Official Languages Committee on Nov. 25th, 2013

[The Chair, Conservative, Michael Chong]

Welcome to the fifth meeting of the Standing Committee on Official Languages. Today is Monday, November 25, 2013. We are here pursuant to Standing Order 108 and the motion adopted on Monday, November 18, 2013, study of second official language immersion programs in Canada.

Today we welcome representatives from two groups: the Association des universités de la francophonie canadienne and the Peel District School Board.

We will start with Mrs. Lalonde, from the Association des universités de la francophonie canadienne.

[Jocelyne Lalonde, Director General, Association des universités de la francophonie canadienne]

Good afternoon, Mr. Chair, distinguished members of the committee, and the partners who are here with us. On behalf of the board of directors of the Association des universités de la francophonie canadienne, and on my personal behalf, I thank you for your invitation. It will be a pleasure for me to share with you the AUFC's information, comments and recommendations on second official language immersion programs in Canada.

Though many of you already know the Association des universités de la francophonie canadienne, allow me to begin by giving you a short overview of the association and its contribution to the development of French-speaking Canada and of linguistic diversity. Then I will share some information about today's topic and the important role that the AUFC and its members play in this area. I will conclude with some recommendations.

The AUFC represents 14 French-speaking or bilingual universities of all sizes, located in seven provinces outside Quebec. The programs offered by those institutions enhance the quality and scope of university learning, teaching and research in French, thereby contributing to the development of French-speaking communities in Canada. The AUFC is therefore committed to playing a role in Canada's human, cultural and economic development through the quality and accessible university training it offers across the country.

With their primary function as intellectual nerve centres for post-secondary education in French outside Quebec, our universities also play a key role in the promotion of official languages in Canada. This dual role sets us apart from the francophone universities in Quebec and allows our students to enjoy a unique French-speaking experience in our communities.

The association's programming is funded in large part by Canadian Heritage and by the dues paid by our members. This year and last, the association was also able to count on funding from Canadian Heritage for some immersion projects. One such program was to provide 25 immersion scholarships, each of $5,000, to the best graduates from immersion high schools registered in one of the AUFC's member universities.

This year as well, the department is funding a project conducted in conjunction with l'Association canadienne des professeurs d'immersion. One of the things that this funding will allow us to do is to complete a study of the needs of immersion students enrolled in our member institutions. This will identify and suggest support and assistance services that could be put in place in order to provide a better welcome and orientation for immersion students arriving from high school.

I now move on to the subject that brings us together today, the study of immersion programs in Canada.

We estimate that around 5 million of Canada's 34 million inhabitants speak both official languages. Currently, around 340,000 students are enrolled in elementary and secondary immersion programs. Those students represent a critical mass to be recruited by and educated in our French-speaking or bilingual universities. The institutions that are members of the AUFC are addressing that recruitment already because more than 5,500 of their students come from immersion out of the 24,000 or so students enrolled in undergraduate programs offered in French or bilingually.

This critical mass of students is very important because it is becoming imperative to create a bilingual workforce at a time when Canada is playing a greater and greater role in the national and international economy. We are therefore very proud to be able to say that, each year, around 6,000 highly qualified, bilingual students receive degrees from our member universities.

The international forum on immersion at the university level that was held in February 2012 identified the challenges facing bilingual university teaching programs and the extra effort required by students enrolled in second language programs. To meet those challenges, universities must put in place orientation programs and special services in order to provide a cultural and social context that will allow the students to continue their immersion experience outside of their campus and during their internships.

I must also say that the move from a high school immersion program to a university immersion program creates a lot of insecurity for the students. They now find themselves in class with francophone students, whereas they were used to being with their anglophone peers in high school. So students may decide not to continue with French-language or immersion studies at university, very often because they are not sure about the quality and the breadth of programs offered in French-speaking universities outside Quebec.

In that context, Statistics Canada notes that bilingualism rates reach their peak with the 15 to 19-year-old age group, at the end of high school; the rate dwindles after that. In 2001, for example, 14.7% of young anglophones in that age group were bilingual. In 2006, just five years later, only 12.2% of the same age group, now aged 20 to 24, identified themselves as bilingual. The knowledge of French as a second language therefore seems to decline with time if it is not supported by a post-secondary experience. However, that experience is available all across the country.

