Evidence of meeting #10 for Health in the 45th Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was working.
A video is available from Parliament.
Bloc
Luc Thériault Bloc Montcalm, QC
I imagine that all Health Ministers want to offer the best care possible and meet the public’s needs. The resistance surrounding setting appropriate ratios in line with scientific practice criteria is specifically connected to the ministers’ lack of financial resources. They’re concerned about it.
Chronic underfunding of health: Isn’t that the elephant in the room throughout the conversations we’re having today?
President, Canadian Federation of Nurses Unions
Yes, that’s certainly the case.
I just met with all the Health Ministers. Clearly, they must be at the financial table to make sure we’re funding our health care appropriately, be it at the federal, provincial or territorial level.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Hedy Fry
Thank you very much.
Now we go to another round. It's a five-minute round, and I begin with Ms. Konanz for the Conservatives.
Helena, go ahead for five minutes.
Conservative
Helena Konanz Conservative Similkameen—South Okanagan—West Kootenay, BC
Thank you, Chair.
My questions start with Ms. Lake. Thank you for coming in today.
How has Alberta integrated international medical graduates into the health care system? How does it differ from other provinces?
Executive Director, Alberta International Medical Graduate Association
I think that in Alberta one of the things we have going for us is a long-standing practice readiness assessment program, where general practitioners, or family physicians, as well as specialists are assessed for eligibility. This has meant more opportunity for some people compared to other provinces.
The other aspect we have is that there are about 250 to 300 internationally trained physicians working in acute care settings as associate physicians. They're working there under a provisional licence. I think there is a desire to look at opportunities where those individuals might be able to work as associate physicians, in a hospitalist role or whatnot. That would be something we would support. That's not happening at the current time, but it's a solution for individuals who are demonstrating their competencies in a clinical environment and setting.
Conservative
Helena Konanz Conservative Similkameen—South Okanagan—West Kootenay, BC
Do you think this is a template that could be used for the rest of the provinces? Is it working well, would you say?
Executive Director, Alberta International Medical Graduate Association
It's a long-standing program. When I first started working with internationally trained physicians in 2004, that program was in existence. It certainly provides a great opportunity for people who meet the requirements to work in a clinical setting.
The one caveat to that particular position is that there is a three-year recency of practice requirement. Some people don't hear about that particular opportunity or may not have the recency of practice. The recency of practice, where they're working under supervision, is the same as if they are going into the practice readiness assessment position, where they're working independently.
Conservative
Helena Konanz Conservative Similkameen—South Okanagan—West Kootenay, BC
I believe you mentioned there are 3,800 people in Alberta seeking licences in health care.
Executive Director, Alberta International Medical Graduate Association
Our membership is national, so it's 3,800 people across Canada.
We support individuals in helping them navigate the licensure pathways for all provinces.
Conservative
Helena Konanz Conservative Similkameen—South Okanagan—West Kootenay, BC
What can we do better to integrate those who are already here in Canada seeking to acquire their licences and practice?
Executive Director, Alberta International Medical Graduate Association
I think certainly doing competency-based assessments, allowing people to demonstrate their skills and also looking at the work experience they have.... Often, we look at the training that somebody has, but we don't take into consideration the years of training.
Conservative
Helena Konanz Conservative Similkameen—South Okanagan—West Kootenay, BC
Do you believe there is a disconnect between immigration policy and health care planning in Canada?
Executive Director, Alberta International Medical Graduate Association
I think we could definitely be more collaborative and coordinated with regard to individuals who are coming, to make sure they get the right supports at the right time. We know that the sooner they get the support, the more likely they are to be successful.
Conservative
Helena Konanz Conservative Similkameen—South Okanagan—West Kootenay, BC
Thank you.
I will cede the rest of my time to MP Mazier.
Conservative
Dan Mazier Conservative Riding Mountain, MB
Thank you, Chair.
I'd like to move the following motion:
That, given the desire of the Minister of Health and Minister of Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship to appear together for the committee's study on the impact of immigration on health care, the ministers appear together for a full two hours and that a separate meeting be scheduled to hear from their respective departmental officials.
Can I get on with debate?
Conservative
Dan Mazier Conservative Riding Mountain, MB
The ministers decided to go against the recommendations of our motion, which said that one full meeting would be dedicated to the Minister of Health and officials, and that one full meeting would be dedicated to the Minister of Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship and officials. There were supposed to be two different meetings with their departments and with the two different ministers.
This is a compromise for the ministers, because they indicated that they wanted to meet together. This way, this would be accommodating the committee. Then it would work for the officials as well. The ministers could come in and have their say. Meanwhile, the committee could ask them some reasonable questions. I'm sure Canadians have many, especially when it comes to health care.
Conservative
Helena Konanz Conservative Similkameen—South Okanagan—West Kootenay, BC
Speaking to the motion, I think we need to respect the time of the ministers and give them a full hour and also respect the time of the people sitting around this table. We shouldn't have to rush. I think we should be able to ask as many questions as we want. Having them both in one hour.... Having to rush through a meeting won't help anyone in creating this report.
Conservative
Kelly DeRidder Conservative Kitchener Centre, ON
I think it's imperative that we have the ministers come, because there are six and a half million Canadians without a doctor right now. Also, 10 years of failed immigration has added extra strain to our health care system. On top of that, we have doctors here as taxi and Uber drivers. That was validated right here in committee today. There is no path to foreign credential recognition.
For these reasons, it's important that we hold our government accountable. It's our duty and our responsibility to do so, and Canadians deserve to hear what the government is doing about this. It's absolutely imperative that we have the Minister of Health and the Minister of Immigration come speak to this committee.
Thank you.
Bloc
Luc Thériault Bloc Montcalm, QC
I agree with the first part of the motion. Although I already said I wanted to hear from the ministers separately, proposing one two-hour meeting to have them both is a compromise I can get behind.
However, I also explained that testimony from officials was of very little interest to me. If we have them during another meeting, I would like us to also have other witnesses. If the mover agrees with that, I will get behind the motion.