Canadian Heritage Committee on May 28th, 2026

[Bernard Généreux, Conservative, Côte-du-Sud—Rivière-du-Loup—Kataskomiq—Témiscouata, QC]

Mr. Kearney, how do you react to that answer?

In your statement earlier, you talked about the threat to the country's cultural security. You said that the threat is ever-present, particularly in Quebec where you operate, of course, because of Live Nation and Evenko. You have a presence in the regions; you represent regional festivals. Could you also tell me whether the region of Montreal is one you represent? I imagine that you also represent festivals in Montreal.

How do you react to Ms. Benjamin's answer? We are seeing the industry in Canada becoming more and more Americanized, if that's the right word. That's what you meant when you alluded to cultural sovereignty, isn't it?

[Patrick Kearney]

Yes, we do represent thirty or so festivals in and around Montreal. We have a presence there, it's a region for us.

I don't quite agree with Ms. Benjamin. I actually think a group like Live Nation can play a role.

First, we don't have to support it financially. But for a good number of the major festivals, the group can apply for grants. Our governments are asking us to consume locally, but, at the same time, they are funding an American company. I find that it makes no sense at all.

The funding for Live Nation has an impact on the share of the pie for others. I was talking about this earlier. Canadian Heritage does not have unlimited amounts of money. If you give a lot to the major players, the minor ones get less. It's quite the game.

I have a really hard time understanding why we are funding an organization that is extremely profitable and powerful.

Let me share a fun fact. When Taylor Swift came to Toronto, it cost less to buy a plane ticket to go and see her in Germany than to see her in Toronto, because the tickets cost so much. It's another example of the effect that company has. Clearly, when you are paying $3,000 to see Taylor Swift in concert, you are not going to see as many shows in Quebec and Canada.

So, yes, our sector is becoming Americanized.

[Bernard Généreux, Conservative, Côte-du-Sud—Rivière-du-Loup—Kataskomiq—Témiscouata, QC]

Ms. Benjamin, until very recently, you were heavily involved in the Canadian Live Music Association. Does English Canada have these problems? Do you think that it's reasonable to pay $900, $1,000, $2,000 or $3,000 to go and see Taylor Swift or anyone else in concert in Toronto?

[Erin Benjamin]

I don't know if we want to have this supply and demand conversation today, but there's a reality when one million people want 500,000 tickets. We see this every time we have international shows.

Do I think it's okay? No. Do I think it's capitalism in action? Absolutely. I don't like paying $1.95 at the gas pump. I broke my iPhone. I'm going to need a new one, and it's going to cost a lot. This is the world we live in.

If we want to be intentional about how we address these things, again, we need to unpack policy. We do this in other sectors. We do this in defence. We do it in tech. To a certain extent, we do it in health care and education. We need to do it in entertainment and creative and cultural industries to understand the opportunities they represent. If we have all these people willing to....

I don't disagree with my colleagues in Quebec at all. We have finite dollars for culture, but there's a reality. My 18-year-old daughter saw Taylor Swift, and I paid for it. I can tell you that it was expensive, but she wanted to see that. I am helping her to understand other types of shows that she'll enjoy, and she does consume music of all kinds in all sizes of rooms. The reality is that this will always exist.

What is our opportunity? Our opportunity is to look at where the gaps are. Smaller venues work in a different market context. How can we address that? How can we help them stabilize and grow? How can we help Canadians and people coming to Canada to consume our culture and understand the range of opportunities?

It can't be big versus little. Otherwise, we don't have the balance that I feel is fundamental to the success of the ecosystem or Canadian artists in the Canadian economy.

[The Chair, Liberal, Lisa Hepfner]

Thank you.

Ms. Hirtle, you now have the floor for five minutes.

[Alana Hirtle, Liberal, Cumberland—Colchester, NS]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Good morning, everyone. It's nice to see you all here. Thank you for being here.

I am in a rural Nova Scotian community, and we have a very active small theatre here.

I'm going to ask my first questions of Ms. Brewin.

Here in northern Nova Scotia, we have a lot of indigenous-led arts and culture happening. I'm wondering, based on your experiences, how you would say indigenous-led arts and culture spaces and programming contribute to reconciliation and cultural revitalization.

[Jennifer Brewin]

I think it's critical, primary and effective. I think that because it's fun to watch. We just recently had a festival called the spring thaw festival, and we worked with Gordon Tootoosis's theatre company out of Saskatoon. They came down to Regina, because Regina doesn't have the same kind of indigenous theatre community as Saskatoon.

What was so striking to us was how grateful they were to be able to come into a space. I don't want to use the word “grateful” around hosting and being guests and hosts. We were both at once all the time. What we heard was that it was so great that they didn't have to do anything. They could come in and read their scripts. They could work on their stand-up comedy. They could have conversations. They could just walk into the space and do what they did well. That energy radiated out to the community, and people started saying, “I want to have that conversation with you guys, too.”

For us, reconciliation is a lot about finding the worlds where settlers and indigenous and non-indigenous people meet. Comedy is a place where we do it, and that's one of the critical parts. We're watching as it happens in different areas.

For us, what we're recognizing is that, on reserve, the kids are into music, visual art and dance, but they're not so much into theatre. That tells me that there's no theatre program per se; it's a multidisciplinary area. The more agency we can provide or offer up so that we're not dictating the kind of work they want to do, but we have a space in which they can access whatever they want, such as our sound booth to create music....

