Health Committee on May 13th, 2020

[Paul G. Brunet]

It's difficult, because we're going through a crisis. For over a year, we've been asking the government to participate in recruitment and to show that workers who work with people who are sick and with seniors who need help or assistance are employed in one of the noblest professions in society.

During the current crisis, we've acted as if we had no plan. We asked for help from doctors and the military. We must now resolve the situation by getting more people working and by asking for better supervision for our employees, as I said earlier. This is essential.

I heard my colleague say earlier that her province went all the way to the Supreme Court of Canada to make laundry free for people living in shelters. There's also the whole issue of food.

Significant challenges lie ahead. We've reached out to the different ministers of health and to the Minister of Seniors. On a political level, I understand that challenges lie ahead and that people aren't necessarily prepared to reach out to organizations such as ours. We're very critical, but we also want to—

[The Chair, Liberal, Ron McKinnon]

Mr. Brunet, we have to wrap it up.

[Paul G. Brunet]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ron McKinnon]

Thank you, Mr. Thériault.

We will go now to Mr. Davies for two and a half minutes.

[Don Davies, NDP, Vancouver Kingsway, BC]

Thank you.

Ms. Langolf, this morning I participated in a webinar sponsored by the Canadian Federation of Nurses Unions with a number of speakers. One was Dr. Samir Sinha. According to him, long-term care is the largest form of health care in the country that is not covered by the Canada Health Act. I noticed that one of your recommendations was to bring long-term care under the auspices of the Canada Health Act.

Can you tell us why you think that would be a wise course of action?

[Gudrun Langolf]

The difficulty we have is that there are 11-plus jurisdictions for health transfers of money and many more differences of quality of care or details of the service provided to citizens because it's left up to the provinces. We're not suggesting that they are negligent. It's just that they have different priorities.

Chances are that unless you provide the guidance with national standards that are clear and understandable across the board, whether you get these services depends on where you live. What happens is that it depends on where you live whether you receive the service, and that should not happen. A Canadian standard ought to be consistent across the country.

[Don Davies, NDP, Vancouver Kingsway, BC]

Thank you.

Ms. Lennox, picking up that point, according to TVA Nouvelles almost half of Quebec's residential long-term care facilities have not been inspected for more than three years. A recent CBC News investigation found only nine of Ontario's 626 long-term care facilities received a resident quality inspection in 2019.

You testified that you felt it was the duty of the federal government to make sure it doesn't happen again.

What is your advice to the committee on the proper role of the federal government in addressing long-term care?

[Marissa Lennox]

The Canada Health Act is one tool you can use in order to raise standards in long-term care. As Ms. Armstrong also mentioned, the other tool is to stand up its own legislation, similar to the Canada Health Act but specific to long-term institutional care or long-term medical home care.

When you think about the people who are receiving this type of care, though, they are requiring the highest levels of institutional care and long-term care, and it should really be treated no differently as a hospital.

I would suggest that the federal government needs to revisit its funding formula when it comes to providing this type of care, and we need to raise the standards and make sure that they are consistent across the provinces.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ron McKinnon]

Thank you, Mr. Davies.

That brings round two to a close. We will start round three with Mr. Webber.

Mr. Webber, you have five minutes.

[Len Webber, Conservative, Calgary Confederation, AB]

Five minutes is wonderful. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

My first question is for Ms. Lennox.

The Government of Canada has announced that a select group of seniors will receive $500 in a one-time payment. A greater number will receive $300 instead, but most will receive nothing. The Liberal government has suggested seniors do not need special payments for the most part, because their income has not been disrupted in the same way as the income of many other Canadians has.

Can you give us a better idea of the types of increased costs that seniors are facing as a result of this pandemic?

[Marissa Lennox]

Sure. A lot of our members have seen an increase in the cost of living, whether that's in dispensing fees for prescription medications or in the delivery of groceries, for example. A lot of seniors over the age of 70 have been told to stay home and so have had to incur those costs. In particular, low-income seniors, who may not have access to family supports or other community supports, are disproportionately impacted by this.