That statistic underlines the importance of more promotion of post-secondary programs offered in French all across Canada, as well as of establishing the infrastructure required to encourage students to continue post-secondary studies in immersion or in French in order to allow their bilingualism to take root.

Here are our recommendations for improving the current situation of bilingualism and second official language learning programs.

First, we would like your committee to recommend in its report that the Government of Canada support the creation of a promotion, awareness and information campaign to inform Canadians, including new Canadians, about the existence of a continuum of French-language education, from elementary to post-secondary. As a result, Canadians would be able to choose a French immersion school, or first-language French school, safe in the knowledge that they would be able to continue their studies in the language up to post-secondary level.

Second, in order to improve existing second official language learning programs, we feel that it is essential to increase collaboration and partnerships between provincial, territorial and federal government authorities on the one hand and, on the other, national organizations that are concerned about bilingualism and that have a scope and a presence in communities across the country. We are thinking here about the AUFC, Canadian Parents for French, the Canadian Association of Second Language Teachers, and so on. With the help of the federal government, the AUFC is offering to work together with the Council of Ministers of Education, Canada to strengthen the ties between the various stakeholders.

Finally, we hope that the new Protocol for Agreements for Minority-Language Education and Second-Language Instruction will lead to an improvement in federal government support for second-language teaching at post-secondary level in Canada. In this context, we would like your committee to recommend that the federal government increase funding for strengthening the capacity and infrastructures of small francophone universities outside Quebec. The result would be improved access to their immersion programs, which would also be better maintained and developed.

Once again, I thank you for inviting me today. I will be pleased to answer your questions.

[The Chair, Conservative, Michael Chong]

Thank you, Mrs. Lalonde.

Our second group in front of us today is represented by Mr. Shawn Moynihan, superintendent of curriculum and instruction support services, as well as Mr. Moreash, associate director of instructional support services. Welcome to you both. Now we'll have an opening statement from the Peel District School Board.

[Shawn Moynihan, Superintendent, Curriculum and Instruction Support Services., Peel District School Board]

Thank you, Chair.

Good afternoon. On behalf of our director Tony Pontes, and the chair of our board Janet McDougald, we are pleased to accept your invitation to appear before the House Standing Committee on Official Languages.

In the Peel District School Board, we have three very successful French as a second language programs. We have French immersion, abbreviated as FI, which begins in grade 1. We have extended French beginning in grade 7, and core French beginning in grade 4.

As the invitation we received asked us to address French immersion “access, capacity, waiting lists, best practices, and efficiencies”, we will confine our remarks to those aspects of our FI program.

The demand for an FI program has grown at a very rapid pace in our board over the last 10 years. In 2001, 9.4% of all grade 1 students were in FI. By 2011, this percentage increased to approximately 25%. This growth demonstrates our board's commitment to the belief that FI is an option for all students, and the principle that “Participation in FSL programs should reflect the diversity of the student population, including students with special education needs and English language learners.” That's from the ministry document entitled “A Framework for French as a Second Language in Ontario Schools, Kindergarten to Grade 12”, on page 10.

However, the rapid growth of the FI program has caused some stakeholders to express concern about the board's ability to sustain a quality FI program for students. To address this concern about the sustainability of a quality FI program, the Peel District School Board conducted an extensive review in 2011-12 of its elementary FI program.

This review was conducted by a committee and had several components, including an extensive review of the literature. Also, FI parent input was sought through a survey, to which 4,342 families responded. They were asked the following questions: Why did you enrol your child in French immersion? If busing were not provided for French immersion, would you have registered your child in the program? For those parents where French immersion is offered at your home school, would you have registered your child in the program if it had been offered at another school? The survey also asked whether they were planning on having their child continue French immersion in secondary school, and finally we asked if there were any other comments that they would like to share.

Other stakeholders, such as board departments, were asked to provide information as issues emerged. For example, our board is experiencing tremendous enrolment pressures in some areas, and this pressure has impacted space for potential FI programs.

The key finding that emerged from the review was the difficulty in ensuring a quality FI teacher. The review committee defined quality as a teacher who is qualified, fluent, and committed. The review committee found that although principals were finding it very difficult to hire teachers who are qualified to teach French immersion, qualifications alone were not enough to ensure a quality program.

