An Act to amend the Income Tax Act

This bill was last introduced in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session, which ended in September 2019.

Sponsor

Bill Morneau  Liberal

Status

This bill has received Royal Assent and is now law.

Summary

This is from the published bill.

This enactment amends the Income Tax Act to reduce the second personal income tax rate from 22% to 20.‍5% and to introduce a new personal marginal tax rate of 33% for taxable income in excess of $200,000. It also amends other provisions of that Act to reflect the new 33% rate. In addition, it amends that Act to reduce the annual contribution limit for tax-free savings accounts from $10,000 to its previous level with indexation ($5,500 for 2016) starting January 1, 2016.

Elsewhere

All sorts of information on this bill is available at LEGISinfo, an excellent resource from the Library of Parliament. You can also read the full text of the bill.

Votes

Sept. 20, 2016 Passed That the Bill be now read a third time and do pass.
April 19, 2016 Failed That it be an instruction to the Standing Committee on Finance that, during its consideration of Bill C-2, An Act to amend the Income Tax Act, the Committee be granted the power to divide the Bill in order that all the provisions related to the contribution limit increase of the Tax-Free Savings Account be in a separate piece of legislation.
March 21, 2016 Passed That the Bill be now read a second time and referred to the Standing Committee on Finance.
March 8, 2016 Failed That the motion be amended by deleting all the words after the word “That” and substituting the following: “the House decline to give second reading to Bill C-2, An Act to amend the Income Tax Act, since the principle of the Bill: ( a) fails to address the fact, as stated by the Office of the Parliamentary Budget Officer, that the proposals contained therein will not be revenue-neutral, as promised by the government; (b) will drastically impede the ability of Canadians to save, by reducing contribution limits for Tax-Free Savings Accounts; (c) will plunge the country further into deficit than what was originally accounted for; (d) will not sufficiently stimulate the economy; (e) lacks concrete, targeted plans to stimulate economic innovation; and (f) will have a negative impact on Canadians across the socioeconomic spectrum.”.

Income Tax ActRoutine Proceedings

May 19th, 2016 / 10 a.m.


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NDP

Guy Caron NDP Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC

moved for leave to introduce Bill C-274, An Act to amend the Income Tax Act (transfer of small business or family farm or fishing corporation).

Mr. Speaker, my bill would end a blatantly unfair situation that puts business people, farmers, and fishing vessel operators at a disadvantage when they want to pass their business on to a child rather than a stranger. The difference is a big one. For a million-dollar business, the difference can be around $200,000 from a taxation perspective. For a $10-million farm, we are talking $2.2 million less if the owner sells it to a stranger rather than a family member. We have to do something about this. This bill is well thought out to avert any possibility of tax avoidance arising from these amendments. I hope that the members of the House will support my bill at second reading. I am pleased to introduce this bill.

(Motions deemed adopted, bill read the first time and printed)

Income Tax ActRoutine Proceedings

May 19th, 2016 / 10:05 a.m.


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Bloc

Xavier Barsalou-Duval Bloc Pierre-Boucher—Les Patriotes—Verchères, QC

moved for leave to introduce Bill C-275, An Act to amend the Income Tax Act (business transfer).

Mr. Speaker, I rise in the House to introduce a bill seconded by my colleague from Manicouagan. The purpose of the bill is to amend the Income Tax Act with respect to business transfers. As we all know, the population in Canada and Quebec is aging. As a result, there are certain needs regarding the transfer of businesses that are becoming increasingly urgent and important. Unfortunately, under the existing rules, there is a certain tax unfairness that makes it disadvantageous in some cases for people to transfer a business to their children or other family members. The purpose of this bill is to amend the act, specifically section 84(1), to include the children and grandchildren of shareholders, so that they are not put at a disadvantage when family businesses are transferred.

(Motions deemed adopted, bill read the first time and printed)

Income Tax ActRoutine Proceedings

May 19th, 2016 / 10:05 a.m.


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Liberal

Karina Gould Liberal Burlington, ON

Mr. Speaker, I hope you will find unanimous consent for the following motion. I move that, notwithstanding any standing order or usual practice of the House, the Journals and the Debates for Wednesday, May 18, 2016, be revised to add the name of the member for Berthier—Maskinongé to the list of nays in division No. 63.

Income Tax ActRoutine Proceedings

May 19th, 2016 / 10:05 a.m.


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The Speaker Geoff Regan

Does the hon. parliamentary secretary have the unanimous consent of the House to propose the motion?

Income Tax ActRoutine Proceedings

May 19th, 2016 / 10:05 a.m.


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Some hon. members

Agreed.

No.

The House proceeded to the consideration of Bill C-2, An Act to amend the Income Tax Act, as reported (without amendment) from the committee.

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May 19th, 2016 / 3:10 p.m.


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Liberal

Diane Lebouthillier Liberal Gaspésie—Les-Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC

moved that the bill be concurred in.

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May 19th, 2016 / 3:10 p.m.


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The Speaker Geoff Regan

Is it the pleasure of the House to adopt the motion?

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May 19th, 2016 / 3:10 p.m.


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Some hon. members

Agreed.

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May 19th, 2016 / 3:10 p.m.


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An hon. member

On division.

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May 19th, 2016 / 3:10 p.m.


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Liberal

Diane Lebouthillier Liberal Gaspésie—Les-Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC

(Motion agreed to)

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May 19th, 2016 / 3:10 p.m.


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The Speaker Geoff Regan

When shall the bill be read the third time? By leave, now?

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May 19th, 2016 / 3:10 p.m.


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Some hon. members

Agreed.

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May 19th, 2016 / 3:10 p.m.


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Liberal

Diane Lebouthillier Liberal Gaspésie—Les-Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC

moved that the bill be read the third time and passed.

Income Tax ActGovernment Orders

May 19th, 2016 / 3:10 p.m.


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Saint-Maurice—Champlain Québec

Liberal

François-Philippe Champagne LiberalParliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Finance

Mr. Speaker, first of all, I am pleased to speak today to Bill C-2, which would lower taxes for the middle class.

Income Tax ActGovernment Orders

May 19th, 2016 / 3:10 p.m.


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Some hon. members

Oh, oh!

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May 19th, 2016 / 3:10 p.m.


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Liberal

François-Philippe Champagne Liberal Saint-Maurice—Champlain, QC

You can imagine how I feel, Mr. Speaker. I understand how you feel when you try to speak and everyone rises. I feel a little like that.

As I was saying, Bill C-2 would lower taxes for the middle class. During the pre-budget consultations, I travelled from Moncton to Yellowknife, and the Minister of Finance travelled from Nova Scotia to Vancouver. It was a very important issue to Canadians.

During our election campaign, we promised to lower taxes for the middle class because Canadians asked us to help them and their families—

Income Tax ActGovernment Orders

May 19th, 2016 / 3:10 p.m.


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The Speaker Geoff Regan

Order, please. I have a couple of things here. Members should know that they should leave the chamber and have their discussions outside. Perhaps the Minister of Natural Resources and the Minister of Heritage might take their discussion outside. The President of the Treasury Board should know that they do not stand between the person speaking and the Speaker. I encourage them to take that outside.

The hon. parliamentary secretary to the Minister of Finance.

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May 19th, 2016 / 3:10 p.m.


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Liberal

François-Philippe Champagne Liberal Saint-Maurice—Champlain, QC

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank you for your wise remarks. We are talking about respect in the House and listening to one's colleagues.

I will come back to the important Bill C-2. As I was saying, during the election campaign, we promised to help the middle class because it drives our economy. When we consulted Canadians from coast to coast, they asked us to help them and their families and to grow the economy.

The first thing we did to help the middle class was to lower taxes, because we strongly believe that that is how we can help Canada's economy. That was the first thing we did, because Canadians told us that they wanted more money in their pockets in order to help their families and to grow the economy.

The second measure we are implementing, which was a key component of the latest budget, is the Canada child benefit. Members will understand that this is probably the most significant social measure since the introduction of universal health care in Canada. This measure will help nine out of 10 Canadian families and allow for simpler, tax-free benefits. This will truly help the families who need a bit more money. For example, it will help families send their kids to summer camp this summer and buy back-to-school clothes. This is exactly the kind of measure that Canadians want.

The second thing people asked us for was to grow the economy. In our budget, we included significant measures for infrastructure. We committed to investing $11.9 billion in infrastructure. When we travelled across the country, people told us that public transit was a big part of what we had to do. In our society, moving people and goods is essential to economic activity. It not only costs more money when people cannot move freely, but it also has a significant impact on our economy. We therefore made a historic commitment of $3.4 billion to be invested in public transit.

Now, let us talk about the important topic of water and waste water. We are also making around $5 billion in investments in this area. These investments will make it possible to rebuild wastewater systems or invest in infrastructure, so that we can take charge or work with the provinces and territories to improve our country's wastewater treatment systems.

There are some very flagrant cases. We know that some communities still discharge sewage without primary treatment. We know how damaging that can be to the environment. The case involving Montreal, with Mayor Coderre, was quite clear. We have seen the impact that can have, and that is why we decided to make a historic investment in this area.

I would like to talk about social infrastructure. Historic investments are being made in what is known as affordable housing for Canadians. Such investments will help us move forward, just as our historic investments in innovation will help to achieve the kind of economic growth in this country that Canadians expect.

As far as Bill C-2 is concerned, I can say that people have had more money in their pockets since January 2016 and they have realized how important that was. The Conservatives often tell us that, from their perspective, promises have been broken, but I can assure the House that investing in middle-class Canadians and reducing their taxes was what had to be done. That is what Canadians really wanted.

I have the privilege to be here today and to take part in this important debate on Bill C-2, An Act to amend the Income Tax Act, at third reading, with a view to providing Canada’s middle class with a long-awaited tax break.

Since January 1, 2016, no fewer than nine million Canadians have been benefiting from this tax break. It is very important to understand that nine million Canadian men and women have been benefiting from this tax break since January 1.

The Liberal Party of Canada made this commitment during the election campaign. Since January 1, people have been benefiting from this tax break, which will enable us to invest in the economy. Canadians in every part of the country were asking the government to make investments and help their families. That is what we are hearing more and more, and that is exactly what this very important measure will enable us to do. The government was elected on the basis of a plan to grow the economy, and these changes are an important first step.

Personally, I made business and the law my career. I saw this investment as important, because it is exactly the kind of investment that helps the economy grow: putting more money in the pockets of Canadians.

The bill in question amends the Income Tax Act to reduce the second personal income tax rate from 22% to 20.5% and introduce a new personal marginal tax rate of 33% for taxable income in excess of $200,000.

During our campaign, we clearly stated our intention to help the middle class. It was the key point in our campaign. However, we also expected people with higher incomes to do more. Helping one another is part of the Canadian spirit and our identity. It was in the context of that promise that we announced our intention to Canadians. Today, I am happy to speak in the House about the fulfillment of that promise through Bill C-2.

This bill also amends other provisions of the act to reflect the new rate of 33%. It contains a number of rather technical measures. Obviously, when you change the top marginal tax rate in Canada, that entails a number of changes in the Income Tax Act. A number of provisions in the Income Tax Act are based on the marginal tax rate, which will now rise to 33%.

It also amends the act to reduce the annual contribution limit for tax-free savings accounts from $10,000 to its previous level, which, with indexation, will be $5,500 for 2016, effective January 1, 2016. We proposed to reduce this amount because we saw that only 6.7% of Canadians had taken advantage of the cumulative total that they could contribute to a tax-free savings account.

We told Canadians that our government would be based on science and facts. This measure was good public policy because, in its previous form, it benefited only a small group of Canadians.

We were elected to take measures that would benefit our economy, the middle class, and those who are working hard to join it. In December, at the first opportunity, the Minister of Finance introduced a tax cut that will put more money directly into the pockets of the middle class. I think Canadians realize that. On October 19, people made a wise choice. People wanted a government that would work for them, for the middle class, for those who are working hard to join the middle class, and for Canadian families.

As I said previously, some nine million Canadian men and women will benefit from this extremely important measure for equity and fairness in our country. The middle class has waited too long for an improvement. Despite the difficult economic situation, we have helped the middle class. We made a promise, and today I can say that we have kept that promise. Income tax has been reduced.

After this bill was introduced, our government tabled the 2016 budget, which is an essential step in ensuring economic growth and revitalizing the Canadian economy. Canada was built on optimism, often in the face of challenges that seemed insurmountable. However, the promise of a better life was broken over the past 10 years.

The confidence of many middle-class Canadians in the economy was shaken, and we wanted to restore it. For once, Canadians have a government that is standing up for them by taking measures that will promote economic development, while at the same time taking into account the most vulnerable people in our society, those who are in the middle class, and those who want to join it.

As I was saying, Canada was built on optimism, often in the face of challenges that seemed insurmountable. Even though our economy is still growing, middle-class Canadians are having difficulties.

Since I was elected, one of the most edifying things I have had the privilege of doing is to meet with those Canadians, from Moncton to Yellowknife. I went to small towns and meetings around the kitchen table where people explained their economic problems and the ways we could help them.

For once, we consulted people who had never been consulted before. It was the first time they had expressed their opinion on the federal budget and told people from the Department of Finance and the Minister of Finance, obviously, or me about their desire to see the Canadian economy grow and the need for inclusive growth.

For too long, middle-class people, families, and our young people were excluded from that growth. We had to restore such measures to benefit families and middle-class people.

Many Canadians are working harder and longer, while the cost of living keeps climbing. I remember meeting a family in Quebec City who asked for our help because they were no longer able to make ends meet. People told us that they needed a government that would listen to them, and that is exactly what we have done.

Middle-class families simply do not feel as if their lot has improved in the last 10 years, and the facts bear that out. That is why we took resolute action on January 1 to put money back in the pockets of middle-class people. The time has come to look to the future once again with the hope and optimism of the generations that came before us.

Mr. Speaker, you have often said, in your wisdom, that the privilege of being a member of this House lies in understanding the great institution of which we are part and always keeping in mind the people who sent us to Ottawa to work for them. That is precisely what we did when we listened to them and took action in this area.

We must embrace the spirit of our country’s founders and build on that legacy by creating opportunities for advancement and mobility that are as vast as those that existed in the past. We have to do so in a way that enables Canada to realize the enormous potential for growth that can come from switching to a low-carbon economy, where clean technologies and economic growth go hand in hand. We already have the keys to that future.

This week, the Minister of Finance had his first meeting with the Advisory Council on Economic Growth, which is composed of eminent experts from around the globe. That committee will work hard to put forward measures designed to promote inclusive, long-term growth in Canada.

That morning, I had the opportunity to participate in that very interesting meeting chaired by Dominic Barton of McKinsey. I should point out that it is the first council with gender parity. I am pleased that our advisory council has as many women as men from all sectors of the economy who talked to us about growth and innovation.

Let us imagine the Canada of the future and identify our strengths, but let us also be conscious of our country's demographic challenges and the fact that the Canadian economy accounts for 2% of the global economy. We must draw inspiration from best practices employed elsewhere in the world if we want to understand how to promote a stronger economy.

We are going to do what we said we would do. As we said with respect to the advisory council, we already have the keys to the future. Yes, we have challenges here in Canada, but we also have tremendous opportunities and a highly educated population.

Our country has vast natural resources. We can count on stability, predictability, and the rule of law. Those features will attract investment here.

As I said, Canadians are among the best-educated people in the world. We rank first among members of the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development, the OECD. More than half of all Canadian adults have a post-secondary degree, and everyone here knows that education is the foundation. No society has experienced strong economic development without having made education a priority. That is exactly what we are doing, and Canadians have one of the highest levels of post-secondary graduation.

We are world-renowned for our research and scientific discoveries. We are often on the cutting edge of clean technology, which is becoming increasingly prevalent internationally.

This is important because Canada invests a great deal in research and development. We now realize, however, that we need to do more in the way of marketing. We have to move from research and development into producing a product. Once we have a product, we need a customer, and once we have a customer, we can hope to export our product. That is how we will successfully create economic growth in Canada.

We have an abundance of natural resources that are surpassed only by the ingenuity and diversity of our people. That is also important. I often say that our greatest resource is human capital. We know, and I am sure that all my colleagues on both sides of the House will agree, that the greatest capital we have in Canada is human capital. Canadian men and women have achieved extraordinary things that have advanced humanity.

My colleague, the Minister of Transport, is a great example. He has done extraordinary things for this country. He went into space. He taught an entire generation of young Canadians, myself included, how we could dream big and realize our dreams through excellence. If there is one man who embodies excellence in Canada, it is the Minister of Transport, because not only did he give young Canadians a glimpse into space, but now he is serving his country with distinction as a member of Parliament, like all my colleagues.

Given that we have one of the lowest debt-to-GDP ratios in the G7, we know we can make these wise investments for the middle class. The Minister of Finance has been applauded by the Financial Times and the Wall Street Journal, by Ms. Lagarde of the International Monetary Fund, and by officials at the OECD. They have said that Canada is building its future on a solid foundation.

I will use my last few seconds to say how proud I am to have worked with my colleagues on both sides of the House, listening to Canadians. We drafted a budget that not only works for Canadians today, but also builds on a solid foundation to ensure that the Canada we have today will continue to prosper for decades to come.

Income Tax ActGovernment Orders

May 19th, 2016 / 3:30 p.m.


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Conservative

Gérard Deltell Conservative Louis-Saint-Laurent, QC

Mr. Speaker, I wish to acknowledge my friend from Shawinigan. I am sorry, I mean the hon. member for Saint-Maurice—Champlain. When I see him I think of the Right Hon. Jean Chrétien, who of course was the member for that riding for many years.

I want to assure the hon. member that I hold him in high regard. He is a new parliamentarian, an intelligent, articulate man who works hard. He does not have any good ideas, but I have the utmost respect for him nonetheless.

I want to repeat what he said a few moments ago. He said, “We are going to do what we said we would do.” With all due respect, that is not exactly true because that party was elected on a promise that the tax changes announced in Bill C-2 would be revenue-neutral. Unfortunately, it turns out that there will be a $1.7-billion deficit. It is not the Conservatives that are saying so, but the parliamentary budget officer, whom the President of the Treasury Board was quoting earlier.

Could the hon. member explain why he says he is going to do what he promised to do, when in fact there is a deficit where the cost should have been nil?

Income Tax ActGovernment Orders

May 19th, 2016 / 3:30 p.m.


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Liberal

François-Philippe Champagne Liberal Saint-Maurice—Champlain, QC

Mr. Speaker, allow me to respond to my hon. colleague, for whom I also have a lot of respect. He is obviously an experienced parliamentarian and a very smart man.

However, as he said earlier, we do not always share the same ideas, but we do respect each other in the House, so that we can debate. What all parliamentarians want is to be able to exchange ideas.

When I spoke earlier, I said that we had made a promise. We promised to grow our country's economy. One of the key measures in our budget is to reduce taxes for the middle class by 7%, from 22% to 20.5%. That is a significant cut, and it took effect on January 1.

I have met with Canadians and I think they would disagree with my hon. colleague, because these people see how important it is to invest in the middle class and have a government that listens to them and proposes innovative measures to give Canadians more buying power.

I am so proud to have a government that is thinking about the middle class and Quebec families. When we think of the nine million Canadians who are now paying less tax, I am sure that my Conservative Party colleagues would agree that lowering taxes for the middle class is the right thing to do.

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May 19th, 2016 / 3:30 p.m.


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NDP

Guy Caron NDP Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC

Mr. Speaker, I thank my colleague, the parliamentary secretary, who often fills in on the Standing Committee on Finance, where we discussed this bill.

I heard his speech. As the Liberals have been doing since this Parliament began, he made several references to helping the middle class. Given the testimony that we heard in committee, I think he will agree with me that the term “middle class” is not clearly defined. Officials from the Department of Finance refused to define it. The definitions varied depending on the witness, but no one seems to agree on what constitutes the middle class.

When all is said and done, it seems that the proposed tax cut will not help the middle class. He, as a parliamentary secretary, and I, as an MP, will see our taxes reduced by the maximum amount, which is about $700. However, the people who work as wait staff in the parliamentary restaurant or child care workers in the Prime Minister's office, for example, will not be entitled to any kind of tax cut.

Someone who is really part of the middle class, as defined by the median income in Canada, earns $31,000 or $32,000 a year. These people are not going to get anything. We tried to work with the government to amend the proposed tax cut and ensure that everyone who earns at least $11,000 could benefit. Under our proposal, anyone who earned the median income of $31,000 would have received $200, but they are not getting anything under the government's plan.

I would like my colleague to talk about how the government's measures, which are supposed to help the middle class, are unfair because they only help people who earn $45,000 or more. Parliamentarians here in the House will get the maximum tax cut of $700.

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May 19th, 2016 / 3:35 p.m.


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Liberal

François-Philippe Champagne Liberal Saint-Maurice—Champlain, QC

Mr. Speaker, I would like to take this opportunity to acknowledge the work done by my colleague, for whom I have a great deal of respect. He is a man of experience who always brings an interesting perspective to the committee. I would like to take this opportunity to thank him for his important contribution to our committee.

Like him, I am a member of the Standing Committee on Finance, together with some other colleagues who are here. We did indeed hear from a number of witnesses who said that the definition of middle class varies greatly depending on the region and the socio-economic context.

I was fortunate to travel to the north. The average salary in some areas is obviously quite different from the average in my riding of Saint-Maurice—Champlain. You will realize that when we take into account all the factors, the middle class is a concept that varies.

This is what we did. The member could at least give us credit for that. We were very clear in the last election when we indicated which tax bracket we would lower. That is exactly what we did. We said that we would lower taxes for the second bracket of the middle class from 22% to 20.5%, which applies to income of approximately $45,000 to $90,000. That is a 7% reduction. Canadians chose to elect us based on that.

I understand what my colleague said. He shared his views and we listened carefully at the Standing Committee on Finance. However, on October 19, Canadians chose a different path.

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May 19th, 2016 / 3:35 p.m.


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Liberal

Arnold Chan Liberal Scarborough—Agincourt, ON

Mr. Speaker, I want to congratulate the Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Finance not only for his presentation here today but for his excellent work, along with the Minister of Finance, particularly at the beginning of this year, when they went coast to coast to coast around the country under a very difficult timeline to consult with Canadians on what was ultimately budget 2016.

I listened carefully to his presentation with respect to many of the tax measures that are included in budget 2016 and how it would improve the lives of middle-class Canadians. Some of the things I did not hear, which I want to give the parliamentary secretary an opportunity to expand on and are particularly important to my riding of Scarborough—Agincourt, are the strategic investments, particularly in infrastructure, and in particular as it relates to public transit.

We have had some interesting announcements that have taken place in, for example, the Toronto area. I would like to give the opportunity to the parliamentary secretary to further elucidate as to how it might impact my particular region of the country.

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May 19th, 2016 / 3:35 p.m.


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Liberal

François-Philippe Champagne Liberal Saint-Maurice—Champlain, QC

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank my colleague and say what a pleasure it is to see him in the House. Perhaps I had the privilege of travelling coast to coast to coast, but I recognize my colleague went through a difficult time. It is nice to see him with us, because he is an outstanding member with the respect of everyone in the House. These days, one can only appreciate being surrounded by people like him.

The question brings me back to the first thing the member said, about the humbling experience. We are going about consultations in many different areas, but we did our finance consultation and went from coast to coast in the country, and I had the chance to go to his part of the country. It was one of the most humbling experiences.

To come back to what the member was saying, over the next two years we will invest $11.9 billion on phase one of our new infrastructure program. This is significant. It is part of the $120 billion for the next 10 years. This is exactly the type of investment that is going to help our country with economic growth, but also provide Canadians the necessities in terms of infrastructure. We have inherited a situation where the previous government lacked the necessary investment in our infrastructure, which deprived a number of our communities and our cities of essential infrastructure.

The member was talking about public transit. The investment is going to be $3.4 billion. In some communities, moving goods and people faster is so important. Traffic jams are not just a nuisance. There is a huge economic cost. Our economists have calculated how much it costs when people are in traffic for one or two hours per day, and they say that making these smart investments would allow us to have economic growth in regions like his.

We heard from many of his people that they wanted us to make investments in public transit. I have been in the cities. We have admitted a number of new Canadians, and because of the sprawling of cities, jobs are here and people are there. There is no connection between the two. I met people who said they could not find people to hire and I met people who said they do not have a job. These investments would help our country to succeed in this century and for the future.

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May 19th, 2016 / 3:40 p.m.


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Conservative

Gérard Deltell Conservative Louis-Saint-Laurent, QC

Mr. Speaker, on behalf of my political party, I am pleased to speak in the debate on Bill C-2.

As we have seen just now, Bill C-2 contains the initial application of the new Liberal government’s financial measures. We recognize that Canadians spoke last October 19. We are true democrats. We respect the choice made by Canadians, and we want the government to respect Canadians.

The first thing that the government and any politician must respect is the commitments made during the election campaign. Unfortunately, in that regard, the least we can say is that this government got elected by saying one thing and is now doing exactly the opposite.

Bill C-2 is the first manifestation, if we needed one, of this sad reality. I said so just now in the question that I asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Finance. Of course, we are all members of Parliament. However, he spoke as a parliamentary secretary, and I am happy to repeat publicly what I said before: this guy should be in cabinet and not just a parliamentary secretary.

What the member said just now is that, unfortunately, election promises could not be kept. With all due respect to the Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Finance, he did not answer the question. The Liberal Party made a commitment to bring in tax changes that, it said, would benefit the greatest number of Canadians. It is a point of honour, because it is a cornerstone of its platform. Those tax changes were supposed to be revenue-neutral. However, now reality has caught up with the Liberals: this government is making tax changes that are not revenue-neutral, but rather create a deficit.

That deficit is $1.7 billion. The parliamentary budget officer also says so, the very one quoted by the President of the Treasury Board just a few minutes ago as saying that everything is hunky-dory. I presume that the government has great respect for this institution, but this institution says, in black and white, that the tax changes made by the government in Bill C-2 will generate a deficit of $1.7 billion.

Not long ago, I heard the member say that families are content and that people are happy that money is being put in their pockets. I am quite sure people are happy, but can we afford that? No. When we do that, we must do so realistically, responsibly, and in a balanced way. Let us remember that our government, under the leadership of the right hon. member for Calgary Heritage, put forward measures to reduce taxes, at zero cost. There were 140 such measures in all.

Let us remember the most spectacular measure, taken in the first term: we lowered the GST from 7% to 6% and then from 6% to 5%. We promised to do that, and we did it. Need I also remind the House that years ago, the predecessor of the member for Saint-Maurice—Champlain, the Right Hon. Jean Chrétien, made an election promise in 1993 to abolish the GST? He never did abolish it, which led to a by-election to replace the minister, who left.

Sure, tax cuts are nice and changes to taxation are nice, but they have to be made realistically and responsibly, which is not the case with Bill C-2.

This is not the only time the government has made a promise about finances but done the opposite. Changes to the tax structure will cause a $1.7-billion deficit, and the same goes for changes to family benefits. The Liberal government is acting the same way. It promised that its changes would be revenue-neutral, but reality is catching up with it.

Changes for families, represented by the hon. member for Québec, the Minister of Families, Children and Social Development, my colleague and neighbour, were not supposed to cost anything. However, they are causing a $1.4-billion deficit.

Need I remind the House that the financial cornerstone of this government or any government is, without doubt, the budget? What did the Liberal Party say about the budget during the election campaign? It said there would be little wee $10-billion deficits for three years followed by a balanced budget and that everything would be fine.

The fact is that there will be a $24.9-billion deficit this year. That is the reality of this government: it says one thing but does the opposite. It promises a balanced budget but ends up in the hole. It says we will have small deficits but ends up with big ones. How are we supposed to trust this government? How can we believe a thing it says?

How can people not be even more cynical about politicians when, unfortunately, the government stands out so distinctly for promising one thing and then doing the opposite?

I am appealing to the government's common sense, and I am inviting it to make some changes and stop living beyond its means. A deficit is a burden for our children and grandchildren. Some will say that this is good for families and children. As I understand it, we are passing the burden to families and children. That is not a responsible approach.

Some colleagues opposite will say that when the Conservatives were in power, they ran up deficits. When we were in power and the right hon. member for Calgary Heritage led Canada, the country faced the worst global economic crisis since the Great Depression of the 1930s. Despite this terrible situation, we won the G7 triple crown because we were in power and because the Conservatives had a prudent and rigorous approach to managing the country. We are the best in the world with respect to the three fundamental aspects of the economy. We like to compare ourselves to the best in the world, because that is how we get good. We won the G7 triple crown under the rigorous management of the former government led by the right hon. member for Calgary Heritage. We had the best debt-to-GDP ratio, the best job creation record, and the best economic recovery. That is our government's legacy.

I want to emphasize the best debt-to-GDP ratio. We often hear the people currently in power say that they have the best debt-to-GDP ratio, which makes it possible for them to incur a deficit. It is because of the Conservatives that Canada has the best debt-to-GDP ratio. Had we used the Liberals' approach to managing the country during the economic crisis, we would not be the best. We would be the worst. They are making bad decisions.

I would like to remind Canadians that we left the House clean. We won the G7 triple crown. We had the best debt-to-GDP ratio. We left a surplus. We are not the only ones to say so. When the current government came to power, in November, what was the state of our finances? We had a $1-billion surplus. I am not the one saying so; the Department of Finance said so.

I got a document out of my desk, but I cannot show it. Why do I have it? I keep it close by because it is crucial to always remember what is fundamental to our political action. We are here to vote on legislation and budgets, but we must always have accurate information.

The Department of Finance indicated in the “Fiscal Monitor”, which is published by that department, that there was a $1-billion surplus for the period from April to November 2015. That has the Conservative government's signature all over it. That is how we left things financially. Unfortunately, the current government is living beyond its means.

I would like to say one last thing about the document I cannot exhibit. I think we have asked for this official document to be tabled at least 50 times. Unfortunately, the government systematically refuses to table a simple document that confirms our sound and good management.

In our view, the best thing for the Canadian economy is clearly wealth creation and job creation. However, wealth and jobs are not created by the government, but by private businesses, our entrepreneurs, our men and women who, through their intellect, enthusiasm, determination, and community leadership, create jobs and wealth. The government needs to be there to support them.

With deep sadness, our entrepreneurs have realized that there is absolutely nothing in the budget to help them. That is our vision.

The Conservatives believe that to help our businesses grow, markets need to be opened up. I have the great privilege of sitting next to my hon. colleague from the Vancouver area, who was the minister of international trade. For four years, with honour, dignity, and success, he conducted the negotiations on the trans-Pacific partnership, which is providing Canada and Canadian business people with access to a market of 800 million people. It is fantastic.

