Evidence of meeting #112 for Agriculture and Agri-Food in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was family.
A recording is available from Parliament.
9:30 a.m.
Liberal
Jean-Claude Poissant Liberal La Prairie, QC
Okay.
We also often hear about the distance that has developed over time between the rural community and the urban community. Some provinces have initiatives to reduce that distance.
I would like you to talk to us about initiatives the government could introduce.
9:30 a.m.
Associate Professor, Department of Sociology, University of Regina
It's a very good question. I'm not sure I have a ready answer for it, but I would certainly concur that the farmers I interview often speak about feelings of being underappreciated—they feel there is a stigma associated with agriculture—so this is certainly contributory to the stress that they feel. Overwhelmingly, the stressors I hear pertain to uncertainty—financial and environmental uncertainty—but I agree that there is sometimes a stigma attached to farmers. Many farmers I talk to say that they're known as “dumb farmers”.
9:30 a.m.
Bev Shipley Lambton—Kent—Middlesex, CPC
Thank you very much.
I appreciate the witnesses for coming.
Mr. Guest, thank you for being here and putting a real person and a face on this issue.
A number of years ago, two young students were working at a local business. They produced concrete form products. At the end of the day, one of them had to go in and clean out the turner. One of the safety switches malfunctioned. His best friend went by and touched a switch that should not have activated the drum, but it did. To your comments about the effects, that young person who accidentally touched the switch—which of course should not have activated the drum—suffered severe mental injuries even though he was not at fault.
That becomes part of what you're talking about. I think it was so important. These are mostly around family events, when there is an accident. I appreciate very much that you talked about walking alongside and giving people hope, because this is really what this is all about from my perspective. Thank you for that.
As my colleague has said, we need to look at how we can help those. These are on-the-ground organizations that will mean as much or more to that family than many of the higher integrated organizations might. It's like the person from Quebec, where they drop in. They're on the road. We'll be talking later about the mobile units from Saskatchewan.
Thank you. I really don't have a question, other than to say that.
T.J., thank you. For those of us who are in the business, to have one of my colleagues come forward....
We've been through it. I remember back to the 1980s. Dr. Fletcher, in some ways there hasn't been much change. There really hasn't. I go back to the 1980s. The change was 23% interest, not 4% or 6% interest, but the multiplier is still the same.
One of the issues in my area is that there's no recognition, other than often condemnation of what we do. This may be a bit like T.J. I'm sorry; I may not have a lot of questions, but maybe we can learn some things. We have one of the most advanced industries in this world, folks. When we get condemned by activists.... I have mink breeders. Their issue is not the market. Their issue is not the weather. Their issue is the people out on the road who are cutting the fence to get into their farms to let the animals loose, that they will die. The breeders' concern in that case is the security and safety of their family.
There is the issue around research. On the weekend I took a young intern to one of my farms that has beef and greenhouses. He's now taken that kernel of corn that used to grow and feed beef cattle to an ethanol plant. He takes the distillers back home to feed to his beef cattle. He's now taken the CO2, which by the way is not a pollutant. It's a fertilizer. That narrative has now asserted a change in terms of climate change about pollutants instead of CO2. He takes that heat and the CO2, and is now growing tomatoes. That is the type of research.
The condemnation is of what we are doing. People say, “We don't like what you're doing to these animals. You're not transporting them properly.” I meet with pork producers. When their trucks are on the road, they're being harassed by individuals at lights. Those are where the real stressors come from, not the everyday work.
I was in dairy. We have cash crop, and right now we're dealing with vomitoxin in corn. We're dealing with wet weather. Those are issues we can deal with, though. It's the external issues on top that discredit everything we're doing.
You know, in terms of the environment, the condemnation to us here is that we're not doing anything. The issue is that we're one of the best countries in the world. The agriculture industry is one of the best carbon sinks in the world. What we need to be focusing on is helping to train those other countries that are the major polluters, and quit condemning our manufacturers and our farmers for what they think we're not doing.
Ms. Fletcher, I would just ask you this. Would you agree that the technology and research and genetics that we now have continue to be of benefit to not only our industry but to the environment in which we live?
9:35 a.m.
Associate Professor, Department of Sociology, University of Regina
I guess I would respond by asking in what way you are referring to genetics. Are you referring to animal genetics, crop genetics—
9:35 a.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Pat Finnigan
Thank you, Mr. Shipley.
Mr. Longfield, you have five minutes, basically.
9:35 a.m.
Liberal
Lloyd Longfield Liberal Guelph, ON
Thanks, Mr. Chair.
