Evidence of meeting #62 for Industry, Science and Technology in the 40th Parliament, 3rd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was program.

A recording is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Bruce Archibald  President, Federal Economic Development Agency for Southern Ontario
Richard Dicerni  Deputy Minister, Department of Industry
Kent Estabrooks  Acting Vice-President, Finance and Corporate Services, Atlantic Canada Opportunities Agency
Peter Hogan  Vice-President, Nova Scotia, Atlantic Canada Opportunities Agency
Kelly Gillis  Chief Financial Officer, Comptrollership and Administration Sector, Department of Industry

3:50 p.m.

Liberal

Anthony Rota Liberal Nipissing—Timiskaming, ON

On that $125,000 that's being transferred from Industry Canada to what seems to be your office, I see part of it going to what I would imagine is IRAP. These are times of austerity, and yet I see $60,000 being transferred to your office. It's actually $65,000 going over. Can you explain why that money is being transferred? Is it no longer needed elsewhere?

3:50 p.m.

Richard Dicerni Deputy Minister, Department of Industry

This relates, I believe, to the minister's office transfer. Is that the one you're talking about?

3:50 p.m.

Liberal

Anthony Rota Liberal Nipissing—Timiskaming, ON

Yes, exactly.

3:50 p.m.

Deputy Minister, Department of Industry

Richard Dicerni

When the agency was initially set up Mr. Goodyear had, and still has, two portfolios; one is Minister of State for Science and Technology and one is for FedDev, and Treasury Board made some initial allocations. In this round of supplementary estimates they have calibrated this better in terms of what should be paid by FedDev versus what should be paid by Industry Canada. We at Industry Canada cover part of the minister's S and T budget, so it's just a calibration that Treasury Board has determined to be more accurate--

3:50 p.m.

Liberal

Anthony Rota Liberal Nipissing—Timiskaming, ON

Mainly staffing, or is it--

3:50 p.m.

Deputy Minister, Department of Industry

Richard Dicerni

Yes, it's staff in the minister's office. It's to better reflect how many people are working in Minister Goodyear's office as Minister of State for FedDev versus Minister of State for Science and Technology.

3:50 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative David Sweet

Thank you, Mr. Dicerni.

Thank you very much, Mr. Rota. We're over time now.

The Bloc Québécois now has the floor.

Mr. Bouchard, you have seven minutes.

3:50 p.m.

Bloc

Robert Bouchard Bloc Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I will share my time with my colleague Mr. Cardin.

Good afternoon, Mr. Minister, good afternoon Madam, good afternoon gentlemen. I thank you for coming to testify before the committee today.

Mr. Minister, you have forecast an adjustment of the appropriations. I think that it is $17.08 million for the Natural Sciences and Engineering Research Council. Could you explain to us what this $17.08 million adjustment to appropriations includes? This is in the Library of Parliament information notes. The French version says that it comes from supplementary estimates (C) 2010-2011, pages 136 to 138, under the heading INDUSTRY, where it deals with the Natural Sciences and Engineering Research Council.

3:50 p.m.

Deputy Minister, Department of Industry

Richard Dicerni

With your permission, I will take some time to read this chapter. I'll come back in three minutes, for the next turn.

3:50 p.m.

Bloc

Robert Bouchard Bloc Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC

All right. In the meantime, I will put another question to the minister.

Under Statistics Canada, there is an amount of $4.23 million. Recently, we heard the chief statistician, along with other witnesses. The chief statistician spoke of advertising, to the tune of several million dollars. He also said, and his statement was published, that the long form questionnaire would cost several million dollars. Indeed, the figure of $30 million was put forward, but we knew that it would not cost that much.

Are you ready to comment on this subject? Do you see a surplus anywhere in your reports?

3:50 p.m.

Deputy Minister, Department of Industry

Richard Dicerni

The estimates speak of extra funds for Statistics Canada to help them make a better analysis of the consumer price index.

3:55 p.m.