We are asking the government for assurance that this treaty will actually be ratified and the guarantees offered to our workers across Canada will be honoured, particularly regarding the famous issue of supply management.

In Bill C-2, we see that, unfortunately, that vision is not the right one, from our perspective. That is where the heart of political action lies. What vision do we have for the future of Canada? For us, the Conservatives, it is clear. It must also be said that for the Liberals too, it is clear. In our view, it is not the right one.

We believe that we have to live within our means, that we should not run a deficit in times of prosperity, which is in fact what was said by the Right Hon. Paul Martin, the former prime minister of Canada, but more importantly, the former minister of finance in the Chrétien government. In fact, his memory was honoured, not in the funereal sense, but for his historical importance to our nation, our country, when his portrait was unveiled just a few days ago.

Paul Martin said that in times of prosperity, the deficit must be eliminated and, above all, the debt paid off. That was a vision that we share and that, unfortunately, seems to have faded over time in the Liberal Party. To us, it is clear: you do not run a deficit when the country is prospering. The Liberal government has quite a different vision.

It is crystal clear. With Bill C-2, we see a government that shares not exactly the same vision, point of view, attitude, or policy as we had under our former leadership for the last 10 years. Let me be clear, in the last 10 years, our former prime minister was very strict on public funding, but first and foremost we left the House clean. There was a $1 billion surplus at the end of our mandate and also the big three of the G7: the best ratio of debt to GDP; the best at creating jobs; and the best in getting back our economy after the crisis. That is the Conservatives' signature. This is how we left the House. It was a really clean, good House left by the former Conservative government.

However, today what we see is a government that spends too much. It is a government that does not respect the fact that we have to live on what we have, instead of what we wish to have. When we create deficits in that situation, we send the bill to our children and grandchildren, even to those who are not born today. They will have to pay for the fact that today the current government is doing it all wrong and making bad decisions for the future of this country.

It is not too late. Maybe the government will open its eyes and make some modification, maybe. It is not too late. The bill is not yet passed. I can dream. I am a dreamer; not all the time, but I am a dreamer.

We strongly disagree with this attitude. Every party wants to give money to the people. We did that 140 times when we were in power. We reduced the debt, reduced the taxes, reduced income tax, and all that stuff. We did that 140 times in our government, but we did it very responsibly, which is not the case in this bill.

I hope that this House will reject Bill C-2.

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May 19th, 2016 / 3:55 p.m.


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Saint-Maurice—Champlain Québec

Liberal

François-Philippe Champagne LiberalParliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Finance

Mr. Speaker, I was pleased to listen to my colleague.

As he said, we are in the House to listen to one another. I would just like to say that there is one model we do not care to emulate. I am talking about the hon. member for Calgary Heritage, the former prime minister of Canada.

To us, he is not really a role model because he added $150 billion to Canada's public debt. Hon. members will understand that on this side of the House, we do not really see that as an example to follow.

I listened to my colleague from Louis-Saint-Laurent with great interest. I noted that at one point he asked rhetorically whether we had the means to help the middle class. His response was no.

I can say one thing. After meeting Canadians from coast to coast, the answer is yes. We do indeed have the means to help and invest in the middle class. The reason is simple. Canada has the lowest debt-to-GDP ratio in the G7. Now I have a question for the hon. member for Louis-Saint-Laurent

Who is he disagreeing with? Is it the Financial Times, which says that Canada is the star of global economic growth? Is it The Wall Street Journal, which described our Minister of Finance as someone who is showing other countries how it is done? Is it the parliamentary budget officer, who said the measures in the budget are going to create growth? Is it Christine Lagarde, from the IMF, who sees Canada as an example? Is it the G7?

Among all those who are saying that Canada is on the right path under this Minister of Finance, who got it wrong in his books?

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May 19th, 2016 / 3:55 p.m.


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Conservative

Gérard Deltell Conservative Louis-Saint-Laurent, QC

Mr. Speaker, I would encourage my colleague to use caution when quoting articles from foreign news sources, particularly if he is reading what the foreign press has to say about our Parliament and our Prime Minister these days.

Since the member is quoting, I would like to quote from his election platform, which says these changes will be revenue neutral. Would he like to quote that document? That is what I went by, and that is what 35 million Canadians based their vote on. In reality, these measures are not revenue neutral.

Once again, the best debt-to-GDP ratio forms the cornerstone of the Liberal Party's plan. Who is responsible for that? Who enabled Canada to have the best economic performance coming out of the economic crisis? What government made sure that we were the best creator of jobs and wealth in the G7? It was our government. Yes, I am very proud of the legacy left by the right hon. former prime minister, the right hon. member for Calgary Heritage.

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May 19th, 2016 / 3:55 p.m.


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NDP

Guy Caron NDP Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank my colleague from Louis-Saint-Laurent. I found his remarks very interesting. He is a good speaker. It spices up the debate.

I would like to begin my question by pointing out a comment that he made at the beginning of his speech. He said that when the Conservatives were in power, they made responsible tax cuts. He mentioned the GST. According to the data that I have, the lowering of the GST from 7% to 5% over two years and the corporate tax cut cost over $16 billion, which completely eliminated the surplus that the Conservatives inherited, even before the recession hit.

The member should be careful about making comparisons that are not quite accurate.

However, one thing he did not mention in his speech that is in Bill C-2 is the TFSA limit. We know that the previous Conservative government wanted to increase the limit to $10,000. One thing we do agree with in this bill is the decision to bring the limit back down to $5,500, but to index it. We support this measure because many people think a TFSA is meant to be a place to put money that will generate interest, which will not be taxable. However, the tool can be used for many other purposes, including purchasing shares and all kinds of other financial tools. Capital gains on these tools would ultimately not be taxed.

The parliamentary budget officer estimated that this measure would cost about 0.7% of Canada's GDP in the medium term. I would like to hear my colleague's thoughts on why the Conservatives always wanted to increase the limit to $10,000, even though that would have had disastrous consequences for the Canadian economy.

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May 19th, 2016 / 3:55 p.m.


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Conservative

Gérard Deltell Conservative Louis-Saint-Laurent, QC

Mr. Speaker, it is my turn to acknowledge the expertise of my colleague from Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, with whom I have had the pleasure of debating several times on RDI. I must admit that I would have to prepare a little bit before going on the air to debate an experienced economist like the member for Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques. Overall, I do not think it went too poorly.

I thank my colleague for bring up TFSAs, because I had that topic in my notes, but I forgot to look at them. I would be happy to talk about TFSAs. Once again, the different parties all have different visions, and that is why we are here in Parliament.

We all know that the New Democratic Party is fine with taxes. We think it is much better to lower taxes, as we did with the GST, and put more money in people's pockets to help get the economy moving.

The economy is a key, cardinal value for us. Unfortunately, we know that Canadians are not saving enough money for retirement. The TFSA was a new vehicle that enabled Canadians to save money. Some people did not like it when it was introduced, but it has been so good that nobody wants to get rid of it now. Bravo. Here is where we part ways: we think the TFSA limit needs to be higher. We have to enable people who earn a good living to save money too. We have to make that possible because that is a vision we have for the future. Everyone has their own thinking on that. I know some people think it is not the way to go, but for us, it is a cardinal value. Canadians have to save money. We created this tool, and we wanted to make it even better.

I am not a millionaire, but I like the TFSA a lot. I save money, and that is a good thing. We all live according to our means, and when possible, if people have no debt, it is a great thing to be able to save.

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May 19th, 2016 / 4 p.m.


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Conservative

John Brassard Conservative Barrie—Innisfil, ON

Mr. Speaker, I want to thank my hon. colleague for his speech this afternoon, and I really respect and honour his parliamentary experience.

I do not have enough confidence to speak or ask a question in French.

I will do it in English, if members do not mind.

I want to focus on the debt and the deficit situation. My home province of Ontario is currently experiencing $313 billion in debt. In fact, the third-largest department in the Ontario government is the payment on that debt.

Of course, we all know that many in the former Ontario Liberal government are now running the PMO, so we are just transferring that debt and deficit ideology into the federal government, and obviously access to a bigger piggy bank.

I want to ask my hon. colleague, given his experience in government, what impact significant debt and deficit can have with respect to the impact on middle-class Canadians going forward.

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May 19th, 2016 / 4 p.m.


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Conservative

Gérard Deltell Conservative Louis-Saint-Laurent, QC

Mr. Speaker, I thank my colleague for his right and very important question. It is a real issue when we are talking about public money, and we are here to do that. People pay taxes and they want to know what we are doing with them.

When we create deficits, we create debt, and we are shifting the bill to our children and grandchildren, even those who are not born today, and they will have to pay for the fact that we live over budget today.

He talks about his own province. I can talk about my home province too, Quebec. This is a very important bill that we have to pay, a very huge debt. That is why I have been involved in politics for the last eight years. I was elected in 2008 in the National Assembly, and it was one of my cardinal issues for which I fought in the National Assembly and for which I want to fight here in the House of Commons, to be very careful with the debt and especially with the deficit.

My hon. colleague from the Liberal Party talked about our result when we were in office. He said we raised the deficits so high. Yes, but he forgot that in this House we faced the worst economic crisis since the thirties.

That is why we had to make difficult decisions, especially in a non-majority government. In a minority government, we had to make some deals with the Liberals and the NDP, and this is why we had to make that difficult choice. However, the result at the end of the crisis was that we were the best, thanks to the Conservative government.

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May 19th, 2016 / 4:05 p.m.


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NDP

Guy Caron NDP Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC

Mr. Speaker, as the NDP finance critic, I am pleased to rise at third reading stage of this bill, which has been debated at length in the House.

From the outset, I want to point out that during the debate and discussions in committee we reached out to the government to ensure that the tax cut promised in this bill was truly for the middle class.

As I said in my question, the middle class is not very well defined. The Department of Finance refuses to define it. We have varying definitions depending on the groups. On the other hand, we can agree that when half the people earn more than us and half the people earn less than us, we are in the middle class. I think that makes a lot of sense.

Those people, who earn roughly $31,000 or $32,000 a year, are not getting one cent from the so-called middle-class tax cut promised in this bill. I find that extremely problematic. I mentioned this in my question, but it bears repeating. As parliamentarians, parliamentary secretaries, or even the chief government whip, we are going to benefit the most from this tax cut. We are absolutely not part of the middle class, but we will get a maximum reduction of nearly $700 because of this promised tax cut.

Someone who earns $30,000, $35,000, $40,000, or even $45,000 a year will not get one red cent from the tax cuts in this bill. Therefore, when the government says that this bill will help the middle class as promised during the election campaign, that is not entirely accurate. Yes, that was in their election platform, but we all know that people rarely consult election platforms online when deciding how to vote. They tend to rely on what is said in the media, on television, in the news, and sometimes in the newspaper. What people kept hearing from the member for Papineau, who was the leader of the Liberal Party, was not that he would lower taxes for people earning over $45,000 a year, but rather that he would lower taxes for the middle class.

Those who earn less than $45,000 a year and consider themselves part of the middle class feel cheated, and rightly so. I am convinced that during the Canada-wide consultations held by the Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Finance and the Minister of Finance, they probably heard comments about that from people who are not eligible for the tax cut. People have been able to tell from the beginning of this year, since the tax cut took effect on January 1 and can therefore be seen on people's pay stubs.

Since the bill does not really apply to most middle-class Canadians, what could be done? That is where we reached out to the Liberal government at committee. We proposed a measure that would cost roughly the same, but would help a lot more Canadians. Instead of changing the tax bracket beginning at $45,000, which is more representative of the upper middle class, we suggested lowering the first tax bracket, the lowest level at which everyone starts paying taxes.

Accordingly, instead of lowering the rate from 22% to 20.5% for the second tax bracket, we are proposing to lower the rate from 15% to 14% for the first tax bracket. That will have a significant impact because the same person who sees half the population earning more than they do and the other half earning less, will receive a $200 tax reduction, whereas they are receiving nothing now. Thus, someone who earns $210,000 a year and now gets $200 of the proposed reduction, would instead pay $70 more.

We have to be careful with slogans. There is no doubt in my mind that, after all the debate, the desire to help the middle class that is constantly being trumpeted by the government is more of a slogan than something real.

If the government really wanted to help the middle class, it would have accepted the proposal, the olive branch that we were extending to the Liberals, in order to ensure that everyone could benefit.

I am sorry to say that this proposal was rejected by the Standing Committee on Finance. It is regrettable because I believe that it could have been debated and probably would have been agreed to. What the government promised during the election campaign, or the spirit of the promise, would have been kept. The whole of the middle class would have received a tax cut. That is not the case at present. It is unfortunate that the government is still trying to make us believe the opposite.

As a parliamentarian, I have to admit that I do not need a tax cut. I want to pay my fair share. I consider myself to be privileged. Why are they insisting that my colleagues and I receive the largest possible reduction? That is a very problematic aspect of the bill, which only has 10 clauses.

We are not fundamentally opposed to the measure to introduce a new tax rate of 33% for income in excess of $200,000 or to the measure to lower the TFSA contribution limit from $10,000 to $5,500. We have supported these measures from the beginning, even before the Liberal Party decided to include them in its election platform. I remember some debates that were held here, in the House, against increasing the limit to $10,000, and those arguments still hold true today.

The parliamentary budget officer conducted a very important and specific study on this topic. Once again, my colleague from Louis-Saint-Laurent did not fully answer the question, because he tried to imply that the TFSA is just a money-saving tool. TFSAs are indeed used for this purpose. After people pay their taxes, they deposit money in a TFSA, which then grows with tax-free interest. However, with the limit increased to $10,000, the TFSA would become a significant tax-avoidance tool for people who have the means to contribute the $10,000 maximum, as proposed by the Conservatives.

What is the result? The result is that not just money will be deposited into these vehicles. People can also put stocks, bonds, and other financial tools that would often be subject to capital gains tax into those accounts. That money can grow tax-free in these vehicles. We have here a situation where we started out with a savings vehicle and ended up with a significant tool for tax avoidance, which allows the wealthiest members of our society to shelter their money from taxes. That is why the parliamentary budget officer described this measure as potentially dangerous for the public purse.

He estimated that in 20, 30, or 40 years, the money that would no longer be paid to the Canadian government in taxes as a result of this measure could be equivalent to 0.7% of the GDP. The government feels that 0.7% of the GDP is too much to allocate to international aid. However, it does not seem to be too much to give away primarily to the wealthiest members of society, who would use the TFSA to shelter their investments.

That is why we think that the limit of $5,500 is entirely appropriate. In fact, only 17% of those who contribute to a TFSA and 7% of the entire Canadian population reach that limit. We agree with that measure.

We are not opposed to the creation of another tax bracket, which explains why we voted in favour of the ways and means motion that could not be debated or amended. It has a major financial impact.

However, there is now another important factor to consider and that is the tax cut for the so-called middle class. We are in a situation where that could be changed.

That is the path we chose. We voted in favour of Bill C-2 at second reading specifically because we wanted to try working in committee to get a clearer picture of what this measure as a whole means for the middle class.

Evidence from Standing Committee on Finance meetings shows that, systematically, almost every time I asked a question, it was about this issue. Most of the answers I got were pretty vague with respect to the impact. Some said that, basically, we were right: we would reach many more citizens and taxpayers and help many more people.

The government argues that this is part of a suite of measures that must be taken as a whole. This bill is not a suite of measures. It contains three distinct measures, one of which is very problematic.

If we look at the government's proposed measures as a whole, including the child tax benefit in the budget implementation bill, we see that many members of the middle class will not get a tax cut or any help from this government.

Single people with no children earning $40,000 a year, which is a fairly large portion of our society, I would say, will get nothing, either from this income tax cut or from other measures proposed by the federal government. An elderly couple earning $30,000 to $35,000 in pension income will get nothing, either from this income tax cut or from measures proposed by the government in the budget implementation bill.

A large part of the Canadian population will get nothing, but those people can clearly and accurately define themselves as being part of the middle class. I do not understand that, and the Liberal Party has not provided any explanation, apart from the fact that people elected them because of that, for refusing our offer to work together to help as many Canadians as possible, to help the entire middle class and not just those who are earning up to $217,000 a year. Those who are earning between $45,000 and $217,000 a year will benefit from the bill.

When I go to my constituency, how can I meet with the head of a banking institution, who may be earning $215,000 a year, and with someone earning $30,000 a year and explain to them that the former will benefit from it and the latter will not?

I do not know how the Liberal members feel when this question comes up. I suspect they will not be in a hurry to answer it. They are well aware of what kind of reaction they will get from those citizens.

We are in a Parliament that we hoped would be collaborative. I will not rehash yesterday’s events, but while the government says that it is willing to listen to our amendments and that it wants to gain our co-operation by working with us, we really feel that it just wants to push its ideas through as quickly as possible, without necessarily paying much attention to the positive effects that an opposition proposal might have.

I would like to have seen Liberal members ask more questions on this issue in the Standing Committee on Finance. However, their questions seem mostly to have been designed to elicit witnesses’ agreement with the government’s position. The Standing Committee on Finance plays a special role in this Parliament, as do all committees, in fact, which is quite different from the role of the House of Commons.

It is different because, here, we have a somewhat adversarial system, with the government on one side and the opposition on the other. However, committee is the only place where we can call each other by our proper names. We are not members for certain ridings, but rather members, period. Our role, whether on the government side or opposition side, is to make sure that the government is held to account and that the government's proposals are studied, scrutinized, and analyzed in order to ensure that they really contribute to the common good of the country.

We are talking about the current government, but I am not saying that the previous government did not do the same thing. Government members act like cheerleaders to applaud their government's proposals, rather than paying close attention to the detailed consideration of what is before them. Not only does the committee's work suffer, but so does Parliament as a whole, and so does Canadian democracy. This situation does not appear to be getting any better as time goes by, despite this government's commitment to do things differently and ensure that Parliament works more collaboratively.

There are measures that we support, including lowering the TFSA ceiling, which will still be indexed to $5,500. Combined with the other savings tools, this measure seems good to us. There is also the creation of a tax bracket for higher incomes. Despite the fact that it applies to incomes over $200,000, it will not be enough to ensure that people who earn $210,000, for example, pay more taxes, because they will pay less.

We feel that this other measure in Bill C-2 is problematic and fundamentally unfair. Contrary to what the government would have us believe, this measure does not meet a need of the middle class and does not apply to all those who belong to the middle class.

The member for Louis-Saint-Laurent makes a valid argument, even though we did not present it: when people voted for a tax cut for the middle class, they did not necessarily know where the middle class began according to the government's definition, and the government did not dwell on that either. However, if there is anything that was mentioned more often than the $45,000 threshold from which the cut would apply, it is the fact that this measure would not cost anything.

When the Liberals say that Canadians voted for this measure, we must realize that Canadians voted for their perception of this measure. That perception quite often was created by the Leader of the Liberal Party, who extolled the virtues of a tax cut for the middle class. Unfortunately, this measure excludes a lot of the middle class.

I can assure the House, that I hear my constituents talk about this and that every one of my colleagues has talked to me about it. This has been discussed by committees and also by our caucus.

Although we support the two measures, we fundamentally disagree with the third one, which we tried to amend. The government chose to ignore us. We debated this issue because it is important and it is being talked about in our ridings. We would have liked the government to listen more and co-operate with us. It did not. This morning, we were not expecting to debate Bill C-2 in the House this afternoon. However, we are discussing it again and we will have the opportunity to meet as a caucus to bring this discussion to a close.

Unfortunately, I do not think that was a very good thing for the government to do. People have rather strong opinions in this regard, even though there is still opportunity for discussion. I think that the debate at third reading will be the government's last chance to consider our demands and those of our constituents.

If the government members have suggestions or if they want to make amendments to initiatives other than this bill, which cannot be amended, our door is always open. With regard to this measure, unfortunately, we are being forced to seriously consider voting against the bill at third reading because the government has failed to listen to or show an interest in a large portion of the middle class.

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May 19th, 2016 / 4:20 p.m.


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Liberal

Anthony Housefather Liberal Mount Royal, QC

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank my colleague for his speech.

I completely agree with him about the role of committees, and I am proud that the members of the Standing Committee on Justice and Human Rights were able to work together to make 16 amendments to Bill C-14. I hope that that will also happen in other committees.

I understand the demand being made by my New Democrat colleague, who wants to offer a tax cut to a bigger group of people than the one provided for in Bill C-2. However, during the election campaign, the NDP did not put forward any proposal to reduce taxes for those who will benefit from Bill C-2 or for anyone else.

How is it that the New Democrats did not propose any tax cuts for the middle class during the election campaign and now they are demanding that sort of tax cut before they will support Bill C-2?

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May 19th, 2016 / 4:25 p.m.


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NDP

Guy Caron NDP Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC

Mr. Speaker, I thank the member for his question.

I have been asked this question before, and I answered it when we were debating this bill at second reading. I agree that the government was elected on a platform of tax cuts for the middle class. That was a measure that made headlines throughout the campaign. The public elected the Liberal government. No one can deny that.

Now, if the Liberals promised a tax cut for the middle class, they should truly cut taxes for the middle class. Here in the House, we accept the public's choice, so we should work to improve the proposal that was made during the election campaign. Many more people shared our understanding of this proposal, which is not what has been imposed by the government.

I cannot deny that the platform on the Liberal Party's website proposed lowering the tax rate for the second tax bracket from 22% to 20.5%. However, if you ask people what the Liberal Party promised them, they will say that they were promised a tax cut for the middle class, not a tax cut from 22% to 20.5% for income above $45,000.

Since the public made its choice on October 19, we wanted to help the government achieve what Canadians were expecting, which was a tax cut that would benefit everyone, starting at $11,000 in income, and that would have essentially cost the same to the treasury as the measure the government proposed.

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May 19th, 2016 / 4:25 p.m.


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Conservative

John Brassard Conservative Barrie—Innisfil, ON

Mr. Speaker, the hon. member touched on a really important part of what the budget is about. We on this side of the House have often said that it is actually a Liberal shell game that says the middle class is going to be getting more than what it will. There is no definition of what the middle class is.

In fact, when it was broken down in a recent Maclean's magazine article, David Macdonald, who is with the Canadian Centre for Policy Alternatives, said that there are roughly 1.6 billion families making $48,000 to $62,000 that will see their tax bills trimmed by, on average, just $51, and as the income goes up, those earning $62,000 to $78,000 will only see a $117 saving, and there will be a $521 saving for the average family making $124,000 to $166,000.

What is important to understand is those making $166,000 to $211,000 will get a tax break of about $813. That benefits what I would classify as the upper middle class. Everybody in the House is going to be getting a bigger tax break than what I would truly classify as a middle-class family.

I want to ask the hon. member how he feels about this Liberal shell game.

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May 19th, 2016 / 4:25 p.m.


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NDP

Guy Caron NDP Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC

Mr. Speaker, I agree with the member for Barrie—Innisfil's statement.

David Macdonald also said that those who will benefit the most from the Liberals' tax proposals are families that earn between $166,000 and $211,000 a year. According to his estimates, these families would receive about $813, on average.

Stephen Gordon is a respected economist and is not known for being partisan. We do not always agree with his positions as an economist, but he is respected. He said that people earning $50,000 in taxable income would benefit much less than those who earn $150,000 in taxable income, which is not far from what we make here. He even admitted that the NDP is correct. Those with a higher income will receive many more benefits under the Liberal plan than those supposedly in the middle class.

The Liberals do not seem to understand what Canadians truly expect. They said that the second tax bracket, for income between $45,000 and $90,000, would be changed. They would be surprised to hear that Canadians thought that would exclude people who earned more than $90,000, but that is not the case. Those who benefit from the tax cut are all those whose income is above $45,000, including those whose income is above $90,000. In fact, in spite of the new tax rate of 33% for income in excess of $200,000, people who earn up to $217,000 will be getting a tax cut. However, there is still nothing for someone who earns $44,000 a year.

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May 19th, 2016 / 4:30 p.m.


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NDP

Alistair MacGregor NDP Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC

Mr. Speaker, I certainly appreciate my friend's speech. He is doing an incredible job for the NDP as the finance critic. I certainly appreciated listening to his exchange with the member for Louis-Saint-Laurent earlier, where he decisively explained why we are opposed to keeping the TFSA contribution limit so high.

I know the Conservatives are champions for lower taxes, but by going the route of giving more savings room, they might be forcing a future government to either drastically cut services, which usually hurt the most vulnerable in our society, or actually raise taxes. Therefore, it would have a converse effect.

I want to touch on the subject of where the middle class sits. One of the privileges of being a member of Parliament is that we get to meet people from all walks of life. It really is a fantastic privilege to get to meet people from the community. In my area of Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, I would say that most of the people I meet would fall into the range of income of around $30,000 to $40,000. If they do not have children, they are not going to get anything from this plan. Several of them have correctly noted that, as a member of Parliament, I would get the full tax cut out of this plan. I was not sent to Ottawa to give myself a tax cut. My job was to come here to make life easier for those who do not have as many means.

My colleague has already illustrated the mechanics of this in trying to find the definition of the middle class. I think we exist sometimes in an Ottawa bubble, and I was wondering if he could inform the House of some of the feedback he has directly received from some of his constituents on this matter.

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May 19th, 2016 / 4:30 p.m.


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NDP

Guy Caron NDP Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC

Mr. Speaker, I thank my colleague, who is also doing an excellent job in his first session in Parliament. He has really impressed his colleagues so far.

This is an important issue. The questions people ask me most often are about this and the proposed changes to employment insurance. For example, people have asked me why their waiting period has not yet been reduced from two weeks to one. I have explained that the measure is not yet in force. Since the government's platform said that would happen in 2017, that is what I tell them.

However, when they tell me they are still waiting for less tax to be withheld from their paycheques, knowing that this measure is in force, and they want to know why they are not seeing a difference, I am forced to ask them what their income is. In many cases, they earn $30,000, $35,000, or $40,000. I tell them that they do not qualify. Then I ask them if they have children to see if they will get the new tax benefit. Unfortunately, I have to tell single people that they will not benefit.

The problem with making big commitments and big promises is that it creates great expectations. Those great expectations can lead to disappointment for people who thought they would be included. That is what happened to a significant segment of the population with Bill C-2.

The House resumed consideration of the motion that Bill C-2, An Act to amend the Income Tax Act be read the third time and passed.

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May 19th, 2016 / 4:35 p.m.


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Liberal

David Graham Liberal Laurentides—Labelle, QC

Mr. Speaker, I will be sharing my time with the hon. member for Mount Royal, who, like me, spoke in French during Monday's debate on Bill C-10. I wanted to make that correction since the hon. member for Outremont misinformed the House about that on Tuesday. In fact, I speak French more than he does in the House. He would contribute more to the quality of the debates in the House if he checked the facts before making unfounded accusations.

I rise to speak to one of our key election promises: the 7% tax cut for the middle class, whose tax rate will go from 22% to 20.5%; the tax increase for wealthier Canadians from 29% to 33%; and the reduction in the TFSA annual contribution limit from $10,000 to $5,500.

I commend the Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Finance and my riding neighbour, the hon. member for Saint-Maurice—Champlain, on his maiden speech. Our ridings meet along a provincial gravel road, Parent Road, where government signs strongly advise the use of CB radios. This border is located more than 300 kilometres north of Montreal, not far from the community of Parent.

Bill C-2 is important to the growth of the middle class. It includes crucial changes to Canada's tax system. The legislative summary of the bill is quite clear:

This enactment amends the Income Tax Act to reduce the second personal income tax rate from 22% to 20.5% and to introduce a new personal marginal tax rate of 33% for taxable income in excess of $200,000. It also amends other provisions of that Act to reflect the new 33% rate. In addition, it amends that Act to reduce the annual contribution limit for tax-free savings accounts from $10,000 to its previous level with indexation ($5,500 for 2016) starting January 1, 2016.

These changes will benefit Canadians, so naturally, they are looking forward to them.

I also want to congratulate my colleague from Louis-Hébert on his speech. I rose to reply to him a couple of times, but better members were recognized before me. The life of an MP is complicated.

I would like to point out that the member for Louis-Hébert alluded to the fact that budget 2016 provides for a deficit. He also said that his government was responsible for all of the good things that came out of the last term of office. He is very happy to take credit for all of the positive results, while saying that his team had nothing to do with anything that went wrong.

Investments in the middle class and economic growth for ordinary Canadians are very important to me, the government, and the millions of Canadians who will benefit.

The member for Louis-Hébert also said that the Conservatives left the House clean. That is not completely true. The Conservatives sold the house to pay off the mortgage. They waved the cheque from the sale in the air for all to see before giving it back to the bank to pay the mortgage. The house was not really clean. It was gone. There are now deficits in the middle class, in infrastructure, and in all levels of government.

My colleague from Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques is a bit more reasonable. He presented fact-based arguments about our policies. I really enjoyed listening to his speech. I do not agree with him when he says that these tax cuts do not help the middle class. I agree with my colleague from Mount Royal, who asked why the New Democrats did not promise to cut taxes in their platform but did promise to balance the budget.

With the exception of the members of the former government, who still think that they left a massive surplus, even though that is not quite true, I think it is clear to all of us that it would only be possible to balance the budget this year if we used extreme measures, such as austerity, which is a very unpopular policy in any country.

In short, I am not worried about these deficits because they are investments. That is the case with Bill C-2. I would like to give my colleague from Louis-Hébert a little bit of background on deficits. Almost 100 years ago—

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May 19th, 2016 / 4:40 p.m.


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Conservative

Gérard Deltell Conservative Louis-Saint-Laurent, QC

Mr. Speaker, on a point of order, I am the member for Louis-Saint-Laurent, not the member for Louis-Hébert, who is a Liberal MP.

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May 19th, 2016 / 4:40 p.m.


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The Assistant Deputy Speaker Anthony Rota

Of course. Thank you. We will continue debate.

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May 19th, 2016 / 4:40 p.m.


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Liberal

David Graham Liberal Laurentides—Labelle, QC

Mr. Speaker, I greatly appreciate the correction made by my colleague from Louis-Saint-Laurent.

I want to tell him that it has been a very long time since the Conservatives managed to balance a budget. They had surpluses in or around 1871, 1912, 2006 and 2007. They left surpluses, but they always inherited them from the Liberals. They have not balanced a budget in about 140 years. When he talks about deficits, he is not being quite honest.

I will stop there, but I am interested in hearing the questions from the member for Louis-Saint-Laurent.

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May 19th, 2016 / 4:40 p.m.


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Saint-Maurice—Champlain Québec

Liberal

François-Philippe Champagne LiberalParliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Finance

Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to have the floor.

I would first like to thank my colleague for his excellent speech. He is very attached to his community. I had the opportunity to campaign with him, and I know that he has a good understanding of the concerns of the people in his riding.

