Official Languages Committee on Oct. 31st, 2017

[Dan Vandal, Liberal, Saint Boniface—Saint Vital, MB]

I ask you that because, in Manitoba, the number of people who said their mother tongue was French declined by 2,000. I wonder whether there is a connection that should be made.

[Jean-Pierre Corbeil]

We released the immigration data last Wednesday, on October 25. One of the findings that emerged was a decline in the number of recent French-language immigrants from outside Quebec.

There is also interprovincial mobility. We can see very clearly that the French-language population in Alberta has risen by nearly 6,000 people, which is attributable to both immigration and interprovincial migration, particularly from Quebec.

Several factors may influence changes in populations, including the francophone population of Manitoba.

[Dan Vandal, Liberal, Saint Boniface—Saint Vital, MB]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

Thank you, Mr. Vandal.

You have four minutes, Mr. Généreux.

[Bernard Généreux, Conservative, Montmagny—L'Islet—Kamouraska—Rivière-du-Loup, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Statistics Canada has 5,000 employees. Does the department have suppliers for computer systems, data analysis, and other items of that kind? Is part of the work done outside the department?

[Marc Hamel]

Part of the work may be done by suppliers, but not outside the department. The data never leaves Statistics Canada. The confidentiality of the results and information provided by Canadians is protected at all times.

In fields where we do not have expertise, such as cutting-edge information technologies, suppliers may work with us to develop systems.

[Bernard Généreux, Conservative, Montmagny—L'Islet—Kamouraska—Rivière-du-Loup, QC]

Could a subcontractor have been directly or indirectly involved in the error that just occurred?

[Marc Hamel]

Not in this case. I do not believe so.

[Bernard Généreux, Conservative, Montmagny—L'Islet—Kamouraska—Rivière-du-Loup, QC]

Are you certain of that?

[Marc Hamel]

These are systems that were developed or modified at Statistics Canada. A system may have been purchased from a supplier at some point, but the source code is taken over by Statistics Canada. We are the ones who make the adjustments.

[Bernard Généreux, Conservative, Montmagny—L'Islet—Kamouraska—Rivière-du-Loup, QC]

From what I understand, you do part of the work associated with the systems created for you, and you assign another part to subcontractors. Have any errors ever been attributable to outside suppliers who were involved in your work?

I am going to draw a parallel here between this and the Phoenix system. We know there is a major problem with that software. Could the same thing happen at Statistics Canada?

[Marc Hamel]

I cannot recall any cases where errors were attributable to suppliers with whom we did business.

As you may remember, some of our data processing systems were supplied by Lockheed Martin in 2006. Since then, we have taken over control of those systems. Some of our processing systems are the same as those purchased in 2006, but outside suppliers no longer work on them.

[Bernard Généreux, Conservative, Montmagny—L'Islet—Kamouraska—Rivière-du-Loup, QC]

This is 2017. Do you think the instruments you have at your disposal today are up to date and ready to meet your needs? I ask you the question in an entirely non-partisan manner.

[Marc Hamel]

Absolutely. I can also tell you that we apply the same discipline in reviewing data, whether the systems were designed in or outside the department, to ensure they can do what they are supposed to do.

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

Thank you very much.

Please go ahead, Mr. Choquette.

[François Choquette, NDP, Drummond, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

If memory serves me, you began talking about changing the mother tongue question in 2011.

[Jean-Pierre Corbeil]

No. All I said was that, in 2011, the questions on the long form concerning the language spoken at home and knowledge of official languages migrated to the short form as a result of legal obligations arising from implementation of the regulations.

[François Choquette, NDP, Drummond, QC]

Was a change not made to the calculation?

[Jean-Pierre Corbeil]

No, not at all. We proceed in exactly the same way as we have for a very long time.

[François Choquette, NDP, Drummond, QC]

Why did you say earlier that we could no longer compare the new data with the historical data? Do you understand what I mean?

[Jean-Pierre Corbeil]

Yes.

You have to understand that the order in which we place the questions in the context in which they are asked may have an impact on the answers given. In 2006, for example, the questions on language followed all of those on ethnocultural diversity, that is to say on immigrant status, citizenship, and so on. In 2011, the language questions migrated to the short form, as a result of which no questions on ethnocultural diversity preceded the language questions. That may have led people to respond differently.

Previously, when the mother tongue question was asked in isolation on the short form, we underestimated the unofficial languages in Canada by approximately 20%. However, when we put the mother tongue question at the very end of the questionnaire, people understood what we wanted to know, which was the first language learned at home as a child.

[François Choquette, NDP, Drummond, QC]

So you improved the situation.

[Jean-Pierre Corbeil]

Yes, we improved the situation starting in 1991. That resulted in a significant decline in the number of people who declared several languages as their mother tongue. People were in a better position to understand that, in addition to asking them to state the languages they knew, we were trying to determine which one was the first language they had learned at home as a child. This did not prevent us from receiving multiple answers, but that number declined significantly.

[François Choquette, NDP, Drummond, QC]

Was that process developed in consultation with QCGN and the FCFA?

[Jean-Pierre Corbeil]

QCGN did not exist at the time. That was in 1991.