Government Operations Committee on March 8th, 2023

[Gord Johns, NDP, Courtenay—Alberni, BC]

Minister, you're spending $33 million a year on your substance use assistance program. That's peanuts for how many lives are being lost.

[Mona Fortier, Liberal, Ottawa—Vanier, ON]

We are investing—

[Gord Johns, NDP, Courtenay—Alberni, BC]

People are dying. You're not acting like it's the epidemic that it is. You've never invested so little on such a health crisis: on SARS—you can name every health crisis—the HIV epidemic, COVID.... This is a drop in the bucket for how many lives are being lost.

[Mona Fortier, Liberal, Ottawa—Vanier, ON]

I think we should also recognize that the federal government, the current federal government, has invested incredible amounts during not only the COVID pandemic but also for safe supply—

[Gord Johns, NDP, Courtenay—Alberni, BC]

If you spent 1% of what you spent on COVID—

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

I'm sorry. That is our time. You'll get another moment, Mr. Johns.

We're entering the second round and our five-minute rounds.

You have five minutes, Mrs. Block.

[Kelly Block, Conservative, Carlton Trail—Eagle Creek, SK]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

Thank you to you, Minister, and to your departmental officials for being with us.

I just want to make a suggestion before I go into my questioning. While you're discussing Bill C-290 and perhaps the things you like about it and the things you don't, I would recommend that you take a look at a perfectly good OGGO study that made recommendations to address the issues within the system. It's my understanding that the report has basically been collecting dust for over four or five years now, and it actually could be implemented for free. You've had parliamentarians undertake a study on this, so please do take a look at that study.

Twice, Minister, you've mentioned “ambitious” agendas and have said that you have “an ambitious agenda”. I think an ongoing issue with the departmental plans has been the departments setting departmental results to be achieved with the money provided to them, but with dates and actual targets set with “to be advised” status. This has been brought up each time for years. You wouldn't get a bank loan for a lemonade stand by setting targets “to be advised”. A full 25%—one in four—had no stated goal for results to be achieved in a year. Why do you expect Parliament to approve money when there are no goals or targets attached to that?

[Mona Fortier, Liberal, Ottawa—Vanier, ON]

Thank you for your different comments.

I do want to mention that, of course, Bill C-290 is going to be part of our study to continue to reinforce the law about whistle-blowing. Also, the OGGO committee tabled the report. There is good in there that we will be using. I did, of course, mention earlier that much of it will be part of strengthening the act.

When we talk about transparency and responsible financial management, our government is committed to that. We bring monthly financial reports that are posted and reported in "The Fiscal Monitor". Our departments provide quarterly financial reporting. You also know that annual audited financial statements are published in the public accounts. We also table, as you know, departmental plans and departmental results reports.

For your information, we will be tabling the departmental plans tomorrow. Outside of the pilot project that we did in 2018-19, which I'm sure someone might raise, our government has tabled the departmental plans—

[Kelly Block, Conservative, Carlton Trail—Eagle Creek, SK]

Thank you, Minister.

You have not answered my question. I will move to another question.

In his report on the supplementary estimates, the PBO states in reference to a quote from you, Minister, when explaining the supplementary estimates, that “This effectively means the Government requires more time to figure out how their spending announcements can be implemented”.

Again, this seems like a trend when it comes to how the government is making announcements with great fanfare but without their being followed up with any great plan. There are goals set with no targets but simply “to be advised”, with Canadians being left in limbo not knowing exactly what their money is being spent on and when it's going to happen.

Now you've just told us—I was going to ask—when the departmental plans were going to be tabled, and that's happening tomorrow, as you've said. We'll be looking for that.

Can you confirm that every single goal in those departmental plans has a target set?

[Mona Fortier, Liberal, Ottawa—Vanier, ON]

As I mentioned, and I will repeat it, our government has ambitious targets to improve the quality of life of Canadians, and we are delivering. Some results do not yet have data—

[Kelly Block, Conservative, Carlton Trail—Eagle Creek, SK]

I've asked a question. I would really like you to answer my question—

[Mona Fortier, Liberal, Ottawa—Vanier, ON]

I am answering.

[Kelly Block, Conservative, Carlton Trail—Eagle Creek, SK]

—because this is my time.