In the speeches given earlier, we heard members ask whether this measure affects the middle class. In fact, this measure affects nine million Canadians. Approximately one third of all Canadians will benefit from this positive measure. We are proposing a 7% tax reduction for nine million Canadians. Therefore, I am quite shocked to hear that it is not an important measure that will help all Canadians. More than one third of the population will be affected by a key measure in the last budget.

I would like to ask my colleague from Laurentides—Labelle, whom I consider a good friend, to explain the meaning of the phrase “help the middle class”. How can these people invest in their family and send their children to school or to a summer camp? I would like him to provide concrete examples. I know him, he is a caring man who is really attached to his community.

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May 19th, 2016 / 4:40 p.m.


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Liberal

David Graham Liberal Laurentides—Labelle, QC

Mr. Speaker, the riding of Laurentides—Labelle is huge, and it has diverse economic needs. This riding is a rather poor one. Any assistance for a riding like mine is very much appreciated.

My riding has 43 municipalities, and the poverty rate is rather high. For a long time, there was a lack of investment from the federal government. We are trying to fix that situation with infrastructure spending and tax changes. This is part of a comprehensive plan that will help regions like mine and my colleague's. That is very important to our community.

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May 19th, 2016 / 4:40 p.m.


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NDP

Jenny Kwan NDP Vancouver East, BC

Mr. Speaker, the middle-income tax cut, which is supposed to benefit the middle class, actually mostly benefits those on the very high end of income, certainly relative to the people in my community.

People making $45,000 or less would not benefit one cent from this tax cut. According to the parliamentary budget officer, that is estimated to be 17.9 million Canadians.

I am wondering how the member could actually square that circle to say that this tax cut is good for people in his community who are in need of support, who have low income, particularly for camps and so on. When they make $45,000 or less, they would not benefit from this.

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May 19th, 2016 / 4:45 p.m.


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Liberal

David Graham Liberal Laurentides—Labelle, QC

Mr. Speaker, it is helpful to have any investment in our community. Any cuts in taxes, for anyone but the wealthiest, are beneficial to us.

It is part of a larger plan that all members have seen in our platform. It is part of a larger budget. There are several more budgets to come before the next election. Everything we can do to help our community will be appreciated and supported.

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May 19th, 2016 / 4:45 p.m.


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Conservative

John Barlow Conservative Foothills, AB

Mr. Speaker, it was interesting that my colleague's other colleague was mentioning how important it is that these tax cuts would help children in his riding go to summer camps and these kinds of programs. I would ask this. Why would the member support eliminating the children's fitness tax credit, the arts credit, and the textbook credit? These are also programs that I know my family relied on a great deal for our children to go to sports and be healthy and active. If that is such an important issue for this member, why would he support eliminating the children's fitness tax credit?

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May 19th, 2016 / 4:45 p.m.


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Liberal

David Graham Liberal Laurentides—Labelle, QC

Mr. Speaker, the wonderful thing about tax credits is that we only get them if we pay taxes, so they do not necessarily benefit people who need them most. I did not see a huge benefit to that. We could put those investments elsewhere in the budget and the economy. That is what the government has done and will continue to do.

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May 19th, 2016 / 4:45 p.m.


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Liberal

Anthony Housefather Liberal Mount Royal, QC

Mr. Speaker, I am honoured to rise today to speak to Bill C-2, introduced by our Minister of National Revenue and defended by our Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Finance.

Today, we have heard speeches from the hon. member for Louis-Saint-Laurent and the hon. member for Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques. What do these four people have in common? They come from three different political parties, but they are all proud Quebeckers who are all here to stand up for Canadian interests.

In my opinion, Bill C-2 advances Canada's interests because it helps the middle class.

During the election campaign, I know that people across this House, in their ridings, did a lot of door to door. I personally wore out many pairs of sneakers in this election campaign. The thing I saw the most was that there are people who need help. There are the poorest of people. There is the single mother who is earning $25,000 a year who needs help. She will be helped by the family benefits, the new child tax allowance that will come to her that will give her a lot more tax-free money. There are the vulnerable seniors who are living on their own. They will benefit, as well, from the guaranteed income supplement going up by 10% for single seniors.

However, there is also that great group of people, and certainly a large number of them in my riding, who are earning between $45,000 and $200,000 a year. They will greatly benefit from the middle-class tax cut and the reduction of the second tier tax rates from 22% to 20.5%.

I heard and I listened very closely to the different members of the NDP talking about those who earn less, and I do understand the goal of trying to help everyone. In the future, perhaps there will be another bill that will lower tax rates on the lowest tier. However, for the moment, we have to acknowledge that what is before us will help a lot of people.

There are people in my riding, and in many of our ridings, who are not comfortably middle class anymore. There are a lot of well-paying jobs that 25 years ago we would have said were well-paying jobs, but the salaries have not increased more than the cost of living, or less, over that long period of time. There may be families of four living on $90,000 or $100,000 on a single income, or $120,000 on two incomes, and they are also struggling to make ends meet. They are struggling to pay for their kids scholastic activities, whether through extracurricular activities such as sports, or alternatively through putting their kids in private schools. They are also struggling sometimes to support aged parents. Members of our sandwich generation have both their aged parents and their kids and are trying to take care of everybody.

It cannot be disputed that this middle-class tax cut for such a high percentage of Canadians, the entire mass of people who earn between $45,000 and $200,000, will help a lot of people. It will help a lot of families. It will help a lot of families take a vacation or do something that they otherwise would not be able to do, such as afford a mortgage on a better house.

When I look at the benefits of this law, while I fully understand the argument that there would be a possibility to do more some day, it still merits support.

I also want to point out that I agree with the reduction of the TFSA contributions from $10,000 to $5,500. I support the TFSA. I think the TFSA is an excellent vehicle for people to save. I do not dispute that it was a very good measure to put the TFSA into place. However, given the number of people who are using it and contributing more than $5,500, which is a negligible percentage, and the cost to the Treasury, I would rather reallocate that money to the child tax benefits.

I would rather see more people who are earning less have more to bring our children out of poverty. Let me just point out that for families earning less than $30,000 with one child under the age of five, that will be over $5,000 more, tax-free, which will benefit that family and perhaps bring a child out of poverty.

Any family earning less than $150,000 is getting more on the child tax credit portion, so for me, I think that is laudable.

I know that many of us have a lot of seniors in our ridings. My riding has a significant number of seniors, not just people who are 65 years old. I know my colleagues agree that 65 is not old nowadays. We are talking about people who are 80, 85, 90, or older. My grandparents and my parents' oldest friends did not move to retirement homes at 65, 75, or 80. They want to stay in their own homes.

The budget that we passed this year will enable more people to stay in their homes.

There is a problem in my riding. Two of our seniors' homes are going to close.

They are one block apart from each other. We need to put more money into social housing, particularly social housing for seniors.

Many members share these problems where they also have in their ridings seniors' homes that are closing, not enough new space for social housing, and people on a list that lasts forever when they are trying to find a way to stay in their communities. Some of the measures that we have taken this year are favourable to that.

I understand and appreciate the arguments on both sides. I am not here to attack anybody's economic record or anybody's economic plans. I only asked the question to the member for Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques to point out that it was not something that the NDP promised in the campaign, that they wanted the lower bracket to be cut. However, I still understand and I respect that argument in the same way I respect the Conservatives' argument that the TFSA should stay at $10,000, but in the end result, what we would ask all the members to look at is the fact that I do think, on balance, Bill C-2 is a good law and we should all support it.

If I may digress for just one second, I just want to say that today after question period I was very proud of the fact that members of this place came back to reality. We had a few days that were really unpleasant here where the tension could be cut with a knife. I came to federal politics, as some members did, from municipal politics, which was not partisan, and we never had things like that happen.

At committees we work with each other really well, at least we do at the justice and human rights committee where people from all parties work together in respect. I would love to see that continue to happen in this place. Everyone here is committed to it and what I learned most from yesterday's incident was that I have a personal obligation, and we all have a personal obligation, to remind our colleagues that we want to work together in respect.

I think this afternoon, where people had to come up with speeches at the last minute, impromptu, was a perfect example of respect. I just want to again thank everyone for the way they have acted this afternoon and I hope it continues.

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May 19th, 2016 / 4:55 p.m.


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Conservative

Todd Doherty Conservative Cariboo—Prince George, BC

Mr. Speaker, I appreciate the comments from my hon. colleague across the way. I too came here and I have offered respect throughout the six months we have been here, time and time again. There are times for jabs back and forth and it is for the most part friendly, but yesterday's incident was unacceptable.

The respect has to go two ways. The actions we have seen, and I am not talking about the motion but I want to talk about the comments at the tail end of my hon. colleague's speech, those actions do speak louder than words.

Would he not agree that perhaps the opposition has not seen the level of respect that we would expect from a government, from a leader in the past week, with Motion No. 6 originally being tabled and perhaps closure being levelled in terms of debate? Again, actions speak louder than words and respect is ensuring that there is debate, not putting a draconian motion in place.

We have moved beyond the incident yesterday as we have mentioned earlier, but again, that respect has to go both ways. Will the hon. member agree and commit to being a leader on his side so that whether it is committee work or if he is witnessing anything on his side that he will take a stand and make sure the opposition has a say, has a word, and that we are not irrelevant, as was shouted across the floor numerous times over the last week, and indeed, that we do have a voice?

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May 19th, 2016 / 4:55 p.m.


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Liberal

Anthony Housefather Liberal Mount Royal, QC

Mr. Speaker, boy, did my digression lead away from Bill C-2.

Let me say that I do commit to the idea that we should all be showing respect for each other and we should be talking to the people in our own parties and our own caucuses when they are not showing respect. When it comes to heckling, when it comes to actions that do not become us, all of us need to be leaders within our own caucuses. I commit to doing that and I hope the hon. member does the same.

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May 19th, 2016 / 4:55 p.m.


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NDP

Alistair MacGregor NDP Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC

Mr. Speaker, it is nice to be debating Bill C-2 after what has gone on this week. I do not think debate on Bill C-2 is going to make the highlight reel on CPAC; let us not kid ourselves.

I appreciate the comments the member made and I understand the position he is coming from. For us in the NDP, we have had a problem with what the Liberal definition of “middle class” is. When we look at the median income in Canada being $31,000 a year and median is very much defined as the middle point in a set of numbers, so it is about halfway. A tax cut in that range is not giving people any kind of relief. The member mentioned that we have many people in Canada who are suffering and I think he would agree with me that the gap in incomes is widening. People on the higher end of the spectrum are getting more and people on the lower end are getting less.

Economists are pointing out that couples with a combined income of $250,000 a year would gain $1,100 in tax cuts, while a couple with a combined income of $75,000 a year, which is pretty average, would gain zero to $4. I would like the member's comments on the fairness of that.

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May 19th, 2016 / 4:55 p.m.


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Liberal

Anthony Housefather Liberal Mount Royal, QC

Mr. Speaker, I always appreciate my hon. friend and the constructive suggestions that he advances. I appreciate the use of the word “median”. One of the first books I ever read was about mean, median, mode, so I do know what median is. I would point out that in the Liberal Party platform there was a very clear explanation about where that middle-class tax cut would be. Whether it is the best or not the best, that was what the platform said. That is what I ran on in the election campaign: $45,000 to $90,000, 1.5%.

In my riding many people earn more than $200,000 and our tax plan was not very popular with many residents, but I said to them, as I said to myself because before I came to this place I also was a high-income earner, that we need to give back. I agree completely that we need to find ways to help the people earning less than $45,000 as well. I think we are doing it with the family allowance, with improvements to EI, and by investing money to help people find jobs and training. I agree that on the tax issue with respect to the lowest tax bracket, that is a subject—

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May 19th, 2016 / 5 p.m.


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The Assistant Deputy Speaker Anthony Rota

I want to remind hon. members that while you are talking, if you do not mind, especially when we are getting close to the end, if you would keep an eye on the Speaker I will let you know that we are running out of time, so I will not have to cut you off like I just did. My apologies to the hon. member.

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May 19th, 2016 / 5 p.m.


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Liberal

Anthony Housefather Liberal Mount Royal, QC

I would never ignore you, Mr. Speaker.

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May 19th, 2016 / 5 p.m.


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The Assistant Deputy Speaker Anthony Rota

Resuming debate, the hon. member for Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan.

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May 19th, 2016 / 5 p.m.


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Conservative

Garnett Genuis Conservative Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB

Mr. Speaker, I appreciate the opportunity to speak to this important bill. I will say at the outset that it is good to be back talking about the business of the nation again. As much as the conversation that happened this morning needed to happen, it is very good to be back to the things that Canadians are most concerned about, which is the economy, jobs, their well-being and that of society as a whole.

There are some significant concerns about the bill that we need to draw particular attention to. We in the opposition have been doing that over the course of this debate, and we will continue to do that. We will continue to do our job, which is to highlight problems with government legislation, suggest improvements, and to do so in a fair-minded and constructive way.

Just by way of some review, the legislation that is before us would make two different changes to our tax system.

The first change is that it would make a modest reduction to some middle-income earners' taxes while introducing a tax increase for those at the high end. However, this change would not be revenue neutral. Rather, it would significantly add to the deficit, and over a number of years, significantly add to the debt. That is one of the changes.

The second change that the legislation would make is that it would do away with the higher cap on tax-free savings accounts that was implemented by our previous government and did exist. There was a limited opportunity for Canadians to save at that higher level. However, it would now cut back on the amount that Canadians can save tax-free.

I want to start my remarks here by talking about one specific aspect of this issue, and that is the issue of equality. Members on all sides of the House are concerned with equality. They want to ensure that everybody has a shot. They want to ensure that everybody in Canada has a similar shot at doing well. That is really a principle that we all come at perhaps from slightly different perspectives and slightly different emphases.

On its face, it seems that the bill was advanced with an eye to equality. However, if we dig into the details, I think there are some serious problems from an equality perspective in terms of the actual impact that the bill would have. I would describe it as maybe a first-year undergraduate version of equality. It may be well-intentioned but it would not actually have the desired impact.

Let me start by saying that for me the most important measure of equality is something called “intergenerational earnings elasticity”. This is a measure of the likelihood that a person will perform at the same economic level as their parents relative to the rest of society; in other words, it measures movement between different income quintiles. Therefore, if I come from a high-income family and was almost certainly going to have a high-income family myself, that would be bad from an equality perspective using this metric of intergenerational earnings elasticity. This does not mean that we want people who are well off now to do worse. Rather, it means that, relative to each other, we want to have a society where people who had lower incomes can move ahead of others, and vice versa, a society where opportunity is more fluid and not fundamentally shaped by who our parents are or where they came from.

This information is tracked, and there was a report that came out in 2012 that looked at intergenerational earnings elasticity. What was interesting to me, and made me very proud as a Canadian, was that we performed particularly well. As I recall, we were fourth place in the world overall. It is interesting that we actually performed better than stereotypically more left-wing countries, and we performed better than stereotypically more right-wing countries. Where we were at, and likely where we have been over the course of our history, was in a relative sweet spot by providing not only necessary social programs but also allowing a healthy level of free enterprise that allows for economic growth and allows people to pursue economic opportunities that perhaps their parents did not have. That is one measure, intergenerational earnings elasticity. It is a measure on which we have historically done very well.

The other question might be the performance of the middle class. I have quoted this before. This is a quote from the former secretary of state, now presidential candidate, Hillary Clinton, when talking about the Canadian middle class. She said:

Canadian middle class incomes are now higher than in the United States. They are working fewer hours for more pay, enjoying a stronger safety net, living longer on average, and facing less income inequality.

There are two ways of measuring the performance of the middle class. Well, there are more than two, but these are two significant ones: looking at median income and median net worth. Between 1999 and 2012, the median net worth of Canadian families rose by 78%. That translated to more than a 50% growth in net worth for every income quintile, except the lowest, which still grew but did not grow as much. Therefore, when it comes to median net worth, we are doing very well.

Median, by the way, is typically used as a measure of middle-class performance. It is better than an average measure, because an average metric can be skewed upward by groups who are doing particularly well, but median gets us closer to looking at those actually in the middle and how they are doing.

There was a study that came out in The New York Times in 2014 that showed real inflation-adjusted median income—I am talking about median income now—went up by more than 20% since the beginning of the last decade. By the way, at the same time, median income was roughly stagnant in the United States.

When it comes to intergenerational earnings elasticity and the performance of the middle class, Canada historically has done and is doing very well. That is important by way of context, because it seems that some members in the House have this revolutionary spirit when it comes to our economy—that we need to upend the way our economy functions now as it just is not working—but if we look at any credible measure of equality or middle-class performance, Canada is in a strong position. That does not mean we cannot do better, but we should recognize where we are and recognize the risks of dramatic or revolutionary changes in our fiscal policy.

I want to say, on the equality front, that at the same time as being very much concerned about equality, I and most of us on this side of the House would strongly reject the politics of envy. We would reject the idea that we should in some way regret the success of those who are doing well. The focus of public policy should be on helping the poor and the middle class. We do not need to focus on improving the lot of those who are well off, but we should not regret the fact that there are some people doing well.

Those people are important members of our community as well, and very often those who are well off are contributing to the community in ways that they are able to do, in particular, because of their wealth or position. That is an important point about equality. It is not about trying to level down those at the top. Rather, it is trying to build up those who are in the middle and those who are particularly struggling. Those are some underlying equality principles, at least as I understand them.

Let us, then, talk about specific measures in Bill C-2 and how they would impact equality. First, we know that this bill would provide a tax cut that would not impact those who are worse off. The tax cut specifically targets those who are making between $45,282 and $90,563. It would not have any impact on those who are making less than $45,000 a year, and that could, by the way, be families with a family income of $70,000 or $80,000 a year, if the earnings are shared by a couple. There would be absolutely no impact of this tax reduction.

Canadians should know that and reflect on the fact that this has a somewhat strange view of middle class. To get the benefit of the middle-class tax cut, one has to already be doing reasonably well. This certainly does not do much for those who, in the Prime Minister's oft-repeated phrase, are seeking to join the middle class.

However, more than that, this bill would lower the limit for putting money into tax-free saving accounts. The data suggests that many people who have low and middle incomes make very good use of tax-free saving accounts.

More than half of those who max out tax-free savings accounts are making less than $60,000 a year, so reducing the power of this vehicle is the only thing in the bill that impacts those who are making less than $45,000 a year, who arguably need the help the most.

This is a rather strange concept of equality, and although taxpayers get a benefit when they start to make $45,000 year, we know the way the tax system works here that they benefit from this change to a greater extent the more of that income tax bracket they cover. Therefore, people who are making just over $90,000 like this policy the most. They are going to benefit the most. A family making $180,000 is really in that sweet spot for earning the tax cut. Again, there are newer, higher taxes when they hit $200,000. However, a family income approaching $400,000 could actually be significantly to the positive because of these tax changes. Therefore, that is a bit of a strange approach if the objective is equality.

The impact on people making less than $45,000 a year with this tax change would be they would be losing the opportunity to invest in a tax-free savings account. They would be losing the opportunity to save in the same way, to the same degree, for their future.

One other point I want to make about tax-free savings accounts is that there are specific things within them that are pro-equality. The impact of TFSAs is greater for those who are lower income. This is because of the relative value of an investment in a tax-free savings account versus an investment in an RRSP. These are different savings vehicles. Canadians who are doing financial planning will potentially choose between putting money in a tax-free savings account or in an RRSP. The difference is that if they put their money in an RRSP they get a tax deduction at the beginning, but then they pay tax on it when it is converted to a RRIF and withdrawn from the RRIF in the future. On a tax-free savings account they have to pay tax on that money up front, but then they can accumulate interest tax-free.

They are different kinds of vehicles, and I would obviously encourage Canadians to save their money in one or both of these vehicles. However, the greatest value of an RRSP is for those who can achieve a significant tax differential between the taxes they would have paid on that money. They are not paying tax on it during their working years, but then they do pay tax in the future. Therefore, if they are paying income tax at a very high rate and they can reduce that amount during their working life, but then during their retired years they can draw on that and pay a much lower rate of tax, that is really where the greatest value is in an RRSP.

On the other hand, Canadians who are making more modest incomes, who are not in the higher tax brackets, are more likely to opt for the use of the tax-free savings accounts because they do not get the same benefit from that differential. This explains why Canadians of modest and lower incomes clearly use tax-free savings accounts at very significant levels.

The argument has been used on the other side that it is only well-off people who have $10,000 they can save. I am not convinced that is true. There are many modest- and low-income Canadians who make significant sacrifices, not necessarily because they have to this year, but because they believe it is important for them to put money aside for a rainy day or for opportunities for themselves and their children in the future. There are many Canadians who do that, and that is often a very good choice to make.

With regard to the specific point about the difference between the tax treatment of TFSAs and RRSPs, if very wealthy Canadians have $10,000 sitting around, they are probably more likely to put it into an RRSP than in a TFSA. The point is that, as much as well-off people have more money to save, TFSAs are a specific vehicle that is specifically providing a greater relative advantage to those who are of modest and lower income. Therefore, it is important to understand that TFSAs are in many ways inherently more of an equal or pro-equality type of saving vehicle.

As we talk about equality, I think it is important to say, as well, that inherently debt is regressive; that is, accumulating deficits and debt is inherently a measure that is not conducive to income equality because it assigns costs to future generations, to children, people who do not have economic means, at least not right now. It says to the next generation, “Here is more money that you have to spend, in addition to dealing with your needs, because we expect you to be working hard to take care of our needs”. It assigns the cost of present needs to future generations. That, obviously, is not conducive to equality.

Telling my three-year-old daughter, Gianna, that she has to pay for social programs that I want to use today is not something that those who are genuinely seeking equality should be doing. We should be paying for present needs with present dollars.

It is worth underlining, in terms of the measures of Bill C-2, that because the tax changes do not balance out, this is going to cost a significant amount of money over the next few years. We are going to be spending billions of dollars simply because of the poorly thought-out hole in the government's budget. It is telling that the Liberals said, during the election campaign, that it would be revenue neutral. They told Canadians that their tax changes would be revenue neutral and, in fact, they were not.

Maybe this is because they were not being truthful; but maybe it is that they just did not know, because they got the numbers wrong. I think either of those is pretty concerning. This is a problem. I think it is a problem that the government should have remedied, and could still remedy.

I think it is very clear, looking at the bill, that there are significant equality problems with it.

Measures that would have been more pro-equality would have been to look for ways to lower taxes for those who are at the bottom.

I have to say that this is exactly what the previous Conservative government did. We lowered the GST from 7% to 6% to 5%. That is the tax that everybody pays. That is the tax that all Canadians pay. We also lowered the lowest marginal tax rate. That was one of the important tax changes we made. We made necessary EI reforms, which would have allowed reductions to EI premiums over the long term. It is no coincidence that all of these taxes that we sought to impact were taxes that had the biggest impact on lower-income Canadians. Cutting the GST, cutting the lowest marginal tax rate, and undertaking those necessary steps that opened the door for lower EI premiums were necessary measures to help those, in particular, who needed the help the most.

If we then compare that with what the government would do in Bill C-2, there is a clear difference. When I sometimes hear members opposite, even the Prime Minister, say that the previous government was helping those who are better off, it is always telling that they never mention a specific tax measure. I have never heard the Prime Minister cite specific tax measures or tax changes we made, in the context of that claim. That is because all of the tax changes we made were really with an eye to those on the low- and middle-income end of things.

Of course, we did cut business taxes, as well. Those are the kinds of measures that help job creation. They help low-income Canadians. They help unemployed Canadians get jobs.

I think it is important, when we think about social equality, to dig deeper into it than just the slogan. It is important to look at how we are performing as a country, first, to look at measures like the performance of our middle class, to look at things like intergenerational earnings elasticity, and then say, “This is where we are now. Now, how do we improve our performance?”

Bill C-2 would not improve our performance. By getting rid of TFSAs and by denying any benefit of these tax changes for those who are less well off, the bill is not pro-equality. We could do better. There are better measures that we could be proposing, and I would hope to see the government be willing to make some of those changes.

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May 19th, 2016 / 5:20 p.m.


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Saint-Maurice—Champlain Québec

Liberal

François-Philippe Champagne LiberalParliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Finance

Mr. Speaker, as the hon. member knows, I have a lot of respect for him. He is always a very good speaker, and has presented one view, obviously his view, of the issue.

I would just like to get back to people. We all represent people. Let us be honest, I do not know too many people in my riding who can save $10,000 in their TFSAs after having to spend money for their children, their mortgage, and their cars. That data is not just in my riding. We have found that only 6.7% of Canadians have contributed the total amount to a TFSA.

We were elected to help the many, not the few. That is why we have made the change to the TFSAs. Indeed, when we look at the middle class, I do not believe middle-class families can save up to $10,000 in a TFSA. I have yet to meet anyone who has ever been able to contribute the maximum amount to a TFSA.

I have heard my colleagues saying that paying for present needs with present dollars makes sense. Obviously, what we are looking at in this budget is investment in our future. Canadians told us two things: help them and our families, and grow the economy. We have reduced taxes for the middle class, and we are making investments for the future.

I have listened to the member many times, and I know he would understand that when we look at infrastructure, it is multi-generational.

How can the member say that this measure is not helping many Canadians, when we are helping nine million Canadians, about one-third of our population in our country, by reducing middle-class taxes?

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May 19th, 2016 / 5:20 p.m.


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Conservative

Garnett Genuis Conservative Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB

Mr. Speaker, I thank the member for his kind words and obviously there is a lot of meat there.

Let me go in reverse order and see if I can get to the second point. I already addressed the issues around TFSAs.

On the question of infrastructure and whether it is good for the next generation, infrastructure is used over an extended period of time. The issue is that the next generation will have to invest in new infrastructure. We will never stop needing to spend money on infrastructure.

We have to spend on it now for the future, but future generations will have to continue to spend money on the maintenance of existing infrastructure and on new infrastructure. The analogy made by some is, well, would we not go into debt to get a mortgage because we would use the house for a long time? If we had to buy the equivalent of a house every year, we probably would not take out a mortgage. If we took out a mortgage, we would not have money to buy the house in the next year and the next year after that. That is kind of where the analogy falls down.

The other issue with the government's budget, and I encourage Canadians to look at the chart on page 91 of the budget which lays out what is infrastructure, is that the debt the government is accumulating here, much of it is not for traditional infrastructure. It is not for building that bridge or road that will exist for a long time. Child care is even included on the page 91 grid on infrastructure.

Obviously taking care of children is important. There is a role for government in providing direct support to parents for child care, but I do not think—

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May 19th, 2016 / 5:20 p.m.


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The Deputy Speaker Bruce Stanton

Order, please. I know we have 10 minutes for questions and comments, but I do note there are other members interested in posing questions.

The hon. member for Central Okanagan—Similkameen—Nicola.

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May 19th, 2016 / 5:25 p.m.


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Conservative

Dan Albas Conservative Central Okanagan—Similkameen—Nicola, BC

Mr. Speaker, I certainly agree with the member that any debt spent on infrastructure really should follow an economic framework of whether it makes our society more productive. It should not just simply be money out the door, and a hope that we will see a proper return.

Could the member maybe discuss the importance of ensuring there is good value for taxpayer money, and maybe give some thoughts about what things he will be looking at as the government moves forward on its plans in this area?

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May 19th, 2016 / 5:25 p.m.


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Conservative

Garnett Genuis Conservative Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB

Mr. Speaker, I will try not to take up the rest of the 10 minutes with my response. Members know me not to be too verbose in the House, I am sure. I heard the member for Winnipeg North laugh at that, which is particularly funny.

With regard to the point about getting taxpayers value for money, it is particularly important, when we talk about something being infrastructure, to ensure that it actually is infrastructure. It is not because there are not important things that we should spend money on that are outside the category of infrastructure, but because there are specific economic arguments that one could make for deficit in the context of infrastructure that simply do not apply in other cases. The government is spending far more this year in terms of its deficit than its total spending on infrastructure. Therefore, it is pretty clear that there is a disconnect here. Again, as I was saying as we wrapped up, child care just is not infrastructure.

I want to quickly come back to the parliamentary secretary's question about lower income people not having money to put in their TFSAs. Again, I think some Canadians who are on the lower income end work very hard to save that much. It may not be most who can approach that maximum, but even someone who would have saved $6,000 or $7,000 a year would be losing out because of reducing the cap. More to the point, those wealthier Canadians, as I explained in my speech in some detail, are more likely to use RRSPs as opposed to TFSAs for a saving vehicle. We should do everything we can to expand TFSAs precisely because of the sort of differential positive impacts on those who are in the middle and lower income end.

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May 19th, 2016 / 5:25 p.m.


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Winnipeg North Manitoba

Liberal

Kevin Lamoureux LiberalParliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons

Mr. Speaker, I can assure the member that I was not laughing at him. However, it is with pride that I stand today to comment on Bill C-2, in a special shirt with a unique-looking tie in celebration of Ukraine heritage.

The fact is that this is an implementation bill that ultimately will see thousands, in fact, millions of Canadians get a tax cut. I say it in that fashion, because the Conservatives who I have known over the years, generally speaking, vote in favour of tax cuts.

The types of tax cuts we are giving are going to Canada's middle class, such as teachers, firefighters, factory workers, and health care providers. They are part of Canada's hard-working middle class, and they would be getting a substantial tax cut, hundreds of millions of dollars in tax cuts.

Could the member explain to all those middle-class workers why the Conservative Party is voting against giving them a tax break? The member should recognize that the Conservatives are also voting against giving a special tax increase to those who make in excess of $200,000. This bill would ensure more income equality. Why would he vote against it?

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May 19th, 2016 / 5:25 p.m.


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Conservative

Garnett Genuis Conservative Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB

Mr. Speaker, I always appreciate the interventions from my friend across the way.

Let me be clear that this is a tax change. It is a tax cut for some and an increase for others. However, the government is not clear on who the “some” and who the “others” are. It is like robbing Peter to save Paul without a great degree of clarity about which one is Peter and which one is Paul. Those making less than $45,000 a year, who are more likely to use TFSAs, would be worse off under this measure. Future generations would be worse off under this measure.

We are all going to vote on this at some point, and the parliamentary secretary needs to be clear about who the benefits go to. Someone making $100,000 a year and not using tax-free savings accounts is a bit better off. If people are in the middle of that bracket using a TFSA, then they are either worse off or neutral. However, if someone is on the low end, then one would definitely not be better off.

When we have these kinds of tax changes, reducing some and raising other brackets, we need to have a clear idea of what we are doing. We need to have a clear idea of why, rather than simply shifting things around perhaps, arguably, just for the sake of shifting.

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May 19th, 2016 / 5:30 p.m.


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The Deputy Speaker Bruce Stanton

It being 5:30 p.m., the House will now proceed to the consideration of private members' business as listed on today's Order Paper.

