Evidence of meeting #14 for Access to Information, Privacy and Ethics in the 40th Parliament, 3rd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was togneri.
A recording is available from Parliament.
11:40 a.m.
Former Parliamentary Affairs Director, Department of Public Works and Government Services, As an Individual
I don't recollect. I don't.... I don't know. I don't think so.
11:40 a.m.
Liberal
Frank Valeriote Liberal Guelph, ON
You don't know. You don't think so. It may have happened, though.
11:40 a.m.
Former Parliamentary Affairs Director, Department of Public Works and Government Services, As an Individual
Again, I don't think so.
11:40 a.m.
Liberal
Frank Valeriote Liberal Guelph, ON
Have you ever urged an ATIP officer or departmental official to make greater redactions or to withhold documents that were not requested in a very specific manner?
11:40 a.m.
Former Parliamentary Affairs Director, Department of Public Works and Government Services, As an Individual
I....
11:40 a.m.
Liberal
Frank Valeriote Liberal Guelph, ON
Have you ever urged an ATIP officer or departmental official to make greater redactions or to withhold documents that were not requested in a very specific manner?
11:40 a.m.
Former Parliamentary Affairs Director, Department of Public Works and Government Services, As an Individual
I don't recall. No, I don't think so. Either way, I didn't have delegated authority to do so.
11:40 a.m.
Liberal
Frank Valeriote Liberal Guelph, ON
Yes, you've already told us that, yet you usurped that authority nevertheless.
How many ATIP requests did you or the ministerial exempt staff at Public Works suggest go to PCO under the guise of information release, harming provincial or international relations, during your time working for the minister?
11:40 a.m.
Former Parliamentary Affairs Director, Department of Public Works and Government Services, As an Individual
I.... Can you repeat the question?
11:40 a.m.
Liberal
Frank Valeriote Liberal Guelph, ON
How many ATIP requests did you or the ministerial exempt staff at Public Works suggest go to PCO under the guise of information release, harming provincial or international relations, during your time working for the minister?
11:40 a.m.
Former Parliamentary Affairs Director, Department of Public Works and Government Services, As an Individual
I don't know if I did. I don't think so.
11:40 a.m.
Liberal
Frank Valeriote Liberal Guelph, ON
All right.
So on your own volition, you took a 137-page document and unreleased it, which was ultimately reduced down to 30 or so pages. What prompted you to do that? Had you read the document before?
11:40 a.m.
Former Parliamentary Affairs Director, Department of Public Works and Government Services, As an Individual
I didn't do that. I don't redact documents. We get ATI files for our information. I don't know what happens to them after we see them, but.... So I didn't redact them. I didn't redact it to 30 pages. I didn't do that, so I--
11:45 a.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Paul Szabo
Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Togneri.
You made a statement, and I wanted to understand your intent or your communication to the committee. You said, and I quote--and the research assistant has been keying this in as well--“...it wasn't my intention to delay or obstruct.... Again, I was wrong in the fact that I did not understand the law fully...”.
I want to make sure that this is not misinterpreted by anyone. It would appear to say that you understand that you delayed or obstructed, but because of your lack of information of the law, you inadvertently made that mistake. Is that what you're saying, sir?
11:45 a.m.
Former Parliamentary Affairs Director, Department of Public Works and Government Services, As an Individual
Just to clarify, I thought that.... And again, I was ignorant of the law. I thought that because it was section 11 that had to do with their request, only section 11 should be released. I was wrong in that. And I was ignorant of the law in the sense that I didn't realize.... I had not been confronted with a situation before where it was...you know, if one section is relevant, then the entire section is relevant.
So in this case, I believe it was chapter 11 of a report, and I mean, I was wrong to think that only that section would be released. I was trying to make sure or.... I was trying to see if the...to make sure that the requester was getting what they were asking for. Again, I was wrong to think that only section 11 or chapter 11 of this report would be released instead of...instead of the whole report.
11:45 a.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Paul Szabo
Instead of the whole report. Okay. So for clarity, you say that your error was that you misinterpreted the law with regard to section 11 applicability to the whole thing. So we'll accept that.
But at the start you said that it wasn't your intention to delay or obstruct. That might be interpreted by some to be an admission that you did, either advertently or inadvertently, delay or obstruct. Is that the case?
11:45 a.m.
Former Parliamentary Affairs Director, Department of Public Works and Government Services, As an Individual
11:45 a.m.
Conservative
11:45 a.m.
Conservative
Pierre Poilievre Conservative Nepean—Carleton, ON
You're trying to make a statement on behalf of the witness--