The review committee heard repeatedly from different stakeholders regarding instances where a teacher had the requisite paper qualifications but was not fluent in French. Furthermore, the review committee heard that qualified and fluent teachers sometimes chose to leave the French immersion program to teach in the English program. The review committee heard that although it is very difficult for principals to find French immersion teachers for permanent contract teaching assignments, it is even more problematic for them to find FI teachers for long-term occasional assignments.

Although the Ontario College of Teachers has stated that there is not a shortage of FI teachers, this has not been our experience in Peel.

Early in the 2012-13 school year, the review committee shared its findings and recommendations with the board of trustees. The board of trustees considered the report and recommendations and enacted some changes to the French immersion program. These changes will be revisited by 2017.

First, the grade 1 French immersion program will be capped at the September 2012 level of enrolment, which is roughly 25%. Second, if registrations for FI exceed capacity at a school, then a lottery process would be used. Third, some students would be exempt from a lottery process should it occur.

At this time we would like to share our process for accessing grade 1 French immersion. First, and most importantly, information is provided to parents so that they can make an informed decision about their children's participation in French immersion. Information evenings are held in every French immersion school and at central locations. The board provides informational material in a variety of formats and languages. The board has worked in partnership with Canadian Parents for French to produce two informational videos for parents.

The second major aspect of our process for accessing grade 1 French immersion is that the registration deadline is set well in advance, and this deadline is communicated to parents in a variety of formats and languages.

The next step is that if there are more registered students than there are people spaces at the school, then a lottery is conducted. However, for the 2013-14 school year, only 4 of our 34 grade 1 french immersion schools used a lottery. Therefore, 97.5% of registrants were placed without a lottery.

Lastly, we keep students on wait lists. We continue to monitor them until the end of their first week of school in September. At this time, students on the wait list who cannot be accommodated at their home French immersion school are offered a place in the nearest French immersion school that has space. By the end of our registration process, all families who registered for grade 1 French immersion were offered a place in French immersion either in their home French immersion school or the nearest French immersion school that had space.

We feel that our registration process has been a success. We have ensured a quality program, but we've also been able to offer a place for all who registered for grade 1 French immersion. We are proud of our French immersion program, our students and our staff, and we value all forms of diversity, including linguistic diversity, and we are pleased to provide students with an opportunity to learn, for many, their third language.

Thank you, Chair.

[The Chair, Conservative, Michael Chong]

Thank you very much.

I'll just make one remark before we go to questions and comments from members of the committee for the next hour and 40 minutes. I find it astounding and amazing that one in four grade 1 students in Brampton and Mississauga is in French immersion. I think that's just a real testimony to your expertise as a board in accommodating that rapid growth over the last decade.

So we'll have now about an hour and 40 minutes of questions and comments from various members of the committee, beginning with Monsieur Godin.

[Yvon Godin, NDP, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Welcome to our witnesses.

Mrs. Lalonde, I have some questions for you.

How do we make sure that francophone students and students coming out of immersion programs will continue their studies in French?

[Jocelyne Lalonde]

For immersion students, different factors are at play. From elementary school through high school, immersion students and their parents, who often have an important role to play in decisions on post-secondary education, must be informed about the programs in French and the support for immersion that universities offer. Students are unaware that it is possible to successfully continue their studies in French. Some high school students decide to study at university or college in English because they are afraid that they will not have as much success if they study in French.

You need to know that a number of our universities provide support programs through which the students can get individual help from teachers in correcting texts with a view to increasing their chances of success. At the post-secondary level in French, all kinds of mechanisms can be put in place. But they do not exist in all our universities. Some larger universities such as the University of Ottawa and the Université de Moncton can help people, but other smaller universities would need help to be able to support immersion students.

To answer your question in a nutshell, I will say there is a great need to make the possibilities in French understood and known. Often, students are under the impression that, if they are in immersion from grades 1 to 12, they can get a bilingual job and use French in the job market, but that is not always the case.

[Yvon Godin, NDP, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

Are you talking about the first two years of university?

[Jocelyne Lalonde]

No. I am talking about students who start immersion in the first or second year of elementary school.

[Yvon Godin, NDP, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

You should talk to the Government of New Brunswick.

[Jocelyne Lalonde]

Yes.

[Yvon Godin, NDP, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

In New Brunswick, it used to be from grade 1, but then they changed it to start in grade 5. The people from Peel should listen to this. It was the first time that anglophones took to the streets, in front of the Legislative Assembly Building in Fredericton, to say that they wanted their children to be learning French from grade 1. Finally, the government started it in grade 3.

