Citizenship and Immigration Committee on Oct. 20th, 2009

[Martin Collacott]

Yes.

[Andrew Kania, Liberal, Brampton West, ON]

Secondly, they're reviewing it on very limited technical grounds such as whether there has been a mistake on the question of fact or law, something like that. It's not a full review to determine whether it was just simply correct as a decision, you will agree.

[Martin Collacott]

They do in fact get into questions of merit, although you're quite right, technically their job is to simply review whether due legal process has been followed.

[Andrew Kania, Liberal, Brampton West, ON]

Not whether or not the decision was what they would do, but whether there were some mistakes made.

[Martin Collacott]

Yes.

[Andrew Kania, Liberal, Brampton West, ON]

So in essence there is no appeal right now, correct?

[Martin Collacott]

In principle.

[Andrew Kania, Liberal, Brampton West, ON]

That's right.

[Martin Collacott]

There's no appeal on the merits, technically.

[Andrew Kania, Liberal, Brampton West, ON]

Right, exactly. That's the point; there's no appeal on the merits. And even for somebody who wants to try to get judicial review, they have to find a source to fund that to go to court. You can't do it for free, correct? You need a lawyer.

[Martin Collacott]

Yes, and you can get legal aid.

[Andrew Kania, Liberal, Brampton West, ON]

Assuming that they give enough hours and assuming that they approve the person, right?

[Martin Collacott]

Yes.

[Andrew Kania, Liberal, Brampton West, ON]

So in essence, then, you'll agree that there really should be an appeal mechanism at some point, out of fairness, to make sure that the substance of the decision is actually reviewed by somebody. You must agree with that.

[Martin Collacott]

I've said that already.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Okay.

I'm going to give Mr. Young a question.

Go ahead, sir.

[Terence Young, Conservative, Oakville, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

Mr. Collacott, did you say there are 10 million people in refugee camps in the world?

[Martin Collacott]

Yes, and those aren't just internally displaced; those are actual refugees outside the country.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

A point of order, Mr. St-Cyr.

[Thierry St-Cyr, Bloc, Jeanne-Le Ber, QC]

On a point of order, Mr. Chair. I understand that Mr. Young still has questions he would like to ask, but when this committee was formed, we established certain rules. Accordingly, after the Liberal critic, it is the Bloc Québécois' turn to ask a question.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

You're right. You have the floor for a couple of minutes.

[Ève-Mary Thaï Thi Lac, Bloc, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC]

Good morning, gentlemen.

[Terence Young, Conservative, Oakville, ON]

On the same point of order.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Mr. St-Cyr is right, although he's not taking his—

[Terence Young, Conservative, Oakville, ON]

I'm not disagreeing, sir. I'm trying to understand, Chair, what is this procedure where you say to the committee members “hold up your hand and whoever is first”—