Official Languages Committee on Dec. 7th, 2010

[Jean-Yves Laforest, Bloc, Saint-Maurice—Champlain, QC]

I would like to ask a very brief question. Mr. Portelance and Mr. Sabourin, earlier you mentioned that there was a very small francophone population pool in the Windsor region, for example, which caused problems in recruiting bilingual officers to the Canada Border Services Agency.

Does that mean that most people who provide bilingual services are francophone and that few anglophones do it or can do it?

[Luc Portelance]

I would find it hard to answer your question very specifically.

[Camille Therriault-Power]

Those officers meet the requirements of the position's linguistic profile, which is level BBB. So they have some second-language skills, which entitles them to the bilingualism bonus.

[Luc Portelance]

I don't have the statistics as to whether they are francophone or anglophone. However, I do know the number of people who meet profile requirements.

[Jean-Yves Laforest, Bloc, Saint-Maurice—Champlain, QC]

You say you're having difficulty finding bilingual officers because there are few francophones in a given area. So that suggests that more bilingual officers are francophone.

[Luc Portelance]

Although I don't have the figures, I'm going to give you an example. Of approximately 1,700 bilingual officers, there are 1,000 in Quebec. Without knowing exactly who those people are, I would say that, among those 1,700 officers, there are more bilingual francophones than bilingual anglophones. However, I don't have the available data.

[Jean-Yves Laforest, Bloc, Saint-Maurice—Champlain, QC]

Thank you.

[Richard Nadeau, Bloc, Gatineau, QC]

You're very cautious, Mr. Portelance. I understand the situation. You try to draw more on the communities, Fort Erie, Windsor, Pointe-aux-Roches and the francophone areas of southern Ontario because the people in those communities are francophones first, and we conclude from that fact that they respect their second official language. That's why you want to recruit them.

Personally, there's an aspect that I find very important, and that's the relationship with the supervisors. Fifty-two percent of your employees feel comfortable speaking to their supervisor in their first language. Exactly what are they afraid of? Someone's going to snub them if they speak French? Have you looked into that aspect?

[Luc Portelance]

The first action under our action plan is to look into things. I believe the data that were available for the commissioner's exercise are based solely on the public service employee survey. However, we have to try to demystify this: not to be comfortable doing it as opposed to the ability to do it.

We've already identified... Our executive committee's bilingualism qualifications are very high.

[Richard Nadeau, Bloc, Gatineau, QC]

You understand that he's the boss in the field.

[Luc Portelance]

Absolutely. In the field, it's like at our headquarters: there are two aspects. First, there is the aspect of knowing whether people meet the linguistic profile. Does the supervisor have the linguistic profile? I believe that, for the majority, we're nevertheless quite well off in that regard.

We intend to do some digging, and to conduct an internal survey, to learn more about the question you asked: why do employees not feel comfortable? That's a little harder to assess. It can be a supervisor, a sector, a—

[Richard Nadeau, Bloc, Gatineau, QC]

I'm going to give you another clue, because I must not have a lot of time left, and that's the issue of writing. That's 56%; so it's in the same range. People write in English because their supervisor won't understand if I write to him in French. You should also know what the situation is in that regard, particularly since federal employees have a right to write in their first language.

[Luc Portelance]

Mr. Chairman, this question is a leadership issue. As to whether CBSA employees feel they can't write to the president in the language of their choice, that's false. It's the same thing for my executive committee and my directors general, and so on.

[Richard Nadeau, Bloc, Gatineau, QC]

He's not the boss in the field.

[Luc Portelance]

Absolutely. The answer to your question is that I realize that it's at the basic level; it's the first level; it's the second level. The action plan for using the employee's language of choice will address those first levels in order to demystify that, to deconstruct the myth relative to the reality.

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

Thank you very much.

Thank you, Mr. Nadeau.

I'll now turn it over to Mr. Lauzon.

[Guy Lauzon, Conservative, Stormont—Dundas—South Glengarry, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Thanks as well to the witnesses for being here this morning.

You definitely have some challenges to address at your agency, but I believe you're also having some success.

Do you think you have enough financial and human resources to meet your challenges?

[Luc Portelance]

I believe so. I have no reason to believe the contrary. We have a training budget. We're already spending about $2 million a year. The exercise we conducted this year consisted in examining our entire training budget. So I'll have the opportunity to reassess the matter to determine whether we have to invest more.

Mr. Sabourin will discuss a number of initiatives specific to operations which are more management matters. Recruitment is recruitment, and the costs are constant.

My answer to your question is yes. We'll see about training.

[Guy Lauzon, Conservative, Stormont—Dundas—South Glengarry, ON]

In the past two years, I've lived near the border in Cornwall, where there are major challenges, but not necessarily with regard to official languages. Over those past 18 months, I have received no complaints from travellers concerning official languages. However, there have been complaints 100 km west of Cornwall.

Could you explain that to us? Do you have any complaints from Cornwall? I didn't hear that you had any.

[Luc Portelance]

I don't personally remember receiving any complaints from Cornwall.

[Guy Lauzon, Conservative, Stormont—Dundas—South Glengarry, ON]

In fact, I'm in close contact with them.

Can you explain to us the difference between the two borders, since they are approximately 100 km from one another.

[Luc Portelance]

That's a good question. Where we have the most challenges—we could say that this is a problem—is at Lansdowne: it starts there. In fact, we don't have any problems at Prescott or Cornwall. It has to be said that Prescott, Cornwall and Lansdowne are designated bilingual crossings. Except that Prescott and Cornwall are in bilingual regions, and employees can work in the language of their choice, whereas Lansdowne is not in a bilingual region.

[Guy Lauzon, Conservative, Stormont—Dundas—South Glengarry, ON]

Would there perhaps be the option of transferring those employees, for doing exchanges? Because for six weeks, they transferred—

[Luc Portelance]

Historically in our recruitment process, the agency has recruited locally. That means that Border Services Agency officers who work in Cornwall mostly come from Cornwall, Prescott and so on. We don't have a big mobility budget. People aren't usually that interested in moving.

[Guy Lauzon, Conservative, Stormont—Dundas—South Glengarry, ON]

I'm going to ask my next question in English.

On page 19 of his report, the commissioner highlighted the wonderful experience of Regan Flowers. Said Mrs. Flowers, a Canada Border Services employee, on July 9, 2010: “They gave me this job because I firmly believe that official bilingualism forms part of who we are. It was also because I'm enthusiastic and...my French is far from being perfect”. Again, I would like to congratulate your agency on this great achievement.

This came from the commissioner. How come that employee was so encouraged? Do you encourage all your employees in the same way?