Citizenship and Immigration Committee on Nov. 18th, 2025

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

I don't doubt that you have very capable officers, and I'm sure there are management-level people who are also very dedicated and want to do their job. I'm sure that's why you signed up for the job in the first place.

What you're saying is basically that, coming from the government and into senior management levels, there's a culture that the job is to be more customer service-oriented rather than security-oriented. Is that fair?

[Mark Weber]

Yes, my experience at the CBSA, and what I hear from my members, is that there's nothing more frightening than a wait time. That always seems to be the focus: “Keep it moving; keep the wait times down. Keep it moving; keep the wait times down. Get them out the door and go.”

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

Basically, if you create a wait time—in other words, if you take a few extra minutes to do your job—that is viewed negatively from a management perspective.

[Mark Weber]

It is. I've heard some pretty extreme stories about people who are spoken to about taking too long, about going too far in the interview. That's everything that you're there for. I question what the 18-week training and the one-year apprenticeship are for, if I'm simply there to watch a machine allow people in.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

This just gets worse, because you're basically saying that if an officer has some suspicions, let's say, and wants to ask a few more questions and takes a little bit longer, they can actually be punished for something like that.

[Mark Weber]

I've never seen anyone punished for taking too long, but I think you're reminded that your co-workers are dealing with an extreme volume and you're told, “Can we please keep the line moving?”

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

You're told to move it along.

You also used the word “facilitation”. When you or your members decided that they wanted to become CBSA officers, were they thinking they were going to be facilitators, customer service people, serving drinks or whatever this conjures up in your mind?

[Mark Weber]

We're not serving drinks yet.

Certainly not. It's a learning curve. I do meet with the recruits when they go through Rigaud, and I see the eagerness and everything that they want to do and why they get into the work. I guess I'm a bit of a Debbie Downer, in that I try to give them a realistic picture of what they can expect when they get to their workplace. It's a little bit disappointing that this has to be part of what they learn.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

I have a Roxham Road question. As you said, the RCMP dealt with people at Roxham Road, and from what I understand they were simply given a customs violation for crossing that border, rather than a charge that could have been done under IRPA or something like that. Can you speak to that at all?

[Mark Weber]

I don't know any specifics around that. I'm sorry.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

Are there certain charges under IRPA that should be levelled against somebody irregularly entering our country?

[Mark Weber]

There are, yes.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

To your knowledge, you don't know if they were applied at Roxham Road.

[Mark Weber]

I couldn't speak to exactly what happened with the charges that were levelled there, sorry.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

Even today, it's the RCMP, not CBSA, that deals with irregular crossers. Is that correct?

[Mark Weber]

That's correct. The RCMP has different combinations of provincial authorities, depending on the province, that are doing that work as well.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

I think I've heard enough.

[The Chair, Liberal, Julie Dzerowicz]

Thank you so much, Mr. Redekopp.

Thank you, Mr. Weber.

We have Ms. Sodhi next for five minutes.

[Amandeep Sodhi, Liberal, Brampton Centre, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Mr. Weber. I know it's been a long hour of questioning for you.

Once again, I just want to reiterate the staffing shortages that the CBSA has had in recent years. You've spoken about it multiple times. This is exactly why our government is committed to hiring 1,000 new CBSA officers. I know you've mentioned that it's just a start, but it's to support the important work that your members do on the front lines.

Can you once again tell us how the day-to-day operations of CBSA officers will improve through both the hiring of these new officers and the new tools that Bill C-12 introduces in terms of how your members are able to process asylum claims at points of entry, which have decreased about 30% in comparison to last year?

[Mark Weber]

Thank you.

The 14 days should decrease some of the amount of work that they have to do. In terms of facilities for examining exports, if those facilities are indeed built for us to be able to do it, that would be tremendous as well. Staffing will help, as long as, again, the staff is allocated to the front line. We see that the CBSA is an organization that is very management-heavy. We have small armies of middle- and lower-level managers. We currently have a contest—I'd urge everyone to visit our website—where we have members send in the most outrageous ratio of managers to officers at our workplaces. In some, we have twice as many superintendents as officers working the line.

That has gotten absolutely out of hand, and it has gotten worse every year at the CBSA. We have superintendents, chiefs, administrative superintendents and administrative chiefs at ports of entry, with two people working with a lineup further than you can see. That is not uncommon, and I see that in every workplace I go to. Anything above a BSO does not process a traveller. That's really something on top of all this that has to be looked at as well. The 1,000 will help, but I really urge the CBSA to apply it where it needs to be applied—that is people who actually interact with the travellers and focus on the security of Canada.

[Amandeep Sodhi, Liberal, Brampton Centre, ON]

You've previously noted that outdated or manual processes can slow decision-making and increase pressure on CBSA officers. Do you believe the modernization measures in Bill C-12 would offer improvements that will reduce bottlenecks and help your members work more efficiently?

[Mark Weber]

Yes, I think they could. Again, it's very difficult, because there's no detail on how this is going to be implemented, so without that detail, it's a difficult question to ask. There's definitely a lot that is positive in here. Our concerns are mostly around the implementation. How is that going to happen? Is that going to happen with a focus on the front line, on security and on getting back to actually speaking to travellers and looking to do interdiction, or will the focus around that be on introducing more technology to allow people to further self-declare and circumvent the people who are there to keep Canadians safe?

[Amandeep Sodhi, Liberal, Brampton Centre, ON]

Do you have any recommendations in terms of the improvements and the modernization tools?

[Mark Weber]

Yes. Use the people you have in place, such as the accommodated officers I mentioned, the 200-some who can start assisting and start doing the actual interviews with the refugee claimants, and get back to the kind of system we used to have before it was completely self-serve. Make the focus of working at ports of entry on interacting with travellers coming through and speaking to travellers, not relying just on the machine. Reduce the number of middle managers we have in order to get the numbers up at the front line so we have the people to do those interviews. I don't need six people supervising three people working; that is crazy by any measure, and that's currently what we have.

[Amandeep Sodhi, Liberal, Brampton Centre, ON]

You've emphasized the importance of having timely and accurate information when dealing with complex or high-risk cases. My last question for you is this: Do you believe the enhanced information-sharing measures in Bill C-12 would improve frontline decision-making and the system's overall integrity?