The House resumed from May 19, consideration of the motion that Bill C-2, An Act to amend the Income Tax Act, be read the third time and passed.

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June 17th, 2016 / 10 a.m.


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Conservative

Karen Vecchio Conservative Elgin—Middlesex—London, ON

Madam Speaker, I am honoured to stand to speak to Bill C-2 once again, and about some of the implications it will have when the bill moves forward.

It is great that we are in the House today debating the bill, because there are many things Canadians need to know about it, and that we as the official opposition have to bring to the attention of the government.

Today I want to start with the tax-free savings account. The current Liberal government has proposed a reduction in the maximum annual amounts Canadians can invest in these accounts. We know this is a tool that has been working for Canadians. Unfortunately, the government does not, on the false pretence that doubling the tax-free savings account only benefits the highest-earning Canadians, rather than just the middle class.

As we talk about this today, we are looking at all of these proposed middle-class tax hikes that we will be seeing for the middle class and for all Canadians.

Madam Speaker, I will be splitting my time with the member for Central Okanagan—Similkameen—Nicola. We probably know him as the member of Parliament for the “free the beer” campaign, another great campaign we have done.

I am here to talk about the tax-free savings account and the proposal of the Minister of Finance to move forward with the CPP contributions that the government will be inflicting on all Canadians, especially future generations.

The Liberals proposed middle-class tax cuts, reducing it to 20.5%. It really does sound good when they say they are cutting taxes for the middle class. However, they are forgetting to tell Canadians about all the other things they are going to do. We heard the Minister of Environment in the House this week talking about the carbon tax. We have to recognize that they are going to say they will be reducing taxes for the middle class in order to create more opportunities, provide better savings, and more opportunities for families, but they are not talking about all of these other things they are also proposing.

I am a resident of Ontario. We are already going to see gas prices go up 4¢ a litre, because it was proposed by the Ontario Liberal government. Now we see our federal Liberal government also proposing a carbon tax, a CPP tax, and all these other things. Therefore, although they talk about a middle-class tax bracket at 20.5%, they are not letting all Canadians know that they are actually taxing us in other forms. It really is very unfortunate that they are saying one thing but doing another.

We are not decreasing the taxes when we have backdoor amendments changing the current tax system. For those people living in Ontario, where we see horrible job creation and much unemployment, much like Alberta with the non-support in our energy sector, not only are Canadians not going to have jobs, but they will be paying more, even at the gas pumps. They are going to be paying more in the grocery stores, because we see governments taxing Canadians, whether they are in Ontario, or anywhere in Canada. I have huge concerns about this.

We talked about the tax-free savings account, which is a vehicle for Canadians to save money. Our Conservative government increased it because we had Canadians saying this was a great vehicle for saving money. By introducing a new threshold for what they could save it gave them the opportunity. Many times, we will hear the government say people are not maximizing it. Now, what it is proposing is nannifying what we are doing in Canada by introducing Canada pension plan increases.

We have a vehicle that currently works, the tax-free savings account, which allows Canadians to save responsibly, and many Canadians are doing so. However, now the Minister of Finance will be touring later on this month, trying to get all of the provinces on board to increase our CPP contributions. We have to recognize that that is not only a vehicle for savings. At the same time, it is a huge burden on small businesses. Those small businesses were looking forward to a decrease in their small business tax. However, the government will not be fulfilling that promise either.

Therefore, what the government will be doing is taking the tax-free savings accounts, which allow Canadians to make the choice on how they want to save their money, and instead introducing a new tax on Canadians and employers through the Canada pension plan, as a nanny state tax.

What is this going to do? We know that when students come out of university, they have high debts. It is something that we should be aware of as Canadians. We are asking our students to go out there and get the proper education they need so that they can make sure they have a brilliant future. They come out of those schools with debt and when they get their first job, not only are they going to have to contribute to the CPP but they will have to double those contributions. We are looking at an additional $3,000 out of their pockets to be put into the CPP.

As a parent, I have no problem because I believe that it is very important for people to save for their future. However, at the same time, what we are doing is having them save for retirement when they can take that money and put it into their student debt, put it into a tax-free savings account, or into the first-time homebuyers plan under the RRSPs and put that money toward their first home. What we have now done is taken away all of those opportunities for Canadians and, as a government, we are saying, “You must put it into the Canada pension plan.”

Although I think saving for retirement is very important, we have to recognize that this is the Canada pension plan. It does not help our current seniors, those seniors who we say are the most vulnerable. It will just be an additional tax. For those students who have come out of Carleton University with these enormous debts, we will see another tax on them. The opportunity for them to save their own money for what they choose is being removed by the current government. These are things that I am extremely concerned with.

The government has talked many times about deficit spending in its campaign promises. I want to talk about the middle class. The middle class we are talking about today will be that group of people, these young families who are currently the middle class, who will wind up with a huge debt. Whether it is the debt from the deficit or from the new CPP contributions or the debt they will have because we will be taking this carbon tax money, will we be using it properly? Those are some huge concerns I have.

I am very much an environmentally friendly person. However, I believe in the stewardship of our land. I think we need to ensure that we recognize that if we are taxing people, this money will actually reduce costs or, as the Liberals are saying, the man-made climate change, or will we just be taking that money and putting it into general revenues and pet projects. Unfortunately, I see the latter, the pet projects, truly being the focus of this climate change plan.

We have this new carbon tax that has now been introduced in the province of Ontario. We will see one at the federal level as well. Average Canadians, the people who will have to pay for this huge deficit in 2016, this line of credit or the 2016 budget, will just see huge debts that they will have to pay. That is a very large concern for me. As I said, I am parent and I have three children currently in post-secondary education. I recognize the costs of education. I am very fortunate to be able to assist with some of those expenses. Not all families can do that. What we have done is once again crippled the middle class by introducing so many different factors in this.

Going back to the tax-free savings account, this is a vehicle, as we have said, and as the government has said many times, to maximize contributions. This party on this side, the official opposition, sees this is an excellent vehicle for people to save money. It gives them the opportunity to put in maximum contributions. Instead, we are rolling that back. We have different institutions and different organizations throughout Canada saying, “We appreciate that increase and we think that's what needs to be done.” Instead, we see a government that is planning on taxing Canadians—tax, tax, tax, and spend, spend, spend. As we go through this, the bottom line is that we are trying to tax ourselves to prosperity. That is not what we should do. We are taking all of this money from hard-working Canadians and we will be taxing them more and more.

Unfortunately, now that the Liberal government has come into office after it had its great campaign, all it is doing is crippling our middle class and our seniors, and it has only short-term plans. I hope that when the Liberals look at this they will recognize that we need to do better, and we can do better. I hope that they look at and review all of the documents that they have put forward.

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June 17th, 2016 / 10:10 a.m.


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Liberal

Steven MacKinnon Liberal Gatineau, QC

Madam Speaker, I thank my colleague opposite for her speech, but I have to say that I am perplexed to hear a Conservative Party member speak against a bill that reduces the tax burden and cuts taxes for the middle class. With respect to the TFSA, obviously I do not know her constituents as well as I know the people of Gatineau, but I know that those of my constituents who earn middle-class incomes are much happier about what we are doing, which is putting money back in their pockets. Nine million Canadians, including a lot of people in Gatineau, are getting a tax cut instead of a TFSA that they cannot afford to put $11,000 in every year. Can my colleague tell me if the people in her riding would rather have money in their pockets thanks to a middle-class tax cut or the opportunity to put money in a TFSA, which is not really an option for them given their income?

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June 17th, 2016 / 10:10 a.m.


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Conservative

Karen Vecchio Conservative Elgin—Middlesex—London, ON

Madam Speaker, the bottom line is, the Liberals are saying one thing and doing another. They are introducing a tax cut for our middle class at 20.5% and they are increasing a carbon tax. They are increasing a variety of other things. These are concerns I have, because it looks great on paper until we see all of the other pages talking about all the other taxes they will impose. Whether it is today or tomorrow, we know the government will tax us.

The bottom line is, we cannot spend our way to growth and we cannot tax our way to prosperity. That is exactly what the government is doing.

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June 17th, 2016 / 10:10 a.m.


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Conservative

Garnett Genuis Conservative Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB

Madam Speaker, I think my colleague did a very good job of pointing out that we have a policy choice. On the one hand, we can allow individuals to save more of their own money or on the other hand, we can have the government take that money and put it into this new, expanded pension concept the government has.

Maybe the member could talk a little bit more about the benefits of giving individuals choice and control over their own money versus giving government control of that money.

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June 17th, 2016 / 10:15 a.m.


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Conservative

Karen Vecchio Conservative Elgin—Middlesex—London, ON

Madam Speaker, the hon. member is absolutely right, we want to give Canadians choices.

One of the biggest things we see with the CPP mandate that the Liberals are coming out with and will be announcing is that it will not only hurt small businesses, it will also reduce jobs, because businesses will not be able to afford to have more employees.

The tax-free savings account is a great vehicle to allow Canadians to save their money. They put the money they have earned into a vehicle so that when they need the money, it is available to them, whether it is purchasing their first home, whether it is going on a vacation, if they can afford to do so, or whether it is saving for their children's future so that they can send them off to college or university, that money is there for them, and it is not under nanny state of this Liberal government.

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June 17th, 2016 / 10:15 a.m.


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NDP

Guy Caron NDP Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC

Madam Speaker, we will have plenty of opportunities to debate the Canada pension plan. The Conservatives are making the same arguments they have been making since 1965. However, getting back to the debate and this bill, my colleague from Gatineau made two points. The first is that this will help the middle class, and the second is that nine million Canadians will benefit. I have news for him. If nine million people are benefiting, that means more than 17 million, maybe even 18 million, will get nothing at all from this tax cut, which, by the way, will apply only to people who earn at least $23 per hour at full-time jobs. I would like my colleague to comment on this tax cut for what I would call the pseudo-middle class, because it seems that this government's definition of “middle class” is not what most people would consider the middle class.

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June 17th, 2016 / 10:15 a.m.


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Conservative

Karen Vecchio Conservative Elgin—Middlesex—London, ON

Madam Speaker, It has been fantastic serving with the hon. member and learning from him as he speaks in the House.

I really do appreciate that question because my children are that middle class. My son, who is 22 years of age, will be moving into his own apartment this weekend, and I am very excited for him. However, when I look at his budget and show him how he has to move forward, he makes $13.50 an hour, and he is not part of this middle-class tax cut, so mummy will be setting up his apartment and trying to help him out.

This is exactly a pseudo-middle class. The Liberals are not helping those people who are most vulnerable. Canadian parents such as myself are trying to help them forward, because what the Liberals are saying they are doing for the most vulnerable is not happening.

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June 17th, 2016 / 10:15 a.m.


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Conservative

Dan Albas Conservative Central Okanagan—Similkameen—Nicola, BC

Madam Speaker, it is an honour to rise in this chamber on behalf of the constituents of Central Okanagan—Similkameen—Nicola.

I appreciate that we are at the eve of our rise, although it is neither your job, Madam Speaker, nor mine to say when that is. However, I want to thank every member I have had the opportunity to work with in this chamber during this opening round before we rise for the summer and thank the pages and the table staff for their commitment to this country.

I am here to speak to Bill C-2. It is an important bill, because it lays out the philosophy of the current government. The Liberals believe that raising taxes on the highest bracket will benefit this country. It is perfectly all right for them to contend that. They won the election. However, it is also perfectly all right for us, as members of Her Majesty's opposition, and all opposition parties, and even their backbench, to question the government.

Oftentimes in our system, members of Parliament are more relegated to being an approval body in this chamber and are not necessarily directing policy. However, I think one of the strengths of our system is when governments of any stripe take the policies of their predecessors, evaluate them, and continue them, if they are good for Canada.

In the same spirit, I would also suggest that we must remember that a broken clock can be right twice a day, but once in Quebec, I believe, because they go by international time. However, even in opposition, we may strike on an idea whose time may have come. I would hope that the government and members of the governing party will listen and take that forward. This country is great because of continued work toward policies that support all Canadians.

With that in mind, I will raise a few points about what I think could be improved and what the government, or ministers themselves as they work with their deputies, maybe not through this legislation but through their deliberations on future legislation, might take into account.

I have had the great opportunity to work with some members of the finance committee by subbing in from time to time. It is a very good group. The members seem to have a good understanding of the bills before them, and they seem to get along quite well.

One of the interesting concepts we heard about in committee was from Dr. Jack Mintz. Dr. Mintz raised a concern that taxing at the highest bracket would put pressure on some people of higher means, who may say that they are going to move to a different province or offshore to another country. When we lose those entrepreneurs, because 60% of small business owners are in that bracket, we lose collectively. We lose their innovation, and sometimes their capital, because they may begin investing in other countries.

The current government has said that it will use evidenced-based decision-making. Evidence means that there is theoretical evidence provided through academia, governmental reports, or think-tank studies or through actually collecting the data and creating an inventory, so to speak, on whether a policy is in the long-term interest of this great country.

In regard to Bill C-2, Dr. Mintz made the suggestion that the Canada Revenue Agency has the ability to track whether someone in this higher income bracket, who the Liberals will be taxing at a higher rate, moves or migrates to other lower-cost jurisdictions to operate, such as my province of British Columbia.

I am sure that Premier Christy Clark would love me to take a moment to sell all the high points of locating to British Columbia to entrepreneurs, but I will not do that. I am not going to speak to the parochial interests of my home province. I refuse to. However, what I will say is that there could be interprovincial or offshore migration.

If CRA was to collect the information, we might be able to get a tale of the tape.

I realize that people move for all sorts of reasons, but economists will tell us that incentives matter and people do make decisions, particularly in the higher income brackets, to find places where they can maximize their capital and where they feel welcome.

As a starting point, this is something the government can do on behalf of all Canadians to ensure that its policies are to the benefit of the long-term interests of this great country. I hope the government will give that full consideration.

I will also step back and tell the House about a personal experience. I love this chamber. I love this country. However, one of the things about our politics that we could change would be to stop judging an idea because of the messenger. If a former minister of the previous government gets up and makes a suggestion based on his or her experience, or someone from some think tank who people believe has some sort of ideological background says that this is a good policy for Canada, we should listen and evaluate it. We should not simply dismiss it because we disagree with some sort of vaguely placed ideological position. Let us start judging policies by their merits, not by the people who espouse them.

There are many things this government is going to be looking at. Trade, for example, is going to be an extremely difficult file for the Liberals, because Canadians have different views. Ultimately, the government is going to have to look at the evidence, look at how our economy has grown over the past 30 years by becoming a free trading nation, and then evaluate how that helps all of us.

We all have a different reaction when we suffer a loss, whether it be an electoral loss or a personal loss. We face denial, then anger, sadness, and acceptance. I am getting close to the acceptance stage on many of the government's policies, but members on the other side continue to get up and criticize the opposition for having a different view. We need to embrace the views, respect the views, and not cut each other down.

That being said, I will go to the subject of tax-free savings accounts. My riding is made up of an older demographic. Broc Braconnier is a veteran and one of the volunteers on a volunteer tax group. This is a group of individuals that helps seniors, usually low-income seniors at risk, file their tax returns so they can get the benefits they so desperately need. He mentioned to me that the tax-free savings account offered seniors two important steps. First, if they sold a home and downsized, a lot of the money from the sale of that home could go into a tax-free savings account if it had not been used before. They could also draw income from that account at an accelerated rate, which could make them feel that they had the nest egg they worked for. The same applies to the RRIFs.

I would just say to members on the other side that it is perfectly legitimate for us to raise concerns about certain policies. I do not mind being criticized, but let us talk about the ideas, and let us make sure that we are not skating around the area we like or the area we dislike. Policies are not so simple that they can be dismissed in one statement in this place.

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June 17th, 2016 / 10:25 a.m.


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Liberal

Ken Hardie Liberal Fleetwood—Port Kells, BC

Madam Speaker, let us take the politics out of it and talk about the ideas.

I think it was economist Rhys Kesselman in 2001 who did the groundwork on the concept of the tax-free savings account that laid the track toward that particular measure. Even he suggested that the doubling that had been suggested by the previous government would really only advantage the very wealthy, the people who, logically, had the money to put in. At this time of high personal debt, having the extra money to put in becomes a little harder. Other people have said that only about 16% of Canadians actually max out at the current level. That is where we might tend to differ as to the best approach.

I want to talk about pensions. Over a period of time, international pressures and mobile capital have meant that people can move money and capital all over the world. We have lost a lot of good jobs. About 60% of Canadians in the private sector do not have company pension plans.

As we look to the future, I would like to ask the member what other measures he would suggest, other than beefing up the Canada pension plan or ignoring—

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June 17th, 2016 / 10:25 a.m.


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The Assistant Deputy Speaker Carol Hughes

We only have five minutes for questions, and there are other parties who want to take part as well.

The hon. member for Central Okanagan—Similkameen—Nicola.

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June 17th, 2016 / 10:25 a.m.


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Conservative

Dan Albas Conservative Central Okanagan—Similkameen—Nicola, BC

Madam Speaker, I will reply to the member's last question.

The PRPPs that allowed portable savings, fully portable among all provinces, is something that all finance ministers agreed with, I think about four or five years ago. Yet many provinces, our most populous provinces, such as Ontario, have not yet implemented that strategy. This was unanimous and would allow people to have their own pensions and allow a voluntary contribution by employers. That is important.

I would like to discuss some of the other concepts with the member at another time, but I appreciate the spirit in which he asked the question. This is the kind of debate people in our home constituencies expect of us.

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June 17th, 2016 / 10:25 a.m.


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NDP

Erin Weir NDP Regina—Lewvan, SK

Madam Speaker, the member for Central Okanagan—Similkameen—Nicola appealed for evidence-based policy and raised the concern that the rich might just leave in response to slightly higher income tax rates at the top end. Yet he presented no empirical evidence on this problem.

Luckily, a couple of weeks ago, Stanford University published a study entitled, “Millionaire Migration and the Taxation of the Elite”, which studied exactly that question south of the border. What it found was that millionaire migration is not an issue and that, in fact, the rate of interstate migration among millionaires was lower than it was among the general population.

I wonder if the member for Central Okanagan—Similkameen—Nicola could bring some actual evidence to bear on this question.

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June 17th, 2016 / 10:30 a.m.


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Conservative

Dan Albas Conservative Central Okanagan—Similkameen—Nicola, BC

Madam Speaker, first, the report the gentleman cites is from the United States, and they have a much different tax system. In fact, academics have widely criticized the many loopholes that allow people to do that. If a person has the ability to use loopholes, there is going to be less migration.

I have to say that the previous government worked very hard to make sure that loopholes were taken out of the tax code here in Canada. Some tax relief was actually put in place for families, people with disabilities, and seniors. That is where the focus was.

I would point out that it was actually Dr. Jack Mintz, not me, who made this assertion at the finance committee. The University of Calgary School of Public Policy has put out a number of reports in this area.

I understand that the member has an ideological position, and that is not bad, but again, let us focus on Canada, let us hear from Canadian academics, and then let us have a discussion around those areas. I appreciate that I did not have evidence to table today. This speech was a little last minute, but if he has other suggestions as to how we can correspond on this, I would be open to that.

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June 17th, 2016 / 10:30 a.m.


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NDP

Alistair MacGregor NDP Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC

Madam Speaker, before I begin, I will be splitting my time with the hon. member for Regina—Lewvan.

It is good to be returning to the discussion on Bill C-2. As we all know in the House, this is a bill that received its first reading all the way back on December 9, 2015. We have had quite a session since then, and it is good to be returning to some old familiar ground.

Bill C-2 covers a few different areas. It is a bill that would amend a few different areas of the Income Tax Act. However, I am going to be limiting my comments to two areas in particular. The reason for that is they are the areas that are most relevant to the constituents in Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, and I suspect to constituents of most members of Parliament in the House as well. One area is the changes the bill would make to our tax code, notably to the area that the Liberals define as the middle class; and the second area is the reduction of the TFSA contributions from what the previous Conservative government used to have at $10,000 per year, down to a more reasonable level of $5,500 per year.

As part of my introductory remarks, I also want to speak a bit about my history as a former constituency assistant. I had the honour of working seven years as a constituency assistant. In that time, Canada Revenue Agency casework was one of the top three cases that came across my desk. It was some of the top casework that I got to see. I had a very privileged position, because over seven years I had very privileged access to many members of my constituency and their tax returns. I got to see the full range of their incomes, the very intricate details of their tax returns, and their relationship with the CRA because they essentially signed a contract with our office to give me unimpeded access to their tax returns and their tax history so that I could make some inquiries with the CRA on their behalf and try to solve the problems that they brought to the office.

One of the notable things that I saw during those seven years was the range of incomes. The range of incomes in Cowichan—Malahat—Langford would not be touched by the Liberals' tax measures. Incomes generally fell in a range of about $25,000 per year and maybe up to a high end of $50,000 to $60,000, so that the people at the high end would get some benefit but not much.

The key point I am trying to make here is that most constituents in my riding and I suspect most people across Canada would not receive any benefit from this tax cut, yet the Liberals keep on selling to the Canadian public that this would be a middle-class tax break. That is absolutely false.

I spoke to the bill at second reading back in February, when I was still getting used to making speeches in this hon. House. One of the things that I really loved to bring up during that speech, and I brought it up again during our discussions on Bill C-15, was the fact that the median income in Canada according to Statistics Canada is $31,000 a year. If we take the definition of median, which basically is the number separating the higher half of a data sample from the lower half, we could take $31,000 a year as a reasonable definition of where the middle class is. However, the Liberals' so-called middle-class tax break would not even start to begin giving benefits until people reach an income of $45,000 a year. They would max out when they get above $90,000 and into $100,000 a year.

To make it perfectly clear to everyone watching this debate, every member of Parliament in this chamber who earns $170,000 a year, which is on the public record, would get the maximum tax break of $670 per year, everyone. That is what the Liberals would do. They would give people in very high incomes a tax break, which frankly speaking we do not need. I do not know about everyone else in this chamber, but I was not elected to come to the House to give myself a tax break while the hard-working men and women of my riding get nothing. That was not what I was sent here to do. That is not the middle class that I came here to fight for.

The Liberals will say that it is okay because they are introducing the child benefit. It is a great concept, the child benefit. I will never, as a father of young children and knowing many constituents who have young children, argue against giving more money to the hard-working men and women of our country to help them raise their children.

However, I need to point out some evidence for everyone who is watching this debate. The Liberals' plan for the Canada child benefit will provide a maximum annual benefit of up to $6,400 per child under the age of six. Compare that with the average cost of child care in B.C., which is $14,000 per year. It is a drop in the bucket.

When I talk to families about the difficulties of child care, they say that more money would help but that what is really bugging them is the lack of affordable spaces and the lack of spaces overall. Furthermore, a lot of parents come up to me and say that their spouse works and they are a stay-at-home parent, and what would really get their family ahead is if they could actually hold two jobs. They cannot do that because the costs of child care are too high. They literally cannot afford to go and get a job.

That is what I hear. That is what I heard during the election. That is what I heard during seven years of working with constituents, right where the rubber meets the road, right at the constituency office.

I do not want any member of Parliament to tell me I do not know what I am speaking about, because I come here with evidence. I come here with testimony. I come here with seven years of experience of working with families. It is a shame that this Parliament is not doing anything to expand child care spaces in this country.

Furthermore, if we really wanted to give lower-income Canadians a leg up, we would pay attention to the wages they are receiving, and we would take this opportunity to show some leadership and institute a federally regulated minimum wage of $15 an hour.

A lot of people will say that is only going to affect a small number of jobs. That does not matter. It is about showing federal leadership. It is about having the House of Commons lead the way so that we put ourselves in the morally correct position of saying that we did it first and we expect the provinces to follow. I do not know how families make it on $11-an-hour wages. I simply do not. It is a miracle that they get by in the first place on those low wages.

I have spent a lot of time in my speech speaking about that particular tax change. It is a very passionate subject for me, as members can see. I do want to devote a little time on the TFSA, because that is one change in Bill C-2 that I agree with.

The Conservative government's plans in the previous Parliament to raise the limit to $10,000 a year would have been a huge cost to our treasury in later years. Furthermore, I do not know many families who could max out at $5,500 per year, let alone $10,000. When a family is earning a median income of $31,000 a year, how on Earth are they able to save $10,000 per year extra, to sock away? It is simply not possible.

That is a policy that benefits the top income earners in this country. Leaving the limit at $5,500 is perfectly reasonable, and it is something I can certainly support.

The costs with the TFSA increase to $10,000 a year would have risen to $132 billion by the year 2080. Conservatives like to portray themselves as the party of low taxes, and they like to really use the phrase “tax and spend”. The point I am trying to make is that if we are taking that much money out of federal revenue by those later years, that in itself is a tax on the programs that we use to support this society, to help low-income people get through.

If we are taking that kind of revenue out of the federal revenue stream, we are going to have to make cuts to federal programs. As much as we do not like to pay taxes, they are a part of living in our society and they are a part of building our infrastructure and building our supporting programs.

I will conclude by saying that we have been proposing some truly progressive things that could have made a real difference to low-income earners. I am sad to see that Bill C-2 did not live up to those standards and for that reason I will be voting against the bill at third reading.

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June 17th, 2016 / 10:40 a.m.


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Conservative

Garnett Genuis Conservative Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB

Madam Speaker, I want to probe my colleague's comments about the minimum wage. He sees that a higher minimum wage would provide benefits. Many economists believe that a higher minimum wage leads to increased unemployment and it is not hard to understand intuitively why that would be. If the cost of something is increased, people will purchase less of it. If the cost of labour is increased, people will hire fewer people.

There are things the government could do that would help people in that same situation. It could raise the base exemption people can earn before paying tax, like we did. It could lower the lowest marginal tax rate, not the middle rate, which is also something that we did when we were in government.

Would the member not agree that those types of measures would have more of a benefit and less of an economic cost because they would not increase unemployment?

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June 17th, 2016 / 10:40 a.m.


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NDP

Alistair MacGregor NDP Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC

Madam Speaker, certainly if we do raise the wages, that is something that businesses will have to bear, but the part that the member leaves out is that if we have low-income workers in a jurisdiction with more money in their pockets, they tend to spend it locally.

In fact, there are several examples in the United States, notably the city of Seattle, which experimented with minimum wages, and it has shown that rather than businesses going out of business, they are actually thriving.

I believe in putting more money into workers' pockets. There are studies that show they spend that money locally, which helps all of our local businesses thrive.

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June 17th, 2016 / 10:40 a.m.


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NDP

Alexandre Boulerice NDP Rosemont—La Petite-Patrie, QC

Madam Speaker, I want to thank and applaud my hon. colleague for his excellent speech.

Successive Liberal and Conservative governments have provided huge tax giveaways to Canada's large corporations, whose tax rate went from 28% in 2000 to just 15% in 2012. Still, this has not created jobs and it has not stimulated the economy, and the Liberals promised to help small and medium-sized businesses, which are the real job creators in our communities, towns, and cities.

What does the member think of the Liberals' broken promise to support those who are the real job creators in our society, namely, small businesses?

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June 17th, 2016 / 10:45 a.m.


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NDP

Alistair MacGregor NDP Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC

Madam Speaker, my colleague raises a very important point about corporate tax rates because the other question the NDP has always received is how would members have paid for their platform. No one in the House except this party has looked seriously at how low corporate tax rates are, how they have been on a downward trend for a decade now, how we are the lowest in the OECD with an average lower than the United States, and yet there has not been a corresponding investment by those corporations.

In fact, none other than the former Bank of Canada governor Mark Carney has referred to the corporate bank accounts that are filled to the brim with dead money. It is not being invested, so despite the low corporate tax rates we have, we have not seen the corresponding investment by the private sector.

All we are asking is that corporations pay their fair share in our society. Their rates go up a little bit more to make life easier on the rest of Canadians and I think the member makes a very fine point because the tax burden for too long has been on the real middle class and that is the one that the NDP is proud to support.

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June 17th, 2016 / 10:45 a.m.


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Liberal

Ken Hardie Liberal Fleetwood—Port Kells, BC

Madam Speaker, I have a quick question about the concept of increasing the CPP contributions. Hon. members on the other side call it a tax. Does the member agree with that characterization?

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June 17th, 2016 / 10:45 a.m.


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NDP

Alistair MacGregor NDP Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC

Madam Speaker, I most certainly do not. I have met with so many low-income seniors that I have lost count, so many who are struggling. The CPP is one pension plan that went through the 2008 financial crisis relatively unscathed. It is a strong plan. It needs enhancement and if we are to have a serious conversation about low-income seniors in this country, we need to start having it now. A retirement vehicle that has survived previous shocks is a solid investment for our future.

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June 17th, 2016 / 10:45 a.m.


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NDP

Erin Weir NDP Regina—Lewvan, SK

Madam Speaker, we are here today debating a tax bill. I would begin by observing that our federal government is faced with a very serious revenue problem. The Conservative members of this House like to pat themselves on the back for the fact that federal tax revenues as a share of gross domestic product are at their lowest level in about half a century.

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June 17th, 2016 / 10:45 a.m.


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Some hon. members

Hear, hear!

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June 17th, 2016 / 10:45 a.m.


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NDP

Erin Weir NDP Regina—Lewvan, SK

They are free to applaud that, Madam Speaker.

Of, course, the flip side of that is that we do not have enough resources to fund important public services and necessary infrastructure. That is one of the main reasons we have a big federal deficit. It is important that if we want to live in a civilized society, we need to have ways of raising the revenue to pay for those services and those infrastructures that we depend on.

What has the government done in terms of generating that needed revenue?

Bill C-2 proposes an additional four percentage points of personal income tax on incomes over $200,000 per year. That is definitely a positive initiative, but it is also a fairly minor initiative. It does not actually raise very much revenue. In fact, it does not even raise enough revenue to pay for the so-called middle-class tax cut that actually goes to what we might call the upper middle class. The maximum benefit is only to people earning more than $90,000 a year. We have this kind of redistribution from the rich to the nearly rich, which is costing the treasury even more money.

We, in the NDP, have suggested that the government might look to the corporate sector as a source of additional revenues to pay for public services.

It is interesting. This morning, the Toronto Star and CBC have come out with a joint investigation that looks into the loss of revenue to offshore tax havens. It notes that all of these tax information exchange agreements that the former Conservative government was very keen to sign have actually made the problem worse.

The goal of these agreements was obviously to achieve greater transparency, to get more information about what was going on in tax havens. However, what the Conservatives did while they were in power was to put in place a policy whereby once a country had signed one of these tax information exchange agreements, there was no more enforcement. Canadian companies could just repatriate profits tax free from those jurisdictions. Far from curtailing offshore tax avoidance, this plethora of tax information exchange agreements has actually made the problem worse. I think that is a problem that we need to be addressing in this House.

