Government Operations Committee on June 2nd, 2021

[The Chair (Mr. Robert Kitchen (Souris—Moose Mountain, CPC)), Conservative, Robert Gordon Kitchen]

I call the meeting to order.

Welcome to meeting number 34 of the House of Commons Standing Committee on Government Operations and Estimates. The committee is meeting today from 4:33 p.m. until 6:33 p.m. today to hear from the Minister of Public Services and Procurement Canada and officials on the subject matter of the main estimates 2021-22 and the departmental plan 2021-22.

During the last 30 minutes of the meeting, we will go in camera to consider our report on the Nuctech security equipment contract study.

I would like to take this opportunity to remind all participants at this meeting that screenshots or taking photos of your screen are not permitted.

To ensure an orderly meeting, I would like to outline the following. Interpretation in this video conference will work very much like a regular committee meeting. You have a choice at the bottom of your screen of floor, English or French. Before speaking, please wait until I recognize you by name. When you are ready to speak, you can click on the microphone icon to activate your mike. When you are not speaking, your mike should be on mute.

To raise a point of order during the meeting, committee members should ensure that their microphone is unmuted and say “point of order” to get the chair’s attention.

The clerk and the analysts are participating in the meeting virtually today. If you need to speak with them during the meeting, please email them through the committee email address. The clerk can also be reached on his mobile phone.

For those people who are participating in the committee room, please note that masks are required unless seated and when physical distancing is not possible.

I will now invite the minister to make her opening statement.

Please go ahead, Minister.

[Anita Anand, Liberal, Minister of Public Services and Procurement]

Thank you.

Thank you. I am pleased to appear before you to discuss our requests for funding in the main estimates for 2021‑2022, as well as the departmental plan 2021‑2022 for Public Services and Procurement Canada.

With me today are deputy minister Bill Matthews, associate deputy minister Michael Vandergrift, and chief financial officer Wojo Zielonka.

As the department that acts as a central service provider to other government departments, PSPC is responsible for a multi-faceted and broad mandate.

Mr. Chair, as you know, PSPC continues to play a pivotal role in fighting the pandemic. Our goal right now is to get as many COVID-19 vaccines into the country as soon as possible. Thanks to a diverse portfolio of vaccines that we began building as soon as vaccine candidates showed promise, we are making progress.

As of today, more than 28 million doses of Health Canada authorized vaccines have arrived in Canada. The provinces and territories have administered more than 24 million doses. More than 66% of all Canadian adults have received at least one dose. In fact, as of today, Canada leads the G20 in terms of percentage of the population with at least one dose of vaccine. I continue to push our suppliers for more vaccine doses to be delivered earlier than scheduled.

Members may also be aware that we are already planning for the future, having established a contract with Pfizer for doses in 2022 and 2023, with options to extend into 2024. The agreement provides us with 65 million doses with access to up to 120 million more.

All of this is the result of teamwork across the Government of Canada, work that will continue until the pandemic is behind us.

At the same time, as outlined in this year's departmental plan, PSPC, Public Services and Procurement Canada, will continue to deliver on the government's other commitments, such as promoting diversity and inclusion, addressing climate change, and stimulating the economy.

One of our top priorities remains the implementation of the National Shipbuilding Strategy. We are making significant progress. However, shipbuilding is a complex business, and we must continuously improve.

We continue to deliver ships to the Coast Guard and the Royal Canadian Navy. In the process, we are growing Canada's shipbuilding industry, which contributes $1.4 billion to the country's gross domestic product and sustains approximately 12,000 jobs each year.

We will continue to work with National Defence, the Canadian Coast Guard and industry to renew Canada's federal fleet of combat and non-combat ships.

As outlined in our plan, we are taking new approaches to federal procurement. We plan to grow participation from businesses led by indigenous peoples, Black and racialized Canadians, women, LGBTQ2 Canadians and other underrepresented groups, building on successful pilots and enhanced outreach efforts to these business communities. This is a priority for me personally.

Our modernization efforts also include moving forward with a new and innovative cloud-based electronic procurement solution. The solution called CanadaBuys allows businesses, big and small, to bid more easily on tender opportunities and manage contracts and orders for goods and services from the government. I can tell you that we have already been using CanadaBuys for procurements related to COVID-19, such as gowns and cloth masks.

These are only a few of our priorities for 2021-22. To achieve these bold undertakings and support the government's work, PSPC is requesting over $4.4 billion in the 2021-22 main estimates. This represents a net increase of $443 million over last year's main estimates.

Of that amount, $285 million is for real property repairs and maintenance, which will help us protect asset integrity; continue advancements in sustainability, carbon neutrality, and accessibility, in addition to protecting the health and safety of public servants during and after the pandemic.

This has been an unprecedented time in Canada's history, but we can now see a way out of this pandemic. As we continue to support Canada's response to COVID-19, my department will keep working to provide the other essential services that Canadians expect from us.

In closing, I look forward to working with my fellow parliamentarians and our dedicated public servants to move these plans forward.

I would like to thank profusely our interpreters for their incredibly hard work not only today but throughout the past year during the pandemic.

