Environment Committee on Nov. 3rd, 2014

[Dr. Faisal Moola]

I would say that the biggest threat to maintaining ecological health in the park is what is happening outside of the park in terms of the greater watershed. In 2008 the David Suzuki Foundation did a comprehensive satellite analysis looking at the loss of prime agricultural land and nature from the Rouge watershed and surrounding watersheds in the GTA. We documented the loss of 11,000 hectares of green space and farmland over that period: 70% of that loss was due to urbanization, 15% of that loss was due to conversion to golf courses, and 13% was due to conversion to aggregates—pits and quarries. The impacts of tree planting were negligible.

There's no question about it: it's urbanization within the greater watershed.

[Rathika Sitsabaiesan, NDP, Scarborough—Rouge River, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Moola.

Mr. Robb.

[Jim Robb]

The greatest impact on an area like the Rouge is habitat fragmentation. Studies done in the current park ranked almost all of the habitat as poor to fair; followed by invasive species; followed by external pressures from urbanization and public use. Those are the greatest threats to the health of Rouge Park and the watershed outside of the park.

[Rathika Sitsabaiesan, NDP, Scarborough—Rouge River, ON]

Thank you.

Mr. Reesor.

[Jay Reesor]

One of the greatest threats is actually the status quo and not doing anything. We have a really good plan on the table right now, and I'd say a big threat to ecological health is just not doing anything in order to maintain the status quo. This is not a good option for ecological health.

[Rathika Sitsabaiesan, NDP, Scarborough—Rouge River, ON]

Thank you.

I'd ask all of you to be even a bit more brief this round.

Can farmers and people with conservation interests work together to preserve the ecological health of Rouge Park?

Mr. Moola.

[Dr. Faisal Moola]

Yes, definitely. We have the world class-renowned greenbelt, 1.8 million acres in size, in which farmers and environmentalists have come together. We have found that this area is producing $9 billion in market sales. In addition to that, it's producing an additional over $2 billion in non-market ecological benefits.

So there's no question about it.

[Rathika Sitsabaiesan, NDP, Scarborough—Rouge River, ON]

Thank you.

Mr. Robb.

[Jim Robb]

Of course; we've worked with the farm community over the years. When the park was started, we worked closely with some of the patriarchs who are gone now, such as Russ Reesor.

[Rathika Sitsabaiesan, NDP, Scarborough—Rouge River, ON]

So you, being a conservationist, are saying yes that you want to work with the farmers.

[Jim Robb]

Absolutely.

[Rathika Sitsabaiesan, NDP, Scarborough—Rouge River, ON]

Got it.

Mr. Reesor.

[Jay Reesor]

Yes: farmers and conservationists are like-minded.

[Rathika Sitsabaiesan, NDP, Scarborough—Rouge River, ON]

You can work together.

[Jay Reesor]

Absolutely.

[Rathika Sitsabaiesan, NDP, Scarborough—Rouge River, ON]

Awesome. Thank you.

My apologies. I'm being as brief as possible because I have 12 other questions I want to ask you all.

[A voice]

Good luck.

[Voices]

Oh, oh!

[Rathika Sitsabaiesan, NDP, Scarborough—Rouge River, ON]

Mr. Robb, over and over and over and over again, you mentioned that you want to see federal lands in the greenbelt and north Pickering included in the Rouge national urban park. Just briefly, why is that?

[Jim Robb]

First, you need to get around the urban blockade. Stouffville forms a blockade between the northern part of the proposed park and the actual heart of the Oak Ridges Moraine. You need the Pickering lands.

Second, they were already announced as a federal green space preserve, or a significant amount of them were, in 2002. We should carry that forward to link to the moraine.

Three, the bigger the park, the more room you have to balance the needs of nature, the needs of visitor use, and the needs of farming.

I guess the last one is that in Markham, the Rouge is only 5% forested. If you go across into Pickering, it's 25%. So there's a little bit more work to be done on the Markham side. You could trade lands. There are fallow lands in the Pickering area that aren't being farmed right now where you could say, “Farmer, you're in the ecological corridor. We don't want to disadvantage you. We'll give you a slice of land over here. But we do need this backbone of the park, that 600-metre ecological corridor, to have a place for nature and public use.”

[Rathika Sitsabaiesan, NDP, Scarborough—Rouge River, ON]

Mr. Moola, I don't know what your official position is on this. Can you briefly tell us what it is?

[Dr. Faisal Moola]

The David Suzuki Foundation supports the current boundaries of Rouge national urban park that have been proposed in the bill. We'd like to see greater stewardship of the surrounding watershed through such things as the creation of an urban farmland reserve and the expansion and strengthening of the greenbelt and so on.

We think there are other complementary forms of government that could—

[Rathika Sitsabaiesan, NDP, Scarborough—Rouge River, ON]

Thank you.

Mr. Robb, you gave us a whole bunch of amendments in the documents you sent us to satisfy the “meet or exceed” clause. I want to say thank you for that, because I know we won't have time for you to go through them all. Why do you think the Rouge Park watershed plans call for restoration of the forest and wetlands on some lands that are currently being leased for agriculture? Is there a scientific basis for this? This topic has come up again and again: is there a scientific basis?

[Jim Robb]

Yes.

The Rouge is part of the Toronto area of concern under the Great Lakes Water Quality Agreement, and, under that, Environment Canada did a scientific report called “How Much Habitat is Enough?” They said that for a healthy watershed—good water quality and biodiversity—you need a minimum of 30% to 50% forest cover. The Little Rouge River watershed, where the park is, has 13% forest cover. They said 10% wetland; it's 1%.

Now the reason that this is so important is that people have lost the economic aspect. The premise of the province's whole growth plan was the Rouge watershed plan. It said that to offset the flooding and erosion of extreme storm events from climate change and also from the runoff from planned urban growth, we have to restore forests and wetlands or our liabilities are going to skyrocket, insurance-wise, and with infrastructure and property damage.

The restoration in the existing greenbelt plan and Rouge park plans was premised on that due diligence. If the federal government ignores that, they're ignoring the due diligence at great risk. We've seen what happened in Calgary, the southern prairies. Even in Toronto, one big downpour is $1 billion in damage; it basically shut down the financial district for a couple of days.

[The Chair, Conservative, Harold Albrecht]

I think we're through our time. We will have to move to another questioner.

Mr. Woodworth, for seven minutes.