I would also like to talk a bit about a specific case of offshore tax avoidance that I think really illustrates the problem.

Cameco is a company that mines uranium in Saskatchewan. In 1999, it signed a deal with its own subsidiary in Zug, Switzerland to sell that uranium to Switzerland at a fixed price of $10 per pound. Switzerland was not the ultimate destination or user of that uranium. The subsidiary in Zug was just reselling it to other jurisdictions around the world at market prices. Of course, the market price of uranium is variable, but it has consistently been quite a bit more than $10 a pound. It is currently around $30 a pound. It was up to as high as $140 a pound in 2007.

The only real effect of this arrangement was to transfer billions of dollars of profits from Canada to this Swiss tax haven. The Canada Revenue Agency has calculated that from 2003 through 2015, that cost the governments of Canada and Saskatchewan more than $2 billion in lost tax revenue.

This is a huge scandal. It first came out in 2013. At that time, I was struck by the fact that Saskatchewan's Conservative MPs and one Liberal MP were totally silent on the matter. Fortunately, we now have some New Democratic MPs from the province who are going to speak up for tax fairness and raise issues like this.

It is very concerning that we have this company that is making huge profits off of Canadian resources and then transferring those profits out of the country, in a very brazen way, in order to avoid paying tax on it.

The good news is that the Canada Revenue Agency has started to pursue this matter. That is the way in which it came out publicly in 2013. However, the news that is a little more concerning is that there has been a real tradition of both Conservative and Liberal governments not actually following through on these cases, and instead signing these deals that let the tax cheats off the hook.

Part of the reason that I want to bring the Cameco case forward in this House is to put it on record, to make sure that the Government of Canada is actually going to follow up on this and not let the company get away with this scam.

I am not alone in this. Earlier this week, an organization called Canadians for Tax Fairness presented a petition signed by more than 36,000 people, calling on Cameco to make these tax payments. There are a lot of people who are concerned about this, and finally they have some Saskatchewan voices in Parliament speaking up for them.

I would also like to touch on the provincial side of this whole question. The tax base to which provincial taxes apply is actually defined by the Government of Canada. When you have a company like Cameco shifting taxable profits out of the country, it is not just the federal government that loses out; it is also the Government of Saskatchewan that is no longer able to collect the appropriate taxes on that money.

This is a pressing concern, because the Government of Saskatchewan is running a huge deficit right now. The Government of Saskatchewan really needs that money to maintain important public programs in our province. This is a critical issue. It has just come to light recently that the small “c” conservative government in Saskatchewan refused to present a budget prior to the recent provincial election because they wanted to conceal the fact that they were running this big deficit.

Now we know there is a huge deficit there, and we know how important it would be for the Province of Saskatchewan to be able to collect fair corporate taxes from the profits generated from our province's resources. It is not just about Cameco. This point is applicable to the whole question of offshore tax avoidance.

If the federal government were to do a better job of preventing this tax avoidance and tax evasion, and actually make sure that the correct amount of profit was subject to federal corporate income tax, that would also mean those profits could be subject to provincial corporate income tax.

I think almost all provincial governments are in deficit right now, and one of the best things this Parliament could do to help our provincial governments generate the revenues they need for health care, education, and social services would be to get our tax system in order. It wants to make sure that appropriate reporting is being done, so that not only do we have adequate revenues for the federal government, but so that our provincial counterparts can fund their operations in an appropriate way as well.

We are facing a huge revenue problem in this country. We have tax rates at historic lows, which are not sufficient to fund the important services and necessary infrastructure on which Canadians rely. Why is this happening? Obviously, one of the problems is that the general corporate tax rate has been cut. As my colleague pointed out, that has led to a huge loss of revenue and has not produced investment in our economy.

The other issue is that whatever the tax rate, it is not actually being applied because of these offshore tax schemes, which were aggravated by the recent Conservative government, of which Cameco in Saskatchewan is a particularly egregious example. We need to focus on this problem and come up with concrete solutions to collect appropriate revenues.

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June 17th, 2016 / 10:55 a.m.


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Conservative

Ziad Aboultaif Conservative Edmonton Manning, AB

Madam Speaker, the plan for those with over $200,000 in income was supposed to be to raise votes not to raise revenue. Does the hon. member agree with that?

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June 17th, 2016 / 10:55 a.m.


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NDP

Erin Weir NDP Regina—Lewvan, SK

Madam Speaker, as I said in my speech, I do believe that this modest tax increase for the very wealthiest Canadians is a good and desirable policy. It will raise some needed revenue, so I certainly think it makes sense.

Where I would agree with the member for Edmonton Manning is that it will not actually raise very much revenue. In fact, it will raise significantly less money than the Liberal government is going to give away through this so-called middle-class tax cut that does not actually go to the middle class.

Therefore, if we are serious about raising revenue, we need to look at the corporate side of the ledger and start reversing corporate tax cuts, as well as closing loopholes and dealing with these offshore tax havens.

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June 17th, 2016 / 10:55 a.m.


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NDP

Kennedy Stewart NDP Burnaby South, BC

Madam Speaker, I would like to thank my colleague for an excellent speech and, of course, his deep knowledge in this area of tax and revenue.

I wonder if the member could expand on his comments concerning the so-called middle-class tax cut. I wonder if he could expand on why the title does not actually match the measures that are being put forward by the government.

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June 17th, 2016 / 10:55 a.m.


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NDP

Erin Weir NDP Regina—Lewvan, SK

Madam Speaker, on the Liberal side of the House, I think there might have been some confusion between a middle-class tax cut and the middle tax bracket.

What the government has done is to cut the middle bracket, which actually only applies to incomes in excess of $45,000, and it goes all the way up to incomes of $90,000. Therefore, to receive the maximum benefit from this supposed middle-class tax cut, one would need to be earning an income of more than $90,000 a year, which I believe most Canadians would consider to be certainly the upper middle class. This is the reason I do not think that the title “middle-class tax cut” is very accurate.

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June 17th, 2016 / 10:55 a.m.


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Winnipeg North Manitoba

Liberal

Kevin Lamoureux LiberalParliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons

Madam Speaker, I totally disagree with the member. This middle-class tax cut is going to provide tax relief to over nine million Canadians, hundreds of millions of dollars. We are talking about farmers, teachers, and all sorts of professions.

Why does the member and the NDP choose to disagree in allowing for Canada's middle class, those teachers, manufacturing workers, that hard-working middle class, to have a tax break?

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June 17th, 2016 / 11 a.m.


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The Assistant Deputy Speaker Carol Hughes

A very brief answer from the member for Regina—Lewvan. However, the member will still have about a minute and a half the next time he speaks on this.

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June 17th, 2016 / 11 a.m.


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NDP

Erin Weir NDP Regina—Lewvan, SK

Madam Speaker, if nine million Canadians are getting some benefit from the tax change, that means that 20-odd million Canadians are getting no benefit at all. Of course, many of those nine million Canadians are not receiving much benefit.

I look forward to debating this matter again after question period.

The House resumed consideration of the motion that Bill C-2, An Act to amend the Income Tax Act, be read the third time and passed.

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June 17th, 2016 / 12:20 p.m.


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Conservative

Garnett Genuis Conservative Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB

Mr. Speaker, I believe that there were one and a half minutes left in questions and comments.

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June 17th, 2016 / 12:20 p.m.


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The Assistant Deputy Speaker Anthony Rota

I have just been informed that technically, yes, that is correct. Normally it is at the discretion of the Speaker, but since it was brought up, we do not want to rob anyone of the opportunity to ask or answer a question.

In a minute and 30 seconds, if the hon. member for Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan wants to ask a very brief question, I am sure he will get a very brief answer from the member for Regina—Lewvan.

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June 17th, 2016 / 12:20 p.m.


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Conservative

Garnett Genuis Conservative Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB

Mr. Speaker, I always so enjoy asking questions of my friend from Regina—Lewvan.

We heard his perspective on economic policy, but I would encourage him to look not just at economic theory but at economic history. He is from Saskatchewan, and I am from Alberta. I think both of us suffer from provincial government envy, to some extent. For decades, under NDP governments in Saskatchewan that pursued policies that he advocates of bigger government and bigger spending, capital, and more importantly, people left Saskatchewan for Alberta, but now, under the Wall government, the exodus of young people from Saskatchewan has stopped.

Does the member not have to agree that the policies of free enterprise that are now being pursued in Saskatchewan are better and have led to more young people staying in Saskatchewan and being able to get employment there?

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June 17th, 2016 / 12:20 p.m.


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NDP

Erin Weir NDP Regina—Lewvan, SK

No, Mr. Speaker, I do not have to agree. In fact, I would note that there are many other differences between the two provinces.

For example, the Canadian oil industry really started out in Saskatchewan. It was the discovery of the huge reserve of oil at Leduc in 1947 that caused that industry to shift to Alberta. That was not about government policy; that was about geology.

Also, we see now that with the downturn in commodity prices, both Alberta and Saskatchewan have been hit with layoffs and cuts in investment, and the right-wing policies at the provincial level in Saskatchewan certainly have not saved our province.

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June 17th, 2016 / 12:20 p.m.


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Conservative

Ron Liepert Conservative Calgary Signal Hill, AB

Mr. Speaker, it is my pleasure to speak to this particular bill one more time as this session of Parliament winds down.

Certainly we have had extensive debate on this particular bill. We have had committee of the whole, and we even had a session the other night with one of our colleagues presenting what I thought was one of the better speeches of this particular session, on If I Had a Million Dollars.

I will be a long way from being as entertaining as my colleague from Red Deer—Lacombe, but it is probably helpful to put on the record a number of things this budget would do, and more importantly, what this budget would not do.

First, we have to go back to the election of October 2015. Leading up to that election, our current Prime Minister, who was the Liberal leader at that time, was promising Canadians that we were going to go into debt just a bit, by about $10 billion, to pay for infrastructure, which Canada needs. If this budget had in any way reflected that we were going to go into deficit to spend on infrastructure significantly, I believe that there would have been wider acceptance of this budget. However, to date, what we have seen in infrastructure spending is only about $1 million on the office of the Minister of Infrastructure and Communities.

If what we are going to do with this budget is continue to spend money, and when we create jobs they will be public-sector jobs, that is hardly going to be a budget that will encourage growth in our economy.

As a member of Parliament from a province that has seen incredible growth, growth that is significantly reduced today, I can say that it is not government that makes things happen, and it is not government that creates jobs. It is the private sector. It is unfortunate that in this budget, the current government has taken it upon itself to feel as though it can take Canadians into debt for the next four years, at least, to the tune of about $150 billion, to try to create jobs.

Clearly, it would be my view, and I believe that of most of my colleagues in my caucus, that if we were to work this hard creating a tax structure that created jobs, rather than the government trying to create those jobs, we would be far better off at the end of the four-year mandate. However, it is the current government that will have to answer for that at the end of four years.

Quite honestly, while I do not support this budget in any manner, I believe that it is this kind of budgeting that will ensure that after the next election, we will be rid of the current government and we will have a Conservative government back that will allow the private sector to create jobs.

I want to take a few minutes to look at what this budget would and would not do. As I said, it is a budget that we were promised was going to rebuild Canada. As I say, besides the office of the Minister of Infrastructure and Communities, we have not seen an awful lot of rebuilding in Canada yet.

Again, we have some promises out there. We have heard a lot of good talk. However, there are a lot of needs. When it comes to infrastructure and infrastructure spending, one of the things I am disappointed in is that the current government seems to be again shifting away from the P3 model. In fact, it is probably not using it at all. It is having public servants in Ottawa and elsewhere across the country deciding how best to spend these infrastructure dollars.

Let us be very clear that while this particular budget would take Canadians $30 billion into deficit in this year alone, only $10 billion would be spent on infrastructure over the next two years.

This budget has significantly increased public spending on programs. We have seen it in a number of areas. I am not even going to start to list them, because there are so many. It will create jobs, more public sector jobs, more people who will be working for government. That is not going to create economic growth.

I also want to talk a little about the so-called tax cut the Liberals have in this particular budget. We have heard the parliamentary secretary stand in his place in this Parliament on at least three or four dozen occasions to talk about this middle-income tax cut that is so significant to Canadians. This is how significant it is. It is $1 a day for working Canadians.

I guess the member for Winnipeg North and the parliamentary secretary, because they fall into that middle-income category, feel as though the members of this Parliament should have a tax cut while low-income earners should not get anything, and high-income earners should pay that $1 a day so that the member for Winnipeg North and the parliamentary secretary can have their coffee paid for every morning by the taxpayers of this country.

That tax cut was supposed to be revenue neutral. It took about 24 hours to change that. When the government finally introduced that objective in a motion in this House in December, we found out that the middle-income tax cut that was going to give Canadians $1 a day was going to cost all Canadian taxpayers $1 billion a year. That is hardly revenue neutral.

If we are going to start having tax cuts, they have to be meaningful tax cuts. This so-called middle-income tax cut is hardly meaningful.

At the same time, the government also took away from middle-income Canadians the ability to save in a significantly enhanced tax-free savings account. This is typical of the Liberals' policies: take on one hand, give back with the other, and then turn around and take what they gave back. The net difference is that taxpayers have less in their pockets than they would have had under a Conservative government.

I want to talk a little about retirement and about future plans the government has. Tax-free savings accounts are a way Canadians can save for retirement. What we have now is a Liberal government that has taken away that ability to save via tax-free savings accounts. We also have a Liberal government that is going to be meeting with the provinces on Monday. Let me make this very clear. It is meeting with a whole bunch of Liberal and socialist finance ministers.

We have a finance minister in Alberta who, frankly, is taking our province into much higher debt than the Liberals. It is hard to imagine that there could actually be a government that would go deeper into debt than the Liberals, but come to Alberta, and we will show people one.

Here we have the Minister of Finance meeting with his provincial counterparts on Monday to take more money out of the pockets of taxpayers and more money from small business taxpayers by way of increasing our Canada pension plan contributions.

I happen to sit on the finance committee. I see that my colleague from Gatineau is here today, and he also sits on the finance committee. He has heard the same evidence we have had presented at the finance committee that the number of low-income seniors is down to single digit percentage points.

The government is saying that we need to take more taxes from Canadians, and let us be clear: increased Canada pension plan contributions are a tax on small business and on working Canadians. This Minister of Finance is going to go to Vancouver on Monday and negotiate a deal with his provincial counterparts, almost all of whom are Liberals and socialists, to take more money away from taxpayers and small businesses to solve a problem that, frankly, does not exist.

If the Liberal government had kept the tax policies that were in place under the previous government, if it had left the TFSA alone, that would have allowed Canadians to save money on their own and not have a bigger bureaucracy take money allegedly to have more benefits for Canadians down the road.

In addition, we had an absolutely unthought-out position. Like so many promises that were made by the Liberals during the campaign, we had a Liberal leader running around the country, making a promise at every stop. There was one particular visit where he was not quite sure what to promise, so he said that the Liberals would drop the eligible age for benefits from 67 to 65. I do not think they really thought they would form government, but when they did, they had to try to keep all those promises. This was one promise they should have broken.

Of the litany of promises the government broke, it should have added that to the list of promises broken. There is no way we should be lowering the age from 67 to 65, some 10 years into the future, because that will cost Canadian taxpayers an extra $11 billion a year. Let us just put that into perspective. That is 30% of the equivalent deficit that the government is putting us into right now. There is a campaign promise that should have been broken.

I would like to spend a few more minutes talking about some of the things the government could do, which could be important for my province of Alberta, for the neighbouring provinces of Saskatchewan and British Columbia, and clearly for Newfoundland and Labrador. I would also venture to say that it is important for other Atlantic provinces. I know we have at least a couple of members in the House today from Atlantic Canada. I hope they will take up the challenge of putting pressure on the government to speed up the process and at least give an indication that it will take seriously the hearings that started yesterday on the energy east pipeline. We know that in 2019, if the government decides not to approve that energy east pipeline, members like the member for Saint John will not be sitting in the House because they will be thrown out of office.

Liberals members from British Columbia are also going to have a very difficult time because the Kinder Morgan pipeline to the west coast is absolutely essential for our country.

If the government listens to that socialist mayor of Vancouver and does not listen to Liberal members from British Columbia, who should be advocating on behalf of the Kinder Morgan pipeline, a whole bunch more of them will not be back here in 2019.

I believe the government will make some bad decisions over the next couple of years. It has exhibited that in the first six months of being in office. If it continues to make those bad decision, I will look forward to 2019 when the government can be a Conservative government again, allowing the private sector to create jobs, not driving us into deficit, and not taking money out of the pockets of taxpayers and small businesses.

Let us also put on record that the government broke a promise to small business in Canada. It promised, like all parties in this Parliament did, to reduce the small business tax. It broke that promise. The finance minister came before the finance committee and clearly stated that this promise would not even be considered in the government's mandate.

I could go on for quite some time, but I will allow my friend, the member for Gatineau to ask me a question.

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June 17th, 2016 / 12:35 p.m.


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Liberal

Steven MacKinnon Liberal Gatineau, QC

Mr. Speaker, I thank my hon. colleague for his speech. As he mentioned, we are both members of the Standing Committee on Finance, and I appreciate his pragmatism and his experience as a parliamentarian both here and in Alberta.

I found his speech very intriguing. I always find it intriguing when a Conservative opposes a bill, our first bill, that cuts middle-class taxes. All of the Conservatives here seem to feel the same way. He gave all kinds of reasons for his stance, but it is always surprising to hear Conservatives speak out against tax cuts and New Democrats in favour of tax cuts. This is all very surprising.

What the member does not yet seem to understand, even though we were very clear about this during the election campaign, is that our decisions would be guided by what is good for the middle class. Whether the issue is retirement, parents, or people who work hard every day, like my constituents and, I would imagine, his constituents, we will make decisions that strengthen Canada's middle class.

I know my hon. colleague to be fair, equitable, and pragmatic. Will he therefore acknowledge that our decisions, our first bill, will benefit the middle class in Canada, in his riding, in my riding, everywhere?

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June 17th, 2016 / 12:35 p.m.


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Conservative

Ron Liepert Conservative Calgary Signal Hill, AB

Mr. Speaker, I and the hon. member for Gatineau are on the finance committee, and we have had a good working relationship over the past six months. I quite often do not agree with the member, but he is open to listening.

Therefore, while he is listening, I did not campaign in the election in 2015 to give myself a tax cut, and that is what the government has done. It has given every member over there a tax cut.

I would have campaigned on the ability to give all Canadians fairness when it came to a tax system. My fellow colleague on the finance committee is probably going to ask me about those Canadians who earn under $45,000 a year, many of whom live in the member's riding I am sure. They get nothing from this budget.

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June 17th, 2016 / 12:40 p.m.


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NDP

Guy Caron NDP Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC

Mr. Speaker, I think my colleague from Calgary Signal Hill had a premonition and knew that I was going to rise and ask him a question. This actually gives me a chance to respond to a point the member for Gatineau just made.

It is not that we support additional tax cuts, but we are in favour of a real tax cut for the middle class, which is not what Bill C-2 proposes. We proposed a tax cut that would apply to annual income beginning at $11,000, rather than $45,000. That would cover 80% of Canadians, rather than just 9 million out of the 25 million or 28 million taxpayers in Canada right now. I just wanted to correct my colleague's comment.

However, I also have a question for my colleague from Calgary Signal Hill, since we disagree on some of the points in the bill. We agree with the Liberals that the TFSA limit should be lowered. We know that the Conservatives want a higher limit, set at $10,000.

Then again, one thing my colleague and I do agree on is the definition of “middle class”, which, seems to us, is not the same as the Liberals' definition. If we look at the tax cut that is set out in this bill, anyone who earns less than $23 an hour will not benefit at all.

I would like my colleague to say a few words about what constitutes the definition of middle class and why the Liberals are trying to make political hay out of an issue that, according to their own interpretation, does not correspond whatsoever to reality?

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June 17th, 2016 / 12:40 p.m.


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Conservative

Ron Liepert Conservative Calgary Signal Hill, AB

Mr. Speaker, my colleague and I have had some good debates at the finance committee on these issues.

As I said earlier, I did not campaign on a tax cut for myself or those who are in our income category. The member raised a good question. At the finance committee, we tried to ask the Minister of Finance to please explain to us what “middle class” meant.

I am quite offended by the term “middle class”. When I hear a term like “middle class”, I think about the class structure of Britain of thousands of years ago. I like to refer to people in income groups. I do not think we have a middle class, a lower class or an upper class. We have an income class.

From day one, when the Prime Minister talked about the middle class, it offended me. I do not consider myself to be in a class system, and he has placed me there simply by the amount I earn.

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June 17th, 2016 / 12:40 p.m.


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Liberal

Ken Hardie Liberal Fleetwood—Port Kells, BC

Mr. Speaker, I was intrigued to hear the hon. member talk about what he would do if he were leading a campaign and the questions he would ask. There is a job opening there. Maybe he will get his chance.

The question on Kinder Morgan is a big one, especially in metro Vancouver. We recognize there is a huge divide between sentiments on the west coast and sentiments in Alberta.

How do we close the gap between clearly opposition on one side and the proponents on the other?

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June 17th, 2016 / 12:40 p.m.


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Conservative

Ron Liepert Conservative Calgary Signal Hill, AB

Mr. Speaker, I would like to get really worked up about this. We talk about being a country. The Prime Minister has said that as Canadians we help each other. Yet when we have projects of a national nature, we have people playing politics with it, whether it is our friends from the Bloc Québécois who keep raising issues in the House about energy, or the mayor of Vancouver who comes to Ottawa to campaign against Kinder Morgan.

There are things that need to be pointed out in the House, and they need to be put on the record. As energy minister in Alberta a few years ago, I had an opportunity to tour the Kinder Morgan facility at Burnaby. One of the things that was mentioned to me was that the current pipeline from Alberta to British Columbia, to Burnaby, provided all of the fuel for all the vehicles that operated in the Lower Mainland. It is okay to ship Alberta oil to Vancouver to refine, to service the Lower Mainland, but all of a sudden, for Vancouver's mayor, it is not good enough that we can ship additional oil to export.

Why is that fair? How Canadian is that? It is good enough for us, but it is not good enough to sell.

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June 17th, 2016 / 12:45 p.m.


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NDP

Alexandre Boulerice NDP Rosemont—La Petite-Patrie, QC

Mr. Speaker, I have two comments to begin with. As far as social classes are concerned, I think that we should agree on the fact that a class structure still exists. The member can come to Montreal and see that between Westmount and Hochelaga there is a clear class difference.

My colleague said that governments do no create jobs, the private sector does. I know that this is part of the Conservative creed, but we need to recognize that this is a rather simplistic cliché. There would be no workers who can read and write without schools; there would be no healthy workforce without hospitals; there would be no skilled workforce without our colleges and universities. The public sector and the private sector must work together, hand in hand, to grow our economy. When the Conservatives were in power, they handed out billions of dollars in tax giveaways to Canadian corporations without creating a single job. They did nothing to help small and medium-sized businesses, which is what the NDP was calling for. Are they going to ask the Liberals to accept the NDP's idea of lowering taxes for small and medium-sized businesses from 11% to 9%?

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June 17th, 2016 / 12:45 p.m.


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Conservative

Ron Liepert Conservative Calgary Signal Hill, AB

Mr. Speaker, I am happy the member understands it was not just an NDP proposal to reduce the small business tax. We clearly campaigned on that and so did the Liberals. The Liberals broke their promise, so it is one thing we probably share with the NDP.

Let me make sure the member is clear. There were 1.3 million net new jobs created during the Conservative government's administration. When the member says that health care and education jobs are all public sector jobs, he is wrong. Thousands of people work in the private sector. I do not believe there is a doctor in Quebec who works for the public health care system. He or she is a private businessperson.

It is wrong for New Democrats to say that we would not have any teachers or health care officials if we allowed the private sector to create the jobs.

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June 17th, 2016 / 12:45 p.m.


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Conservative

Chris Warkentin Conservative Grande Prairie—Mackenzie, AB

Mr. Speaker, I will be splitting my time with my colleague, the member for Carleton, so I ask that members stick around, because I am going to give a speech, but he is going to give an excellent speech.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, for the opportunity to speak to Bill C-2, to talk about the government's financial record and the challenges I see presented with its financial vision.

I come from Alberta. I am a proud Albertan, and I am proud to defend the people I represent. I am also proud of the people who have built our local economies within the communities I represent. They are the bedrock of the communities across the province of Alberta, across western Canada, and contribute so much to the economy of our nation from coast to coast.

One of the things I have noticed with the Liberal economic plan is that there seems to be no long-term perspective as to how it is going to create jobs and drive the economy. The Liberals talk a lot about things like creating jobs and providing opportunity for people to move from lower income to middle income. Of course, they do use the terms of class, which as my colleague from Calgary referenced, is probably offensive to a lot of people who are workers in our country. The concern I have is the Liberals keep talking a good game, but they have not demonstrated a plan that is coherent in any way. As a matter of fact, the bill we are debating today probably establishes for all of us that that is the case.

They talk about it being a tax cut for people who need it most. Of course, what we do note is that those who need it in our country most are actually not able to benefit from the provisions in the bill. Lower-income Canadians are not included. As a matter of fact, there is nothing in the bill that provides any assistance to lower-income Canadians.

There is also a major hit against senior citizens. Just this last week, we heard it said that the Liberals are looking at a plan to increase CPP contributions. As my colleague just referenced, this in fact would be a payroll tax. Not only does it establish a problem for those income earners who would have an additional amount of money taken off their paycheque, it would also mean that small business owners would have to pay additional taxes to help support a CPP increase.

Let us just think about this a little. A CPP increase today would not benefit seniors today. It would not benefit those people who are in their later years and who most desperately need support today. The hope is that if money is put aside today, seniors in decades to come would benefit from those increased contributions. That is a debate to be had, but let us be clear, this would benefit no senior who is a senior today. It also would not help those people who will become seniors and start drawing pensions in the next number of years. We are talking about a Liberal plan to start taxing small businesses, workers, and families today in the hopes that someday there may be a benefit to people down the road. It is not about seniors who are struggling today.

One provision that we as a government instituted was the tax-free savings account. Having looked at the evidence, what we note is the people who were most likely to use the full allocation of the tax-free savings accounts were low-income senior citizens, those people who were having to withdraw money from RIFs or different types of savings plans. The tax-free savings account was a vehicle that created all kinds of opportunities for senior citizens to manage their retirement money. It allowed senior citizens to put money in and withdraw money without any tax implications. They could manage it, and withdraw money as they needed, to address their needs. They could withdraw it if they had a medical emergency and all of a sudden needed to pull out some money for travel, or if they wanted to go on a vacation they were able to withdraw that money without having to take any kind of a penalty.

The Liberals have gone after senior citizens by cutting down the tax-free savings account at the same time that they are telling Canadians they are concerned about seniors, but they have no plan that would benefit seniors today or people who will become seniors in the next number of years.

I am also concerned about the Liberals' plan for families. I did reference the fact that I come from Alberta and I represent people who are in the resource sector, those who work hard every day, play by the rules, pay their taxes, and contribute to our communities. They have had some of the worst years of their lives over the last couple of years.

Obviously, all governments and all parties recognize that we in Parliament do not control the price of energy in the world. Regardless who is in power, there are going to be some troubles with regard to small and larger businesses and to those who are employed in the resource sector.

We know that the Liberal government can make it better or worse for those people who work in the energy sector. Let us be honest, Liberals have made it significantly worse, creating uncertainty in the marketplace, such that companies refuse to invest in Canada because they are uncertain about things like carbon taxes. They are uncertain whether they are going to be able to get products to market.

When the Liberals continue to place hurdles in the way of the development of the energy east pipeline and the TransCanada pipeline, when they continue to play politics with some of the most important nation building infrastructure, which will cost the taxpayer zero dollars as this is private sector investment, when the Liberals continue to create hurdles to see that infrastructure built, my constituents are hurt.

The reason they are hurt is because many of them are employed in the energy sector or have businesses that are secondary industries within the resource sector, that are looking toward the future. The companies are saying they are not going to invest in a place where there is so much uncertainty. The Liberals' announcements that they are going to create difficulty for pipelines to be built and their commitment to continue a job-killing carbon tax hurt.

There is a document that came out this morning from the Alberta government that is an assessment simply on the provincial portion of the carbon tax, not of the federal government's carbon tax that it promised, which will be in addition to any provincial carbon tax. The government's analysis itself says that it will cause 15,000 job losses, it will take $4 billion out of the household income of Albertans, so not only is the government taxing them more, it is also going to reduce their income. If there is going to be $4 billion taken out of the household income of Albertans with a provincial carbon tax, one can only imagine how much additional money will come out of household incomes of Albertans when the Liberals get their hands on a cash grab from the province of Alberta as well.

The Liberals' plan has been completely incoherent. We have established that. They have said they are going to support seniors, yet they are taking vehicles away for seniors to actually save. They have said they are going to help people move from lower income to higher income, yet they are taxing those families at every turn, creating disincentive for investment in provinces like Alberta and other provinces that depend on the energy sector. They are continuing to increase payroll taxes on those same small business owners, creating disincentive to create more jobs. The incoherence of the Liberal economic plan is not only challenging, it is actually creating such difficulty for people who live in communities like mine.

There is an urgency for the Liberals to change course. We would ask the Liberals to look at the facts and the evidence and start to respond to the needs of Albertans and all Canadians to ensure that we can build an economy that will prosper for generations to come.

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June 17th, 2016 / 12:55 p.m.


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Liberal

Wayne Long Liberal Saint John—Rothesay, NB

Mr. Speaker, as per usual, the Conservative view of economic reality is something to behold.

The member opposite spoke about the tax-free savings account and how good it was for Canadians. There certainly were some benefits.

One question that I have been asking members opposite for weeks now and one to which I still have never received an answer is this: Why the doubling of the tax-free savings account when only 7% of Canadians maximized it? The former finance minister himself said it would cost billions of taxpayer dollars by doubling it. He also said that the former prime minister's grandchildren could worry about that debt in the future.

I would ask the member opposite, why the doubling of the tax-free savings account? Canadians knew that it was targeted to the Conservative base and it was not fair. Why the doubling when 7% of Canadians maximized it?

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June 17th, 2016 / 12:55 p.m.


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Conservative

Chris Warkentin Conservative Grande Prairie—Mackenzie, AB

Mr. Speaker, the member makes the point that 7% of Canadians were maxing out the TFSAs. Many more were coming close to the max and many others were using it as a tool to put in different amounts. Let us be clear. He called it a Conservative base but we are talking about low-income senior citizens. I am hopeful that they are our base, but let us think about this. The same people who max it out one year, 7%, will be different from the 7% the next year, it may be 10%, which might be different than the next 10%. Within three years perhaps 30% of Canadians will have maxed out their tax-free savings accounts.

