Evidence of meeting #15 for National Defence in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was family.
A recording is available from Parliament.
5:30 p.m.
As an Individual
Dr. Madeleine Nicole Maillette
According to the 200 individuals who answered, most of them have finished high school, which is different from what we had before. A lot of them have a first year of college or a first year of university.
5:30 p.m.
Conservative
Kerry-Lynne Findlay Conservative South Surrey—White Rock, BC
Do you know what portion of the recruits are male or female?
5:30 p.m.
Conservative
Kerry-Lynne Findlay Conservative South Surrey—White Rock, BC
Do you know what portion of recruits are indigenous?
5:30 p.m.
Conservative
Kerry-Lynne Findlay Conservative South Surrey—White Rock, BC
In your opinion, do you think Canadians join the Canadian Forces to be peacekeepers and to fight if necessary, or to fight climate change?
5:30 p.m.
As an Individual
Dr. Madeleine Nicole Maillette
The people I talked to are looking to be peacekeepers. When it comes to climate change, if it can help someone, yes they will. If it doesn't, then no, they won't. They would rather be peacekeepers.
5:30 p.m.
Conservative
Kerry-Lynne Findlay Conservative South Surrey—White Rock, BC
They don't have specialized training on climate change. Is that correct?
When they are deployed for those services, I'm told that often they end up just kind of keeping things in order because they don't actually have training in firefighting or flood control specifically. Is that correct?
5:30 p.m.
As an Individual
Dr. Madeleine Nicole Maillette
I'm sorry. I cannot answer this one. I don't know.
5:30 p.m.
Conservative
Kerry-Lynne Findlay Conservative South Surrey—White Rock, BC
What kinds of inducements are available and do you think should be available to get people to join the Canadian Forces? Better support for families sounds as though it would be one of them.
5:30 p.m.
As an Individual
Dr. Madeleine Nicole Maillette
That is one of them. Another is changing the way that instruction given to the soldier is recognized in certain academic functions. In certain areas, it's not recognized at all, and that is causing a problem for some soldiers to advance in academia.
5:30 p.m.
Conservative
Kerry-Lynne Findlay Conservative South Surrey—White Rock, BC
Some people in service actually.... I've seen many who have obtained a high level of education through the support of the armed forces. Is that not correct?
5:30 p.m.
As an Individual
Dr. Madeleine Nicole Maillette
Yes, that is correct. However, some of the instruction they get in the military training is, sometimes, simply not recognized in the public service.
5:30 p.m.
Conservative
Kerry-Lynne Findlay Conservative South Surrey—White Rock, BC
I was a little disturbed by your testimony. You said there was a lack of bereavement time given. What do you mean by that?
Were people who lost a family member not allowed leave to deal with that? Is that what you're talking about?
5:30 p.m.
Conservative
5:30 p.m.
As an Individual
Dr. Madeleine Nicole Maillette
Military policy is very specific as to the kind of bereavement you are allowed to have or not allowed to have.
Let's say that you lose an aunt, who was your mother for 20 years. Because she's an “aunt”, you will not get the bereavement leave, even though you considered her to be your mother.
5:30 p.m.
Conservative
Kerry-Lynne Findlay Conservative South Surrey—White Rock, BC
I take it that what you're saying is that these are not looked at as individual cases. It's like a grid, and you either fit the grid or you don't fit the grid, which is extremely impersonal and not conducive to a happy workplace.
Is that what you're telling us?
5:30 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal John McKay
Thank you, Ms. Findlay.
As a point of clarification, you said that the percentage of male and female recruitment was equal, yet the composition of the forces is clearly not equal between males and females. Could you clarify that point, please?
5:30 p.m.
As an Individual
Dr. Madeleine Nicole Maillette
No, it's obviously.... Recruitment by the individual—male versus female—is absolutely not equal. I think I was answering that the education level—male and female—is equal.
5:35 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal John McKay
Thank you for that clarification.
Madam Lambropoulos, you have the final four minutes.
5:35 p.m.
Liberal
Emmanuella Lambropoulos Liberal Saint-Laurent, QC
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I don't think I'll be taking up the entire four minutes.
Something that stuck out to me in Ms. Lane's testimony was the fact that.... We spoke about family benefits and the fact that the CAF doesn't necessarily take into account when someone has a family that many Canadian families now have two incomes and not just one, either by choice or by necessity. What changes would you make to the benefits that are there for families?
You also mentioned something that struck me a little, which was that people who don't have families and are in the CAF may not see changes to the way the benefits benefit families in a great way. What do you think would make it fair for those who don't have families? What kinds of benefits do you think are necessary or important to include?
5:35 p.m.
Defence Scientist, Centre for Operational Research and Analysis, Defence Research and Development Canada, As an Individual
Strictly in the context of my own personal opinion as a researcher and spouse, and not as a DND employee, I think one thing that could dramatically change the way that dual spouses are able to handle military life—as well as increase recruitment from ethnic minorities and new Canadians—would be to reinstate having CAF establishments in our major cities, the way that we did prior to a variety of base closures in I believe the 1990s. The places where people live in Canada—especially young people, non-white people, new Canadians and tech people—are not necessarily where we have our main military installations, so there's a disconnect there. If you're an ambitious young person in a couple and you want to join the military, it's very hard to uproot your entire life and go and live in a small town in a different province, in a rural community that you've never experienced. That would solve two birds with one stone.
In terms of the fairness question, I think almost every policy that is family friendly can be made “individual friendly” as well in terms of having the flexibility to take leave, for example, whether you need to care for a newborn child, you want to take a master's degree or you have elder care responsibilities. Every Canadian and every CAF member has something in their lives that they could use a bit of institutional flexibility with. Currently we have policies that are designed for families, obviously, because that's a main concern, but to be able to involve people who don't necessarily have what we think of as a traditional family—to extend those leave options, for example, to parents or siblings or loved ones in different contexts—would be one way of making policies feel a little more fair, I think.
Nobody really wants to have a lot of sympathy for the single person who doesn't have kids and who's grumbling about taking the weekends so that their partner's colleagues can.... The reality is that more and more people are choosing to be child free or to live in relationships that don't look quite like traditional marriages, and we have to value their contributions as well and take their concerns seriously. There is some room there for improvement, I think.
5:35 p.m.
Liberal
Emmanuella Lambropoulos Liberal Saint-Laurent, QC
Thank you very much.
I'll cede the rest of my time, Mr. Chair.