Bloc

Robert Bouchard Bloc Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC

Does it mention the $4.23 million?

3:55 p.m.

Deputy Minister, Department of Industry

Richard Dicerni

That is it. What Mr. Smith mentioned yesterday was in connection with the census and the national survey of households that will be done this year. Therefore, we have two things that are somewhat different.

3:55 p.m.

Bloc

Robert Bouchard Bloc Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC

He mentioned an extra $15 million for advertising. If I am not mistaken, these are not extra appropriations, this was included in the budget. Am I right?

3:55 p.m.

Deputy Minister, Department of Industry

Richard Dicerni

It is in the Statistics Canada budget because the census will take place this year. The government had granted them funds for this purpose. If you compare with the estimates of previous years, you will note that this year there was an increase to cover the implementation of the census. The appropriations he mentioned are included.

3:55 p.m.

Bloc

Robert Bouchard Bloc Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC

With regard to the sum of $17 million that I just mentioned, and regarding the details of these expenditures, does this adjustment apply to Canada as a whole?

If we suppose that this applies to Canada as a whole, are you ready to give us a breakdown? How much will go to Quebec, for example? The adjusted sum of $17 million for the Natural Sciences and Engineering Research Council is mentioned in pages 136 to 138.

Can you give us a breakdown and tell us how much goes to Quebec, or is this a total expenditure?

3:55 p.m.

Deputy Minister, Department of Industry

Richard Dicerni

This a total expenditure, but the appropriations are always based on excellence and on merit.

There is no allocation regarding the funds that the granting councils give to various researchers. This depends on the proposals that are submitted. These proposals are reviewed by peers in order to choose the ones that have the best rating. This is how the funds are granted.

All of the granting councils function the same way. There is a peer review of the proposals, and funds are granted pursuant to that.

Let me say that recently an allocation was made for chairs of excellence in research. Laval University obtained two of them and the University of Sherbrooke obtained one. As for McGill University, it also obtained two or three. Therefore, there is a good representation that reflects the academic excellence found in Quebec.

3:55 p.m.

Bloc

Robert Bouchard Bloc Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC

This is interesting.

I would like to ask one brief question. With regard to adjustments to appropriations, does the department or the service obtain the authorizations it needs after the expenditures have been made, and when they realize they have overspent, or does it ask well before the funds are spent?

3:55 p.m.

Deputy Minister, Department of Industry

Richard Dicerni

This has to do with appropriations for 2010-2011. Actually, there are two weeks left before the end of the fiscal year. I think that this committee's objective is to review the last supplementary estimates and report to the House before March 31.

3:55 p.m.

Bloc

Robert Bouchard Bloc Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC

As we speak, these amounts have for the most part already been spent. Am I wrong in saying this?

3:55 p.m.

Deputy Minister, Department of Industry

Richard Dicerni

I think that it would be fair to say that there are working hypotheses that have been formulated regarding the extra appropriations. Very often, these are transfers.

As for the Department of Industry, these are often transfers between government agencies. For example, every year, our department transfers $75,000 to Treasury Board. This is our contribution to a national effort managed by Treasury Board; they organize an annual managers' conference. Every department makes a contribution. If you look at the additional appropriations for the departments, you will see that they all have the same amount of $75,000.

A certain number of hypotheses must be advanced in the course of a year. This depends on the budget process. There is the budget, and supplementary estimates (A), (B) and (C). Now we are dealing with supplementary estimates (C).

3:55 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative David Sweet

Thank you, Mr. Dicerni and Mr. Bouchard.

Now we go on to Mr. Braid for seven minutes.

3:55 p.m.

Conservative

Peter Braid Conservative Kitchener—Waterloo, ON

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you very much, Minister Goodyear and officials, for being here this afternoon.

Minister Goodyear, thank you for your presentation today, for sharing this great news story concerning the programs and the impact of FedDev, and for your leadership of this important, great, new agency.