Thank you. Merci. Meegwetch.

[The Chair, Conservative, Robert Gordon Kitchen]

Thank you, Minister.

We will start our first six-minute round of questions with Mr. McCauley.

[Kelly McCauley, Conservative, Edmonton West, AB]

Thanks, Mr. Chair.

Minister and witnesses, welcome back.

Minister, I'm looking at your departmental results from last year. PSPC achieved just 57% of its targets. Do you find that acceptable?

You are muted, madam.

[Anita Anand, Liberal, Oakville, ON]

I am sorry about that.

We are offering high-quality services and programs to support the daily operations of governments, and we provide value and sound stewardship on behalf of all Canadians. I believe that is what is emphasized in our departmental results report.

[Kelly McCauley, Conservative, Edmonton West, AB]

So you don't believe actually setting targets is important if you're only achieving 57% of them? The point of the departmental plan is to set out your priorities and your goals for the coming year and justify your spending. PSPC achieved a quite dismal 57% last year.

What is the department doing to improve this? Do you find 57% acceptable? I think you were a law professor. Would you pass someone at 57%?

[Anita Anand, Liberal, Oakville, ON]

Mr. McCauley, we certainly always need to do better. I will also say that there are areas of the departmental report where we don't have performance indicators because we need a baseline. We need to have good data in order to track our performance. In that respect, we will continue to work hard to do better.

I'd also like to mention that we've been working very hard on our COVID response—

[Kelly McCauley, Conservative, Edmonton West, AB]

Okay. I'm going to take back my time, Minister.

Canada Post has lost $1.1 billion, almost $1.2 billion, over the last couple of years. The Canada Post Corporation Act requires it to operate on a self-sustaining basis financially. What is the plan going forward to ensure fiscal sustainability with Canada Post?

[Anita Anand, Liberal, Oakville, ON]

I will say that we have been in close communication with the board of directors of Canada Post regarding its path toward financial sustainability. Indeed, we were all working very hard to respond to the COVID-19 pandemic, which to some extent did cloud the agenda—

[Kelly McCauley, Conservative, Edmonton West, AB]

One hundred million dollars of their loss.... There's still a billion....

You mentioned the board of directors. For the record, has the board submitted their corporate plan to you yet? I haven't seen it published in a while. Has it been submitted?

[Anita Anand, Liberal, Oakville, ON]

I will reiterate that we have been in very close touch—

[Kelly McCauley, Conservative, Edmonton West, AB]

Thanks, Minister. It's a really simple question. As you mentioned, you've been in close contact with the board of directors. Have they submitted the corporate plan to you? Again, I haven't seen it published in a while.

[Anita Anand, Liberal, Oakville, ON]

Thank you, Mr. McCauley. I will ask my deputy minister to respond to that question.

[Kelly McCauley, Conservative, Edmonton West, AB]

It's a simple yes or no, Mr. Matthews.

[Bill Matthews, Deputy Minister, Department of Public Works and Government Services]

There have been ongoing discussions about the corporate plan—

[Kelly McCauley, Conservative, Edmonton West, AB]

It's a simple yes or no, please. Has the board submitted its corporate plan?

[Bill Matthews]

Mr. Chair, we have been in touch with Canada Post. They've submitted documents, and it's being finalized, but obviously COVID is having an impact on the corporate plan, so it takes some extra time to work through it.

[Kelly McCauley, Conservative, Edmonton West, AB]

We did not have a plan the year before COVID, and we still don't have a plan. This is what you're saying.

We've discussed a lot in committee about buying PPE made by forced labour from China. We understand there are very minimal guidelines about purchasing. Both Mr. Matthews and you, Minister, have stated you would do more.

What actual concrete actions have been taken—I want to hear of actual actions—to ensure that we're not bringing in any PPE that was made by forced labour from Xinjiang province?

[Anita Anand, Liberal, Oakville, ON]

When awarding our contracts, we first of all require suppliers to agree to terms and conditions prohibiting these labour practices. Second, we conduct integrity checks into each supplier's background. Third, I wrote to suppliers, glove manufacturers in particular, to seek assurance from them that they were not using forced labour practices.

Those are three solid items that we have undertaken.

[Kelly McCauley, Conservative, Edmonton West, AB]

It's mostly self-attestation, but I understand the CBSA rules require companies to actually show suppliers going back to prove that it's not being used. Yet we're doing self-attestation, it appears.

Are we not following the CBSA rules for importation?

[Anita Anand, Liberal, Oakville, ON]

Of course, I can speak to PSPC actions—

[Kelly McCauley, Conservative, Edmonton West, AB]

These are taxpayers buying these items. Do we not follow the law?

[Anita Anand, Liberal, Oakville, ON]

We do follow the law, Mr. McCauley, and we take it very seriously. In fact, we—

[Kelly McCauley, Conservative, Edmonton West, AB]

Do we follow the rules as set out by CBSA?

[Anita Anand, Liberal, Oakville, ON]

We go over and above in terms of seeking attestations from the suppliers or—