Evidence of meeting #5 for Fisheries and Oceans in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was work.
A recording is available from Parliament.
11:55 a.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Ken McDonald
Thank you, Madame Desbiens. There are 20 seconds left, but I don't think that gives you much time to get a question and answer in.
11:55 a.m.
Bloc
11:55 a.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Ken McDonald
Thank you.
We'll now go to Ms. Barron for two and a half minutes or less, please.
11:55 a.m.
NDP
Lisa Marie Barron NDP Nanaimo—Ladysmith, BC
One of the concerns that has been brought forward to me is around the potential introduction of petrochemicals and other toxins into salmon habitats as a result of the flooding. I understand there's research being done to fully understand the situation at the moment, but is that something that DFO is currently monitoring?
Could you expand on that?
11:55 a.m.
Senior Director, Pacific Salmon Strategy Initiative, Pacific Region, Department of Fisheries and Oceans
Mr. Fanos, go ahead.
11:55 a.m.
Director, Fish and Fish Habitat Protection Program, Pacific Region, Department of Fisheries and Oceans
The response to this is that the department works in collaboration with others on the water quality issues. You referenced petrochemicals. These are in the jurisdiction of Environment and Climate Change Canada, as well as the provincial authorities responsible for the water quality, if you will, of deleterious-type substances that may need to be controlled for entry into freshwater systems.
It's not our direct jurisdiction in DFO to do that work, but we work with others when there are impacts sufficient to share work where they have the primary jurisdiction.
Thank you.
11:55 a.m.
NDP
Lisa Marie Barron NDP Nanaimo—Ladysmith, BC
Thank you.
I'm going to try to sneak in one last question here. This is around disaster funding support from advocates. I'm hearing that a lot of the time, fish friendly infrastructure has larger sticker prices attached to it.
Will DFO adjust the funding criteria for flood control infrastructure projects to ensure that federal dollars are not spent on projects that block access to fish habitats or on pumps that kill salmon?
11:55 a.m.
Senior Director, Pacific Salmon Strategy Initiative, Pacific Region, Department of Fisheries and Oceans
I can begin.
I would say that in our funding programs that DFO administers, we are looking forward to things that further support and protect fish and fish habitat, and to do this in ways that are forward-thinking in terms of climate adaptation going forward. Regarding the additional costs, as long as it's a solid project and meets the program criteria, I think the type of work you're talking about, which has positive outlooks for salmon, would be well received.
You may be referring to some of the broader funding that's being managed by the provincial government by way of broader response. I don't know if Mr. Fanos has anything to suggest there, other than the fact that this work still requires regulatory permits and necessary requirements to show that it is not harming fish or fish habitat. That would be a key part of our process, as well as participating in the planning.
11:55 a.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Ken McDonald
Thank you for that. Your time is up.
We'll now go to Mr. Strahl for five minutes or less, please.
February 8th, 2022 / 11:55 a.m.
Conservative
Mark Strahl Conservative Chilliwack—Hope, BC
Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.
I thank the witnesses for coming today.
Obviously, in the Fraser Valley, we experienced a major flooding event. That's why Mr. Fast and I are here. What I saw was private citizens rushing in to the breach, if you can put it that way, to not only help with search and rescue and animal rescue, etc.; shortly afterwards, the Fraser Valley Angling Guides Association, professional guides, used their own boats and own fuel and expertise to rescue not only stranded salmon, but stranded sturgeon, as well, which is an endangered species.
Have you reached out to those groups that incurred significant costs and used a significant amount of time, to compensate them for their efforts to save precious salmon and sturgeon resources that were impacted so drastically by that flood event?
Noon
Senior Director, Pacific Salmon Strategy Initiative, Pacific Region, Department of Fisheries and Oceans
We had a team, part of an integrated inter-agency approach, as part of that emergency response phase. Mr. Fanos and I are looking more at what we do now to rebuild and for the restoration going forward. For instance, our conservation protection folks were on the ground in boats out in the water supporting other emergency response providers.
I would need to get back to you on the direct engagement with those individual citizens. As you mentioned, we saw a lot of them on the news. In terms of their ongoing involvement in the next phase of work, we'd have to get back to you on that.
Noon
Conservative
Mark Strahl Conservative Chilliwack—Hope, BC
Right. I do think that as we go forward they need to be acknowledged for not waiting. They did get permits, but they certainly didn't wait around. They saved a lot of displaced fish in those critical days following.
I want to follow up as well on the issue of debris in the Fraser River. There was an unprecedented washout of a lot of material—thousands of cubic metres—now stranded, I would say, on the banks of the Fraser River, waiting to be pushed downriver by the spring freshet. Is there a plan in place to ensure efforts that prevent more significant damage to flood protection infrastructure? If that stuff all comes down at the same time, we are going to have massive damage to infrastructure downriver.
I'm wondering if there is a plan in place to ensure that fisheries regulations, permitting, etc., are all streamlined so that red tape doesn't prevent the necessary cleanup that needs to take place before the spring freshet comes through.
Noon
Director, Fish and Fish Habitat Protection Program, Pacific Region, Department of Fisheries and Oceans
I can take this question, Sarah—if that's appropriate, Mr. Chair.