The point is that this tool should be available when Canadians need it. Many people who need it are in their later years and are trying to manage their retirement savings money. They want to be able to access that money. The flexibility that that tool provides for senior citizens is one that we need to continue allowing them to use.

I am concerned that the hon. member is not just offended by the doubling of the tax-free savings account but he is now offended by the tax-free savings account altogether, which makes me wonder if it is the Liberals' plan to eliminate the tax-free savings account altogether.

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June 17th, 2016 / 1 p.m.


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NDP

Marjolaine Boutin-Sweet NDP Hochelaga, QC

Mr. Speaker, I do not know what the member's riding is like, but in my riding seniors who do not earn a lot of money and are on a fixed income cannot invest $10,000 in a TFSA; they cannot even invest $5,500.

In order to save money, people need to have enough to survive on. Many seniors are having trouble surviving. I would be very surprised if the member saw that in his riding.

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June 17th, 2016 / 1 p.m.


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Conservative

Chris Warkentin Conservative Grande Prairie—Mackenzie, AB

Mr. Speaker, I am not speaking about what my feelings are. Many people's intuition might be similar to that of the member, but the evidence demonstrates that 60% of the people who were maxing out the tax-free savings account earned less than $60,000 in that given year. I am not asking the hon. member just to believe me because I think that is the case, but the evidence demonstrates that, and it is not just my constituents but her constituents her as well. The evidence demonstrates that the vast majority of those who were maxing out the provisions were lower-income Canadians.

Many of our constituents have probably used the tax-free savings account as a mechanism to move money, as they are withdrawing money from RRIFs. They might use that as a vehicle so that they have flexibility in their retirement years as to how they hold that money, how they earn interest on that money, and how they use that money.

The hon. member should call the Library of Parliament and ask if it has statistics on her particular constituency. I think she will be surprised by what she finds out.

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June 17th, 2016 / 1 p.m.


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Conservative

Pierre Poilievre Conservative Carleton, ON

Mr. Speaker, our friends in the Liberal Party have been trumpeting the middle class in their rhetoric a lot lately. In fact, they included a fancy chart in their recent budget to talk about the incomes of middle-class people. In it they claim that for the last 40 years, the middle class has not had a real after-inflation raise.

I was surprised to hear that, because Conservatives had produced a lot of data to show that in the last decade alone, middle-class incomes had skyrocketed. How could both of these claims be true?

I looked at the underlying data that Finance Canada used to produce this chart in the Liberal budget. I found that when Liberals say that Canadians have had almost no middle-class income increase over the last four decades, they are telling the truth. When the Conservatives say that there has been a very large increase in middle-class incomes in the last 10 years, we are also telling the truth. How do we reconcile both of those things?

We can look at the chart. We can go back to 1976, the beginning point of this chart that the Liberals put in their recent budget. It demonstrates that, at that time, in inflation-adjusted dollars, Canadians were earning just over $46,000 on average, and then suddenly, over the following six years, incomes plummeted by 6% after inflation.

That drop was the biggest of the last half-century, and it was presided over by Pierre Elliott Trudeau, whose policies of high taxes, spiralling debt, and taxpayer give-aways to large corporations sent our economy reeling. It caused a massive national recession and enormous job loss, particularly in western Canada, but caused a job-loss contagion that spread right across the country and led us to the biggest pay cut for the middle class in a half-century. It then took 30 years for incomes to recover to the level they had been back in 1976. It just so happens that recovery occurred under the previous Conservative prime minister.

What happened in the last 10 years then?

According to data right out of page 11 of the Liberal budget, incomes for middle-class Canadians rose by a staggering 11% after inflation, from $44,700 to $49,602, which is a $5,000 after-inflation increase in median incomes. In fact, the pay increase that occurred under our most recent Conservative prime minister was larger than income growth under Prime Ministers Trudeau, Clark, Turner, Mulroney, Campbell, Chrétien, and Martin combined, again, according to data right out of the Liberal budget.

Let us break it down further. The government has said that it is a big champion of women in the workforce. In fact, the Prime Minister likes to brag that he is a “feminist”. I would like to look at the data that his budget presents about incomes for women.

Anybody who does look at that data, which again is found on page 11 of the recent Liberal budget, will find that women enjoyed a $5,234 pay increase after inflation during the most recent Conservative government. This is an increase of 14%. In other words, female incomes grew even faster than the average income during the last 10 years.

It is also worth noting that the annual rate of income increase for women during the most recent Conservative government was five times the rate it was during the first Trudeau government, and five times as fast as during the Chrétien and Martin governments.

In other words, women, middle-class women, had their biggest pay increase in a half-century under the most recent Conservative government, according to the Liberal budget.

Where do we go from here? Ironically, this budget, which contains this valuable information, seeks to repeat the exact same mistakes that caused Pierre Elliott Trudeau to tank the middle class four decades ago. It is unfortunate, but history does seem to repeat itself. This Prime Minister is enacting the same high-tax, big-debt, costly government strategy that his father did to destroy the middle class when he was in office not so long ago. We would think that the Liberals would learn. We would think that they would understand that trickle-down government harms the middle class even though it is particularly good for the wealthy and well connected.

We talk today about a budget that would make changes to the income tax system. Far from helping the middle class, if people earn $150,000 as Liberal MPs, they would save almost $700 in income tax as a result of changes in the bill before the House right now. If people earn $45,000 a year, they would get absolutely nothing. The question of social justice can always be answered with the following two-part question: From whom, to whom?

The costs of the bill would be borne by people who earn $45,000 a year and the maximum benefits would go to those earning $150,000 a year. That is not social justice. That is not a defence of the middle class. That is a wealth transfer from the working poor to the wealthy and the well connected.

So it is so often the case when government gets big and expensive. Those who can afford the lobbyists to pressure government and the accountants and lawyers to gain the rules of government always do so much better when there is more government. That is what we are seeing today, a government that is on the side of the very rich, that is increasing the cost and the burden on the shoulders of the working poor, and that is reversing the very impressive middle-class gains that our country enjoyed over the last decade.

Now we hear speculation that the current government may give one billion middle-class tax dollars to Bombardier, a company of billionaire owners and millionaire executives. This is a company, in fact, that just paid $8 million to one executive alone, while it was simultaneously asking middle-class taxpayers in Quebec and Canada to bail it out. This again would be a massive wealth transfer from the working poor and the middle class to the wealthy and well-connected, which is so common under left-of-centre governments like the current one. This is the insider economy or crony socialism at its very worst.

By contrast, our official opposition will continue to fight for working people who get up every day and put in a hard day's work in order to earn their incomes. We will continue to fight for those who want to save a bit more through their tax-free savings accounts, keep a bit more from their income tax bills, and hire a bit more through their small businesses. In so doing, we will champion the underdogs in Canada and fight for the people who are the backbone of this country.

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June 17th, 2016 / 1:10 p.m.


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Liberal

Dan Vandal Liberal Saint Boniface—Saint Vital, MB

Mr. Speaker, that was a very interesting speech. The hon. member spoke about social justice and wealth transfers. The people in the constituency I represent, Saint Boniface—Saint Vital, are very excited about the new Canada child benefit. It is more generous than the previous benefit. It is targeted to income; if people earn less money, they will get more money. Probably most important of all, it is tax free. The Canada child benefit will raise 300,000 children out of poverty. That is what I call a wealth transfer and a champion for social justice.

In addition to the Canada child benefit, we are launching Canada's largest ever infrastructure program, as part of the budget.

In addition, speaking of the middle class, and perhaps it was not this speaker but an earlier speaker who did not like to talk about class but income levels, Canadian citizens making between $40,000 and $90,000 will get a 7% tax cut. That is in the budget.

How can anybody be against a 7% tax cut for income earners between $40,000 and $90,000?

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June 17th, 2016 / 1:10 p.m.


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Conservative

Pierre Poilievre Conservative Carleton, ON

Mr. Speaker, if only it were true. In reality, the member's numbers are inaccurate. If someone earns $44,000, they will get a zero per cent income tax cut from this budget. The very small tax relief that does exist really only peaks for people who earn over $100,000. Even for them, it works out to about $700 a year. A person needs to earn about as much as the hon. member does to enjoy that maximum tax relief under this budget. However, the working poor get exactly nothing, which is unfortunate because it reverses the trend of the previous government, according to the parliamentary budget officer, the independent and non-partisan parliamentary budget officer.

The previous government cut taxes by about $30 billion per year, and that tax relief was overwhelmingly in favour of lower- and modest-income earners. In fact, for many low-income and impoverished workers, the previous Conservative government cut their taxes by 100%; meaning that they do not pay anything at all. That helps them get over the welfare wall; that is to say, it ensures that work always pays more than welfare. We know that the best anti-poverty plan is a good job.

Now, we have a government that is going to impose new costs on the working poor, through a carbon tax that will make it more difficult to heat a home and drive to work, and through a payroll tax, which will mean that small businesses will have to lay off their most vulnerable workers. That is an attack on the poor, it is an attack on the working family, and we will, on this side of the House, fight it every day.

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June 17th, 2016 / 1:15 p.m.


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Conservative

Robert Gordon Kitchen Conservative Souris—Moose Mountain, SK

Mr. Speaker, we have heard a lot about taxes today, with the cutting of the sports deduction, as well as the Canada pension plan prices going up. You mentioned charts being available.

I wonder if you might be able to comment as to how that is going to affect jobs and the economy?

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June 17th, 2016 / 1:15 p.m.


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The Assistant Deputy Speaker Anthony Rota

I just want to remind the hon. member that I will not be commenting on it. I am sure he meant the hon. member for Carleton.

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June 17th, 2016 / 1:15 p.m.


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Conservative

Pierre Poilievre Conservative Carleton, ON

Mr. Speaker, the member is quite right. The Liberals got rid of the children's fitness tax credit, they have cut back the tax-free savings accounts, and they are planning, now, to raise payroll taxes on small businesses and working people who earn less than $50,000 a year. I think this will have a detrimental impact on low-income people trying to make a break and get ahead.

The tax-free savings account, by the way, has been mischaracterized by members of the Liberal Party and the NDP, who say that it is only for the rich. Again, Statistics Canada has demonstrated that 60% of those who maxed out their tax-free savings accounts earned less than $60,000 a year. They are seniors who, typically, have sold their homes to downsize and want to reinvest the proceeds, or who have inherited money from a deceased spouse. They want to put that money where the government cannot get it, and who can blame them? That is the Canadian thing to do.

The tax-free savings account at $10,000 allowed them to do that. The government has raised taxes on those people. We will, hopefully, try to convince it to change its mind on that.

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June 17th, 2016 / 1:15 p.m.


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Conservative

John Barlow Conservative Foothills, AB

Mr. Speaker, it is a pleasure to rise today to speak on Bill C-2, an act to amend the Income Tax Act.

We have talked a lot today already about some of the changes that are going to be coming forward with this. However, I would like to tell a personal story about why I feel that this is important to speak about today.

I remember vividly, in 2006, my wife and I were in a small southern Alberta town. I would say that we were a low to middle-income family. We had three children: one in hockey, one in volleyball, and one in dance. I remember when the children's fitness tax credit was first introduced by the Conservative government, and what a godsend that was to me and my family to be able to cover a substantial part of the costs for my children's activities.

Then, last year, when we put forward a plan to double the children's fitness tax credit from $500 to $1,000, I went to as many doors as possible in my riding to talk about this program with my constituents. It was incredible how many families, especially young parents, spoke to us about how important this program was to ensure they were able to keep their children healthy, active, and enjoying some of the activities.

There is a reason that programs such as KidSport, the United Way, and Boys and Girls Clubs are so popular. It is a reality that lower-income families have a difficult time being able to afford the costs of some programs.

The children's fitness tax credit was a program that impacted just about every single Canadian family with children. It was extremely disappointing to see that the Liberal government has eliminated that program. I have had profound feedback from residents in my Foothills riding who are extremely upset with that change.

We will hear from the members opposite that the reason they got rid of programs, like the children's fitness tax credit and the post-secondary school book tax credit, was that they were going to be more generous on the side of other programs and the middle-class tax cut. It was going to be revolutionary for Canadian families. This was going to be something that was a life-altering change for Canadian families.

However, let us put it in perspective. According to Finance Canada, the average impact to Canadian families with the middle-class tax cut is $6.34 a week. That is less than $1 a day. That is what the impact on the average Canadian family is going to be. The government is eliminating the children's fitness tax credit, the universal child care benefit, and those types of programs. I find it interesting that the Liberals find $1 a day to be revolutionary. I am pretty positive that I can say for my family that $1 a day is anything but revolutionary.

We were kind of joking a little in question period, but I found it interesting that the Minister of International Development was laughing at the fact that we were asking about $17 for a glass a juice. We, on this side of the House, are here to protect the Canadian taxpayer. Every single dollar has an impact on their lives, their jobs, and their families. Paying $17 for a glass of juice, or $5,000 on tips and gratuities for two days, is certainly worth asking about. For Liberals to say that $6.34 a week, less than $1 day, is somehow revolutionary and is going to lift up 9 million families out of poverty, or 9,000 children out of poverty, or whatever the number, is pretty coy.

The money will either have to be drawn from or reduced from the public services and the tax base. I would say that the spending plans of the Liberal government are risky at best. We have seen no concrete proof that these tax cuts, which the Liberals initially said during the election were going to be revenue neutral, are that in fact.

The tax breaks they introduced were going to be revenue neutral and revolutionary, but in fact are going to cost Canadians more than $8 billion over the next six years. It is not really a tax cut at all, because they are going into very severe deficits to do these things. The amount of $9 billion dollars over the next six years is not a tax cut in my estimation.

Again, as part of that election platform, the deficit was going to be around a $10 billion mark. Now we are beyond that, three times beyond that. The four-year plan that the Liberals tabled as part of the budget in 2016 has absolutely no plan to get out of that massive deficit spin. It is a downward spiral. It is a massive deficit with absolutely no plan to get us out of it.

To have $30 billion deficits year after year, and then laugh about overspending on trips to Washington, shows the arrogance of the Liberal government.

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June 17th, 2016 / 1:20 p.m.


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Conservative

Peter Van Loan Conservative York—Simcoe, ON

New York.

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June 17th, 2016 / 1:20 p.m.


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Conservative

John Barlow Conservative Foothills, AB

New York, Mr. Speaker, I am sorry. Thanks for that correction.

The Liberal government has said that it wants to cut the tax-free savings account, so again we are going to be talking today about the impact and what it truly means for Canadians. The tax-free savings account, I know from speaking to residents in Foothills in southern Alberta, was something many of them embraced. They felt that it was an outstanding opportunity for them to save. In fact, 11 million Canadians accessed the tax-free savings account.

Instead, the Liberal government has taken away another voluntary option for Canadians to save for whatever they feel is most important to them. It could be a house, children's education, or, yes, retirement. Instead, after reducing the tax-free savings account limit from $10,000 down to its original $5,500, the government would like to replace that with a mandatory CPP tax, which would be a tax of more than $4,000 for the average Canadian worker, as well as an additional tax on small business owners. When Liberals say Canadians will have these benefits, if they do not have jobs, they will not pay any taxes. They will be more of a burden on the social system.

Liberals also want a job-killing carbon tax. We have talked about that several times this week. In Alberta, in the month of May alone, another 24,000 jobs were lost. There are 24,000 more Albertans out of work. The unemployment rate in Alberta is now 7.9%, the highest it has been since the national energy program was brought forward by the Liberals in the 1980s, with no relief in sight.

In question period today, I talked about Ritchie Bros., one of the largest auction operations in Alberta, last month having what was supposed to be a two-day auction sale. It ended up being five days, and it sold more than $240 million in industrial commercial equipment that went south to the United States. With the equipment that goes south to the United States, so do the jobs that go with that equipment, or they disappeared in Canada entirely.

Over the past year, half a billion dollars in oil sands equipment has been sold, and the vast majority of it has gone south of the border. On top of that, $50 billion in investment has left Alberta. That shows the impact that Albertans are feeling right now. We expect the unemployment rate to exceed 8% over the next year. I do not think this is the time to be joking about that $1-a-day middle-class tax cut, which actually only benefits those making over $100,000, many who have now lost their jobs entirely, or to be joking about introducing a carbon tax, which would increase the cost of literally everything that an average Canadian is trying to pay.

The government wants to bring in a mandatory CPP tax, while taking away an option that Canadians have to make the choices that they feel are best for them, which is the tax-free savings account. I appreciate that it is still going to exist, but it is not going to have the limit that Conservatives had offered before.

Let us put that in perspective. Over the last six months, the Liberal government has talked about a middle-class tax cut, which is not really a tax cut at all because it is not revenue neutral. It is going to cost close to $9 billion over the next six years. It wants to establish a mandatory CPP tax, which will impact Canadians and small business owners, our job creators, and now it is talking about a carbon tax. That is really a tax on top of a tax, because 80% of Canadian jurisdictions already have a carbon tax at the provincial level. Therefore, why would we add yet another tax on Canadians?

Putting it into perspective, over the Conservatives' 10 years in government, we reduced taxes more than 150 times. Canadians had the lowest tax burden they have had in 50 years. The average Canadian family was saving more than $7,000 a year on their taxes. Those tax advantages will be gone almost entirely with a CPP tax, which would cost more than $4,000 for the average Canadian.

I am sure we will hear the argument today from my colleagues on the other side that the tax-free savings account was simply just a tax haven for the wealthy. We also heard from my esteemed colleague from Carleton that is simply not the case.

People earning $80,000 a year or less accounted for 80% of those who had a tax-free savings account, and of 60% of the individuals who contributed the maximum of $5,500, the vast majority of them had annual earnings of less than $60,000.

As a Canadian, I do not feel that $60,000 a year is wealthy or anything close to wealth. That is just the average hard-working Canadian who is making certainly difficult decisions for whatever they feel is best for them and their families, whether it is a down payment on a house, saving for their children's education, or saving for their retirement.

I believe that reducing the tax-free savings account is a step backwards. I do not think it is something that will benefit Canadians. This was a savings mechanism that was extremely flexible and allowed Canadians to make the choices they felt were best for them and their families.

I want to jump ahead a bit and talk again about what our Prime Minister said during the election. During the election, he said repeatedly that the $3 billion tax cut for middle-class earners was for a $3 billion increase on high-income earners. We said before that this simply is not the case. This will actually cost Canadians close to $9 billion a year. That just shows that in six months, there has been broken promise after broken promise by the Liberal government . The Liberals are simply trying to regress some of the tax advantages and things we were able to change.

In conclusion, I would encourage all members of the House to vote against Bill C-2, because it reverses some of the great tax advantages that we were able to offer Canadians over the last few years, including the lowest tax burden on Canadians in 50 years.

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June 17th, 2016 / 1:25 p.m.


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The Assistant Deputy Speaker Anthony Rota

It being 1:30 p.m., the House will now proceed to the consideration of private members' business as listed on today's Order Paper.

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September 19th, 2016 / noon


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Winnipeg North Manitoba

Liberal

Kevin Lamoureux LiberalParliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons

Mr. Speaker, I will be sharing my time with my colleague from Labrador, which means I only will have 10 minutes to speak to a very important legislation.

This is where the previous Conservative government really lost touch. The Conservatives were out of touch with Canadians and real people, and that it ultimately led to the current Prime Minister. Even before he became the leader of the Liberal Party, he talked about the importance of Canada's middle class. The Prime Minister has been consistent throughout not only his leadership, but even prior to it in saying how important Canada's middle class is to our economy and to Canada's future prosperity. The Conservative government never really understood that. One only needs to look across the way to see how those members have voted on this legislation. I would challenge them to revisit the way they voted on the passage of Bill C-2 at second reading, and listen to what Canadians are telling them. If they are really in touch with Canadians, they will appreciate what Bill C-2 is all about. Not only that, it goes even beyond Bill C-2. It is about Canada's middle class and those who want to become a part of it.

I have been a parliamentarian at the provincial or federal levels now for 25-plus years. Never before have I seen a government so determined to have an impact on Canada's middle class. That is why it is with great enthusiasm that I highly recommend to all members, no matter what their political affiliation, to get behind Bill C-2 and vote in favour of it. If they understand how the economy works, I believe they will recognize how important it is that the middle class be supported. Let me give an example. If a middle class is given a tax break or is enriched, we will have a healthier economy. How does that work? If there is more money in the pockets of average Canadians, that means they have more disposable income to invest in our economy.

There is an immense amount of literature and there are many arguments put forward to tell us that if the middle class has confidence in the economy and they have money in their pockets, they will spend that money. By spending that money, we then enrich and afford small businesses and so many others the opportunity to do that much better.

I find it interesting. Whether from the Conservatives or the New Democrats, and at times we get confused messages coming from those two parties, there seems to be a consistent message in their fight to resist Bill C-2, which I do not quite understand. One of the things they ask us is why the government does not support small businesses. This bill would do more to support Canada's small businesses than anything the previous Harper government did in its ten years. It would put that money back into the pockets of people. By doing that, people would be spend. We can ask small business owners, as I have done, as have many of my colleagues who have canvassed their constituents over the summer in a very real and tangible way. They will tell us that the best thing we can give a small business is not necessarily a tax break, but a consumer. Small business owners want people going into their stores, buying their products and consuming them.

Bill C-2 is all about that. It would give a significant amount of money to Canada's middle class. Ultimately it is not just talk; it was the first piece of legislation that the Prime Minister introduced to the House of Commons, and it was implemented on January 1. Not only did we want to give the middle class that tax break, we also wanted it to take effect as soon as possible. We saw that in the implementation of the government's policy. It was a substantial election platform promise made to Canadians. The Prime Minister and this government are materializing on that promise. We should recognize this valuable legislation. It reflects what Canadians want and is something on which the government is delivering.

Other criticisms on Bill C-2 have nothing to do with the bill. The New Democrats ask about those who make less than the threshold to get the tax break. It is important to recognize that over nine million Canadians will benefit by this tax break. The NDP refuses to acknowledge that this is step one of a number of steps. All my NDP friends need to look at is the Canada child benefit. Some of Canada's poorest families are getting significant increases in child support. We would have to look a long way back before we would see a government taking such a strong social commitment to lifting children out of poverty. Hundreds of thousands of children are being lifted out of poverty because of the Canada child tax benefit. That tax-free money is already being sent to families across this nation.

That is just one aspect to help those with low incomes who want to become part of Canada's middle class. What about the other most vulnerable, our seniors? Some of the most vulnerable seniors are easily identified through the guaranteed income supplement. We saw a significant increase in the last budget for seniors. I believe some of them will receive an additional $900 per year. If people are in a poverty situation and receive the GIS, that $900 is the equivalent of thousands of dollars to individuals making $100,000 per year. It is a significant increase for those vulnerable seniors. Through Bill C-2, they see a government that truly cares and is prepared to invest in Canada's middle class, but we have not forgotten about our most vulnerable such as children and seniors, in particular those who are on the guaranteed income supplement.

We have seen a redistribution of wealth that we have not seen in many decades. The bill is in part made possible because of a new tax for those Canadians making more than $200,000 taxable income per year. There is that expectation from this government. It is making our system that much fairer.

When we look at Bill C-2, I would like to think the commitment to that tax break is being fulfilled here.

I started off by saying that the Conservatives have lost touch. They can demonstrate that they are listening to Canadians by voting in favour of Bill C-2.

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September 19th, 2016 / 12:10 p.m.


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Conservative

Cathy McLeod Conservative Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC

Mr. Speaker, I clearly recall that when the Liberals were campaigning approximately a year ago they talked about the middle-class tax cut, but they never did define “middle class”. I know that the member opposite is in the tax bracket that would benefit most from this tax break, and I do not think that many Canadians would look at members of Parliament and say they are part of the middle class.

Therefore, I would ask the member this. Could he define “middle class”, and would he suggest that the members of this House are the ones who should be benefiting the most from this initiative, which is what the Liberals have done?

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September 19th, 2016 / 12:10 p.m.


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Liberal

Kevin Lamoureux Liberal Winnipeg North, MB

Mr. Speaker, if that is how the Conservative members want to justify voting against the legislation, they can do that. However, I would suggest that it is ill-advised.

The real benefactors of this tax break are teachers, firefighters, professionals, and factory workers. These individuals are part of Canada's middle class. They work very hard to build our society. That is the group that is receiving the greatest total benefit. If members want to nitpick, I am happy to do an overall assessment of who is benefiting, which is Canada's middle class and those who want to be able to participate in it.

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September 19th, 2016 / 12:10 p.m.


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NDP

Gord Johns NDP Courtenay—Alberni, BC

Mr. Speaker, we know that two-thirds of Canadians, 17.9 million Canadians, will not benefit from this Liberal tax break. In fact, those who work full time and earn $45,000 a year, which is $23 an hour or less, will get nothing.

The Liberals talk about lifting people who are not in the middle class and helping them join the middle class, but they have forgotten them with this tax break. They tell them that they will help and grow the middle class. The people who will benefit the most in this tax bill earn between $100,000 and $200,000 a year, or between $50 and $100 an hour. Even they do not think it is fair that those who earn $23 an hour or less get nothing.

I would like the member to tell us what the Liberal middle class is, because in Canada the median middle class is $31,000 a year. I know in his riding it is $24,000 a year. In my riding, it is $26,000 a year. The member likes to scold the Conservatives for being out of touch with Canadians and the middle class. Therefore, I would like to hear from the member, what is the Liberal middle class?

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September 19th, 2016 / 12:10 p.m.


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Liberal

Kevin Lamoureux Liberal Winnipeg North, MB

Mr. Speaker, if the member would read the legislation, he would get a very good sense of what the middle class is.

If the member wants to take the issue to the next election, whether in 2019 or whenever it might be, I would invite him to do that. I would like the members who vote against this bill to tell those individuals I pointed out, the teachers, the firefighters, the health care workers, the many different professionals, the factory workers, and hard-working middle-class members, that they voted against this bill because they wanted their own narrow perspective which does not encompass what the government is providing.

When the member makes reference to those who make less than $45,000, imagine those individuals making under $45,000 who have children, and the benefits they are getting under the new Canada child benefit program. The NDP conveniently forget that.

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September 19th, 2016 / 12:15 p.m.


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Liberal

Gary Anandasangaree Liberal Scarborough—Rouge Park, ON

Mr. Speaker, I want to thank my friend for outlining our government's priorities on how this bill will help the middle class.

During the summer, I met a lot of people in the constituency who received the Canada child benefit, tax free, for the first time. The difference it is making on individual lives is phenomenal.

I wonder if our member could outline the issues with respect to the TFSA. In many ways, the TFSA was short-sighted in terms of increasing the amount of tax-free growth within the TFSA. It will debilitate our future generations from getting the benefit of tax revenue. Therefore, could our member advise as to the changes, and how those will benefit the economy right away and ensure we have a long and steady stream of tax revenue so that future generations are not debilitated?

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September 19th, 2016 / 12:15 p.m.


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Liberal

Kevin Lamoureux Liberal Winnipeg North, MB

Mr. Speaker, when we looked at how we could deliver the most effective tax change that would assist Canada's middle class, it was determined that Bill C-2 would be the easiest and most effective way of putting money back into the pockets of Canada's middle class.

If we contrast that to the tax incentive that the Conservatives were talking about in terms of increasing it, there are two distinct approaches. I would argue that our approach is far more direct and that millions of Canadians will benefit by it, which is far greater than what was proposed by the previous government.

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September 19th, 2016 / 12:15 p.m.


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Labrador Newfoundland & Labrador

Liberal

Yvonne Jones LiberalParliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Indigenous and Northern Affairs

Mr. Speaker, it is a pleasure for me to speak to Bill C-2. I thank my colleague from Winnipeg North for sharing his time with me today.

Bill C-2 would amend the Income Tax Act. It falls in line with what the Liberal Party said during the election campaign and what the Prime Minister said in subsequent days. Bill C-2 would reduce the personal income tax of many Canadians and allow them to have more money in their pockets. It also introduces new marginal tax increases to people at higher taxable income levels. Why anyone in the House of Commons would not want to support that is beyond me. Bill C-2 would allow more money to be held by families who need it, families in the middle-class tax bracket.

Bill C-2 is a good piece of legislation. It is good because it will help many middle-class families, and many income earners who fall into this bracket, to move forward and do things in their lives that they have not been able to because they were in higher tax brackets, losing more of their money and not being able to catch up.

With Bill C-2, our government is allowing middle-class families and income earners to catch up. We are giving them the break they deserve, and this is what Canadians want. It was a large part of the platform of the Liberal Party of Canada in the election. Canadians had an opportunity to have their voices heard at the ballot box, and they chose to have reforms made to the income tax legislation that would allow the middle class in this country to move forward. That is exactly what we are doing.

We are making changes around direct income tax adjustments and allowing more income tax earners to be in a lesser tax bracket. Higher income earners will pay a little more, which we asked them to do in a friendly way and they agreed. We also introduced the child tax benefit in July of this year. This Liberal government initiative allows more families to gain more money in child care benefits that are tax free. They no longer have to incorporate these benefits as part of their income, which was required by the former government and gave them less money in their pocket.

Our government is making that child care benefit tax free. We are bringing more balance to the child care benefit to ensure that families who need that benefit to care for their children will actually get the benefit. This means that people in the higher income bracket will be eliminated from the child care benefit. They can take comfort in knowing that those with lower incomes who need the money to support their children in their initiatives, schooling, careers, and in their lives, will have a little extra money to do that. This is about bringing more fairness and balance to Canadians right across the country.

The other thing we have done to complement the changes we are proposing in the Income Tax Act, besides the child care benefit, is the increase in the guaranteed income supplement for single seniors. This was a huge issue in the election campaign from aging individuals in our country who felt they needed an increase in their supplement to allow them to support themselves, especially widows and widowers. We introduced that benefit, which is going to help them substantially.

We also made improvements to the employment insurance program. We expanded it to include regions that were the hardest hit in the country at the time, including Newfoundland and Labrador, the province in which I live, and also Alberta. These two provinces have been going through huge transitions.

In addition to the income tax breaks, the child care benefits, and the increase in the guaranteed income supplement, we provided a reprieve for workers who have found themselves unemployed. We were able to make changes to the employment insurance program to help them in a difficult time.

However, we also need to look at how we are investing in capital infrastructure, which complements the strategy of where the government is going in lifting up people in our country and ensuring there is a greater balance.