Could you comment on that, given that you are experts in studies and things like that. Is it not better for children to start immersion at an early age? Is the government doing enough for services in both official languages in a country that is supposed to be bilingual? It should be doing promotion in the universities to tell students that, if they want a job with the Government of Canada, they should be learning both languages. That is what it should be doing, not telling people that they do not need to be bilingual, because judges and all kinds of people appointed to positions are not bilingual either.

This question goes to the people from Peel. What role should the government play in this?

[The Chair, Conservative, Michael Chong]

If Mr. Moynihan or Mr. Moreash could respond to that question from Mr. Godin, he would appreciate that.

[Shawn Moynihan]

If the question is, is it better to start immersion early, then the research is really clear that, yes, the earlier the better, and that's why we start our immersion program in grade 1.

[Scott Moreash, Associate Director, Instructional Support Services, Peel District School Board]

Certainly, because we start in grade 1, we've seen, as Mr. Moynihan pointed out earlier, an increase over the last 10 years in interest in early immersion programs, to the point where, as the chair stated, we have one in four of our grade 1 students opting into a French immersion program beginning in grade 1.

[Yvon Godin, NDP, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

It is said that federal government positions should be bilingual so that Canadians can be provided services in both official languages. Mrs. Lalonde, do you feel that the government is doing enough promotion in the universities to make sure that students understand that it would be good for them to learn the other language? There have to be programs to encourage them along those lines from an early age. You mentioned universities like Moncton and Ottawa, but other universities are poorer.

[Jocelyne Lalonde]

When people thought about immersion, they thought mostly about elementary and high school education. There was very little mention of the post-secondary level. I think that is starting to happen. Work in awareness and promotion must continue. Students must be told that they must be in immersion throughout their education. Studies clearly show that, if students do not continue their education in French into post-secondary level, their ability to use both languages decreases a lot.

If we want our investments in immersion education and training at elementary and high school to bear fruit and if we want our workforce to be bilingual, we have to continue the investment into the post-secondary level.

[The Chair, Conservative, Michael Chong]

Thank you, Mrs. Lalonde.

Thank you, Mr. Godin.

Over to you, Mr. Gourde.

[Jacques Gourde, Conservative, Lotbinière—Chutes-de-la-Chaudière, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

My thanks to the witnesses for being part of our meeting today.

My first question goes to Mrs. Lalonde. I am going to continue along the same lines.

We all agree that, if anglophones can continue into post-secondary studies in French, they will be more competent. But what tools can we offer them? Sooner or later, they will leave school, and if they end up in an anglophone environment for seven or eight years with no chance to use their French, I feel that they will be back to square one.

[Jocelyne Lalonde]

First, they have to get post-secondary training that they can rely on in their jobs. If they take post-secondary education in English, they will still have their French vocabulary. They will have a base of education in French, and that is very important. If they want to continue to study French, they have that choice. They have to use their French and continue with language training, if they feel it is necessary. At that point, it becomes their responsibility.

[Jacques Gourde, Conservative, Lotbinière—Chutes-de-la-Chaudière, QC]

You said that bilingual students in Canada have an advantage when they reach the job market, not just nationally, but also internationally.

Can you give us some more details about this international dimension?

[Jocelyne Lalonde]

Given the agreement that Canada has just signed with the countries of Europe, I feel that our bilingual workforce will increasingly be an asset for Canada. We can do business internationally with a number of countries in the Francophonie.

In another context, international students come to study in our universities and, in many cases, we want them to stay in Canada as economic immigrants. They are often viewed positively by the government as potential Canadian citizens who will participate in Canada’s economic life. That is a way in which we increase our bilingual workforce.

[Jacques Gourde, Conservative, Lotbinière—Chutes-de-la-Chaudière, QC]

In trade and economics, interpersonal relations are really very important internationally.

Are there other countries in the world, apart from those in Europe, that provide those advantages?

[Jocelyne Lalonde]

There are all the African countries we work with, the countries of the Maghreb. I think there are a number of regions in the world where French is spoken and used for trade.

[Jacques Gourde, Conservative, Lotbinière—Chutes-de-la-Chaudière, QC]

In the eyes of Europe and those other countries, does the fact that we are bilingual make Canada a sort of gateway that allows them to do business with North America?