Evidence of meeting #16 for International Trade in the 41st Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was services.
A recording is available from Parliament.
12:15 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Rob Merrifield
It's a trade issue and he'll answer you on the trade issue component of it, but not the debate around asbestos use. It's not for this committee to debate that.
Go ahead.
12:15 p.m.
NDP
Brian Masse NDP Windsor West, ON
Well, it's just the irony of the situation that we're faced with here....
The carve-out, though, would be different: it would be us not removing the tariff from the asbestos. Currently you're suggesting that you've been ordered to negotiate the removal of a 10% tariff on asbestos. We could just take the position that we're not going to remove that tariff or not going to request a removal of that tariff. That's a benefit to them.
12:15 p.m.
Chief Trade Negotiator, Canada-India Comprehensive Economic Partnership Agreement, Department of Foreign Affairs and International Trade
Yes, I haven't actually been given any specific directive in respect of the tariff on asbestos; I'm just saying that in the tariff negotiations, when they finally get going, the direction of the negotiations is to reduce and eliminate tariffs. With respect to.... Again, I don't want to get involved because I have no expertise in the matter of the various kinds of asbestos and the uses of asbestos. I suspect we're talking about different things in respect of the building that's being refit--
12:15 p.m.
Chief Trade Negotiator, Canada-India Comprehensive Economic Partnership Agreement, Department of Foreign Affairs and International Trade
--and the uses of asbestos that is being exported from Canada.
In any event, there is no restriction, so in respect of the trade dimension of this issue, I guess I've given you the answer.
12:15 p.m.
NDP
Brian Masse NDP Windsor West, ON
Yes. That's fine. I'll move on.
I would like you to detail a little--if you can with the time remaining--the India-South Korea and the India-Japan negotiations, how they would impact this trade agreement, and whether or not they had an automotive component in those agreements. All three of those nation states have high tariff and non-tariff barriers. If you look at Japan, for example, I think you'll see that we sent in 5,000 vehicles last year, and they have hundreds of thousands that come into Canada every year. Can you highlight that dynamic of the three nations?
12:15 p.m.
Chief Trade Negotiator, Canada-India Comprehensive Economic Partnership Agreement, Department of Foreign Affairs and International Trade
I guess the most helpful thing I could do would be to offer to prepare a written brief in respect of the details of the Japanese and South Korean deals with India, but there were provisions on automobiles. Certainly in the case of the EU-India negotiations, which are still ongoing and are said to be currently at a bit of an impasse but could conclude relatively soon, we are advised that those negotiations also include provisions.... In fact, one of the sticking points is said to be the automobile sector, which of course is a huge interest for the European market.
The Canadian companies that are active in India at the moment are more in automotive parts and services or equipment that supports automobile assembly plants, and we sell some specialized vehicles into that market. But that's about it.
12:15 p.m.
Conservative
Ed Holder Conservative London West, ON
Thank you,
Chair, I'd like to thank our guests for attending this session with regard to CEPA, our free trade deal with India.
I find it a very compelling argument, the reasons for the need to do this deal, and the chair cited earlier the size of the population of India. That just got me reflecting on its size and, according to your comments, Mr. Stephenson, how big the population of India will grow, which is to become the number one population in the world in the frankly not too distant future. I therefore think that if there's an opportunity, it's now.
One of the things that occurs to me, when I look at it.... We've talked before about the BRIC countries having some significance. This committee has gone to Brazil for that purpose. It is a focus. China, and obviously Russia...these are things that I know we will cover over time.
I heard one of my colleagues opposite expressing concern about losing ground with our current markets. I was thinking about that and about how we had the representatives from the pork industry here, who some years ago had 75% of the industry in the States. Now their market share is down to 32% while in fact their volume has actually doubled. So I think the reason we're doing this, and why there's such an aggressive trade agenda with the government, is that we don't want to have reliance on any one country. To have this kind of support in working with India makes a whole bunch of sense to me. The reason that we're so aggressively engaged in bilaterals is that the notion of multilaterals is off the table, as I see it, frankly.
This is related, so I'd like to ask this question: in your opinion, is Doha done?
12:20 p.m.
Chief Trade Negotiator, Canada-India Comprehensive Economic Partnership Agreement, Department of Foreign Affairs and International Trade
I usually like to say it's not dead--it's resting.
12:20 p.m.
Voices
Oh, oh!
12:20 p.m.