On top of that, we also know that a number of community support programs have shut down. Forty per cent of food banks in Toronto, for example, shut down because of COVID-19 due to physical distancing restrictions and also because of a shortage of volunteers. These are things that seniors depend on, discounted laundry services.... These are some of the ways in which [Inaudible—Editor] I would also mention that some of the tax support programs for seniors to file their taxes have also had to close their doors, and seniors are being forced to incur those costs in addition.

[Len Webber, Conservative, Calgary Confederation, AB]

Those are very good points. Can you give us any idea of an average price of these new costs at all? This would give us a better idea of how adequate or inadequate the government assistance is.

[Marissa Lennox]

It's difficult to say because on top of that—

[The Chair, Liberal, Ron McKinnon]

Ms. Lennox, your sound is very difficult for the translators. Could you speak into your mike if you have one?

[Marissa Lennox]

Yes.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ron McKinnon]

I'll pause Mr. Webber's time here for a minute.

[Marissa Lennox]

I took it out because it kept coming out. Can you hear me now?

[The Chair, Liberal, Ron McKinnon]

I can hear you. How are we for interpretation?

[Marissa Lennox]

Regarding the costs, it's difficult to say because on top of those out-of-pocket expenses, seniors have also seen significant declines in their retirement savings.

What we know about CARP members is that a majority of them are very concerned about outliving their savings, but when we talk about hard out-of-pocket costs, one of the biggest out-of-pocket expenses is prescription copayments. As you know, many of the provinces have restricted people to a [Inaudible—Editor]

[The Chair, Liberal, Ron McKinnon]

I'm sorry. You are cutting out a little bit, but if you would speak very slowly and carefully, we'll do the best we can.

[Marissa Lennox]

I'm sorry. It could be my Internet connection.

Many provinces and territories have moved to a 30-day supply on prescription medications. Previous to this it was 90 days. The reason for it is supply chain issues and fears of a hoarding mentality at the beginning.

When we have surveyed our members, on average, CARP members take about four prescription medications each, with some taking more than 10. Now that they've been reduced to a 30-day supply, they're having to pay for prescription copayments on each of those medications, and they add up. Depending on where you live in the country, as you know, those copayments and dispensing fees vary.

I don't know if I could give you a hard cost because it really depends. It's very individualized. It would depend on the individual.

[Len Webber, Conservative, Calgary Confederation, AB]

Yes. Do you feel that the government is providing an adequate amount to seniors?

[Marissa Lennox]

No, I do not.

[Len Webber, Conservative, Calgary Confederation, AB]

No.

Thank you for that.

I'll turn to Ms. Mackenzie now.

Many people have changed their buying habits as a result of this pandemic, of course, and we see that there is more online buying and curbside pickups. Many of these seniors do not have the technical comfort to shop online. Many others no longer drive, and curbside pickup is a challenge. Of course, family and friends are helping but that will not always be possible.

What is your organization doing, Ms. Mackenzie, to help seniors adjust to this new economy, and how can the government help?

[Isobel Mackenzie]

Well, we've encouraged the government around the creation of, what I've talked about already, the bc211 program. In the longer term, of the many, we've talked a lot about long-term care, but the other fault line that's been exposed in all of this is the vulnerability of seniors who are not connected to the Internet perhaps, and therefore are unable to organize those types of deliveries, and who don't have a family network to help them.

Right now, there's an outpouring of volunteers, and some of those volunteers are materializing because they have time. Some of that, I suspect, will dissipate as people return to their paid employment and have less time for volunteer work. I think it is something we need to think about, because there could be another wave. We need to remember that. Certainly here in British Columbia where we're on the downside of the curve, we are expecting potentially another outbreak in the fall. So, what does that look like, and how are we going to make sure that people get the supplies that they need?

I think when the federal government leadership provided some funding to the United Way at the federal level—the province here in British Columbia had already done that—that was helpful as well. It's going to give an opportunity for organizations on the ground to organize in their communities around how they are going to get these seniors the things that they need, remembering that this is time limited to some extent.