Citizenship and Immigration Committee on May 4th, 2010

[Les Linklater]

Not yet, but a few years ago, for example, Australia implemented that kind of system, with an exemption for New Zealand. It is something we could look at in the context of our political work, but obviously one would need the necessary infrastructure to assess each individual wanting to come into Canada each year, especially given the trade between Canada and the United States—

[Denis Coderre, Liberal, Bourassa, QC]

I understand all that. We have agreements and we can get more agreements. The first thing the minister said was that when visas are required, that allows for the orderly flow of people arriving here, does it not?

[Les Linklater]

Yes.

[Denis Coderre, Liberal, Bourassa, QC]

We've been talking about Hungary. If one follows the same logic, the department should be considering a global visa, and then craft specific agreements for the North American continent, or something like that. If you do that you control the flow of individuals. In actual fact, people go where they don't need a visa in order to get in. It's logical, it was like that before. If we do this, we don't need to change policy and start designating safe countries.

Have you considered this?

[Les Linklater]

No, not yet, given that we don't have the means to implement this type of system on a global scale. With our network abroad, a system like that would require several years of work and obviously the corresponding resources needed to implement it.

[Denis Coderre, Liberal, Bourassa, QC]

But you're discussing it?

[Les Linklater]

We always have discussions with our partners. Maybe at some point in the future this will be a vision we'll be able to work on. However, there is no real policy on that issue currently.

[Denis Coderre, Liberal, Bourassa, QC]

That's another step. You're considering those options and you discuss them, but have you discussed them with the minister?

[Les Linklater]

No. As I said, we have discussions with our partners, especially Australia and the United States. However we have not put together any policy proposal as such.

[Denis Coderre, Liberal, Bourassa, QC]

You have a safe third country agreement that has nothing to do with what's in the bill—we agree that's completely different. Under that agreement, if you go to the United States, for example, given that your country is a signatory to the Geneva Convention, you make your claim in the United States, and then you're taken back, unless there's an exception, for example if we don't have the same foreign policy as certain countries and there are exceptional measures. That is the agreement that was reached with the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees at the time, and that I negotiated.

In the same way, if we wanted a global visa, we wouldn't have to change the policy if the main goal of the bill was a focus on process and selection of well-founded appeals, and also, if you were already able through regulations to create an orderly system or flow of people.

[Les Linklater]

It's an interesting concept, but you must remember that a certain proportion of claimants have already managed to obtain access to Canada through a visa or another status document. Afterwards they submit a claim.

[Denis Coderre, Liberal, Bourassa, QC]

I'm asking all these questions because ultimately the spirit of the law is just as important, if not more important, than what is written down. If the main purpose were to control...

We've always said that in Canada we have a policy that strikes a balance between openness and vigilance. We don't build walls but we do control the doors. And if we control the doors, but we completely change the principle by using a label that states that a country is safe, then what will be the initial reaction of a civil servant or board member when faced with a claimant coming from that country? They'll ask them what they're doing here. They won't believe that refugees can come from Japan, for example. That's something that the minister said at the time, among other things, when we asked him questions.

I would like to know what's hiding behind this policy. This could have been done through regulations, and you have the ability to propose that. That was already proposed to me, when I was minister.

The minister said he didn't have that option, yet it is an option. Didn't you propose it?

[Les Linklater]

In the current context of the act, what you're suggesting is a significant departure for Canada with respect to managing access to our territory.

It should be recalled that even with visas, people will have access to our system for requesting asylum, refugee protection. Furthermore, there will still be problems even with an assessment of the good faith of individuals before they come to Canada.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Okay. Thank you very much again to all of you for coming. We may or may not wish you to come again, but you've been very helpful with your answers. Thank you very much.

[Les Linklater]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

We will suspend for a moment and go in camera.

[Proceedings continue in camera]