though, for it to be connected to this appearance with the minister, so that the minister and officials are aware that this is top of mind for committee members. It is not just a separate study. It's also a clear signal to the minister that this ongoing issue needs to be resolved. Promises were made and promises need to be delivered. I hope to hear from officials in terms of that update with respect to that and how the issues and concerns have been properly addressed with respect to the students.

Like other committee members over the course of the summer, I too have been in contact with a student who's been impacted. For some of them, the issue has not yet been resolved. I cannot get an update from officials on what's happening with those cases. That's not acceptable. This has to be dealt with in a serious way. The minister will appear before us, and I'm sure he will also hear those concerns from committee members.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

Thank you, Ms. Kwan.

I would now love to welcome Mr. McLean to the committee.

The floor is yours.

[Greg McLean, Conservative, Calgary Centre, AB]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

Thank you to everybody for welcoming me to this committee. It's been a pleasure to meet many of you here today and to discuss what I think are some of the most important issues facing Canada going forward here—that is, the way we deal with our immigration system, much of which is straining greatly at this point in time and causing all kinds of effects throughout society.

I am going to challenge why we are combining what would be two motions and two approaches and putting them into one meeting. I think when we talk to the minister about his mandate, the mandate he's been given by this government and by this Prime Minister, that will be a full meeting. We're actually going to find out where the government is going. I don't think it should be limited to the one issue that we're talking about here right now, even though it is a very important issue.

We can have another meeting. It will stress the importance if we actually schedule one full meeting for addressing this second issue. The minister can talk at one meeting about his new mandate and where he's going with his department at this point in time. Then we can have a full meeting to discuss the very important issues around what's happening to the students who have been defrauded coming into Canada.

I think it warrants a full meeting on its own, as is indicated in the motions that were initially put on our agenda here. I think we should stick to that and actually do this work separately. That would give much more prominence and much more importance to the issue of the students who have come from overseas, some of whom have been defrauded of their money. That signifies more importance than combining the two meetings.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

Go ahead, Mr. Redekopp.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

This is just a technical question on the implication of having it in one motion. I'm just curious about whether or not the minister and the officials have to be in the same two-hour slot. Can they be separated?

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

The committee itself decides how we want to handle that meeting. If that's what you're asking, the motion is on the floor and the members will decide.

Are we ready to take the vote yet?

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

Yes. Take the vote.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

Okay. I will take the vote. If there is not unanimous consent, then I would ask the clerk to take the vote.

Go ahead.

[Greg McLean, Conservative, Calgary Centre, AB]

Could the motion be read, please?

[The Clerk]

The motion as moved by Ms. Kwan is:

That, pursuant to Standing Order 108(2), the committee invite the newly appointed Minister of Immigration, Refugees, and Citizenship to appear before the committee for one hour to brief the committee on the Minister's priorities and objectives for the department and that, in the context of the committee's study of the exploitation scheme targeting certain international students, the committee request that the task force officials from Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship Canada and the Canada Border Services Agency subsequently appear before the committee for one hour, for a total of two hours, to update this committee on actions taken to address the exploitation scheme.

(Motion agreed to: yeas 11; nays 0)

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

Madam Kwan, we have five minutes.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Perhaps we can quickly get through the order of things.

We've just passed three motions or studies to be undertaken. In the order of things, one would assume, then, that the appropriate thing to do is to have the minister come first, whenever he is available. Hopefully, he can come first.

It then would be to move forward with the study that Mr. Brunelle-Duceppe has moved, and then for the third study to follow on the motion that has already been passed with respect to regularization. Then, of course, just prior to that, I think we also have to deal with the draft report that's sitting on our desks.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

Thank you, Madam Kwan.

I have Madam Zahid next and then Mr. Redekopp.

[Salma Zahid, Liberal, Scarborough Centre, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

We have passed the motions, so I think we should have a subcommittee meeting to schedule meetings.

As Ms. Kwan mentioned in regard to the minister's appearance, we will extend an invitation, but we don't know on which day he will be coming. We really need to go through our schedule to figure out what Thursday's meeting will be and then, going forward, what we are undertaking. I would say that I think we should have a subcommittee meeting to figure out the business of the committee.