[Mona Fortier, Liberal, Ottawa—Vanier, ON]

I understand.

[Kelly Block, Conservative, Carlton Trail—Eagle Creek, SK]

I've just asked if you can confirm if every single goal in the departmental plans has a target set. I'm sure you've seen them. If they're being tabled, you must have looked at them.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

Give a quick answer, please.

[Annie Boudreau]

In some cases, departments may not be able to have any target, and I will give you a couple of examples. Some indicators are new, and expected data were not available at the time of the reporting. That's one example. Another example is that departments may have stopped collecting data because of COVID-19. They have more pressing issues to take care of. Another example could be that they need the census to be able to get the data.

Year after year, there will be, for sure, missing targets that are not available, but there are very good reasons for that, which will be included in the documents.

[Kelly Block, Conservative, Carlton Trail—Eagle Creek, SK]

So then “no” is the answer. “No” is the answer.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

That is our time. Thank you.

Mr. Kusmierczyk, please, you have five minutes.

[Irek Kusmierczyk, Liberal, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, Madam President, for being here at the OGGO committee. It seems like you're appearing here on a regular basis—probably at least once a month—so I want to say thank you for always taking great time and care to answer our questions.

Yesterday was an historic moment in the House of Commons. The president of the European Commission, Ursula von der Leyen, addressed the House of Commons. It was an historic moment for many reasons.

She dedicated the start of her speech to the situation in Ukraine and the valour of the Ukrainian people in fighting back against brutal Russian aggression. She highlighted the decisive efforts of Canada early on in training and preparing over 30,000 Ukrainian soldiers to be ready to thwart Vladimir Putin's egregious aggression and war. She also went on to say that Canada has demonstrated tremendous and decisive global leadership in supporting Ukraine, both in terms of humanitarian and military assistance.

Of course, Canadians and Canada continue to be supportive of Ukraine's defence against Russian aggression. Can you explain what funding Canada is providing to Ukraine in these estimates?

[Mona Fortier, Liberal, Ottawa—Vanier, ON]

First, thank you.

Yes, Canada and Ukraine have a long history together. A year after Russia's illegal and unjustifiable “full-scale...invasion” of Ukraine—as the EU President, an inspirational leader who has been central to galvanizing support for Ukraine and its people, put it yesterday in her historic address—Canada continues to be....

As you know, since February 2022, Canada has committed over a billion dollars in military assistance to Ukraine. The supplementary estimates we're presenting today include funding to continue providing Ukraine with valuable military training and equipment to defend its freedom. It includes $500 million for that.

As part of the Government of Canada's response, special programs have also been introduced to help thousands of Ukrainians. If my memory serves me well, over 170,000 Ukrainians have since come to Canada. This supplementary estimate includes $170 million to provide transitional financial assistance to help those families take care of their basic needs while they settle in Canada.

Therefore, I think the answer to your question is that we are working to make sure we're supporting Ukraine in this fight.

[Irek Kusmierczyk, Liberal, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

Thank you, Madam President.

Certainly, you've just described a country—and Canadians—stepping up in this incredibly pivotal moment to defend democracy and freedom. I should clarify that we are supporting Ukraine in its defence of not just its own borders, territory and people but also democracy and freedom around the world.

You mentioned the fact that Canada and Ukraine have a long-held relationship. You stated the support being provided to Ukrainian refugees. I think you mentioned about 170,000 have arrived. I'm wondering whether you have numbers on how many have been approved for the emergency visa. I'm curious about whether you have that information off the cuff. The last number I heard was around half a million approved for an emergency visa.

I'm just wondering whether you might have that information.

[Mona Fortier, Liberal, Ottawa—Vanier, ON]

Thanks to my supporting official, I have the answer to that question.

Through the Canada-Ukraine authorization for emergency travel—the CUAET, as some call it—Ukrainian nationals and their family members can apply, as you know, for a temporary resident visa to travel to, and stay in, Canada temporarily. There were 514,000 temporary resident applications approved between March 17, 2022 of last year and January 24, 2023 of this year—probably more, by now.

That would answer your question.

[Irek Kusmierczyk, Liberal, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

Thank you.

Ms. Vignola, you have two and a half minutes.