Evidence of meeting #94 for Finance in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was chair.
A recording is available from Parliament.
9:10 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Peter Fonseca
MP Genuis, that's not a point of order.
Right now, shall Bloc-1 carry, members?
9:10 p.m.
Conservative
Garnett Genuis Conservative Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB
Chair, it's a point of order. I submitted a subamendment to Bloc-1. I submitted it in writing to the clerk in advance of this meeting. The motion as adopted by the committee does not exclude the possibility of subamendments.
9:10 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Peter Fonseca
I'm suspending.
We're back.
I know that MP Genuis was not here for, and did not hear, the motion brought forward. It's pursuant to the motion adopted by the vote. There is no debate, MP Genuis.
Shall Bloc-1 carry?
9:10 p.m.
Conservative
Garnett Genuis Conservative Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB
Chair, it's not a matter of debate. It's a subamendment.
9:10 p.m.
Conservative
Garnett Genuis Conservative Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB
I don't want to debate it. I don't want speak about it. I don't want to read it.
9:10 p.m.
Conservative
Garnett Genuis Conservative Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB
On a point of order, Chair, there is nothing in the motion....
Chair, this is an important matter of procedure because if you don't allow members the opportunity to move subamendments, then amendments will be moved at report stage in the House.
9:14 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Peter Fonseca
We're back.
My ruling is no subamendments. That's where we are.
MP Genuis, that is my ruling.
9:14 p.m.
Conservative
Garnett Genuis Conservative Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB
On a point of order, Chair, could you explain your ruling? There is nothing in the motion that refers to subamendments.
9:14 p.m.
NDP
Daniel Blaikie NDP Elmwood—Transcona, MB
My understanding of what is going on is that the motion says there's no debate, which means that no member can get the floor except by a point of order.
You can't move a subamendment off a point of order, which means you can't move the subamendment because there's no debate allowed and no having the floor except on a point of order. The job of the chair now is to put every question forthwith and successively without debate.
You can't get the floor, so you can't move a subamendment.
9:14 p.m.
Conservative
Garnett Genuis Conservative Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB
Could I speak to the same point of order?
Thank you, Chair.
The amendments are deemed moved because they were provided in advance. I provided subamendments in advance, which were based on the amendments that were provided. By the same principle....
If we don't allow subamendments to be moved, then the chair is opening a situation where members have not been able to make changes in committee, which means that all of those various changes could be moved and would require separate votes in the House if members aren't able to make these changes.
The other thing is just in an appeal to the way committee should function—
9:15 p.m.
NDP
Daniel Blaikie NDP Elmwood—Transcona, MB
We're well past that, Mr. Genuis. Don't even start. We're well past—
9:15 p.m.
Conservative
Garnett Genuis Conservative Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB
To say it's impossible to move a subamendment to an amendment even if the subamendment were submitted in advance is just an absurd way to legislate. It means that you can't do any kind of refining even if someone saw the amendment in advance and submitted a subamendment, which is what I did. I have only one subamendment to this amendment.
9:15 p.m.
Conservative
Garnett Genuis Conservative Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB
There's nothing in the motion that says you can't subamend. You're just kind of making things up that aren't in the motion, Chair.
9:15 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Peter Fonseca
MP Genuis, pursuant to the motion adopted by the vote, there is no debate. You're debating right now. We are going to move—
9:15 p.m.
Conservative
9:15 p.m.
NDP
Daniel Blaikie NDP Elmwood—Transcona, MB
On this same point of order, my question is one of clarification. If a member has duly submitted an amendment or subamendment in advance, is that something that any member of Parliament—not any member of this committee because Mr. Genuis is not a standing member of the committee—has a right to do?
If so, was it received before we started this process? If so, it seems to me that it's in order and we should just have a vote on it and put an end to this.
If it's not in order to have been received, then that's a separate question.
9:15 p.m.
Conservative