When we look around the country today, we see in the first year of our mandate that we have already been investing money in transit, transportation, housing, and infrastructure, which the country has needed for a very long time. This is not just an investment for today but ensuring economic prosperity for the regions in which we are investing this money. That in itself is creating new opportunity and new jobs for people in many regions of the country, and they are seeing the benefits very quickly. They are seeing it in their homes, their pockets, and in their communities. I think that is very important.

The changes we are making to the income tax legislation, as I said, will ensure that those people who were at a personal income tax rate of over $45,000 a year will drop from 22% taxation to 20.5%. We will also introduce a new personal marginal tax rate of 33%, which will be for those with taxable income in excess of $200,000 a year.

The opposition members are critical because they know that what we are doing is right. It is the right direction to take. They also know that what we are doing is benefiting families. They had the opportunity to do this but chose not to. They chose to distribute the investments of the country in a different way. They provided more income relief for wealthy income earners than they did for low and middle-class income earners. We have chosen a different route. Our route is creating a better balance for Canadians right across the country.

I represent a riding that falls in the middle income level. I define that middle income level as people who make $40,000 to $45,000 a year to $100,000 a year. They are the people who work in our factories, mines, hydro power projects, schools, hospitals, firefighting and policing services. These are the middle-class earners of Canada.

We are saying to them that we recognize that over the last 10 years they have been falling behind and that we are now going to allow them an opportunity to start catching up, be a stronger part of the middle class, and ensure that their families have that opportunity. We are doing it through our income tax reductions, child care benefit, guaranteed income supplement to seniors, and our investment infrastructure programs, which are helping communities, businesses, and Canadians right across the country.

I would suggest that there is no member of Parliament that has any reason or rationale not to support the changes we are proposing to allow middle-class families to have more money in their pockets.

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September 19th, 2016 / 12:25 p.m.


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Conservative

Cathy McLeod Conservative Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank the member for Labrador for her speech, but I think she neglected to tell Canadians one very important thing.

When the Liberals were on the campaign trail and first talked about this middle-class tax cut, they guaranteed that it would be revenue neutral, so that the money the rich paid would wash out in the wash. What the member has not told Canadians is that this will add to the deficit. It has been estimated by the parliamentary budget officer that it would be $8.9 billion over six years.

When the member was on the campaign trail, did she commit to her community that this would be a revenue neutral tax cut, because clearly it is not?

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September 19th, 2016 / 12:25 p.m.


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Liberal

Yvonne Jones Liberal Labrador, NL

Mr. Speaker, what we indicated to people on the campaign trail, and are still indicating to people today, is that the changes we are making in the income tax legislation will allow them to have more money in their pockets.

The former government catered to the wealthiest of the wealthy in our society. It did not reach out to lift up those in the middle class.

We recognize that, and it is exactly what we are doing. We have made changes in a number of pieces of legislation to accommodate this. We are making good on our commitment in the election campaign, and we are ensuring that middle-class Canadians are going to benefit.

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September 19th, 2016 / 12:25 p.m.


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NDP

Richard Cannings NDP South Okanagan—West Kootenay, BC

Mr. Speaker, I would like to pick up on the comment from the member for Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo. This tax cut will cost Canadian taxpayers as a whole $8.9 billion over the course of the next four or five years.

How can the Liberal government condone such an expense when it does not even help those who really need the help most? This may not be a tax cut for the super wealthy, but it is a tax cut for the upper middle class, if not the upper class itself. Those who make $45,000 a year, and there are many, almost 60% of Canadians, will be left out of this tax cut. They will be the ones who will end up paying that $8.9 billion.

I wonder how the government can condone such a tax cut in light of the current situation in our country.

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September 19th, 2016 / 12:25 p.m.


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Liberal

Yvonne Jones Liberal Labrador, NL

Mr. Speaker, first of all I think we need to realize that the tax cut the government is proposing today is not going to have a negative impact on anyone in society, other than those who may earn over $200,000 a year in income. That needs to be noted.

Maybe the New Democratic Party could tell us if it agrees with the approach in the legislation toward TFSAs. We will be reducing the contribution limit from $10,000 back to $5,500, simply because Canadians in the middle class and lower class were not able to take advantage of the TFSA. We see this as an opportunity for the government to save, not just today but in future generations of governance and taxation.

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September 19th, 2016 / 12:30 p.m.


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NDP

Don Davies NDP Vancouver Kingsway, BC

Mr. Speaker, it is a pleasure to rise in the House today to speak to this important bill and to welcome all members back to the House on the first day of the resumption of Parliament. I hope all of my colleagues had a good summer and are ready to get back to work on behalf of Canadians in all of our ridings.

Bill C-2 received first reading in the House on December 9, 2015, following the adoption of a ways and means motion. At that time the New Democratic Party voted in favour of Bill C-2 at second reading in order to be able to propose our amendments to make the bill progressive and actually conform to the rhetoric that accompanied it both during the election and in the House at that time.

Despite the support of various stakeholders, our amendments at committee were rejected. Therefore, we cannot support the bill at third reading as it currently stands and will be opposing the bill.

Bill C-2 amends certain provisions of the Income Tax Act, such as the tax credit for gifts, taxation on income splitting, the tax payable by a non-testamentary trust, the refundable tax on investment income, private corporations, the tax on assessable dividends, the limit on TFSAs or tax-free savings accounts, and most important, the tax rates Canadians pay on their income in this country.

The New Democrats stated our position on the two significant elements of Bill C-2: the amendment on the income tax rates and the amended TFSA limit. Our approach was careful and principled then, and it is careful and thoughtful now. Although we support the government's proposal to limit the TFSA contributions to $5,500, we cannot accept the amendments of the Liberal government to the tax rates, which will primarily benefit the wealthiest.

Let me put this in some context. After almost a decade of poor economic growth and misguided management by the previous Conservative government, working-class and middle-class Canadians and their families are working harder than ever, yet falling further behind. What Canada needs now is a government that will fight against this pattern and this direction, against growing inequalities. However, we find, when we analyze the provisions of the bill and the way the government is using tax rates, that the Liberals will do just the opposite.

The Liberals have continually said they have a plan to help Canadians, middle class and otherwise. They promised change: rapid, urgent, and positive change. However, since they came to power, the Liberals have largely ignored Canada's real middle class, and certainly, as I will show hon. members with numbers, they have absolutely ignored Canada's working class and low-income earners with the bill.

Bill C-2 should have been the Liberals' opportunity to move from rhetoric to action. Unfortunately, that is not what happened. The Liberals' tax plan gives nothing to 60% of Canadians. I listened carefully to my friend from Winnipeg on the other side, who invited us to take the bill to Canada's next election. When two-thirds of Canadians do not receive a red penny from these tax changes, and when they see that people earning more than $89,000 in this country receive the lion's share of these tax cuts while over 17 million Canadians do not receive a cent, I would be happy to take this into the election and debate my hon. friend on who the bill really benefits.

The government is proving every day to be one of celebrity, one of rhetoric, one of spin. Let us look at something surprising. Let us look at facts. Let us look at the numbers. The government is proposing to reduce the second personal income tax rate in this country from 22% to 20.5% and to increase the tax rate to those earning more than $200,000 from 29% to 33%.

This is how Canada's tax rates will look as a result of the bill. If people make $45,282 or less of taxable income, the current rate is 15% and the new rate would be 15%. They receive zero tax breaks from the bill. If people make between $45,282 and $90,563, the next bracket of taxable income, they get a tax cut of 1.5%. From $90,563 to $140,388, the tax rate is the same. From $140,388 to $200,000, the tax rate is the same. For more than $200,000, as I say, the tax rate would go from 29% to 33%.

An analysis of this Liberal tax plan reveals that it is in fact the wealthiest Canadians who will benefit the most from the tax reduction program. The Prime Minister's tax plan excludes Canadians who are not in the second income tax bracket, the large majority of Canadians who earn less than $45,000.

No one has to listen to me and we certainly should not listen to the spin doctors on the government side of the House, so let us see what the parliamentary budget officer says. The PBO's office said it is estimated that 17.9 million Canadians who will file income tax returns in 2016 fall within the first tax bracket. They have taxable income and will report taxable income of less than $45,282, and will, therefore, fall below the threshold set by the Liberals to benefit from any tax adjustment. Therefore, the Liberal tax proposal excludes the lowest 60% of wage earners, anybody making under $45,282.

According to the latest statistics available from Statistics Canada, the average Canadian income is $40,000, while the median income is $31,000. That means 50% of Canadians make $31,000 or less. Canadians in this country most in need, those whose incomes are equal to or less than the median or average incomes, will not benefit in any way from this Liberal plan. In fact, only people in the first, second, or third income deciles will see a drop in their taxes.

My hon. colleague on the other side of the House from Winnipeg North also mentioned that the best thing we can do for small businesses is to provide them with consumers. Every economist in the world will say that the people who spend the most of their disposable incomes are the working poor. They cannot afford to save. Every dollar given to a working poor Canadian is a dollar that will be circulated in the economy and spent at every business in our communities, yet the government has not given a penny to two-thirds of Canadians to spend in their communities or in small businesses. Why the government thinks that this proposal is going to stimulate small business, when two-thirds of Canadians will not have a penny in their pockets to spend in their communities or in small businesses, is beyond me.

Let us look at it the other way. Canadians whose income ranks in the highest 30% will be the main beneficiaries, while the wealthiest 10% of Canadians will pocket most of the money from these tax reductions. Even with the income tax increase for those earning more than $200,000, the Liberal plan still offers benefits that are three times higher for people earning $210,000 or more a year than for people earning $50,000.

An income tax reduction for the middle class should benefit a larger proportion of Canadians, in New Democrats' view. That is not the case with the bill. Full-time workers earning less than $23 an hour, which in my riding of Vancouver Kingsway is most people, will get no tax reduction, while those earning $100 an hour will get the maximum tax reduction. That is a funny middle-class tax plan from the Liberals.

Using numbers from the Government of Canada's job bank, let us turn again to another objective source that has illustrated who would benefit from these changes.

An office worker who has a median hourly rate of pay of $19 an hour would get zero from this tax plan. A hairdresser who has a median income of $13.25 an hour would get zero from this tax plan. A fish plant worker who averages $12.50 an hour in median income would get zero from this tax plan. A bank teller who averages $17.20 an hour in median income would get zero from this tax plan. A school bus driver who averages $20 an hour would get zero from the Liberals. A child care worker who makes $17.35 an hour in median income would get zero from the Liberals. The Prime Minister's nanny, who makes $18.20 an hour, would get zero from the Liberals. Even the Prime Minister's assistant chef, who makes $20 to $21.68 an hour, would get nothing from the Liberals.

Let us see who does get money from the Liberal tax plan. A lawyer who averages a median hourly income of $53.91 would get $679.22 courtesy of the Liberals.

A member of Parliament, who is hardly middle class when we make $170,000 a year base income, will receive $679.22. Let us stop and contrast that. A member of Parliament gets money back from the government, almost $700, and officer workers, child care workers, and school bus drivers get nothing.

That is the proposal from the Liberal government to make Canada's tax system fairer. I do not believe that any Canadian who hears those contrasts will agree that it makes our tax system any fairer.

Contrary to what the Liberals claimed during the election campaign, the revenues generated by the tax increase for the very wealthy will not be enough to finance their plan.

I notice that the Liberals consistently refuse to answer questions put by the Conservative opposition and the New Democrats to actually hold them accountable for the promise they made to Canadians during the election.

On this side of the House, at least, we believe that candidates ought to tell the truth to Canadians during elections. What the Liberals said to Canadians was that if they were elected, the tax cuts for the middle class would be revenue neutral and would be paid for by a tax increase for the wealthiest Canadians. They told Canadians that directly.

After the election, it turned out that the Liberals were out by billions of dollars. It has been estimated that some $7 billion of excess money will have to be borrowed to pay for the tax cut, because in fact, the Liberal math was wrong.

In terms of Vancouver Kingsway, I have done my homework. According to Statistics Canada figures from 2010, in my riding roughly 70% of individual income earners will see absolutely no benefit from this cut, because they do not report income over $45,282. In my riding, we have 25,635 people who reported income of over $45,000 and 58,480 who reported income of under $45,282. The median income in my riding of Vancouver Kingsway is $22,614, and the average income is $30,639.

I think my riding is typical of most members' ridings across this country. Let us forget the spin about the middle class and the spin by the Liberal government that everyone is going to do better. The numbers tell the truth, and that is that most Canadians will actually not see a dime from this tax proposal, but wealthy Canadians will.

I want to just turn to something that has not been mentioned, which is the gender impact. It is well known in this country that women, still in 2016, earn significantly less money than men do. It is well known in this country that women who work full time earn less than their male counterparts.

The numbers I found for Vancouver Kingsway bear that out. The median income for men in my riding is $25,532. It is $20,303 for women. It is a full $5,000 less. What that means is that this bill, which exacerbates the inequity between wealthy Canadians and poorer, working, and middle-class Canadians, is going to have a disproportionately bad impact on women.

I was at a conference a couple of days ago when the Prime Minister stood up and said, “Poverty is sexist.” That is true, but then his government, in this House, puts a bill in that will change the tax rates in this country that will disproportionately give advantages to men and disproportionately harm women because of the skewed nature of the tax changes.

I want to mention the changes to the TFSA contribution limit. On this, the NDP does agree with the government. The Conservatives wanted to raise the annual TFSA limit from $5,500 to $10,000. The Liberals, to their credit, campaigned against that during the election, and the New Democrats agreed with that. There are a number of reasons for that. The bottom line is basically that the TFSA, by increasing the amount of money individual Canadians can shelter from taxes, is a cost to the treasury. A cost to the treasury means that it takes revenue from the government needed to pay for much-needed programs that the New Democrats will fight for in this Parliament, like pharmacare, child care, and health care.

Moreover, it has been shown that because investors in our country can take already established investments and shift them to TFSAs, most people, by and large, putting money into TFSAs are not making new investments. They are simply shifting investments.

Finally, I do not know too many Canadians who have an extra $10,000 this year they can put into TFSAs.

I want to comment a bit about the New Democrats' plan and what we would do.

If we really want to make a difference in the country, we have to make an adjustment to the first tax rate. What the New Democrats proposed during the election, and what we suggest to this government, was that we would reduce the income tax rate for the first $45,282 of income from 15% to 14%. That way, 83% of taxpayers would see a change in the amount of tax payable. According to the parliamentary budget officer, nine million Canadians would benefit from this proposal who do not benefit from the proposal of the current government. This solution would not only benefit more taxpayers but the cost difference would be minimal. The difference, we would argue, could be easily recovered through a very slight half-percentage point increase in taxes for large corporations.

I would point out that the Liberals are indistinguishable from the Conservatives on this score. Canada already has an extremely low corporate tax rate of 15% for large, profitable corporations, and neither of those two parties proposes altering that at all. If we were to increase that by half a point, from 15% to 15.5%, for companies like the Royal Bank and Imperial Oil, large profitable companies that are making a lot of money in the country, we could actually put more money in the hands of working-class Canadians, who would then circulate that money in the economy and help stimulate small business, which, the New Democrats believe, deserve a corporate tax cut. That is not what the Liberals and Conservatives believe, though.

David Macdonald at the Canadian Centre for Policy Alternatives, Nicolas Zorn of l'Institut du Nouveau Monde, Stephen Gordon, an economics professor at Laval University, and Luc Godbout, professor and holder of the research chair on taxation and public finance at the University of Sherbrooke, are all absolutely ad idem on this issue. They have all crunched the numbers, and they all say the same thing: this amendment to Canada's tax laws would benefit the wealthy, would do nothing for the poorest Canadians, and is bad economic policy.

The New Democrats will stand in the House and continue to fight against this bad policy and fight for the millions of Canadians who deserve some tax relief and support from the government, as opposed to spin and rhetoric from a government that is more interested in celebrity and style than in actually helping the millions of Canadians from coast to coast to coast who are suffering in this economy.

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September 19th, 2016 / 12:45 p.m.


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Winnipeg North Manitoba

Liberal

Kevin Lamoureux LiberalParliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons

Mr. Speaker, I believe the member is not doing himself or his party a favour in the way he portrays the legislation or the Government of Canada's agenda. The budget came forward and Bill C-2 came forward. Bill C-2 specifically deals with a tax cut, between the brackets of $45,000 and $90,000, from 22% to 20.5%. It would also implement a tax increase, for those who make over $200,000, from 29% to 33%. What we are going to be voting on is that aspect.

The member wanted to focus on the fact that the Government of Canada has left out others. We see in the budget the Canada child benefit, which helps most of the individuals he says the Liberal government has fallen short on. His facts are just not correct, when we look at the budget combined with the legislation. The issue is whether the member supports the middle class getting a tax decrease and those making more than $200,000 an increase. That is the essence.

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September 19th, 2016 / 12:50 p.m.


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NDP

Don Davies NDP Vancouver Kingsway, BC

Mr. Speaker, it is funny. My hon. colleague seems to think that every person in Canada has a child and a family. They do not, do they? Pointing out this incredible inequity in the change of tax rates by saying “We have given Canadians a child tax credit” does nothing for low-income Canadians who do not have children. I take it that my friend would probably agree with that.

I guess what he is saying is that low-income Canadians with no children get nothing, but wealthy Canadians will benefit from this Liberal government. That is skewed logic.

I want to quote the parliamentary budget officer, who said directly that benefits of this tax cut will skew to higher-income, higher-wealth households.

David Macdonald from the Canadian Centre for Policy Alternatives, using data from Statistics Canada, demonstrated that middle-class families earning between $48,000 and $62,000 would gain only $51 a year, while families earning between $166,000 and $211,000 would receive $813.

My friend can keep saying the words “middle class, middle class, middle class”, but what the numbers tell us is that middle-class Canadians, whether they make $48,000, $62,000, or less than $45,000, will see hardly any money from this, but people who make $150,000 plus will. That is not the New Democrats' definition of “middle class”.

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September 19th, 2016 / 12:50 p.m.


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Conservative

Cathy McLeod Conservative Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC

Mr. Speaker, I would like to go back to something that both the member and I have alluded to. On the campaign trail a year ago, we remember hearing the commitment from the Liberals on the tax cut they were going to provide. They very clearly said that it was going to be revenue neutral. We now know that there is a big “oops” in that calculation.

I wonder if he could talk a bit about the math behind it and who, ultimately, is going to actually have to cover this tax reduction.

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September 19th, 2016 / 12:50 p.m.


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NDP

Don Davies NDP Vancouver Kingsway, BC

Mr. Speaker, that is an excellent question from my hon. colleague. She is absolutely right. I may be old-fashioned, but I come from the school of thought that says that candidates, during an election, should tell the truth to the people they want to get votes from. I also think it is very important to create integrity in the system so that when people vote for a certain party, they can actually expect that the politicians will be true to their word.

The Liberals directly told Canadians during the election that their middle-class tax cut, as much as we can still call it “middle class”, which I think is not really accurate, would be paid for by a tax increase for the wealthiest Canadians. They were out by only a billion dollars, I think, and over the years many more billions of dollars. The problem with that is that when we are deficit financing, the government is effectively borrowing money to give to wealthy Canadians that Canadians of all income levels will have to pay for.

This was not just a one-off mistake. The Prime Minister also said during the election that we would have three modest $10-billion deficits, and he would balance the budget in the fourth year. With the very first budget tabled by the government, we have a $30-billion deficit, six more years of deficits, and no plan to balance the budget whatsoever.

They did not bring in 25,000 refugees by the end of the year. They did not bring in 25,000 government-assisted refugees. They are not restoring mail delivery to homes in Canada. I could go on and on with the broken promises of the government, but we have a whole session to do that.

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September 19th, 2016 / 12:50 p.m.


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NDP

Alistair MacGregor NDP Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC

Mr. Speaker, I read an interesting opinion piece in the paper a couple of days ago by Robin Sears. He said that one of the great facts of Canadian political life is that Liberals “always break progressive hearts”.

I did not come to this House to give myself a tax break, yet this bill is going to give me and everyone in this chamber $679. That is not the middle class I was sent here to represent. It is not the middle class I came to fight for.

Our friend across the way from Winnipeg North likes to keep talking about the child benefit. Yes, it pays out a maximum of $6,400. What he neglects to tell this House is that child care costs in British Columbia are double that, and there is a lack of affordable spaces.

I know my friend from Vancouver Kingsway is a great member of Parliament for his region, and I know that he has received feedback on this and many other Liberal bills. I would love to hear some of the feedback he has received from his constituents on the wrong direction the Liberal government is taking.

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September 19th, 2016 / 12:55 p.m.


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NDP

Don Davies NDP Vancouver Kingsway, BC

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank my hon. colleague, who is doing an outstanding job for his constituents on Vancouver Island, for that question, because it allows me to raise the very critical issue of child care.

The Liberals, in previous governments, promised Canadians a national child care plan. In fact, I have often, in this House, heard Liberals blame the New Democrats for the Liberals not bringing in a national child care plan. How that is the case when they had 13 years of majority governments to do so is beyond me, but I have heard that.

Here we are. The Liberal government is a majority government. I challenge the Liberal government to actually bring in a national child care plan that makes sure that every single parent in this country can drop off his or her children at a quality, accessible, affordable child care. Let us see if the government can produce that instead of bragging about throwing money at families that is not sufficient for them to actually take care of their children.

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September 19th, 2016 / 12:55 p.m.


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Conservative

Cathy McLeod Conservative Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC

Mr. Speaker, it is a pleasure to be back in the House. I hope everyone took the time this summer to reconnect with their constituents to find out what was happening in their ridings. I also hope they took a bit of time to enjoy our very short summers in Canada.

It is interesting that we are back here today debating Bill C-2. I noted an article yesterday in which it said that the Liberal government had the most unproductive Parliament in two decades in what it had managed to move forward with. Perhaps Bill C-2 is an example.

Bill C-2 was introduced in December of last year and we are now at third reading. That really illustrates the Liberals' inability to move what they say are important pieces of legislation through the House. However, I would rather have no legislation than bad legislation, which Bill C-2 is.

Because it has been so long, as a quick refresher, Bill C-2 contains a number of measures such as the change in the marginal tax rate, the TFSA reduction in limit, and of course some other things. There are general clean-up measures dealing with such things as charitable donation tax credits and income earned by trust, among others. Clearly what we will hear from the debate is that those clean-up measures are relatively uncontroversial. Really the issues around the marginal tax rate and the TFSAs are the most problematic.

Again today the debate has predominantly focused so far on the Liberals proudly proclaiming that their middle-class tax cut was a significant move forward. However, the Liberals really forgot to tell Canadians two very important things. One is that they never have clearly defined the middle class. I think most Canadians, as they listen to this, might be thinking that as the middle class, members of Parliament will see $700 where people who earn $23 an hour will see nothing.

I will be sharing my time, Mr. Speaker, with the member for Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke.

We have a very poorly defined middle class, and I do not think many of us would really call members of Parliament middle class who are deserving of the biggest tax cut. As Conservatives, we certainly support tax cuts in whatever form, but the bigger problem is that tax cut and what it would actually do. The government had a big oops in its math. The Liberals went to Canadians and said they were going to give this tax cut and that it was going to be revenue neutral because they were going to increase taxes for higher income earners. That was the commitment and the promise the Liberals made to Canadians. Lo and behold, they are in government and it is “wow, we've made a really big math error in that particular calculation”. That is an $8.9 billion error that will be over six years. The mistake the Liberals have made is over $1 billion a year.

We also had a commitment that they would have a $10 billion deficit. It has gone to $30 billion now. This is just one of the measures that has added to the deficit that will create problems into the future.

This is not a promise kept. This is a promise that has been broken to Canadians because it is not revenue neutral. It has been said in the past that debt is deferred taxes. For the $600 or $700 to someone who earns $160,000 a year, their children and grandchildren will have to pay. To be quite frank, the government is irresponsible to put that kind of debt and deficit on our children and grandchildren when it is not necessary. It is quite shameful.

The other piece I want to focus some comments on is the tax-free savings account. There really is no justification for the way the Liberals have structured their marginal tax reduction. They have reduced the ability to contribute to a tax-free savings account from $10,000 down to $5,000 plus a bit of change.

Let me talk about what the tax-free savings account is all about. This is from a Department of Finance document that looks at tax expenditures and evaluations.

It states:

Ensuring that the tax system provides meaningful incentives to save supports a more efficient allocation between current and future consumption. In particular, the accumulation of personal savings allows Canadians to improve their living standards and better align income and consumption when planning for important life events such as retirement [or purchasing a house]....[It is] increasing the funds available for capital investment, which leads to a higher capacity to produce goods and services.

The evidence from the program shows that Canadians have taken advantage of these tax-saving opportunities. It is a popular means of saving for Canadians of all ages. I would commend to anyone who is interested in the TFSA and its impact. This is an excellent document, and it certainly talks about the benefits.

What is the Liberals' argument with respect to why they had to reduce the tax-free savings account? They said that it was only benefiting the rich, that not everyone could put money into it and therefore it was not a good thing to do.

There are 440,000 GIS recipients who have put $4.3 billion into their tax-free savings accounts. That gives us a really good example. I think anyone could imagine that living on old age security and the guaranteed income supplement is a challenge for any senior. However, let us say that there are seniors who have a house but really no major means of support. They then sell their houses and have tiny nest eggs that they can put into their tax-free savings accounts and have the interest that they make to support them during their retirement and very difficult times. Having that allocation is a very important mechanism for seniors putting a little from the sale of a house into a GIS, or young people in Vancouver or Toronto. Right now we know how difficult it is for young people to get into the housing market. Therefore, it is a real step backward and a real shame to see the measures the government has taken in that area.

The Liberals do not like allowing us the personal freedom to make choices about our own money. They want to enforce an increase in the Canada pension plan, which will not only enforce increased contributions from individuals but also employers. They like a plan that the government controls. For some reason they are adversely opposed to plans that Canadians control. Perhaps if people do not want to put extra money into the CPP, they see the TFSA as an opportunity to put money into their savings. Therefore, there is not a one size fits all.

I am very concerned that the government is showing a massive predisposition toward spending taxpayer money that it does not have, deficits, debt, and creating a one-size-fits-all government-run program that is not good for meeting the needs of Canadians in all of their diversities.

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September 19th, 2016 / 1:05 p.m.


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Winnipeg North Manitoba

Liberal

Kevin Lamoureux LiberalParliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons

Mr. Speaker, there is a natural question that should be asked when a Conservative member speaks to a tax-reducing legislation. We need to make it very clear that Bill C-2 does give tax relief to millions of Canadians. Traditionally, I would have thought the Conservatives would have supported a tax cut. The core of Bill C-2 is just that: a tax cut to Canada's hard-working middle class and those aspiring to be a part of the middle class.

Therefore, as a member of the Conservative Party, does she not believe she should be supporting tax cuts? I would have thought that would be a given. How does she justify to her constituents that she does not support them getting a tax break?

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September 19th, 2016 / 1:05 p.m.


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Conservative

Cathy McLeod Conservative Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC

Mr. Speaker, that is a good point. We do support tax cuts in many forms, but we also put a high priority on a balanced budget. Again, debt is deferred taxes. Liberals are taking a tax cut now and moving it to future generations. Our government worked very hard to see Canada through the global recession and get back to balanced budgets. The Liberal government spent $8 billion over the summer on gazebos and assorted items. It has miscalculated the money the tax cut would cost. Liberals have a huge spending problem and we need to be very concerned.

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September 19th, 2016 / 1:05 p.m.


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NDP

François Choquette NDP Drummond, QC

Mr. Speaker, I am happy to be taking part in this debate because I am worried about the working class. People work so hard, but, unfortunately, they still have trouble making ends meet.

The Liberal government is not really doing more for the middle class. Canadians earning $31,000 per year, the median income, will not benefit from this tax cut, which is really for those earning between $89,000 and $200,000 per year. The people who are having the toughest time making ends meet are not the ones who are going to benefit the most from this tax cut.

It is sad to see this kind of measure from the Liberal government after it promised to work for the middle class and those who need it most. That is not what it is doing. We were also told the plan would be revenue neutral, but, unfortunately, revenue will drop.

Who will once again end up paying for this poor fiscal management?

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September 19th, 2016 / 1:05 p.m.


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Conservative

Cathy McLeod Conservative Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC

Mr. Speaker, it is not very often that we agree with the NDP, but my colleague has some excellent questions. We talked earlier about the math problem the Liberals had with the execution of their middle-class tax cut being $8.9 billion, over a billion dollars a year of math problems. They also have a definition problem. They have never been able to clearly articulate what the middle class is and why they are defining and giving the biggest benefit to those making between $100,000 and $200,000 a year. I am sure most Canadians if asked if that were the middle class would clearly say this is not what they expected in tax cuts and in revenue neutral.

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September 19th, 2016 / 1:10 p.m.


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Conservative

Cheryl Gallant Conservative Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke, ON

Mr. Speaker, my colleague clearly articulated how the Liberals are back to using gun registry math, where we had a $2 million gun registry balloon to $1 billion. That is a debate for another day seeing as how they are bringing that one back.

I would like my colleague to tell us how the reduction of the TFSA maximum amount from $10,000 per year to $5,500 a year is working against the middle class.

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September 19th, 2016 / 1:10 p.m.


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Conservative

Cathy McLeod Conservative Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC

Mr. Speaker, the Department of Finance has an excellent report on the uptake of Canadians and how the TFSA has been a very important vehicle for them. Again, whether it is for young people perhaps who want to save for their first home, whether it is people in the middle class who are looking to save toward retirement, the argument that because they cannot put $10,000 a year in is not a good argument. There are some years where people can put in $10,000. To have that limit has been a very important vehicle for all.

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September 19th, 2016 / 1:10 p.m.


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Conservative

Cheryl Gallant Conservative Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke, ON

Mr. Speaker, as the member of Parliament for Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke, I thank the electors of my constituency for this opportunity to represent their interests in the affairs of this nation.

Today we will talk about paying for bad spending, like this legislation, Bill C-2. It is one of the reasons Canada has gone from having a budgetary surplus to having a huge requirement to raise taxes.

The legislation we have before us today is the result of election campaign promises. These measures could easily have been incorporated into the federal budget, but for whatever reason of political expediency that motivates the government, we are dealing with budget measures, but not from the March budget.

Some election promises are made to be broken. Unfortunately for Canadians, the election promises that were broken were the wrong ones, starting with a decision to triple the deficit from $10 billion to $30 billion in each of the government's first three years, with no plan to get Canada out of deficit. Deficits are nothing more than deferred taxes.

The Prime Minister went across the country during the campaign saying, we'll take the money from rich and we'll give it to the middle class for income tax cuts, and don't worry, it will not come out of the Treasury. It will be a revenue-neutral bill. The Prime Minister repeatedly and directly stated that he would introduce a $3 billion tax cut for the middle class, paid for by a $3 billion increase on high-income earners. The fact of the matter is that, as usual, the Liberals got their numbers completely wrong. There is no such thing as a revenue-neutral Liberal tax cut.

