Procedure and House Affairs Committee on March 4th, 2014

[David Christopherson, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

Now, the same thing could be said about Calgary. Most of them across the table like Calgary. It's another beautiful city, world-renowned, with some economic stats that are just amazing. There is a beautiful downtown to their city.

There is so much to be heard, yet this government won't go there. They won't go to Calgary or to Edmonton.

It's not as if we're only going to stand on a motion that says you have to go to the back alleys of Hamilton, two blocks over from where I live. My colleague Mr. Martin is toing and froing, but no, we really wouldn't do that.

No. What we're talking about here is inviting the committee, maybe as a selection, to go to Calgary. Surely the government members aren't afraid in Calgary—are you?

[Blaine Calkins, Conservative, Wetaskiwin, AB]

No.

[David Christopherson, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

There we go; there is one brave soul willing to say that he's not afraid.

[An hon. member]

[Inaudible--Editor]

[David Christopherson, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

Oh, you don't think we need to go there? I'm sorry; say it on the record, if you don't mind. You don't think we should go to Calgary specifically?

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

Don't talk across the table, gentlemen.

[David Christopherson, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

Thank you, Chair. I was just trying to afford the member a chance to be clear on what he seemed to want to say.

[Ève Péclet, NDP, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

Don't forget Montreal.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

You were given the floor; let's not...[Inaudible--Editor].

[David Christopherson, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

Yes, that's not going to happen. But I did give him a chance to heckle out, which I could have repeated and it would have gone into Hansard. I'm just trying to be helpful, Chair, as you can see.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

Well, we certainly appreciate that.

[David Christopherson, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

Thank you. I appreciate your appreciation.

I think going to Calgary would be a grand idea. We heard from the government that they don't want to go anywhere. They didn't qualify their comments. They said public hearings outside Ottawa would be a circus. They said public hearings outside of the Ottawa bubble would be a gong show. If that's what they honestly believe, let's go to the heartland of conservatism—Alberta—and we'll go to Calgary or we'll go to Fort McMurray.

They can pick any place they want where they feel the safest. Maybe we could hold hearings in the mines and they would feel safe there. Nobody could get at them—no bombs, no placards. That might be an idea. It's available. It's just an idea, Chair. I'm just trying to be helpful in throwing out all these ideas.

So we could go to Calgary. I'd love to go to Calgary. I can never get enough of Calgary. It's a beautiful city in a beautiful province. Let's go there. There's no hidden agenda here, Chair. There's a lot of sound and fury; I accept all of that. But there are not games in this motion. There are not.

At no time—I think I can say this. I'm not divulging secrets. At no time did I indicate to the government, when we had our short-lived negotiations, that certain cities either were or had to be on the list or off the list. We didn't get that far. At no time in our early discussions about shaping the parameters of our discussion did I say that there was somewhere we had to go or somewhere we couldn't go. So this business of its being a gong show and a circus....

Fine; let's go to some cities that the government is going to choose. Let's go to whatever area of the country they feel comfortable and safe enough in to actually say to Canadians, “Excuse me, what's your opinion?” Wherever they want to go to do that is fine.

Yes, there are a couple of places we'd like to go, that we think are a good idea. I raised Iqaluit, which I thought would make a lot of sense in terms of the ease of getting there from here, etc. I won't repeat those arguments, but I raised that issue as an example of somewhere we could go.

We could go to Saskatchewan. We held our last retreat in Regina; we could go there. Really, there's nothing scary about Saskatchewan. My dad was from Saskatchewan. I'm very proud to have Saskatchewan blood. I don't think they're scary people. I'm sure we could safely fly you in and out and guarantee that you won't be.... Well, you might be upset, but you won't be hurt.

[An hon. member]

[Inaudible--Editor]

[David Christopherson, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

I'm sorry; you seem to want the floor, but you don't have it.

I don't know what's going on, Chair. Either have him heckle so that I can hear him or ask him to be quiet—one of the two.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

I think he was making a comment with respect to your Ticats, but I won't go there.

[David Christopherson, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

Are we getting that low? Is it that bad?

[Voices]

Oh, oh!

[Tom Lukiwski, Conservative, Regina—Lumsden—Lake Centre, SK]

They're the CFL's second-best team.

[David Christopherson, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

Don't forget next year.

We're kidding here to break the moment, but I say again that the fact is that they can be cities in which the government thinks they're going to get the most support. We're not trying to jig the process the way the government jigged the bill. We're not. So if they have suggestions, we'd be open to them. I am very sincere.

I am kidding about the security and all of that, but given what was said about a gong show and a circus.... Really, what did the government expect to get back after saying things like that about Canadians? What did they think?

I'm quite prepared to say that some of the choices would be those of the government. There may be places that they want to go to because they believe they'll get good testimony and good witnesses and that they'll get supportive witnesses. That's fair enough; that's part of the process.

Why is it that we're willing, as the opposition, to accept that the government has the right to stake out some places we would go to in which they are likely to get support, but they are not willing to do the same thing in other parts of Canada where they don't have that same security? Although I have to wonder about any government that hides from its own people, because that's what's going on.

[Pat Martin, NDP, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

It's the beginning of the end.

[David Christopherson, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

Make no mistake, Chair, I'm not making this up. The government's quoted words are there. The reason they didn't want to do public hearings wasn't that they didn't think it was an important part of the process, it wasn't that they didn't want to hear from Canadians, and it wasn't that they didn't want to go to certain parts of the country—all things they could have said about why they don't want to travel that would at least have been a respectable comment they could have hidden behind.

No. Instead, they did what comes natural to them, which is to lash out and insult people. So then we got the remarks about a gong show, a circus—

[Pat Martin, NDP, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

Shame.

[David Christopherson, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

It is shameful. It's very shameful, because that's a part of the democratic process. It's called free speech. Free speech happens quite often outside the House of Commons, out on Parliament Hill, on the street. People very peacefully come and they protest and they have concerns. Not once has that stopped us from being able to do our jobs. They respectfully do their protest thing, and we respectfully go about doing our work, and hopefully, if their cause is good and just, we will be affected by it and it will ultimately affect the way we make decisions.

But this whole notion that we can't do public hearings—

[Craig Scott, NDP, Toronto—Danforth, ON]

In Calgary....

[David Christopherson, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

—in Calgary because it will be a gong show.... Really?

I wonder if they make that kind of statement at Calgary City Hall, that they can't trust their citizens to come out and behave in a civilized fashion, and that they would just participate in what the government wants to call a gong show. I don't know who the genius was that came up with that as the response, but boy, that was not the one to give.

But what it did do was give us an insight into the way the government views the very citizens who they govern, and that is, with contempt, with a measure of fear.

All we've done with our motion is to point out the importance of the process to this bill. We believe the process in its own way is as important as the bill. Because if there is an unfair process, how can you come up with a fair bill and a fair election, with a fair elections act?

The government's arguments don't hold. But I have maintained, and it's my position, that the government doesn't care about how much negativity there is because it's more than worth it. Whatever negative press, whatever negative hits they take now, it's worth it because they're banking on Canadians forgetting and not thinking about this again until the election is in the bag. Then they'll worry about dealing with everything afterwards.

That's why they have no problem being so disrespectful, and that's why they sit there the way they do looking everywhere except at themselves as to why we're here tonight. It's certainly not because I enjoy talking—I do—but even I don't like talking this long.

It's funny to see the people who speak for me laugh.

It's got us in a place now where you have a bit of a standoff. I'll continue to go as long as I can.