Subcommittee on International Human Rights Committee on Feb. 28th, 2022

[Jeremy England]

States will choose the available mechanisms to respond depending on the situation. We aren't in a position to judge whether sanctions should be imposed.

However, clearly sanctions have many unintended consequences. It's necessary to implement exceptions or permissions as soon as the sanctions are established to ensure that humanitarian assistance organizations, for example, can operate. People will always think of themselves, but that isn't really what matters most.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

Thank you. I appreciate it.

[Denis Trudel, Bloc, Longueuil—Saint-Hubert, QC]

Thank you, Mr. England and Ms. Byrnes.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

Now we turn to Mr. Boulerice.

You have seven minutes.

[Alexandre Boulerice, NDP, Rosemont—La Petite-Patrie, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I want to thank the witnesses for joining us this evening to discuss these broad and critical topics.

Mr. England, several children of Canadian citizens are stuck in refugee camps in Syria. There was a documentary on this topic called Children of Daech. One child was repatriated here to Canada at the request of family members. However, there are still 24 or 25 children in camps there.

In your opinion, how could Canada do more or better in terms of repatriating these children to their families here at home?

[Jeremy England]

Thank you for the question.

The ICRC is very concerned about the situation of children and families who have been held for a long time in northwestern Syria. We've consistently called for the countries of origin of these citizens, both adults and children, to take all possible steps to repatriate them, including through their national justice systems. The countries can work on both the legal process and the reunification of families to ensure reintegration into civil society.

We're talking about all Canadians who require repatriation, not just the children. They must be dealt with in some way, either through the legal system or through the social system.

For children, it's even more urgent, obviously. I can't go into detail about the 24 cases that you mentioned. However, we can communicate bilaterally and see what we can do in some cases. We also want to avoid repatriating children if their families are still in Syria. That could further harm the children. This situation requires a comprehensive solution.

Only two or three weeks ago, there was an attack in northwest Syria. Until a solution is found for all the international workers on the ground, there won't be any stability.

[Alexandre Boulerice, NDP, Rosemont—La Petite-Patrie, QC]

Thank you, Mr. England. This is a key issue for many people here in Quebec.

Ms. Byrnes, I want to ask a question about an issue that may stray somewhat from the topic at hand for the past hour. I'll circle back to the pandemic.

According to Oxfam‑Québec, how important is equity in access to vaccines?

What more should Canada do to lift the patents on these vaccines so that some countries can access them, given the tremendous inequity in access to vaccination around the world at this time?

[Denise Byrnes]

Yes, you're absolutely right about the inequity.

Oxfam will be releasing an update this week on the issue of deaths, which are much higher in low‑ and middle‑income countries than in countries such as Canada. We hear that some countries are less affected, but that some middle‑income countries, such as Brazil, India and South Africa, have been hit very hard. The lack of vaccines, lack of access to treatment and overcrowded hospitals have resulted in many more deaths, which aren't always recorded. There has been extensive research on the topic.

The current trend in Canada is to think that the pandemic is almost over and that everything is opening up. However, that isn't the case in other places. This inequity has been going on for a considerable amount of time, since the start of the pandemic. It's time to launch the discussion to ensure that patents are no longer protected by pharmaceutical companies. These companies have made ample profits. They're indeed investing in pharmaceutical development. However, these companies have made tremendous profits, which are well documented. People are dying simply because they don't have access to a vaccine and treatment. Many children are losing their mothers. Several countries have recorded the number of children who have lost their mothers because of COVID‑19. This is really an issue.

We also have the power to pursue this issue and to ensure that Canada plays a clearer role in the removal of patents. Canada hasn't yet taken a strong stance on this issue. It hasn't said yes and it hasn't said no. About 100 countries have said yes and others have said no to the removal. We would like to hear Canada speak out in favour of lifting patents. This is a matter of human rights, equity and justice. We know that women and children are hardest hit by COVID‑19. Women are even more affected as the primary caregivers.

[Alexandre Boulerice, NDP, Rosemont—La Petite-Patrie, QC]

Thank you for your response, Ms. Byrnes.

We've heard more or less the same thing about the removal of patents. We hear one thing and then we hear the opposite. To some extent, the federal government is saying both things right now.

If I still have some time, I want to ask Mr. Turkel a question.

Mr. Turkel, you told us about an issue of significant concern to the Canadian Parliament, namely, the situation of the Uyghur people in China. The Uyghur people are being subjected to genocide, the oppression of their rights and forced labour.

You also spoke about the situation of Muslim people in India. I'm less familiar with this issue. It isn't discussed as much in the news.

What's happening to Muslim people right now? What are they currently experiencing in India?

[Nury Turkel]

As part of my government role at USCIRF, we monitor 29 countries under the International Religious Freedom Act of 1998. Alarms have been sounding in India in the last few years. The trend line is deeply disturbing. This is one area that everyone needs to be focused on. As discussed earlier, much of the rhetoric, the hatred, racism, Islamophobia is actually quietly promoted by the government officials. It's not a state policy, but very subtle. We've seen this in China and India. We're seeing it elsewhere.

One significant problem that we all have to think about and deal with is that in the last 10 years, the international community has experienced at least three known genocides, starting with the Yazidis, the Rohingyas and then the Muslim Uighurs in China. I'm afraid that the Muslim population in India might be meeting a similar type of fate.

There are more than 150 countries, state parties, to the Genocide Convention. In response to the Uighur genocide, there have only been eight countries and parliaments that have recognized it. So the rest of the world, the rest of the state parties to this important legal tool or mechanism, are still sleeping at the switch, if not wilfully ignoring this. They're failing to fulfill their treaty obligation.

If you don't act, if you don't show leadership, the bad actors will be getting bad ideas and encouragement, and will be emboldened. We see this repeatedly everywhere around the world. The human rights and religious freedom policy positions should be a key component of our foreign policy approaches, otherwise we'll end up dealing with a humanitarian disaster and national security threats.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ali Ehsassi]

Thank you, Mr. Turkel.

Allow me to thank all three witnesses—Mr. Turkel, Ms. Byrnes and Mr. England. We're grateful for your testimony and for taking our questions.

Members, we do have committee business to do, so I ask that you each log off from this meeting and use the link that's been provided for in camera business.

Thank you.

[Proceedings continue in camera]