Evidence of meeting #43 for Official Languages in the 42nd Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was departments.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Liberal
Darrell Samson Liberal Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS
Thank you. I will accept any invitation that is offered.
Thank you very much for being here. I greatly appreciate your presence today in helping us to better understand what is happening on the ground.
I would like to ask you some questions about matters that affect me greatly.
First, what changes has your department made in the last year and three months? Have you received any guidelines from the new government? Is anything different happening?
Director, Policy and Legislation, Treasury Board Secretariat
Actually, there is a clear commitment from the government to fully comply with the Official Languages Act. That commitment is found in the public mandate letters of the Minister of Canadian Heritage and the President of the Treasury Board, who share that responsibility.
If you are asking me for an idea of how that commitment is being made into reality, I have to tell you that, last November 17, an announcement was made about reviewing the Official Languages Regulations. We are fully committed to complete that review and to communicate with key stakeholders. That is the concrete result of action being taken since 2015.
Liberal
Darrell Samson Liberal Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS
Thank you. I am happy that you touched on the matter of the Official Languages Regulations.
I have noticed that reports on plans and priorities and departmental reports do not mention the answers about official languages. There are no indicators on which to base an opinion. Do you think that is acceptable? You are responsible for enforcing the act, but there is no mention of it. It is not likely that a lot is going to happen on the ground, because there is no mention of it.
Assistant Deputy Minister, Governance, Planning and Policy Sector, Treasury Board Secretariat
I am trying to understand your question.
Liberal
Darrell Samson Liberal Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS
I am talking about the reports that are submitted, like reports on plans and priorities, departmental reports or performance reports. Those reports do not deal with the matter of official languages at all. For example, with environment and climate change, there is no reference to official languages.
Director, Policy and Legislation, Treasury Board Secretariat
Some institutions and departments do make mention of it in their reports, such as ours, Canadian Heritage. You will certainly find it in the program activities. There are 200 institutions, and people responsible for official languages in each one of them. There is activity on official languages in each department.
Liberal
Darrell Samson Liberal Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS
If reports are produced with no requirement to deal with the most significant issue in the country, providing Canadians with bilingual services, it seems to me that we are missing the boat. How can you be sure about what you are telling us? You rely on people internally, and I am not saying that they are not doing their job. However, in order to ensure that there is compliance, and to be able to announce that to the public, it seems to me that we should be able to base that on something.
Assistant Deputy Minister, Governance, Planning and Policy Sector, Treasury Board Secretariat
It is the role of the deputy heads to provide that information in full, to provide the reports, so that we have an overall view of the health of the official languages in the public service. It is their role to do so within the confines of a report for a given department and perhaps for a representative of that department. Unfortunately, that does not provide an overview of the situation in general.
The Treasury Board has given us the mandate to take good care of the overall health of the official languages horizontally. We work with the departments to make sure that it is done.
Liberal
Darrell Samson Liberal Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS
However, if the department has no report to submit, it has no need to make a lot of effort. That is my opinion.
Second, do you believe that an external evaluation should be conducted from time to time, at random, in one or two departments? At the Olympic Games, for example, they do random tests to detect drugs. Likewise, we could choose one or two departments per year, in rotation, at random, that would have to answer specific questions as part of their evaluation.
Assistant Deputy Minister, Governance, Planning and Policy Sector, Treasury Board Secretariat
I would say that our process is quite rigorous. In fact, the Commissioner of Official Languages is not part of our department and he closely follows what we do on official languages. I agree with you, but I feel that an external organization does follow what we do.
Liberal
Darrell Samson Liberal Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS
I am pleased to hear you emphasize that, because the Commissioner is doing an outstanding job.
I am more concerned about the connection, or lack thereof, between the report and the action. There is no guarantee that you, the government or the department, are going to implement those measures and move matters forward. Although the report says that the institution must change the way it is doing things, there are no obligations or consequences.
Do you think that’s acceptable? As my colleague Mr. Généreux often says, in the private sector, there’s a review, followed by changes and actions.
I have trouble with all that.
Director, Policy and Legislation, Treasury Board Secretariat
The issue of bilingual meetings was addressed. Thanks to the public service survey, we have a pretty good idea of the situation. The Commissioner has looked into the issue. We have two advisory committees with officials from the departments and crown corporations. We have invited the Office of the Commissioner of Official Languages to share its tools, best practices and approaches with our communities. This co-operation is one of our activities in support of institutions, in addition to the actions we take ourselves.
Liberal
Darrell Samson Liberal Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS
I cannot assess your answer, but I appreciate it, because the Commissioner plays for our team. We really like him.
Liberal
Darrell Samson Liberal Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS
He’s the player who tells us whether the rules are being followed and to what extent. This helps improve the situation.
Liberal
Paul Lefebvre Liberal Sudbury, ON
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I would like to go back to your speaking notes. You clearly stated that, under your leadership, there were policies, support and reviews. We have talked at length about reviews. In terms of policies, you said that you recommended that official languages policies be adopted.
What are the latest official languages policies that you have recommended?
Assistant Deputy Minister, Governance, Planning and Policy Sector, Treasury Board Secretariat
They are the ones currently in place.
Liberal
Assistant Deputy Minister, Governance, Planning and Policy Sector, Treasury Board Secretariat
They were adopted by Treasury Board. We can now apply them. They are applied in all federal institutions.
Liberal
Paul Lefebvre Liberal Sudbury, ON
So there is support and evaluation to determine whether that support exists.
Assistant Deputy Minister, Governance, Planning and Policy Sector, Treasury Board Secretariat
Evaluations indicate how things are going. As to support, that is the work we will be doing with departments and stakeholders to make improvements where there might be some shortcomings.
Liberal
Paul Lefebvre Liberal Sudbury, ON
We have some concerns about evaluations and what is done with them. In the case of self-evaluations, people can say anything.
You talked about successes and challenges. Why are there challenges? What steps are being taken to meet them? Is that measured? Are the challenges measured? Is the way they will be met measured?