Yes, DFO often provides support and advice to provincial authorities that do debris management in the Fraser, largely for protection of infrastructure and for navigation control and safety. We will continue to provide advice. I think you've made an excellent point in terms of the streamlined process. You're familiar with the processes there.
As we did with the flood work in November-December, our teams were actively involved with all the local authorities and the people needing to do the work to make sure that we had timely responses. We'll continue that work in the spring. As Sarah indicated, this is work that's going to continue over the next several weeks and months and perhaps even years. We'll be making that a priority for sure.
Noon
Conservative
Mark Strahl Conservative Chilliwack—Hope, BC
Finally, there was certainly some criticism on the ground that federal assets, federal boats—for instance, fisheries boats—were not deployed to assist residents who quickly found themselves in a very dangerous situation and that it again fell to private citizens.
Have you done a review, or are you in the process of reviewing, the response of DFO in terms of whether the assets that were in the area, the individuals in the area, etc., were deployed appropriately and quickly enough, given the emergency we were facing in the Fraser Valley?
Noon
Senior Director, Pacific Salmon Strategy Initiative, Pacific Region, Department of Fisheries and Oceans
Yes. As part of any involvement in emergency response activities or incident response, a post review is undertaken. In the case of this work, I want to emphasize again how much of an inter-agency effort it was, not only across federal agencies but also with the province and other local governments. That process may take a bit longer, but DFO will certainly be part of that, and learning lessons from our role and how we can work more effectively with other agencies in events like this in the future.
Noon
Liberal
12:05 p.m.
Liberal
Ken Hardie Liberal Fleetwood—Port Kells, BC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Information from the Library of Parliament suggests that flood control systems along the lower Fraser have fundamentally cut off 80% to 90% of the fish habitat. Now, the legislation in British Columbia says that if you build something that uses, diverts, obstructs, impounds or otherwise changes the natural flow or course of any river, you have to have some means by which the fish can get around or over it.
I guess what I need from you is this: What is the situation right now, especially with the dikes and the pumping stations, and have those systems actually been put in place?
12:05 p.m.
Senior Director, Pacific Salmon Strategy Initiative, Pacific Region, Department of Fisheries and Oceans
I will start, and then I'll quickly pass it over to Mr. Fanos.
If there is a silver lining to the flood events that we saw, it is the fact that much of the infrastructure that was put in place, as I think Mr. Fanos mentioned, was from the fifties or was quite old in nature. Building forward, there is an opportunity to do it in a way that is much greener and more fish friendly.
Mr. Fanos, do you want to quickly add to that?
12:05 p.m.
Director, Fish and Fish Habitat Protection Program, Pacific Region, Department of Fisheries and Oceans
Yes, you're asking what our role is right now with the existing challenges you described.
There are two different angles that we're working on right now in the department. One, as systems are coming up for works and maintenance repairs, provincial authorities are planning on getting permits provincially for that. We typically try to provide advice in those processes to determine whether or not there's permitting from DFO, and that's the time when we engage, look for the avoidance mitigation and whether we need to offset measures here so that we're getting better inputs, or better conditions for fish. That's one way.
The existing facilities that aren't going under any reviews right now cause serious concerns and problems. We have been taking some lead from the various ENGO groups that have done a lot of work in this area, particularly Watershed Watch, and trying to understand some of the opportunities that they see in collaboration with indigenous groups and local governments to work with existing facilities that have been in place for some time.
We all know that the costs associated with many of these upgrades are substantial, not just in the floodgate access issues that would be of particular concern for DFO, but also the general maintenance of these dikes and facilities—
12:05 p.m.
Liberal
Ken Hardie Liberal Fleetwood—Port Kells, BC
Maybe I can intercede here, because my time is short.
Let's talk about pumping stations. I understand they have been identified as a serious concern. What is the state of them? How many pumping stations are in need of either a retrofit or replacement along the lower Fraser in order to again open up fish habitat that could be supporting a much healthier salmon population?
12:05 p.m.
Director, Fish and Fish Habitat Protection Program, Pacific Region, Department of Fisheries and Oceans
I don't have the exact number. I would have to get back to you on the exact number, but there are dozens, if not more, of those types of pumping stations that are either impeding or preventing migration.
We're prioritizing those for action to look for these opportunities, whether it's through new funding programs, restoration programs or infrastructure programs, to ensure we're getting improvements to those fish passages.
12:05 p.m.
Liberal
Ken Hardie Liberal Fleetwood—Port Kells, BC
With regard to the international implications of this, it was the Nooksack River system that failed, which caused the flooding in the Sumas Prairie. There's also a dam near Oroville. I'm trying to remember the name of it—it's the Enloe Dam near Oroville that is making it very difficult for salmon to come up the Similkameen River.
Do we have any kind of reciprocal agreement with the United States to consult back and forth across the border on measures that impact the health of fish stocks in B.C. waters?
Ms. Murdoch, maybe you could take that.
12:05 p.m.
Senior Director, Pacific Salmon Strategy Initiative, Pacific Region, Department of Fisheries and Oceans
We definitely have international arrangements, particularly with the U.S., given the migratory nature of salmon. There's the Columbia River Treaty process. There's the Pacific Salmon Treaty process more broadly.
I am not familiar enough to be able to speak to exactly what's happening regarding the Similkameen and fish migrating there, so I will have to get back to you in writing on that.