Thank you so much for all your presentations this morning.
To the Canadian Farmers with Disabilities Registry, you mention on your website assistance on suicide prevention. I've been on your website and I've seen that you have connections to Farm Credit Canada. They were a previous witness on this study.
Mr. Guest, you mentioned that you used to have funding. It looks like that funding used to come through Growing Forward 2, possibly for project funding. On your website, at least, there was an indication of Growing Forward 2 funding. It seems as though funding is one of the big question marks. There is a safety association on Pembina Highway in Winnipeg—I know Winnipeg well, so I know where you're located—but it's not part of the government. You're relying on some funding from the government to keep it going.
Could one of you talk about the challenge of the organization in terms of funding?
9:40 a.m.
Canadian Farmers with Disabilities Registry
The Pembina organization that you're referring to is the Canadian Agricultural Safety Association. That organization is separate from the Canadian Farmers with Disabilities Registry. They have a contribution agreement with the federal government that provides them with funding, but at this time the Canadian Farmers with Disabilities Registry does not have an agreement in place for them to access funding.
9:40 a.m.
Liberal
Lloyd Longfield Liberal Guelph, ON
The two organizations are indeed separate, but the registry does some work with CASA?
9:40 a.m.
Canadian Farmers with Disabilities Registry
They have in the past. That was through prevention activities and safety awareness. However, now there isn't funding available to provide assistance for the peer-to-peer support, which is the primary role of the organization—to assist farmers.
9:40 a.m.
Liberal
Lloyd Longfield Liberal Guelph, ON
Mental health should fall under safety in some way or another. Again, maybe that's just a statement. Funding is a question in terms of our study, and recommendations coming forward in terms of providing adequate funding from the federal government to help support the registry. I'm extending that into safety in general.
9:40 a.m.
Canadian Farmers with Disabilities Registry
Yes, and there is funding available for the safety side. Currently, there isn't funding available for the peer-to-peer support and the mental health side.
9:40 a.m.
Liberal
Lloyd Longfield Liberal Guelph, ON
Okay. Thank you.
In terms of peer-to-peer support, CTV News Regina mentioned that the University of Regina has a free e-counselling service that they have been providing since 2010 across the province. Nearly half of the clients are coming from rural Saskatchewan, so there is some type of e-counselling service available through the university. I'm not sure whether that connects to your research or not.
My question is about that e-counselling. We had a previous study on broadband on the farm and on whether we have the right technology support to get to the farms in Saskatchewan or across the Prairies. Is this something the university does on an ongoing basis, and is that sustainable?
9:40 a.m.
Prof. Nicholas Carleton
Dr. Heather Hadjistavropoulos is the PI who oversees the online therapy unit project. That's the Saskatchewan e-therapy opportunity that you're speaking about. I believe there was some renewed funding from the provincial government that came to support that. I don't know the size and scope of it, off the top of my head.
9:40 a.m.
Liberal
Lloyd Longfield Liberal Guelph, ON
Thank you.
Dr. Fletcher, something very interesting to me was the social intervention of climate change. We see the political argument that carbon taxes are bad. They're increasing the prices on the farm, but at the same time the problem of climate change is providing a stressor as well.
How do we look at those two stressors?
On one hand, we have to try to eliminate the effects of climate change, and we need to do that economically to get into the right effectiveness. On the other hand, the economics hurt the farmer. Could you make a comment on that, please, in the 20 seconds we have left?
9:40 a.m.
Associate Professor, Department of Sociology, University of Regina
I'm not an expert in mitigation strategies, so I can't speak to carbon taxes.
However, one thing to keep in mind is the cause of the emissions. I think it's important to remember that individual farmers.... Even as a collective, the agriculture industry contributes only about 10% to 13% of emissions.
We need to look at the polluters.
9:40 a.m.
Liberal
Lloyd Longfield Liberal Guelph, ON
Yes. Putting a price on pollution is where we're heading, as well.
Thank you.
9:40 a.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Pat Finnigan
Thank you, Mr. Longfield.
This, unfortunately, is all the time we have.
I want to thank Dr. Carleton, Dr. Fletcher, and also Mr. Guest and Mr. Johnson.
As you saw, on this committee there are quite a few farmers. I'm a farmer myself, and there are other farmers here. We really understand, and it's also a chance for us to talk about our personal experience. I think it's great that we have such diversity.
I forgot to mention Mr. Baylis. You're so quiet. Welcome to our committee.
We're going to break and change the panel. We'll be back in two minutes.
Thank you.
