Citizenship and Immigration Committee on May 4th, 2010

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Thank you.

We'll go to Ms. Chow.

[Olivia Chow, NDP, Trinity—Spadina, ON]

How many more IRB workers are you seeking to hire?

[Les Linklater]

I believe that in the refugee determination division, the IRB would be looking to hire approximately 100 new decision-makers.

[Olivia Chow, NDP, Trinity—Spadina, ON]

They would replace the IRB board members who are now making decisions, right?

[Les Linklater]

Do you mean at the front line?

[Olivia Chow, NDP, Trinity—Spadina, ON]

Yes.

[Les Linklater]

Yes.

[Olivia Chow, NDP, Trinity—Spadina, ON]

On the safe countries question, it says here that if they come from, say, England, which is a safe country, but they are originally from the Congo, they would be classified under safe countries, if England is part of the list, even though they come originally from a country that is not on the safe country list. Am I correct?

[Les Linklater]

When we examine the claims of individuals, it's based on their nationality. If someone is a dual national, for example, we would look at that. If someone holds a passport from a safe country, and that is the identity the person presents to the IRB for the purposes of a claim, and if that country, as I said, is designated as safe, the person would be channelled into the safe country of origin. Essentially, as the minister has said, I think during second debate and quite publicly, one of the things we would look at is whether people could avail themselves of state protection from a country that is deemed to be safe.

[Olivia Chow, NDP, Trinity—Spadina, ON]

It's the same if the safe third country is the U.S. So if they're able to go back to the U.S., even though they are, say, from the Congo, and if the U.S. is on the safe country list--putting aside that agreement--then this person would go into a safe country stream, even though the torture and all of that really came from the Congo, for example, and not from Hungary, which may be on the list.

[Les Linklater]

If I understand the question correctly, Mr. Chair, it's if someone holds a passport of a country that is deemed safe by the minister, would they be channelled into the safe country stream. The answer is yes. However, they would, as the minister said very clearly, have the right to have their claim heard—

[Olivia Chow, NDP, Trinity—Spadina, ON]

I know that, but they wouldn't have the right to appeal.

[Les Linklater]

—and have it adjudicated on its merits.

They would not have the right to appeal to the RAD, that's correct.

[Olivia Chow, NDP, Trinity—Spadina, ON]

I find that quite unfair.

What about the new evidence? It seems that when you're doing the appeal, existing materials cannot be presented if they have already been presented during the original hearings. The IRB, by and large, would only be hearing new evidence.

What if they just want to appeal on the initial decision? That seems to be what the legislation says.

[Les Linklater]

In effect, an individual who receives a negative RPD decision can appeal that on any ground to the RAD.

[Olivia Chow, NDP, Trinity—Spadina, ON]

But what they can submit--

[Les Linklater]

But they could also introduce new evidence to the RAD as well.

[Olivia Chow, NDP, Trinity—Spadina, ON]

Of course, but can they introduce the older material?

[Les Linklater]

Yes.

[Olivia Chow, NDP, Trinity—Spadina, ON]

So it's not just new material?

[Les Linklater]

Correct.

[Olivia Chow, NDP, Trinity—Spadina, ON]

Okay.

And in terms of getting the pre-assessment review, if they are from the safe countries track and they didn't get the appeal, can they still go through PRRA, if PRRA takes more than a year, but they would be deported within a year, so you could still deport prior to a hearing?

[Les Linklater]

If the person is ready for removal within the one year from their last negative decision?

[Olivia Chow, NDP, Trinity—Spadina, ON]

That's right.

[Les Linklater]

Yes, they would not have access to a PRRA—