Evidence of meeting #90 for Fisheries and Oceans in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was dfo.
A recording is available from Parliament.
9:05 a.m.
Liberal
Ken McDonald Liberal Avalon, NL
What about when somebody modifies their boat because it's three feet too long and they either cut off the bow or cut off the stern? DFO doesn't do any inspections on that either, to see the stability with regard to the fishing industry?
9:05 a.m.
Director, Marine Investigations, Transportation Safety Board of Canada
It's not systemic. They wouldn't do it themselves, but it would be up to the regulator to determine if the vessel falls under the regulation. That's the part that TC is responsible for. The mariner, the fisherman, will adjust the length according to the DFO regulations and the type of boat he needs. He or she may cut the boat down for different purposes. That's up to the regulator to determine if it's safe or not.
9:05 a.m.
Liberal
9:05 a.m.
Director, Marine Investigations, Transportation Safety Board of Canada
TSB does not use a measurement. We assess the measurement done by TC and done by DFO. We came up with the fact that they're not always using the same measures.
9:05 a.m.
Liberal
Ken McDonald Liberal Avalon, NL
Explain "not always using the same measures". Are they doing it on different portions of the boat to determine length overall?
9:05 a.m.
Director, Marine Investigations, Transportation Safety Board of Canada
Yes.
It could be that TC would do from bow to stem, and this would meet the regulations, either the small vessel regulations or the large vessel regulations. If the fisherman decides to add on an extension, that extension would be covered by the TC regulations, but it would not be covered by the DFO regulations. DFO would say that it's bow to stem, and they don't include the extension. You can have have a 22-metre boat plus a four-metre extension. You would meet the regulations for DFO because the maximum length is 22 metres, but you add on this extension, which is not covered by DFO. Therefore, you're able to fish with that boat even though it's larger and may not have the appropriate stability assessment done, or it may be a risk factor because you put more traps on to it and so forth.
9:05 a.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Scott Simms
Thank you.
Mr. Doherty, we'll turn to the Conservatives for seven minutes, please.
March 22nd, 2018 / 9:05 a.m.
Conservative
Todd Doherty Conservative Cariboo—Prince George, BC
Thank you to our guests today.
This may seem an odd question to start off with. Ms. Weldon, how long have you been with Transport Canada?
9:05 a.m.
Director General, Marine Safety and Security, Department of Transport
Nine years, I believe.
9:05 a.m.
Chief Operating Officer, Transportation Safety Board of Canada
I've been with the TSB since its inception in 1990.
9:05 a.m.
Director, Marine Investigations, Transportation Safety Board of Canada
I've been the Director of Investigations for seven years.
9:05 a.m.
Luc Tremblay Executive Director, Domestic Vessel Regulatory Oversight and Boating Safety, Department of Transport
Eleven years.
9:05 a.m.
Conservative
Todd Doherty Conservative Cariboo—Prince George, BC
This may seem odd. The reason I ask that is that I'm absolutely flabbergasted at your testimony today. I'm looking at Transport Canada's mandate online. I'll spare you the preamble. I know most of you know this, and you probably know it very well, but Transport Canada's safety and security activities include the following: aircraft services, civil aviation, marine safety, and marine security.
Your testimony today is pointing fingers at DFO. Many of the folks here know that I have a transportation background. Here's full disclosure. I was once a Transport Canada employee in airports and aviation. I know that we have standards. I know that Transport Canada is our overarching regulation authority.
How is it that—forgive me, I didn't do the math—the four executives who are before us today...and that we have not a standardized marine vessel length that...? The one paragraph that was mentioned, that there are four or five different vessel lengths that are out there, that DFO has its own method of measuring.... How is it that we do not have a standardized vessel length or...?As you can tell, I'm flabbergasted here, and I'm having a hard time getting the words out.
How is it that Transport Canada is having to defer to DFO on this?
Ms. Weldon.
9:10 a.m.
Director General, Marine Safety and Security, Department of Transport
I wouldn't say that. We don't defer to DFO. For any regulation at Transport Canada, we use one method for measuring length. We're consistent—
9:10 a.m.
Conservative
Todd Doherty Conservative Cariboo—Prince George, BC
Why isn't Transport Canada mandating that this is a standardized vessel length requirement, that this is how we're going to do it, so that there is no ambiguity, and DFO has to follow it?
9:10 a.m.
Director General, Marine Safety and Security, Department of Transport
It's not Transport Canada's role to regulate another federal department, so you can address DFO about—
9:10 a.m.
Conservative
Todd Doherty Conservative Cariboo—Prince George, BC
Pardon me, but in Transport Canada's own mandate, the Government of Canada recognizes that now more than ever we need a safe and secure transportation system for a healthy and competitive economy and efficient and safe secure transportation systems. I would say that marine vessels would be a transportation system or part of our transportation system. Correct?
9:10 a.m.
Director General, Marine Safety and Security, Department of Transport
I wouldn't say that.
9:10 a.m.
Conservative
Todd Doherty Conservative Cariboo—Prince George, BC
It's for transportation in coastal communities. Is that correct?
9:10 a.m.
Director General, Marine Safety and Security, Department of Transport
That is correct.
9:10 a.m.
Conservative
Todd Doherty Conservative Cariboo—Prince George, BC
Thank you.
Transport Canada's safety and security activities include the following: aircraft services, civil aviation, and marine safety. What has just been brought forth is clear mismanagement. You are an executive in Transport Canada and if DFO were here, I'd be saying the exact same thing to them. It is unbelievable that lives are being lost and that we have bureaucrats who can't get their act together. There's a standardized vessel length.
Is there an international standard for vessel length to which Canada could adhere?
9:10 a.m.
Executive Director, Domestic Vessel Regulatory Oversight and Boating Safety, Department of Transport
There is. You're right that there is a standard and that's what Transport Canada is using.