9:50 a.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Pat Finnigan
We'll get going with our second hour on our study of mental health as it applies to farmers and ranchers.
With us today by video conference, we have, from the Centre for Addiction and Mental Health, Dr. Katy Kamkar, clinical psychologist and director, Badge for Life Canada. From Mobile Crisis Services, we have John McFadyen, executive director.
Welcome. We'll start with a seven-minute opening statement.
Do you want to start, Mr. McFadyen?
October 23rd, 2018 / 9:50 a.m.
John McFadyen Executive Director, Mobile Crisis Services
Thank you.
In 1989, the Ministry of Agriculture recognized the range of issues faced by farmers and rural families and the potential benefits to farmers and rural families in Saskatchewan of having a specific phone line to assist. The farm stress line was initiated and funded, resourced, by the Saskatchewan Ministry of Agriculture and the agriculture knowledge centre in Moose Jaw, Saskatchewan. Crisis counselling and referrals were provided.
In 2012, the farm stress line was contracted to Mobile Crisis Services and it provides a 1-800 number to farmers and rural families to access confidential telephone crisis counselling support, information and referral. This change provided 24-7 access along with proven expertise in crisis counselling services.
Crisis intervention is immediate and short-term psychological care aimed at assisting individuals in crisis situations and restoring equilibrium back to their lives. The farm stress line can address any self-identified crisis, whether it's a mental health issue, stress, depression, suicide ideation, family conflict, teen-parent conflicts, seniors' deteriorating health, abuse and neglect, relationships, parenting, addictions, gambling, alcohol, drugs and substance abuse, or even custody, child abuse, neglect and youth in crisis, whether it's bullying relationships with peers and parents or financial issues.
What can individuals expect when they call the farm stress line? The farm stress line can help the individual or those concerned about an individual. The hardest part is the decision to pick up the phone and make the call. Crisis workers will listen to what's worrying you, they will help you tell your story, they will help you prioritize the issues you have identified, and they will get you to provide information about your current situation, your past situations, your current and past supports and whether those are family, friends or professionals. They will assess what has worked well and what hasn't. They will help you determine what needs to be addressed and what can wait. They will help you to determine what you have control over and those issues you have no control over. They will help you problem-solve and identify alternatives.
Since June of 2017, mental health and farm stress have become a conversation that is more acceptable in the Saskatchewan farming community. Unfortunately, this was sparked by the suicide of a farmer in June of 2017. Conversations were initiated by Do More Agriculture Foundation, Bridges Health and the farm stress line. Organizers of agriculture forums in Regina, Saskatoon, Weyburn and Yorkton provide panels of experts to talk about mental health and farming. Organizations that worked with and for farmers, like Farm Credit Canada and APAS, also promoted this conversation.
At a Christmas gathering, my brother-in-law told me that he did not realize how much stress he had been under until he retired from farming.
We all have mental health, and our mental health is good when our thoughts are positive, our relationships are good and our emotions are stable. Our mental health is not good when our thoughts are negative, our emotions are unpredictable and our relationships are stressed. Stress impairs our ability to think and problem-solve and distracts us while we manage our day-to-day tasks. Stress can come from equipment breakdowns, weather, crop decisions, finances, physical health issues or issues with farm support workers.
Stress can also come from domestic issues with a spouse, children, extended family, illness in the family, accidents or a traumatic event like the death of a family member. When farmers are distracted and stress levels get too high, farmers are more likely to make poor farming decisions and be involved in farm accidents.
Over the past four years, since Mobile Crisis Services took over, there have been approximately 220 to 320 calls per year coming in on the farm stress line. Calls range from individuals calling in about issues that they're having with succession planning and the stress of making those decisions, and how that's impacting them with regard to sleeping patterns. A wife called in concerned about her husband who was unresponsive, worried about dementia. An unknown female called in stating that earlier she was not feeling safe and intended to take all her sleeping pills. She was currently under pressure due to decisions around the rental of a section of land, and relationship issues with a current and ex-partner. An unknown male called in who was struggling with anxiety and depression on an ongoing basis, which was made more difficult with the pressures around what to do with his will and succession planning. There was a grandmother who had her grandchildren visiting for the weekend, and a child was scared to return back home.
Here are some challenges and recommendations. Some of the challenges are the lack of awareness of the services available, the stigma of asking for help, providing access to services for those in rural Saskatchewan—
9:55 a.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Pat Finnigan
Mr. McFadyen, I'm sorry. We're out of time, but you'll have a chance to answer questions as we go.
Dr. Kamkar, you have seven minutes.