Evidence of meeting #43 for Finance in the 45th Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was quebec.
A video is available from Parliament.
Bloc
Jean-Denis Garon Bloc Mirabel, QC
I imagine that you're talking about the black hole of employment insurance.
President, Confédération des syndicats nationaux
Yes. Some workers end up receiving no income for a number of weeks. This situation is quite challenging for us.
I would also say that the employment insurance system is particularly ineffective for young people. Measures are put in place for long‑tenured workers, but it's difficult for young people. To use the employment insurance program, you must be eligible. I think that this is the key point.
Extended temporary measures are the best proof of the need for permanent measures and predictability. They create a great deal of uncertainty for people and industries. Every time we hit a rough patch, we realize that this program isn't up to the task. Let's look at the program as a whole and adjust it for the people who need it.
Bloc
Jean-Denis Garon Bloc Mirabel, QC
We would like to remind the government that the bill is already written and that we could even table it in this committee for the pre‑budget consultations should there be unanimous consent. I'm sure that this will be the case. It was and still is an excellent bill.
I'll continue with you, Mr. L'Ériger.
At the request of the federations of chambers of commerce and steelworkers, the Bloc Québécois proposed the introduction of a wage subsidy during the current crisis to respond to the new tariffs imposed by Donald Trump. This wage subsidy would make it possible, in the event of temporary closures or shift cancellations, for example, to keep workers on the job in order to maintain the employment relationship and ease the pressure on the employment insurance system. From an actuarial point of view, the system isn't designed for two crises in seven years.
This would prevent a company from laying off workers, who could then move on to the company next door, creating a game of musical chairs in the regions, where attracting talent is becoming a sensitive matter.
I would like to know your thoughts on this proposal.
Director, Research Service, Fédération des travailleurs et travailleuses du Québec
We certainly back income support measures that maintain the employment relationship. Once that relationship is lost, the companies lose out on skills. So, yes, we're probably in favour of additional government support during exceptional crises of this nature.
Bloc
Jean-Denis Garon Bloc Mirabel, QC
Obviously, the employment insurance fund must remain balanced over a seven‑year period. Otherwise—correct me if I'm wrong—the employer and employee contributions must increase. This fund has already gone through a crisis because of COVID‑19. We're now facing a second crisis.
I gather that this type of subsidy would cost about the same as employment insurance benefits. It would help maintain the employment relationship, ease the pressure on the employment insurance system and avoid increasing employer and employee contributions at a time when they need a bit of breathing room.
Do you think that this type of subsidy would be a disadvantage?
Director, Research Service, Fédération des travailleurs et travailleuses du Québec
You asked a good question.
In my opinion, employment insurance must be sufficiently funded to meet needs. As previously stated, only four out of ten people have access to it. Regardless of the solution, we need sufficient access to benefits in the event of economic hardship. If the unemployment rate rises, workers who pay into employment insurance must be entitled to receive benefits. Regardless of the solution chosen, I think that we must bear in mind the objective of ensuring good coverage and a good social safety net.
Bloc
Jean-Denis Garon Bloc Mirabel, QC
Ms. Senneville, we have one minute to discuss the green transition.
The government has repealed the carbon tax and put a de facto end to carbon pricing for the industry. We won't be able to meet our climate targets under the Paris agreement. Moreover, the member for Laurier—Sainte‑Marie has just resigned. Yet this industry has a high added value and a promising future.
Are you concerned about what we're seeing today from the federal government? Do you feel that the situation with Donald Trump justifies this, including the construction of new pipelines with public funds?
President, Confédération des syndicats nationaux
Mr. Trump and his administration are taking up a great deal of space. I understand the concern. However, in the meantime, other countries are moving forward. They're introducing technologies and transforming their economies. Fossil fuels will become increasingly rare and expensive to use, not to mention environmentally hazardous, of course. These countries will be ready, but we won't be.
It's costly and difficult for the economy to play what's known as catch‑up hockey. So we must continue to ensure a fair transition that includes the workers. This is also vital. We can't let workers feel left behind.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Karina Gould
Thank you, Mr. Garon.
We'll continue now with Mr. Kelly for five minutes.
Conservative
Pat Kelly Conservative Calgary Crowfoot, AB
Thank you.
I'd like to begin by offering Mrs. Payne a minute or so, if she would like, to finish off her answer to the question put by Mr. Seeback about the designation of supply chain jobs as essential services and the effect this might have on the right to strike.
National President, Unifor
Thank you very much.
As you probably all know, we have made a pretty significant submission on this Labour Code review. We have been very vocal about the fact that we are looking at a 35-day period for this very in-depth look at what is the most important piece of labour legislation in the country. Very often, it is the leadership piece of labour legislation.
We know not having the right to strike will limit what unions can do and achieve at bargaining tables. We know this because we are very experienced in this world. The reality is that the problem we have is not with everybody. We have situations where, sometimes, we end up with—and we've had them too, sir—not a great relationship with the employer, and things build up over time. Not all those things can get resolved at a bargaining table, which means we have to look at putting in tools and supports to help in those cases.
Fundamentally, what I will say to you is that if there is a move to limit—
Conservative
Pat Kelly Conservative Calgary Crowfoot, AB
Thank you so much. I hate doing this, but I have to get.... I wanted to give you a chance to answer the question for a minute. I let you go over by a lot.
Conservative
Pat Kelly Conservative Calgary Crowfoot, AB
Thank you.
I will quickly move to Mr. Sauvé to speak a bit about firearms policy.
Your position has been clear that the real problem is illegal firearms trafficking, not licensed firearms owners. In committee, the Toronto Police Association said that the buyback would have zero impact on crime in Toronto. They said that violence is coming from gang members, thugs, owners of illegal guns, people out on bail or people who have already been prohibited from owning firearms.
Is it your view that the buyback program is an expensive, complicated program aimed at the wrong people?
President, National Police Federation
The buyback program is obviously going to be an expensive program. It's going to be complicated. From 2020 until now, our position has been that if you're going to spend money in public safety, target it at where it has the greatest return on investment. From our perspective, that is the illegal importation of firearms across the 49th parallel—the longest unsecured border in the world, with the largest manufacturer of small arms just to the south of us.
Conservative
Pat Kelly Conservative Calgary Crowfoot, AB
You would agree that illegal firearms smuggling is a bigger driver of gun crime than legally owned firearms, at present.
President, National Police Federation
It is. The statistics actually show that. The majority of firearms crime in Canada comes from unregistered, unlicensed or illegally transported or smuggled firearms into Canada.
Conservative
Pat Kelly Conservative Calgary Crowfoot, AB
Do you agree that this buyback will not have an impact on gun violence in major cities?
President, National Police Federation
I can't predict the future. We will have to wait to see how the buyback goes and whether it's going to have an impact on public safety.
Conservative
Pat Kelly Conservative Calgary Crowfoot, AB
Okay.
Would you agree that having police forces helping to administer this program actually pulls resources away from real public safety work?
President, National Police Federation
It does add and download to police officers' duties. That's one reason, from our perspective, that we've been relatively public in saying that it would be nice to see a plan. What is the plan for the buyback? For example, if a member of the community chooses to call the 1-800 number to have their firearms surrendered, where do they go? What resources are there? Are they on overtime? Are they on scheduled duties? Are they being taken away from their core policing duties?
Conservative
Pat Kelly Conservative Calgary Crowfoot, AB
I have about half a minute. Your recommendation is about a secretariat, a single entity accountable for procurement, which has been a disaster for many years across government, as well within the armed forces and other branches of government. You have a few moments left. Is there anything you want to add to that recommendation for a single secretariat?