Also, 85% of our audience is non-indigenous. Ten years ago, when we put on a play by an indigenous artist, no one came to it. Now they sell out. It's becoming a third space where people are sorting out that conversation among communities and among different cultural and ethnic spaces. We're watching stories happen on stage around what it's been like for conversations to happen.

I'm inspired by it all the time. It's not easy. We're always learning. We're always open to it, but it's a pretty critical place for some big ideas to take off and flourish.

[Alana Hirtle, Liberal, Cumberland—Colchester, NS]

That's amazing. Thank you for that.

Perhaps Ms. Benjamin can also chime in on this. I'm wondering about the challenges faced by rural, northern and remote communities, as an offshoot of that question.

[Erin Benjamin]

Thank you. It's such an important question.

I spent 13 years living in northern Ontario as an artist, and I have direct experience. I spent many years on the board, actually, of the East Coast Music Association. I was from away, but I somehow ended up on that board. I certainly spent a lot of time in different parts of eastern Canada and as a touring artist playing in very small communities across the land.

Organizations like the Canada Council for the Arts, when we're talking about the non-profit side of things, have a deep understanding of this and attempt to approach effectively some of the very unique, specialized needs of live music spaces in rural parts of Canada, but we need to go further in terms of connectivity. The cost of touring is exponential. You're less likely to attract artists because of the cost of getting to smaller places. Typically, we may see smaller budgets in smaller rural places as well.

It's a great opportunity, when we're thinking about the modernization of cultural policy, to understand those unique aspects and to consult with folks—artists, venues and festivals—on both the not-for-profit and commercial sides of that spectrum to understand those challenges and integrate their perspectives into future policy.

[Alana Hirtle, Liberal, Cumberland—Colchester, NS]

That's my time, unfortunately. Thank you, ladies.

[The Chair, Liberal, Lisa Hepfner]

That's perfect.

Mr. Champoux, the floor is yours for two and a half minutes.

[Martin Champoux, Bloc, Drummond, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Mr. Kearney, let's pick up where we left off. We were talking about the explosion of ticket prices for shows and about access to culture in large urban centres. How do you describe the impact that may have on regional festivals? Do you see a change in the number or the type of the customers at regional festivals?

[Patrick Kearney]

The advantage of festivals is that they are still very affordable. The cost of a ticket is not at all high for a 20‑year‑old, and he can see a wide range of artists. That's the significant advantage of festivals.

As we were saying earlier, increased costs affect festivals too, of course. So organizers will sometimes make the difficult decision to reduce their programming. That's something we notice.

We also know that artists are not selling cassettes, CDs or records any more now. So the performance venues are becoming incredibly important. Festivals and small halls become keys to an artist's career. They can only make a living from their shows.

[Martin Champoux, Bloc, Drummond, QC]

That's interesting.

It ties in a little with your concerns, Mr. Weisz. Are you seeing a greater interest in less popular shows, so to speak, basically in large urban centres because it is so hard to make money from, shall we say, more popular culture? Earlier, we talked about Taylor Swift and Paul McCartney, but they are not the only examples where we see increased ticket prices to the detriment of the customers. In your halls, do you see bigger audiences or greater interest for your shows? Can it have a beneficial effect?

[Jon Weisz]

We see the interest. But, as was mentioned previously, people's ability to consume culture is sometimes reduced. If people pay $400 for a pair of tickets at the Bell Centre, they will have less money to go out into their communities.

[Martin Champoux, Bloc, Drummond, QC]

Yes, but people who cannot pay $400 for a pair of tickets at the Bell Centre may well pay $60 or $100 for two tickets in one of your venues. The effect can be positive.

[Jon Weisz]

That may be so to a small extent. Our venues are not really reporting that they have noticed more people as a result of the increased prices for the bigger shows. It's possible in theory, but it is not something that our members have remarked on.

[Martin Champoux, Bloc, Drummond, QC]

While some people may profit, no one wants higher prices, of course. We agree on that.

I think that's all the time I have. I see Madam Chair making eyes at me.

[The Chair, Liberal, Lisa Hepfner]

And what lovely eyes they are.

[Voices]

Oh, oh!

[The Chair, Liberal, Lisa Hepfner]

Mr. Genuis, welcome to the heritage committee. You now have the floor for five minutes.

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

Thank you, Madam Chair. It's a pleasure to be here.

I want to welcome our witnesses and the many people who are listening to the committee in the room today. From my recall of faces, it appears that many representatives of the Falun Dafa community are here to observe these hearings.

I want to thank you for being here. You're regular witnesses on Parliament Hill in various fora, including here at this committee. I will be directing my questions to you as representatives of Falun Dafa. If you're able, give responses that are as short as possible. I'd like to get through a few different things.

What we're talking about, as I see it, is the systematic targeting of a particular arts and culture presentation by a foreign state that doesn't like it. Is that fair?

[Joel Chipkar]

Yes.

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

Further, we're talking about a situation in which this is being tolerated by people in Canadian elite institutions who in some cases are complicit in it, are allowing it to happen or at least are looking the other way. Is that fair?

[Joel Etienne]

Absolutely. That's except for our local police forces, who've been incredibly diligent and on top of things in terms of protecting the venues, our artists and the public. They are conducting very efficient, quick investigations and giving us the results we all know about, which is foreign interference with, of course, local actors—we believe the consular services of the CCP.