Minister, in your opening comments you said that 240,000 jobs have been created in southern Ontario. Since 2009, 460,000 jobs have been created across the country, so more than half have been created in southern Ontario, I think partly due to the valuable work that FedDev is doing.

Minister, could you start by listing some of the important programs that have been established under FedDev?

4 p.m.

Conservative

Gary Goodyear Conservative Cambridge, ON

I'd be happy to do that. Thank you very much.

As I mentioned earlier, when FedDev was initially set up, the crisis was pretty imminent, and the instruction from the Prime Minister was to create jobs as quickly as possible. I'll give you some examples of what we did.

There was the community adjustment fund, for example, of which FedDev took on the southern Ontario portion of this national program. We looked for applications, and we got a lot of them that would in fact create jobs the next day, such as replacing water treatment facilities. I'm sure in your ridings, as in mine, there were roads being repaved, and curbs, etc. These were jobs that were created immediately.

We also looked for opportunities to partner with folks who already had a finger into the economy, like IRAP and Yves Landry and some of these other great programs. But we travelled around the province as well. We spoke to literally hundreds if not thousands of mayors, economic development folks in communities, and university presidents. We spoke with people who were employed and people who were not employed. We continued to do that. We would take the feedback and start to look at our programs. We did in fact tweak the programs to the current needs.

So in the community adjustment fund, CAF-1 was actually a little different from CAF-2. If we were going to pave a street under CAF-1 because that's what a city wanted to do, under CAF-2 we would look for paving a runway at an airport, which might allow for future economic progress. As the economy continued to pick up, we changed again, and then again.

Just last November, we launched seven new programs. All of them are designed of course to create jobs as quickly as possible. The one I can tell you about is the graduate enterprise program, where we saw the need to put skilled folks into small and medium-sized businesses. We married that with graduates coming out of school into a weaker job market, and we saw the opportunity to put graduates into businesses. So we developed a program to do that. We saw the need for businesses to use more R and D to create, again, new processes or become more efficient, and to become more competitive, which all leads to more jobs.

So we developed a program called the applied research and commercialization initiative, where we said to colleges and universities, “Here's a pot of money, $15 million over two years. The way to get it is to go out and talk to small businesses around the province and help them be better.”

Recently I launched one of those programs where a luggage manufacturer needed to find a better way to produce aluminum luggage, and with the help of a college and their skilled students and laboratories, they did exactly that.

We launched seven new programs. They are for graduates. They're for small businesses. They're for not-for-profits. They're repayable contributions for profits. They're for venture capital folks to help our entrepreneurs, all the way up to the serious jobs of the long-term future, which is our youth STEM initiative.

This is again seeing an opportunity. From the science and technology file, I am hearing that scientists could probably do a little better at business. With the decline in R and D by the private sector, we felt that businesses could probably learn a bit more about the value of science. We can start that after people graduate from university, and I just mentioned that we are. But I believe the way to start that is actually in grade three, grade five, grade nine, and this is what we continued to hear on the ground.

So the youth STEM initiative is a $20 million initiative for folks who already do programs with kindergarten through to grade 12, to get them interested in those key subjects that we know will lead our innovation, which we know will improve our productivity and which we have seen other countries are beating us on. That is, PhDs and graduate degrees in science, technology, engineering, and mathematics.

Our programs now have gone from creating jobs tomorrow by improving infrastructure—they've been extremely successful—to creating jobs today, and longer-lasting, better quality jobs of tomorrow in that knowledge-based economy that we are facing as the global economy has changed.

4:05 p.m.

Conservative

Peter Braid Conservative Kitchener—Waterloo, ON

Something I want to touch on, which you mentioned in your opening presentation, is the investing in business innovation program. As the member of Parliament for Kitchener--Waterloo, I have received particularly positive feedback from small tech companies, from start-up companies, and from the venture capital community concerning the value of this program. Could you speak a little about the gap that it fills and why this is an important program not only for today, but for the future?