Finance Committee on July 30th, 2020

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

We'll go back to Mr. Angus, Prime Minister.

[Charlie Angus, NDP, Timmins—James Bay, ON]

Thank you.

Well, Mr. Prime Minister, I totally agree with you about the civil service. That's why your decision to privatize this and give it to the Kielburger brothers really concerns me, and what really concerns me is you didn't answer the question about whether or not you thought that your close family financial relationships and the Morneau family's close financial relationships were a conflict of interest. That is why we're here. We're not here because of the civil service. We are here because you don't seem to understand, Mr. Prime Minister, that conflict of interest applies to you.

When you tell us that WE Charity was the only game in town, well they were in your world, but, obviously, this deal fell apart, and you need to understand that your conflict of interest has put you here.

[Justin Trudeau, Liberal, Papineau, QC]

Mr. Angus, your statement that in my world or in our cabinet, WE was the only game in town is simply untrue.

[Charlie Angus, NDP, Timmins—James Bay, ON]

That's what you said.

[Justin Trudeau, Liberal, Papineau, QC]

It is the professional public service that put forward the recommendation that said to us, having done their due diligence, that the only organization with the scale and the capacity to deliver this grant program would be WE.

Personally, I thought we were going to be able to deliver it through the Canada service corps, which I created two or three years ago and was all about rewarding service and creating opportunities for service for young people. I would have loved to see it supercharged and accelerated to be able to deliver many thousands of opportunities for young people throughout the country.

[Charlie Angus, NDP, Timmins—James Bay, ON]

Not a dime went out the door. You failed them.

[Justin Trudeau, Liberal, Papineau, QC]

But that wasn't able to be done. The public service, themselves, made the recommendation that we had to go with WE Charity, and I was not involved in that recommendation at all—

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

Thank you.

This is your last question, Mr. Angus, and it will have to be a very quick one.

[Charlie Angus, NDP, Timmins—James Bay, ON]

Very quickly, Mr. Prime Minister, as a former youth voice, you could have been talking to the Federation of Students when you were telling them that they were not eligible for the CERB, when you told them to work for less than the minimum wage, when you pushed this deal with the Kielburger brothers and refused to recuse yourself, and not a dime has gone out the door, Mr. Prime Minister—

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

We'll go over to you, Mr. Prime Minister.

[Justin Trudeau, Liberal, Papineau, QC]

Thank you.

Mr. Angus and the NDP have said this a few times, this idea that volunteering is somehow working for less than the minimum wage. I'd like to remind—

[Charlie Angus, NDP, Timmins—James Bay, ON]

That's what the legal—

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

Mr. Angus, the Prime Minister has the floor.

[Justin Trudeau, Liberal, Papineau, QC]

—Mr. Angus that volunteers are the heart of this country. People get out and volunteer, not for money but because they want to make a difference in the world. If you start calculating every volunteer as working for less than the minimum wage, then you are missing a really important part, Mr. Angus—

[Charlie Angus, NDP, Timmins—James Bay, ON]

Student debt.

[Justin Trudeau, Liberal, Papineau, QC]

—of the fabric of Canada. Getting young people to step up and volunteer is something—

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

We will have to end that round there, gentlemen.

We are going now to five-minute rounds. We'll start with Mr. Poilievre, followed by Mr. McLeod.

Mr. Poilievre, you have five minutes.

[Michael Barrett, Conservative, Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON]

Mr. Chair, I'll be taking Mr. Poilievre's time.

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

Okay, sorry, Mr. Barrett. I had Mr. Poilievre on my list. I'll not take my talking from your time.

You have the floor.

[Michael Barrett, Conservative, Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON]

Thank you.

Prime Minister, I'm just looking for a number. How many times would one of your ministers need to be found guilty of breaking the Conflict of Interest Act for you to fire them? How many times, sir?

[Justin Trudeau, Liberal, Papineau, QC]

Obviously, our cabinet is formed of extraordinary individuals who serve their country, and I have confidence in their ability to do just that.

[Michael Barrett, Conservative, Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON]

How many times would they need to break the act before you would fire them?

[Justin Trudeau, Liberal, Papineau, QC]

Obviously, any time someone contravenes the Ethics Commissioner's act we take it very seriously. We look at each situation based on the gravity of the situation.

[Michael Barrett, Conservative, Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON]

Okay. Well, you claimed in your opening remarks that you had basically no idea what was happening in your government. Who are you holding accountable for this decision?

[Justin Trudeau, Liberal, Papineau, QC]

Mr. Barrett, over the past number of months, as a government and as a Prime Minister I have been involved in the decisions around CERB, around the wage subsidy, around helping Canadians through this extraordinary time of crisis. We've been involved in working quickly and flexibly, with an extraordinarily professional public service, to deliver tremendous programs to help Canadians—