Foreign Affairs Committee on Dec. 11th, 2012

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

That's all the time for Mr. Dechert, but I'll ask you to answer the question.

[Dr. Karen Barnes]

I would say that education, obviously, is one, and I think it's about access and making sure that all northerners have access to good quality education right up through higher learning. I think the discussion about business that was mentioned and the economic development of the region is critical in helping people understand what that means and how they are going to implement business practices and enterprise opportunities.

I think research needs to be continued on climate change; we've heard that a lot in your deliberations already. It is real. If you live up here, you see it constantly, and it's facing people in terms of food security, transportation, and other issues like that.

I think we have to think about what the whole issue of resource development and resource extraction means in the north. The environment is so fragile and so vulnerable, and we need to do it differently if we're going to do it in cold climates, and we need to really focus on that as a northern global entity.

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

Thank you very much.

Madame Péclet, five minutes, please.

[Ève Péclet, NDP, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I am very pleased to hear all the success stories you have told us about. It is very refreshing.

I would just like us to bear in mind that we are talking about international policy, the policy that Canada should have with its international partners. Last week, I asked the government a question about the fact that Canada's agenda includes many more domestic issues.

For example, most of your speech talked about the access to education, resource development and business opportunities in the north. But I would just like to point out that the Arctic Council mandate includes none of those three issues.

You mentioned research and climate change. I would just like to ask you to tell us what you think about the fact that, in its Arctic policies, Canada has not currently raised the issue of climate change at the Arctic Council.

In 2010, the Minister of Foreign Affairs talked about the Arctic strategy being based on the Canadian government's four pillars; he did not ever mention climate change. Could you comment on the fact that Canada has completely abandoned the environment as an international issue?

[Dr. Karen Barnes]

It's a very good question.

I would have to say, from the standpoint of a northerner, it is a big gap for us. As I just mentioned, when you live in the north you see the impact of climate change every single day. Certainly the elders—their people have lived here for millennia—tell us that they are seeing rapid change that is not predictable. It's impacting people everywhere.

I think it is an issue that will face governments across the north, particularly when we look at resource extraction. The disappearance of the permafrost is just one example of where we're seeing difficulties in mining and oil and gas extraction, and in the ability to build roads. We have highways in the Yukon that we spend millions on every year because of permafrost issues.

So although it may not be named, it certainly is, I think, on everyone's radar. We'll certainly be at the table. When the ambassador from Norway was here recently and visited the college, she implored us to make sure that we continued to talk about climate change and the adaptation of our communities.

We will continue to do that from the college's perspective.

[Ève Péclet, NDP, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

In your opinion, the government should make climate change one of its priorities at the Arctic Council.

[Dr. Karen Barnes]

I would say it would be a good idea going forward.

[Ève Péclet, NDP, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

Do you think that the Arctic Council is the place for Canada to discuss its national policies on education and resource development? Do you believe that it really is the appropriate forum to discuss national and domestic issues and policies, as well as the challenges faced every day by indigenous communities? Do you think that the Arctic Council is the appropriate forum at which to discuss the problems of Canada's indigenous communities?

[Dr. Karen Barnes]

As I said at the beginning of my presentation, everything begins and ends with education. To me, the Arctic Council is about providing a forum for us to learn what others in the north have learned ahead of us. Whether there are good, sustainable practices that we can learn from in the north to inform our domestic policy—that's where I see the value of the Arctic Council.

If you talk to indigenous peoples in the north, they don't see the boundaries that we do. They consider the north to be a place that is shared by all indigenous peoples north of 60 or north of wherever. For them, it's not a political discussion; it's a discussion about the land and how we're going to protect it.

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

Thank you very much.

Are there any more interventions over here?

Did you have a quick question?

[Lois Brown, Conservative, Newmarket—Aurora, ON]

I would ask a question about governance, if I may.

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

Sure.

[Lois Brown, Conservative, Newmarket—Aurora, ON]

Dr. Barnes, you talked about governance. You talked about having people trained in the north to be leaders in negotiations of land treaties, and hopefully we would see young people who are going through the education system at the college become young people who would take on responsibilities in the north as parliamentarians, as members of the legislature.

