Evidence of meeting #10 for Human Resources, Skills and Social Development and the Status of Persons with Disabilities in the 40th Parliament, 3rd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was ccl.
A recording is available from Parliament.
4:55 p.m.
Some hon. members
Oh, oh!
4:55 p.m.
Conservative
Lisa Raitt Conservative Halton, ON
I don't want to seem facetious about it, but it's very true. If you make it an obligation for an employer and if you make it an incentive for an employer in that they are able to have a part of the procurement process within the federal government, it's enough to have them want to follow the rules. We're there to help them do so, and when it's not done, we're also there to tell them that it has to be done.
5 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Candice Bergen
Thank you, Minister.
We do have bells at 5:15, but if the ministers are all right with this, I'd like to allow Mr. Martin to finish off this round with his question. I think then we'll have completed the questions. Unfortunately, after that point we won't have time for another full round.
Is it all right with the ministers if Mr. Martin asks a question?
5 p.m.
NDP
Tony Martin NDP Sault Ste. Marie, ON
I have a couple of questions, hopefully one for each of you.
One is on the self-employed EI program. We had a forum in the Soo last week. Your Service Canada employees were excellent. They came in and were very gracious. A number of self-employed people came, because they were very interested.
They were, first of all, a bit frustrated that they hadn't heard enough about it up until then. None of them were able to take advantage of that early sign-on date; I think it was April 1 to qualify by June 1. They weren't able to get in because they hadn't heard about it, so when we set up the forum, they came. They raised a couple of issues. I'm just wondering how it's rolling out and how many people have actually signed on.
The folks who were there that evening were very concerned. Many of them own their own businesses and are self-employed. It seemed that the program was sort of income-based and that a lot of things were triggered by their income tax. If they went off on benefit, perhaps had a child, had somebody come in to replace them and keep the business going, and then that business actually continued to generate income, would that income then act as a clawback...? Would the benefit be clawed back once they filed their income taxes? That was one of the questions. They were a bit concerned about that.
So, how many have signed on, and is this issue a problem?
5 p.m.
Conservative
Diane Finley Conservative Haldimand—Norfolk, ON
This is a new program. We wanted to make sure people knew about it. We had a very short window in which to do this, but we did do an advertising campaign.
We worked very closely with the chambers of commerce--the national and the local chambers. The Canadian Federation of Independent Business was putting stuff on their website, as was the Direct Sellers Association.
We have a number of groups that can reach a broad range of self-employed, because they vary from people who do part-time work as an Avon lady to lawyers who are earning hundreds of thousands of dollars a year on a self-employed basis. There's a broad audience here, of some 2.6 million Canadians, and we made a lot of efforts, including on our own website, with a feature right on the front page, to try to attract attention to this to get people to sign up. That information is still there.
In terms of the tax situation you've described, it would vary from person to person depending on their corporate structure and their financial structure. If they took that money as personal income, there could be an issue there. If the money was paid to the replacement employee, that's a whole separate issue. It's going to vary for individual cases, but I'm pleased to say that over 3,000 people have signed up so far.
5 p.m.
NDP
Tony Martin NDP Sault Ste. Marie, ON
The message I'm bringing to you from them is that it's not clear. They're very concerned. They're not buying in because they're afraid. They pay, and they want the coverage, but they're concerned that once they actually go on leave and the business continues to generate income, they'll in fact lose, and there will be no benefit for them there. I'll just leave it at that.
5 p.m.
Conservative
Diane Finley Conservative Haldimand—Norfolk, ON
I'm glad you mentioned that, Mr. Martin. We'll try to clarify that for them.
5 p.m.
Conservative
Diane Finley Conservative Haldimand—Norfolk, ON
Sure, and I enlist the support of all the members in letting self-employed Canadians know about this terrific option for them, so that they don't have to choose between their work responsibilities and their families.
5 p.m.
NDP
Tony Martin NDP Sault Ste. Marie, ON
The other question I have is with regard to Habitat for Humanity, which is, as you know, another wonderful vehicle out there that is building homes for people. They brought a really interesting scenario to my attention in regard to trying to find families.
On one end, if you don't make enough, you don't qualify. You have a number of families that are just below the threshold, so they don't get in, and they'd really benefit if they could. Sweat equity doesn't work as well as some of us think it should in terms of that. On the top end, for people who should qualify and are now getting the child tax benefit, the child care benefit, and their GST rebate, those things are putting them over the threshold.
So in my area, with a population of 75,000 to 85,000, they're finding it hard to find the family that actually fits because of those two thresholds. Why is that? Who makes those decisions? Who puts in place those criteria? How can we be more flexible here so that we can get some families into homes?
5:05 p.m.
Conservative
Diane Finley Conservative Haldimand—Norfolk, ON
Habitat for Humanity is a great program, no question about it. It is an international program and is totally independent of the federal government. They do make their own decisions. We work with them in different situations, but they are an independent operation making their own decisions.
5:05 p.m.
NDP
Tony Martin NDP Sault Ste. Marie, ON
So those criteria, top and bottom, are not driven by Canada Mortgage and Housing in terms of the mortgage and that kind of thing...?
5:05 p.m.
NDP
Tony Martin NDP Sault Ste. Marie, ON
Because the person I was talking to didn't seem to know either where that actually came from. So you're saying to go back to Habitat for Humanity, that it's there.
5:05 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Candice Bergen
Thank you very much.
I would like to thank the ministers for being here. We've appreciated the time that you spent—
Mr. Savage.
5:05 p.m.
Liberal
Michael Savage Liberal Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS
On a point of order, Madam Chair, I appreciate the ministers being here as well, but we did pass a motion at this committee, unanimously, that the ministers would stay for 90 minutes. There's no need to leave. The votes are about 11 seconds that way; I know we have bells coming up. I wonder if we could do another round.
5:05 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Candice Bergen
Well, we would need unanimous consent, because as soon as the bells ring, I do need to adjourn the meeting. We don't have time right now for a full second round, so we definitely would have to stay past 5:15. I'm not sure if the ministers are able to stay that long.
Mr. Lessard.
5:05 p.m.
Bloc
Yves Lessard Bloc Chambly—Borduas, QC
If we start right away and we have three minutes each, we'll have just enough time.
5:05 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Candice Bergen
To be fair, actually, to finish this round we do have one more question that would be allowed from the government side. That would be a five-minute question; I was actually hoping that the government wouldn't mind if we didn't proceed with that. But if we want to finish the round, then right now we would go to Mr. Lobb for five minutes.
5:05 p.m.
Liberal
Michael Savage Liberal Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS
Pardon me. I defer to your judgment and wisdom. You've been a scrupulous chair--no problem. I wonder if we could then proceed on the basis that the Conservatives could have their five-minute round, and then we could begin the next round and get as far as we can before we have to adjourn.
5:05 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Candice Bergen
Let's make that decision now. First of all, I need to ask the ministers if they would be able to stay past 5:15.