Chief Trade Negotiator, Canada-India Comprehensive Economic Partnership Agreement, Department of Foreign Affairs and International Trade
It's difficult in the current global environment to see sufficient leadership being shown to bring the round to an early conclusion. That's my assessment: I don't think it's for any time soon--
12:20 p.m.
Conservative
Ed Holder Conservative London West, ON
So do you think our strategy of promoting these bilaterals the way we have thus far--which I think we all agree is a fairly aggressive schedule--is the right approach?
12:20 p.m.
Chief Trade Negotiator, Canada-India Comprehensive Economic Partnership Agreement, Department of Foreign Affairs and International Trade
I don't really see an alternative, as long as all your other trading partners are doing the same thing. You can only fall behind.
12:20 p.m.
Conservative
Ed Holder Conservative London West, ON
We heard some comments earlier from somebody about our situation as it relates to South Korea. I'd rather talk about India, because that's what you're here to talk about.
We're ahead of the United States on this. Why does that matter?
12:20 p.m.
Chief Trade Negotiator, Canada-India Comprehensive Economic Partnership Agreement, Department of Foreign Affairs and International Trade
For the same reason that the comment was made about the U.S. deal with Korea: we could provide our exporters with a tariff advantage over their competitors in other countries, including the United States, if we were successful in negotiations with India first.
12:20 p.m.
Conservative
Ed Holder Conservative London West, ON
Thank you for that.
You made a comment about our business tripling by 2015. That feels a little aggressive to me, and I'm never bad with aggressive. How do you see that happening? How do you see that developing? Where will that business come from? Do you think that's attainable?
12:20 p.m.
Chief Trade Negotiator, Canada-India Comprehensive Economic Partnership Agreement, Department of Foreign Affairs and International Trade
I get a little nervous around numbers and projections, because that's sort of all they are. The joint study, for example---
12:20 p.m.
Conservative
Ed Holder Conservative London West, ON
We used to be, too, until we had a majority government. It's a little different now.
Sorry, Chair.
12:20 p.m.
Chief Trade Negotiator, Canada-India Comprehensive Economic Partnership Agreement, Department of Foreign Affairs and International Trade
The joint study is just an economic modelling exercise. What happens in real life depends on real-life Canadian businesses moving more aggressively to the Indian market. What the government is trying to do is provide the certainty and provide the support to bring more Canadian.... I understand from figures from the Export Development Corporation that there are something in the range of 300 to 350 Canadian companies active in the Indian market. That's the number we need to focus on: doubling and tripling that number.
The way to do that is partly through trade negotiations, the negotiation of the foreign investment protection agreement, the CEPA, to provide a rules-based...and also to eliminate tariffs, of course. But on the other side, the Canadian trade commissioner service and the trade promotion investment activities--you know, the other half of the trade department--are critically important in actually achieving this goal.
December 1st, 2011 / 12:20 p.m.
Conservative
Russ Hiebert Conservative South Surrey—White Rock—Cloverdale, BC
I have a number of questions. I'll start by asking for your thoughts.
You mentioned in your opening remarks that India has already concluded several trade agreements with I think the EU, among others. Can you remind me which...?
12:25 p.m.
Chief Trade Negotiator, Canada-India Comprehensive Economic Partnership Agreement, Department of Foreign Affairs and International Trade
They recently concluded agreements with Japan and South Korea. They have not concluded one with Europe. They're in negotiations with Europe.
12:25 p.m.
Conservative
Russ Hiebert Conservative South Surrey—White Rock—Cloverdale, BC
To what degree are we able to use those negotiations to our advantage? Are we able to see the terms of those agreements? Do they tend to try to mirror those agreements or is there a great deal of flexibility in altering or changing those agreements?
12:25 p.m.
Chief Trade Negotiator, Canada-India Comprehensive Economic Partnership Agreement, Department of Foreign Affairs and International Trade
The prior negotiations of India help us a great deal, to the extent that the obligations that have been negotiated are satisfactory and sufficient to meet Canadian interests.
No trade agreement is a legal precedent for what you will negotiate with the next partner. Certainly how much leverage you have in negotiations matters, but they still provide a kind of a benchmark against which you can negotiate. The extent to which we can use the model that has already been successfully negotiated with India by others will help us move quickly in the negotiations.
We are hopeful that Europe will also help us in this regard by pushing the envelope a little. I said earlier a couple of times that Indian trade policy is a moving target. It's evolving all the time and tends toward increasing liberalization all the time. In each of their trade negotiations, they have addressed new issues or have gone a little further in what kinds of obligations they're willing to take. So yes, their existing agreements and their other negotiations help Canada push its own agenda in the negotiations.