First of all, how is that course being accepted? Are you seeing great uptake on that? What are the processes for building those negotiations? Are they doing research first that can then be parlayed into some of those negotiations?

You have young people who are first nations people who have grown up with the issues. They have an internal, intrinsic understanding of some of these things. Because they are cross-border as well, are these studies then able to go into international fora?

[Dr. Karen Barnes]

To answer the first part of your question, we are seeing the uptake increasing rapidly. I think you would be very impressed to come into our communities in the Yukon and see how many of the young people are going on and completing degrees and post-graduate degrees. And many of them are returning. We have first nations lawyers from our communities, first nations engineers, and first nations geoscientists who are coming back and really participating in those negotiations—the drawing of maps and boundaries, the issues of mineral rights, etc.

You ask about cross-boundary. I'm not as familiar with land treaty negotiations outside of Canada and Alaska, but certainly just yesterday I was talking to one of the Yukon negotiators. He used to be a chancellor at our college. He has recently returned from Alaska, because they continue to seek input from the Alaska experience, particularly around oil and gas. It is further ahead than we are, so we can learn from not only its successes, but also its mistakes. We will certainly incorporate some of that research into our programming.

[Lois Brown, Conservative, Newmarket—Aurora, ON]

You talked about three baccalaureate and three master's degrees. I think one of them was a baccalaureate in science, in mining engineering.

[Dr. Karen Barnes]

Yes.

[Lois Brown, Conservative, Newmarket—Aurora, ON]

Can you tell us what the others are—

[Dr. Karen Barnes]

We have a bachelor of science in conservation sciences, we have a bachelor of education and a bachelor of social work, we have a master's in educational leadership, a master's in education curriculum, and a master's in public administration.

[Lois Brown, Conservative, Newmarket—Aurora, ON]

So for any of the engineering courses, the students are likely to have to go out of province to get that right now. Is that correct?

[Dr. Karen Barnes]

That's correct.

We have articulation agreements with southern universities that students can go into for sciences and engineering, and we're building an articulation with the university mining school in Fairbanks.

[Lois Brown, Conservative, Newmarket—Aurora, ON]

That's very interesting. I'm very interested to hear about the governance issues particularly and to see that the students are able to take that information, because I'm sure that is something the Arctic Council is going to be able to call on, as we move forward in Canada to have that expertise and that research behind them and to have those young people participate. Thank you very much for doing that.

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

Thank you, Ms. Brown.

We'll finish up with Mr. Bevington, for five minutes.

[Dennis Bevington, NDP, Western Arctic, NT]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

And thank you to President Barnes.

I'm very interested in what you had to say. I sat as chair of the Aurora College board of governors for a number of years in the Northwest Territories. I certainly could spend a little time bragging about our college system as well. However, this is an international discussion, and I have to keep it on that basis, because it's very important that we understand how these issues are going to play out.

Having said that, there was a very large meeting of UArctic in Winnipeg a month or so ago. Did you attend that? Could you give us some details of that?

[Dr. Karen Barnes]

Unfortunately, we had our student awards that night, which I always feel is very important to attend. We did send our vice-president of research and academics. Dr. Chris Hawkins did attend the meetings.

I think we have attended almost all of the rectors' meeting. That was a rectors' meeting, which includes all of the presidents and vice-presidents of all the participating universities and colleges.

From what I understand, there was a lot of discussion about the northern provinces. That was interesting to hear, because that's always been a bit of a tension in the University of the Arctic and the northern Canadian provinces.

Of course, the real value now for the University of the Arctic is primarily around the research networks. I think there was also a lot of discussion on how we're going to continue to resource our researcher community so that members can travel and continue to work together across the north.

[Dennis Bevington, NDP, Western Arctic, NT]

So you would say that U of Arctic is something we should be promoting in Canada.

I know you had a different point of view once you took over your position in Whitehorse a number of years ago. Is it safe to say you're on side with UArctic now in Canada, as a larger partner?