Fisheries Committee on Oct. 7th, 2024

[Dr. Bernard Vigneault]

The data was analyzed recently, along with the sentinel survey.

As you recall, there have been some issues with the transition of vessels, so there was no stock assessment done in 2022 and 2023. In the latest stock assessment, the logbooks were used.

[Clifford Small, Conservative, Coast of Bays—Central—Notre Dame, NL]

The data is analyzed in offices at 200 Kent and on White Hills Road, not on the vessels that were out of commission. Why was the data not analyzed sooner? Also, if it was analyzed at all, what was the story of the catch rates that you got from that data?

[Dr. Bernard Vigneault]

It's exactly as you said. The catch rate trends are looked at in every stock assessment and they inform the analysis of the data, and that is part of the science advice that was published.

I don't know if my colleague, Mr. McGillivray, has additional information on the logbook information analysis in Newfoundland.

[William McGillivray, Regional Director General, Newfoundland and Labrador Region, Department of Fisheries and Oceans]

I don't have anything to add, Bernard.

[Clifford Small, Conservative, Coast of Bays—Central—Notre Dame, NL]

Thank you.

I have a specific question about an area on the Newfoundland coast, from Cape Bauld to Cape Norman, where the cod fishery was shut down in 1992. It's a part of 4R, which remained open until 1993, but scientifically, that part of the stock was considered to be northern cod.

Now, with the stewardship fishery and now this commercial fishery, harvesters who have home ports between Cape Norman and Cape Bauld aren't allowed to fish in that area. They have to go outside into a certain part of 3K.

Why can't they fish in that area between Cape Norman and Cape Bauld if that's an area that science has identified as having stock that is northern cod? Why aren't they allowed to fish that area? Why are they being pushed outside and actually driving their carbon footprint way up in having to do so?

[Adam Burns]

Mr. Chair, I'll ask my colleague, Mr. McGillivray, to respond to that question.

[William McGillivray]

This is in reference to what we call the 3K equivalent fleet that, as you said, is between Cape Bauld and that location. There are about 34 licence-holders from Newfoundland and Labrador at the present time on our conservation harvesting plan. They do have access to fish, and they fish in 3K. They're fishing northern cod in 3K.

These conservation harvesting plans are done collaboratively also with the FFAW in negotiations with them. If that changed, we'd have to have conversations with them on the way forward.

We negotiate those plans every year, if I'm not mistaken.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

Thank you.

We'll now go on to Mr. Cormier for five minutes.

[Serge Cormier, Liberal, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

My questions are for either witness.

At the beginning of the meeting, you talked about some offshore fishing companies that will be able to start fishing cod in accordance with the new quota that has just been given to them.

Could you once again name some of these companies that will be able to take advantage of this access to cod, that is, this cod quota? I'd like some examples.

[Adam Burns]

Sure. For example, Ocean Choice International would have access to northern cod.

[Serge Cormier, Liberal, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

How many employees do big companies like Ocean Choice International have, approximately?

[Adam Burns]

That would be in the hundreds. I don't have the exact figures. I believe that some of their executives will also be appearing before the committee in the coming weeks. They can then give you more accurate figures.

[Serge Cormier, Liberal, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

To clarify, could you repeat the percentage allocated to offshore fishing companies under the new allocation?

[Adam Burns]

It is 6% of the Canadian quota.

[Serge Cormier, Liberal, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

So 6% of 18,000 tonnes, which is roughly two million pounds, is that right?

[Adam Burns]

Yes.

[Serge Cormier, Liberal, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

Before the moratorium was put in place in 1992, those same companies probably shared in the cod quotas as well. What did these companies do after the cod fishery closed? Did they start fishing other resources? Did they continue to employ as many people?

[Adam Burns]

They do have quotas in other fisheries, such as groundfish. Many of these companies also have northern shrimp quotas. In addition to national quotas, they also have quotas in the NAFO area, the Northwest Atlantic Fisheries Organization.

They use different combinations of quotas, but that's what they do.

[Serge Cormier, Liberal, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

So you could say that these big companies, even though they haven't had cod to process for more than 30 or 40 years, have managed to do good business, isn't that right? I think some of them are publicly traded.

[Adam Burns]

Yes, that's right.

As I've said before, the Arnold's Cove processing plant, for example, and other plants as well, from time to time, need to buy fish from abroad to have work year-round.

[Serge Cormier, Liberal, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

If these companies have done well for all these years despite the closure of the cod fishery, why give them 6% of the quota? It's the same with the new redfish allocation; if I have time, I'll talk about that later. In the case of cod, why not give 6% of the quota to fleets that are in greater need?

Is that one of the recommendations you made? I remember that, when I was parliamentary secretary, the minister received documents that often presented three options or three scenarios from which he had to choose. These were options that you, the officials, submitted to the minister for him to make the decisions.

Did you recommend to the minister a 6% quota for offshore fishing companies, or was that not part of the recommendations?

[Adam Burns]

The minister's decision was based on the objective of having year-long employment. It's necessary to have an offshore fleet to fish during the winter months, for example. That is why the minister made this decision, as she explained when she made her announcement in June.

[Serge Cormier, Liberal, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

Mr. Burns, every time you and your colleagues come before the committee, we talk about protecting resources, protecting biodiversity and protecting our oceans. And yet, here we are giving quotas to large companies again. It's the same thing in the redfish fishery, for example, where 60% of the quota will go to large companies.

I'd like to read an excerpt from an article that quoted what Roméo LeBlanc said in the 1970s.

[Mr. LeBlanc] sided with Canadian fishers, who claimed that foreigners [or large offshore fishing companies] were overfishing and were therefore responsible for the decline of the stocks. Consequently, in 1977, Mr. LeBlanc extended Canada's economic zone to 200 miles off the coast. “In other words, that means that we secured our fisheries' destinies for the foreseeable future”, he said. Ten years later, five years before the cod moratorium was imposed, Roméo LeBlanc, then a senator, couldn't help but note the failure of that vision. “The challenge is that biology doesn't necessarily follow the greed and appetite of those who want to empty the oceans”, he said.

As a government, we are certainly responsible, but have you, as public servants, recommended to the minister that such a percentage be given to offshore fleets that, in my opinion, need it less than our regions' inshore fleets?

We've been talking about protecting oceans and biodiversity in recent years, but then, for example, 60% of the quota for redfish fisheries is allocated to large companies that have held up and continued their activities, even though other fleets have been decimated. Is it right that we still give a percentage of the quota to large companies in a context where we advocate for ocean and biodiversity protection?

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

Thank you, Mr. Cormier.

We have to go on now to Mr. Arnold for five minutes.

[Mel Arnold, Conservative, North Okanagan—Shuswap, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Mr. Burns, I'll carry on with the year-round employment message you say the minister was focused on as part of her decision. She wants to work towards year-round employment.

What time frame did the stewardship fishery operate under? How many weeks or months was it?