Evidence of meeting #37 for Finance in the 40th Parliament, 3rd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was federal.
A recording is available from Parliament.
9:45 a.m.
President, Fédération étudiante universitaire du Québec
The situation in Quebec is somewhat particular. Currently, one province, Quebec, and the three territories have opted out of the Canada Student Loans Program and the Canada Student Grants Program. Since the early 60s, Quebec has been administering its own student financial assistance program, which is based on two principles: a contributory principle and a supplemental principle. In a nutshell, that means that the student and his or her family must contribute and the government provides an additional amount to meet living expenses that are calculated bearing in mind educational expenditures and tuition fees.
This is a system which, in Quebec, works relatively well despite some shortcomings. However, it does enable students in Quebec to have a much lower debt load than those from the other Canadian provinces. The average debt, following completion of a bachelor's degree, is $15,000 as compared to approximately $27,000 in the rest of Canada. This is a system that has proven itself, which overall works very well. Some aspects of its administration require adjustment but the infrastructure itself enables widespread accessibility to post-secondary education without acquiring an unreasonable level of debt.
9:45 a.m.
Executive Director, Canadian Association of University Teachers
This government actually did make an important contribution by introducing the Canada student grants program.
Currently that program provides low-income students with just about $2,000 a year, which doesn't even cover half the cost of tuition in most provinces. We'd certainly recommend raising the maximum grant under that program to $5,000, which is a level that more accurately reflects the average undergraduate tuition fee in the country. That's a very concrete step that would provide enormous help, because it's a national needs-based grant program. I think it would be a very important step forward.
9:45 a.m.
Liberal
Paul Szabo Liberal Mississauga South, ON
My time is up, so I just want, for the arts, I absolutely support....
On the clean technologies, more, more. Our committee is going....
Carry on.
9:45 a.m.
President, Conseil national des cycles supérieurs (Québec)
Just to add to the question, you talked about allocating financial assistance in accordance with requirements. In Quebec, this is primarily how we operate. That being said, as Ms. Clayton pointed out, there is a great deal of federal money—and we see the same thing at the provincial level—that is being channeled to tax measures which may be less attractive when compared with, for instance, reducing tuition fees or awarding additional bursaries.
The CNCS and the FEUQ have been examining ways to direct this money better. There is the option of redirecting this money to additional bursaries, even perhaps waiving certain federal tax credits to ensure that the money is redirected to the Government of Quebec so that it can in turn invest more in university financial assistance and drop tuition costs.
9:50 a.m.
Conservative
October 21st, 2010 / 9:50 a.m.
Bloc
Daniel Paillé Bloc Hochelaga, QC
Basically, there is a solution to all of the problems that you have raised. Earlier, you said that when you live close to a university, it is more likely that you may go there. So, the closer a government is to its constituents, its students, its citizens, the more sensitive it is to their concerns. In our opinion, it does not make sense that the federal government should meddle in the educational jurisdiction, and we have good evidence to show that this is the case.
Yesterday we heard from the Canadian Student Association and they expressed their way of seeing things. The association wanted, for example, to cancel $12 billion or $13 billion in current debt which would be converted into non-refundable grants. That is one way of seeing things, but we can clearly see, from the FEUQ and all of the people associated with this association, that in Quebec, we can have another way of viewing things.
Mr. Savoie and Mr. Oliny, you talked about going back to the 1994 transfers. You seem to be saying that you are hoping that the government will think things through properly. I will leave you with your illusions—no doubt, God, over time... That being said, I would point out to you that on page 19 of the brief submitted to the Minister of Finance last year, we stated all of this very clearly.
You are in favour of Bill C-288. Should I tell you—and you know this full well—that this too was an initiative from the Bloc Québécois as part of its parliamentary work. So when people say that we're useless, that is false.
I would like to hear your opinion on one matter. You said that you are going further compensating Quebec financially through the equalization system. Do you really think that the Government of Canada would, in a flash of genius, go back to the table and hand over this money? Or again, basically, would it not be better for the federal government to give the Government of Quebec tax points—and not amounts—to enable the latter to sustain its student labour force—because students are our workforce in the making?
9:50 a.m.
President, Fédération étudiante universitaire du Québec
With respect to all of these questions, particularly those pertaining to sales tax and equalization, there is a broad consensus in Quebec. Nearly all of the organizations agree on these two issues. That is why we want to send out this message today.
As far as the various scenarios are concerned, there are certainly all kinds of ways to finance the various social programs through transfers between the federal and provincial levels. This is an extremely complex issue. We believe that the basic guiding principle that underpins the federal government's investment in education must first and foremost be a recognition that education is a matter that comes under provincial jurisdiction and that any action taken must bear this in mind in each and every case. This jurisdiction belongs to Quebec and the other provinces, and this must be respected.
We have seen this, for instance, during the debate that was held on student financial assistance programs. The Canadian financial assistance program works differently from that of the other Canadian provinces, and that is what, in part, gives it its strength. The diversity that exists in the student financial aid programs is also present within the Quebec university network, just as each university network, in each Canadian province, has its own features that are unique. These features, in our opinion, must be respected in federal financing. This is what will enable us to use the transferred money as effectively as possible.
9:55 a.m.
Bloc
Daniel Paillé Bloc Hochelaga, QC
Thank you.
I would like to question the people representing the arts sector.
Last year as well, when we tabled our brief—because the Bloc Québécois, in addition to contributing to this committee, also surveyed its state—we presented some measures regarding cutbacks in the exporting of our works. You talked about $25 million; we suggested $30 million. I would invite you to continue supporting us on this matter.
Two measures were included, which are not present in your brief. We had suggested that once again income averaging should be given consideration for federal taxation, a measure that exists in Quebec.
Also, why did you remain silent about the Société Radio-Canada, which is supposed to be this great broadcaster of the arts?
9:55 a.m.
Co-chair, Canadian Arts Coalition
I would answer by saying that these two issues, these two recommendations that you have before you and which are in our brief, are those for which there is the widest consensus within the artistic community from one end of the country to the other. Clearly, there are other priorities, there are other requirements and we could have presented you with a long 10-page shopping list, full of concerns and priorities.
9:55 a.m.
Bloc
9:55 a.m.
Co-chair, Canadian Arts Coalition
That is why we have turned to the committee, and not Santa Claus.
However, I would tell you that of course there have been many discussions about the tax measures that could have been implemented in order to promote artists and cultural workers. This remains a concern, but it is not a priority for this year, given the economic situation and the nature of the proposals we have made to you.
9:55 a.m.
Bloc
Daniel Paillé Bloc Hochelaga, QC
And as far as Radio-Canada is concerned, do you feel that, at one point, if too many cuts are made, it may break?
9:55 a.m.
Co-chair, Canadian Arts Coalition
Radio-Canada remains a vital ally of the artistic community from one end of the country to the next. Obviously we are concerned about its continuity and stability, but it does not figure in our recommendations this year.
9:55 a.m.
Bloc
9:55 a.m.
Conservative
9:55 a.m.
Conservative
Mike Wallace Conservative Burlington, ON
Thank you, Mr. Chair, and I want to thank our witnesses for coming this morning.
How long do I have, seven minutes?