Now Canadians understand why the measures in the legislation before us today were sliced out of where they should have been, in the March 22 federal budget. That is because someone's tax cut on the one hand must be paid by someone else on the other hand, Canadians now realize that the title of the budget document was misnamed. It should really have read, “Paying for Bad Spending”.

By the Minister of Finance's own admission, when he is not in denial of the fact that our Conservative government left the nation's finances in a budgetary surplus, there will be a revenue shortfall of almost $2 billion from the measures contained in this legislation. Where will that money come from to pay for this campaign promise? It has to come from existing revenues, or the government will create an even larger tax increase requirement.

Starting April 1, the federal government is spending $444.4 million to hire a new army of tax collectors to go after average Canadians, with a five-year quota of $2.6 billion. For anyone who cannot afford to hire an expensive accountant or lawyer to defend themselves, or who has so much money that they can afford to use overseas tax shelters, the Liberal government will spend $351.6 million with a five-year collection quota of $7.4 billion to collect so-called tax debt. In round numbers, it will be spending almost $800 million in total to squeeze $10 billion more out of the pockets of Canadians.

The CBC tells us that Montreal-based clothing maker Gildan earned $396 million in profit last year, but paid just over $6 million in taxes, a rate of about 2%. Drug maker Valeant, based in nearby Laval, Quebec, booked $1.1 billion in profit in 2014 but paid only $110 million in tax.

If the plan was to go after companies that use overseas tax shelters to avoid paying their fair share of tax, Canadians would support that. However, rather than paying for the tax changes in Bill C-2 by going after the large corporations that make extensive use of lawyers, accountants, and tax shelters, the Liberal government has targeted campgrounds—not any campgrounds, just the small mom and pop campgrounds that are typically family owned and operated.

The Liberal government even mentioned a number, five employees, on page 220 of the budget, implying that a campground with fewer than five full-time employees is a tax planning scheme. This is the arbitrary Liberal threshold to be considered a small business. Forget that many of these small campgrounds consist of a husband and wife doing all the work, or that the short camping season in Canada is only a season. Someone has to pay for the Liberal campaign promises.

This is what the executive director of a camping organization in Ontario had to say:

Campgrounds are active, labour-intensive recreational businesses that provide an affordable vacationing option for Canadian families and international visitors.

These recent Canada Revenue assessments not only put these small, mostly family-owned businesses at risk, but also sends a terrible signal to the entire industry just days before the 2016 camping season is about to begin....

The Canadian Federation of Independent Business has stated that “Requiring five staff to qualify for the small business tax rate is deeply insulting to the entrepreneurs who are often a part of the daily operations of their businesses. It's called the small business tax rate. Being too small should not be a reason to exclude anyone.” It is called paying for bad spending.

The Minister of Finance in his opening remarks regarding Bill C-2 stated the government consulted widely before introducing the measures in his legislation. He claimed to have asked Canadians directly how the government could support them and grow the economy. The Minister of Finance even claimed to have met people from all walks of life, including small business owners. He obviously skipped meeting with any small business entrepreneurs who operate family campgrounds.

As much as I know that the government likes to say it consults Canadians, here are a few comments from average Canadians on how they feel about the federal government going after small family-owned campgrounds to pay for its wild spending.

If a company with fewer than five employees is not a small company, then what is, besides campgrounds that are still reeling from having to charge property tax on seasonal trailers? Surely the CRA must have bigger fish to fry.

There is this comment: “I am not running a passive small business. I am running a business. One that I work seven days a week. My campground is host to campers from Germany, Holland, France, Switzerland and darn near every state and province in North America. Passive I am not. I am however the owner of a small business and I resent that you suggest otherwise in order to rob me or any campground of more tax dollars. I do not believe that small family-run businesses should pay more tax than billion-dollar corporate businesses. I, along with my family, have camped most of my life and I'd like to continue doing so.”

As tax collection targets of the Liberal government, imagine the shock of family campground owners when they receive collection letters telling them they no longer are considered small businesses and owe tens of thousands of dollars in reassessed taxes. A campground owner in southwestern Ontario recently received a collection letter stating that he owed $250,000 in reassessed taxes. Another campground owner received a notice of assessment for 2013-14 showing that $36,000 more in taxes was due, plus $250 per month in interest charges alone. Campgrounds will be closing. This move to go after small businesses like family campgrounds is not unexpected.

The second campaign promise to be broken by the Liberal government after breaking the first by blowing the deficit sky-high was to renege on its promise to lower the small business tax rate. The Prime Minister demonstrated his contempt for small business by claiming that small businesses were nothing more than tax scams. He believes they are set up as a way to avoid paying taxes. That comment is an insult to the husband and wife team who work 60- to 70-hour weeks to manage a family campground during the short summer camping season. Camping is family time, getting kids off video games and out into nature and the great outdoors. The last affordable family vacation will now be taken away from Canadians.

Since I brought this change in taxation policy to the attention of the people who would be the most adversely affected by it, I am pleased to recognize the many individual campground owners, as well as the many municipalities, who have expressed their support for any action taken to rescind this unfair taxation.

We are supposed to be more active. What better way to be healthy than spending the day outdoors? Campgrounds are an escape for people who live in urban areas. Not everyone can afford a cottage. These businesses need to be recognized for what they are: small family run businesses. Small business is the backbone of our nation. Canada was built on appreciation for the great outdoors. The government should stop over-taxing and allow our kids to enjoy themselves in nature.

It is truly unfortunate that the first budget of the new regime should be so wrong for Canada. I urge the Liberal Party to really think about the harm it is doing to Canada with its policy of high deficits and raising taxes.

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September 19th, 2016 / 1:20 p.m.


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Winnipeg North Manitoba

Liberal

Kevin Lamoureux LiberalParliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons

Mr. Speaker, my question continues from my previous one, which the member responded to by talking about deficits. The member seems to be convinced that the Liberal government intends to have nothing but deficits when in fact the reality is that when the Conservatives took office, they inherited a healthy multi-billion surplus, and then ran deficits in every year since 2009. Until today the Harper government had a deficit, so it deferred.

Why does the member now believe that a deficit is bad when the Harper government itself created a $160 billion plus deficit? It does not make sense.

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September 19th, 2016 / 1:20 p.m.


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Conservative

Cheryl Gallant Conservative Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke, ON

Mr. Speaker, again, the Liberals are in denial. Our government left this country with a surplus at election time.

Because the Liberals like to consult so much, on climate change for example, and load up the meetings with their Liberal riding association members, is that another way to funnel money now? It used to be foundations during the Chrétien and Martin years, but now it is these organizations run by their electoral district associations. However, because they like to consult, I am going to provide more consultation from our campground owners.

One them says, “I have grown up with my parents running a family campground, run by my parents alone, with the occasional help of my sister and I. There is no 'one size fits all' but in our area, campgrounds are not investment opportunities, but instead a way for many families to make a living by offering those outside of the area a small piece of heaven.”

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September 19th, 2016 / 1:20 p.m.


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NDP

Gord Johns NDP Courtenay—Alberni, BC

Mr. Speaker, earlier today we heard from the member for Winnipeg North. He accused the Conservatives of being completely out of touch with the middle class. The member expressed the opinion that the Conservatives did not do enough to tackle inequality during their term in government.

When we look at the tax break that is being proposed, we know that those who earn $45,000 or less will get nothing, and those who earn between $100,000 and $200,000 will get the most. We know that even those who are earning between $100,000 and $200,000 need a break. Housing prices are going through the roof. However, Canadians are fair, and I do not think we will find a Canadian who earns between $100,000 and $200,000 who thinks it is fair that they will get a tax break and someone who earns less than $45,000 will get nothing.

Does the member think that the middle-class tax break being proposed by the Liberals is fair? Would she support the New Democrats' call to include the bottom tax bracket in the Liberal middle-class tax break, or scrap it altogether and do something more productive like create a national child care plan?

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September 19th, 2016 / 1:25 p.m.


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Conservative

Cheryl Gallant Conservative Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke, ON

Mr. Speaker, clearly the Conservative Party represents the taxpayers. We have to fight for tax cuts and against tax increases. One of those increases is the small business tax credit. The Liberals, instead of lowering the amount that we had in mind and pledged to do during the election, did not. That really amounts to a tax increase.

I want to share another comment from another campground:

...I support small family run campgrounds. Regardless of how many people they employ, the surrounding municipalities benefit greatly from all the campers they draw in from other areas to contribute to our local businesses and attractions. Many of the people hired to work at the campgrounds are returning college and university students who rely on these summer jobs to pay for their education.

They, as my colleague said, are in the lower-income bracket and need the work.

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September 19th, 2016 / 1:25 p.m.


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Conservative

Dianne Lynn Watts Conservative South Surrey—White Rock, BC

Mr. Speaker, I will be splitting my time with the member for Saskatoon—Grasswood. I rise in the House today to speak to Bill C-2, an act to amend the Income Tax Act.

This legislation slashes the contribution limit for the tax-free savings account from $10,000 to $5,500. The rationale behind this cut, as we have heard many times from the Prime Minister, the Minister of Finance, and other ministers is that the tax-free savings account is only for wealthy Canadians, and no one has an extra $10,000 just lying around.

This rationale could not be further from the truth. Seniors are saving for their retirements, students are saving to pay for their educations, new parents are saving for their children, and young entrepreneurs are saving to start a business.

In my riding of South Surrey—White Rock, it is the seniors who will be hit the hardest by the legislation. Constituents in my riding overwhelmingly do not support this change. A report from the parliamentary budget officer back in 2015 stated that middle-income earners and Canadian seniors were benefiting the most from the tax-free savings account. This report also stated that raising the limit to $10,000 would benefit middle-income earners and seniors even more in the long term. This is exactly what the Conservative government did. We raised the limit to $10,000 to benefit seniors and the middle class.

However, I hear from the Liberal government that the tax-free savings account, again, only benefits the rich and therefore needs to be cut in half. It is the same thing with small business. We heard from the Liberal government that small business is only a tax haven for the rich. I cannot help but wonder where and how it is getting its information, because it is contrary to the parliamentary budget officer, contrary to experts in the banking industry, and frankly contrary to plain old common sense.

Let us talk about the so-called tax cut for the middle class. Again, we heard over and over again that the tax cut, which is also included in this bill, would be revenue neutral and would not cost Canadians anything. This statement is simply not true. The finance minister has since amended his comments and stated that his plan is not revenue neutral, and in fact it will cost Canadian taxpayers at least $1 billion. However, in a report from the parliamentary budget officer, it is stated that the figure is $1.7 billion.

Now we have gone from revenue neutral to costing the taxpayers $1.7 billion. However, it gets even better for taxpayers and those who are losing their jobs. The Liberal government told taxpayers that for a tiny deficit of $10 billion, infrastructure projects would be built and the economy would flourish. Again, that is not true.

From a balanced budget with a $1-billion surplus, the condition that we left our finances in, as stated numerous times by the parliamentary budget officer, the Liberal government burned through the $1 billion, racked up a $30-billion deficit, and we are still waiting for the infrastructure projects.

The Liberals have decreased the ability for seniors, middle-class families, and students to save, and increased the debt burden on every Canadian through reckless spending, as well as removing the tax credits for post-secondary tuition, school textbooks, and for sports and arts programs for children. They also increased the contributions to the CPP, and $6.7 billion has been spent or committed overseas. Just today, the Prime Minister announced over $450 million to the UN. That raises the total to over $7.1 billion.

Further to that, recently announced by the Prime Minister, an eight-month-old Asian infrastructure investment bank initiated by the Chinese government will see approximately 2.9 billion of Canadian taxpayer dollars for infrastructure built in Asia. It is important to note that all of these figures are only what is publicly being pledged. As we know, not all government spending is announced publicly.

There is only one question to ask: what tax increases will the Liberal government implement in order to pay off the debt? It will have to be paid off. I remind the government that there is only one taxpayer and it is not their money.

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September 19th, 2016 / 1:30 p.m.


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Winnipeg North Manitoba

Liberal

Kevin Lamoureux LiberalParliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons

Mr. Speaker, we talk about being out of touch with real Canadians and we see that demonstrated by yet another Conservative speaker.

On the one hand, the member is saying that seniors are going to be most negatively affected by this government, when in fact the most vulnerable of seniors, the ones receiving the guaranteed income supplement, are seeing a larger increase than the Harper government ever gave to seniors. If she was in touch with the seniors in her community and if Conservatives listened to what their communities were saying, they would hear that the Government of Canada is in fact addressing many of the needs of our seniors.

The member made reference again to the deficit. Does she not realize that the Conservative Harper government had over $160 billion, more than the Chrétien and Martin governments. Only the Chrétien and Martin governments had balanced budgets.

Is she listening to her constituents?

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September 19th, 2016 / 1:30 p.m.


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Conservative

Dianne Lynn Watts Conservative South Surrey—White Rock, BC

Mr. Speaker, as my colleague well knows, there was a global recession and Canada fared extremely well as it went through that.

Also, the GIS absolutely helps seniors, but why give with one hand and take away with the other hand?

When we look at how financially prudent the Conservative government was and how our banking system was set up, Canada fared better and were at the top of most countries around the world. I think there needs to be more acknowledgement of the actual facts.

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September 19th, 2016 / 1:30 p.m.


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NDP

Richard Cannings NDP South Okanagan—West Kootenay, BC

Mr. Speaker, I want to bring it back to the fact that the NDP and the Conservatives seem to be agreeing on at least one thing in this debate, and that is the concern around the fact that this tax break we are hearing of is not revenue neutral and will create an $8.9-billion deficit that will have to be paid back by all Canadians. The tax break we are hearing about is going to benefit wealthier Canadians.

The member's colleague who spoke previously mentioned the fact that there are many large profitable Canadian corporations that are getting off very lightly in terms of taxes. Canada has some of the smallest corporate income taxes in the world. I wonder if the member would comment on the NDP proposal to raise those corporate income taxes by 0.5%, which would help cover this shortfall and help real middle-class Canadians in their tax savings.

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September 19th, 2016 / 1:35 p.m.


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Conservative

Dianne Lynn Watts Conservative South Surrey—White Rock, BC

Mr. Speaker, I think they need to go back to the drawing board. The Liberals have taken away tax credits for kids and added additional CPP contributions. They are all over the map on a number of things. There has to be a broad plan outlining exactly what it looks like, how much is being spent, how much is being borrowed, what the income is, and a plan to pay it back. It needs to be looked at broadly by people who actually know what they are doing.

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September 19th, 2016 / 1:35 p.m.


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Liberal

Kevin Lamoureux Liberal Winnipeg North, MB

Mr. Speaker, my colleague just reminded me about first responders and how important it is that we recognize that when we talk about the middle class we are talking about factory shop workers, police, health care workers, and many different professions both in the private and public sectors. They all would benefit. Actually, they have benefited because this bill took effect in January of this year so they are all getting more money in their pockets.

Why would she oppose putting more money in the pockets of the types of individuals I just listed?

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September 19th, 2016 / 1:35 p.m.


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Conservative

Dianne Lynn Watts Conservative South Surrey—White Rock, BC

Mr. Speaker, I guess the point is this. All of us support our first responders and all of us want to ensure they are well supported and well paid in the jobs they do. However, the Liberals' so-called tax cut would benefit everybody over $100,000. Again, they have to look at it with some critical thinking and through a lens that makes sense, and certainly this does not make sense.

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September 19th, 2016 / 1:35 p.m.


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Conservative

Kevin Waugh Conservative Saskatoon—Grasswood, SK

Mr. Speaker, it gives me a great opportunity today to speak to Bill C-2. Spend, spend, spend is what the government has as its agenda, and spend it did. In the last 94 days since we last sat in the House, the government has given out roughly $8 billion. Canadians from coast to coast to coast are realizing that the government's agenda will send our country into massive debt. Debt comes with a cost, and it appears that the well educated and those with high-paying jobs will pay the brunt of these budget announcements.

A poll released earlier this month shows that nearly half of all Canadians are draining their bank accounts between each two-week pay period. Many are adding to their debt levels, which as we know are very dangerous. There are four in ten Canadians who say that they spend it all between pay periods, so even a small increase in interest rates would spell disaster for many Canadians families. We have enjoyed record levels of low interest rates, but sooner or later they will go up. We are obviously not prepared for this. Live and spend for today, but tomorrow brings paybacks, and governments should always be aware of that.

We have talked long and hard about not spending our children's and grandchildren's future in this place, so then why are we doing it? We should be reminded about the economic policies of the Liberal government some 30 years ago, which increased taxes, debt, and bailouts. It took subsequent governments 30 years to recover from that reckless spending. Why is the current government repeating the same policies? It took a generation to recover from that.

To look back in history, it was our previous government that restored the pay increase to the middle class by an average of $5,000 per year. Those living in Ontario appear to be far more pessimistic than the rest of the country as a whole. We should not be surprised about that, because it too is a Liberal government, and like the one in Ottawa, Liberals love to spend, spend, spend. Taxes will eventually have to be paid for down the road.

It has been an especially dark summer in my province of Saskatchewan. We have had many layoffs, shutdowns, and takeovers in the headlines of our major newspapers in the province. Mitsubishi Hitachi Power Systems laid off 150 Saskatoon employees in July. The company later said it is going to close the plant permanently and sell off all of the assets. In July, workers at Mosaic's Colonsay potash mine were told that the entire mine would be shut down until January 3, 2017. The company said it hoped to call back workers, but there is no guarantee. In late July, I drove by that mine in Colonsay, once hosting well over 200 to 300 stalls for parking, and there were five vehicles in the parking lot. It has affected the entire area, as businesses surrounding the Colonsay mine have been hit hard with the shutdown. Many were forced to cut hours or lay off staff.

The entire potash industry in this country is nervous, with the possible merger of Potash Corp. and Agrium that was announced earlier this month. Vecima, another company in Saskatoon, announced massive layoffs in July. The decline in the construction industry has hit our province especially hard. The largest decline in construction employment was in the Saskatoon metropolitan area where the employment for three months ending in August was 3,200 lower than it was the year before.

There were 42,000 unemployed in the province of Saskatchewan during August. That is an increase of 3,400 from the month before, and 5,200 more than the number of unemployed in August of 2015. EI recipients jumped 19% alone in the month of June.

Doug Elliott, who is the publisher of Sask Trends Monitor, said that people were unable to find work and simply stopped looking entirely. Let us think about this. The incentive to work among the current unemployment ranks is lost in our country.

Now we hear that the government will move forward on its carbon tax. Like it or not, we are going to have a carbon tax in our country. There was no agreement at all from the Vancouver meetings that were held in March, and we actually missed the September 2 deadline. Now, like it or not, we are going to have a carbon tax, because we were promised one. What happened to the collaboration that was promised by the government almost a year ago?

Employers are feeling the pressure in oil and gas producing provinces like mine in Saskatchewan, along with Alberta, and Newfoundland and Labrador. The budget did nothing to improve their situation at all. Once considered the backbone of Canadian economy, these provinces were left to fend for themselves with the current federal Liberal government.

I might add, changes coming to the CPP would add more cost to businesses at a time when they are scrambling in this weak economy, yet the federal government shows no mercy for business and the middle class. According to a new Ipsos survey conducted on behalf of the Canadian Federation of Independent Business, eight of ten people want the government to consult with the public before going ahead with its CPP expansion plans. Therefore, if the CPP reforms mean that businesses freeze or even cut wages, employees will simply oppose these reforms. Working Canadians do not support changes to the CPP if it has the consequence of freezing or even diminishing their salaries at all. This makes sense, since we all know Canadians are feeling the pinch in this economy right now.

Today the Minister of Finance confirmed that the economy will create 1,050 fewer jobs per year over 10 years than would have been the case without the higher premiums. Changes to the Income Tax Act were, and continue to be, a major concern for entrepreneurs and professionals coast to coast. These are the people who are driving our economy. We know that our previous current government left the current government with a surplus. In the last 94 days alone, the federal Liberal government has gone through nearly $8 billion of announcements, plus the $1.3 billion spent outside of our country.

Our previous Conservative government believed that people needed to save for the future. The popular TFSAs were there for emergencies. This was visionary, as it promoted families to save for the future. In times of uncertainty, like right now, they could withdraw from those TFSAs. In times of prosperity, they could save for the future. By saving now, it would take the burden off the federal government in future years. It could be used to redirect the money to other needed programs.

This summer, I knocked on hundreds of doors in my riding of Saskatoon—Grasswood, and we did a number of barbecues. I was constantly told by people how disappointed they are in the Liberal government. Many professionals said they would simply cut back their hours. Instead of serving the public like they do now for six and seven days a week, they will cut back their hours to three or four days a week. The incentive is gone, and that will make us all pay dearly in the end.

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September 19th, 2016 / 1:45 p.m.


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Cape Breton—Canso Nova Scotia

Liberal

Rodger Cuzner LiberalParliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Employment

Mr. Speaker, it is great to see you back in the chair and to see all the friendly faces back in the confines. I am happy to be back.

I am more than happy to help the member with his history lesson as he takes us down memory lane from deficits past. If we are going to reach back, I think we should reach all the way back.

Let us go back to 1984, when the Conservatives led by the Prime Minister Mulroney took over and inherited a national debt of $120 billion. By the time he left in 1993, the national debt had gone up to $560 billion. Enter Jean Chrétien and Paul Martin in 1993, who were able to take on the tough questions, balance the books, and have successive surplus budgets. They brought the national debt down to $460 billion.

In came another Conservative government, and where did we end up? We ended up with $612 billion of accrued national debt under the Conservatives.

I think we have to be fair with Canadians. Successive Conservative governments have collected this huge amount of national debt and the Liberals have come in try to fix the mess they were left with. I think that is probably where we are now. We are going to give relief to many Canadians and we are going to attack the deficit.

Does he not agree that again it is left to the Liberals to mop up the mess?

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September 19th, 2016 / 1:45 p.m.


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Conservative

Kevin Waugh Conservative Saskatoon—Grasswood, SK

Mr. Speaker, first, they did not promise a $30-billion deficit in their term; they promised a $10-billion deficit. Now we know that they are three times over that.

However, if we look back at governments, let us look to the North American trade agreement that was brought in by a Conservative prime minister. My province has prospered because of that trade agreement. We can look back to 2008-09, where the Province of Ontario, because of the Conservative government at the time, was saved. We had a massive world crisis on our hands in 2008-09, as members know, and it was our government that saved the automobile industry.

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September 19th, 2016 / 1:50 p.m.


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Conservative

Garnett Genuis Conservative Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB

Mr. Speaker, I appreciate the excellent speech by my friend in terms of our fiscal situation.

However, hearing the ridiculousness coming from the other side makes one's head spin. They completely ignore the existence of the financial crisis, and they forget that it was their party that every step of the way said we should be spending more. We made timely, targeted, and temporary investments in the economy, and it was their side, every step of the way, that said we should spend more. Now that they are in government, they are spending far more. They eliminated the balanced budget that we had, and now they are somehow presenting themselves as fiscal savers.

Would my friend please correct the record in terms of what was said about that?

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September 19th, 2016 / 1:50 p.m.


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Conservative

Kevin Waugh Conservative Saskatoon—Grasswood, SK

Mr. Speaker, I am going to point out that in the last 94 days since we last sat in this place, $8 billion has been pushed out by the Liberal government. How are the Liberals going to balance that? They agreed on a $10-billion deficit. We know by the announcement alone that in three months or less they have blown this thing right out. Canadians are not fooled by this. We all spent the summer door-knocking, having barbecues, and talking to our constituents. They know that Bill C-2 will not survive.

Income Tax ActGovernment Orders

September 19th, 2016 / 1:50 p.m.


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Conservative

Michelle Rempel Conservative Calgary Nose Hill, AB

Mr. Speaker, it is wonderful to be back in the House of Commons, and it is wonderful to hear my colleague, the member for Cape Breton—Canso, long for the days of finance minister Paul Martin. It takes a lot for a blue-blooded Calgary Conservative like me to actually long for the days of finance minister Paul Martin, because this particular Liberal government is so far to the left of that.

The member for Cape Breton—Canso talks about history. I think he is longing for days long past because the Liberal government is actually making the leader of the NDP happy in his demands.

I wonder if my colleague would talk about the great irony of a Liberal government putting forward and talking about the merits of a balanced budget when it is mortgaging generations of Canadians' futures with this particular budget.

Income Tax ActGovernment Orders

September 19th, 2016 / 1:50 p.m.


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Conservative

Kevin Waugh Conservative Saskatoon—Grasswood, SK

Mr. Speaker, it is interesting that we have seen the economy turn in three provinces: Alberta, Saskatchewan, and Newfoundland. We have seen little or no response from the federal Liberal government. We know these three provinces carried Canada for decades. Because of the oil and gas situation, they are hurting right now and they are far from getting help from the government.

Income Tax ActGovernment Orders

September 19th, 2016 / 1:50 p.m.


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Conservative

Tom Lukiwski Conservative Moose Jaw—Lake Centre—Lanigan, SK

Mr. Speaker, it is good to be back, good to see you back in the chair, and good to see all of my colleagues here as well. I have limited time before we have to adjourn this debate so I will make my comments as brief as possible.

However, I have to at the outset correct the record again for my colleague, my friend from Cape Breton—Canso, who tried to imply that during the time of the previous government we recklessly ran up deficits and added to the national debt indiscriminately. Of course that is not true. We did so for one very good reason. We did it grudgingly but it was necessary to spend money, particularly on infrastructure projects, during the time of the worldwide global recession.

Every country in the G20 agreed to that plan. We did so grudgingly, as I mentioned, but the one thing that stays with me, and my colleague and my friend who was opposite at the time would have to agree to this, is this. As we were preparing our budgets and as we were preparing to spend $50 billion or $60 billion on infrastructure projects to try to stimulate the economy, the complaints the member opposite and his colleagues in the Liberal benches had were that we were not spending enough. They and their colleagues in the NDP were on record day after day saying that we had to spend more. Now, the Liberals have the audacity to stand in their place and complain about the debt. This is typical Liberal hypocrisy. It is doublespeak. The Liberals have always in their terms of office spent first and tried to correct the record later. That is simply not the way we have done things when we were in government.

What is even more troubling to me is the fact that the Liberal government, beyond trying to be a revisionist history party, is reversing many of the initiatives we brought forward that are so incredibly popular and beneficial to Canadians.

I take for an example the TFSA. The tax-free savings account is the most important tax-saving initiative that we have seen in the country since the advent of the RRSP. It allowed Canadians to put after-tax money into an account where that money could accumulate tax free and then to withdraw the money tax free. It was unbelievably popular with Canadians. We had at the outset $5,000 as a limit that Canadians could contribute to this account. We later increased that to $10,000 and then to $10,500. However, when the Liberals came to power, they said they would roll back the contribution limits to $5,000. Their rationale was that the ordinary Canadian could not afford to put $10,000 a year into an account so they ratcheted it back.

I just have one question. When has it become a bad thing to allow Canadians to save more money tax free? When has that become a bad thing? Apparently it has because the government says it is. Tens of millions of Canadians have maxed out on their TFSA contributions each and every year. Tens of millions more were looking forward to putting more money into a TFSA so they could withdraw the money when they wanted, to spend it on what they wished.

However, the government of course knows better than Canadians. The Liberals said sorry, that people could not put that money into a tax-free savings account because they wanted it to spend it. That is the tax-and-spend philosophy of the Liberals and it is something that most Canadians eventually, and hopefully sooner rather than later, will come to understand and realize once again that there is only one party in this place that truly protects the interests of the taxpayers, and that is the Conservative Party of Canada.

Income Tax ActGovernment Orders

September 19th, 2016 / 1:55 p.m.


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The Deputy Speaker Bruce Stanton

Is the House ready for the question?

Income Tax ActGovernment Orders

September 19th, 2016 / 1:55 p.m.


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Some hon. members

Question.

Income Tax ActGovernment Orders

September 19th, 2016 / 1:55 p.m.


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The Deputy Speaker Bruce Stanton

The question is on the motion. Is it the pleasure of the House to adopt the motion?

Income Tax ActGovernment Orders

September 19th, 2016 / 1:55 p.m.


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Some hon. members

Agreed.

No.

Income Tax ActGovernment Orders

September 19th, 2016 / 1:55 p.m.


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The Deputy Speaker Bruce Stanton

All those in favour of the motion will please say yea.

Income Tax ActGovernment Orders

September 19th, 2016 / 1:55 p.m.


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Some hon. members

Yea.

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September 19th, 2016 / 1:55 p.m.


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The Deputy Speaker Bruce Stanton

All those opposed will please say nay.

Income Tax ActGovernment Orders

September 19th, 2016 / 1:55 p.m.


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Some hon. members

Nay.

Income Tax ActGovernment Orders

September 19th, 2016 / 1:55 p.m.


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The Deputy Speaker Bruce Stanton

In my opinion the yeas have it.

And five or more members having risen:

Income Tax ActGovernment Orders

September 19th, 2016 / 1:55 p.m.


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Liberal

Andrew Leslie Liberal Orléans, ON

Mr. Speaker, I ask that the vote be deferred to the end of the time provided for government orders tomorrow, Tuesday, September 20.

Income Tax ActGovernment Orders

September 19th, 2016 / 1:55 p.m.


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The Deputy Speaker Bruce Stanton

Accordingly the deferred recorded division will be deferred until tomorrow, September 20, at the end of government orders.

Income Tax ActRoutine Proceedings

September 20th, 2016 / 10:10 a.m.


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Liberal

Andrew Leslie Liberal Orléans, ON

Mr. Speaker, if you seek it, I believe you will find consent for the following motion:

That, notwithstanding any Standing Order or usual practice of the house, the recorded division on the third reading of Bill C-2, An Act to amend the Income Tax Act, deferred to the expiry of Government Orders later this day be deferred until the expiry of Oral Questions today.

Income Tax ActRoutine Proceedings

September 20th, 2016 / 10:10 a.m.


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The Speaker Geoff Regan

Does the hon. member have the unanimous consent of the House to propose the motion.

Income Tax ActRoutine Proceedings

September 20th, 2016 / 10:10 a.m.


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Some hon. members

Agreed.

Income Tax ActRoutine Proceedings

September 20th, 2016 / 10:10 a.m.


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The Speaker Geoff Regan

The House has heard the terms of the motion. Is it the pleasure of the House to adopt the motion?

Income Tax ActRoutine Proceedings

September 20th, 2016 / 10:10 a.m.


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Some hon. members

Agreed.

Income Tax ActRoutine Proceedings

September 20th, 2016 / 10:10 a.m.


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The Speaker Geoff Regan

(Motion agreed to)