Official Languages Committee on Oct. 8th, 2024

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

First we need to determine whether the amendment is an integral part of Mr. Godin's motion or not.

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

Okay.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

An amendment has been moved, so we have to follow procedure.

I'll go around the table. Is everyone in favour of Mr. Beaulieu's proposed amendment? Raise your hand, please.

On the monitor, I see that Mr. Boulerice is in favour.

[Lucie Lecomte, Committee Researcher]

We have two NDP members.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Oh, I didn't see him.

[Lucie Lecomte]

I didn't see Mr. Julian.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Sorry, Mr. Boulerice. At the moment, Mr. Julian represents the NDP.

[Peter Julian, NDP, New Westminster—Burnaby, BC]

No, I'll yield to Mr. Boulerice, Mr. Chair.

That was nice. Thank you. We'll see each other in the House in a bit.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Mr. Boulerice, you have the hot potato.

I'm sorry, Mr. Boulerice. You're in favour of Mr. Beaulieu's amendment, and so is everyone else around the table.

(Amendment agreed to)

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Let's move on to the motion as amended. Are there any questions or comments?

Mr. Samson, go ahead.

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

Mr. Chair, I've expressed my opinion about this in the media. I believe the Governor General should be able to speak both of the country's official languages. That has always been, is and always will be my opinion. In addition, I've stated publicly, and I stand by this, that I was disappointed that the Governor General, who, as the motion points out, made it clear she would make every possible effort to learn French, did not achieve the level of proficiency she hoped to achieve. She herself has recognized this. I'm just echoing what she said. I'm sure you can understand my position.

That said, I will vote against the motion because it's just a political tactic designed to waste the committee's precious time. We all know this Parliament will end by October 20, 2025, at the latest. We have an extremely important study to do between now and then. It's historic. As I clearly explained this morning—or at least it was clear in my head—as proud as I am of section 23 of the Charter, I have to recognize that it was a major achievement for the government of the day, the government of Pierre Elliott Trudeau. I also want to recognize the incredible work done by the minister responsible for this file, Jean Chrétien, who was the key player in the section 23 negotiations on education. He did an amazing job of negotiating to convince the provinces and territories to agree to it. That was huge.

I can hear some of my colleagues saying I'm obstructing the process, but that's not true at all. I'm just explaining why I'm going to vote against the motion. As soon as I'm done, we can vote. I know my Liberal colleague would like to talk about it, but I'm fine with it.

I just want to explain and recognize that section 23 and now Bill C‑13 are amazing tools to make positive change for Canada's francophonie. However, I don't want to waste one second of the essential work we need to do here and in the House, and this motion is a tactic to get in the way of that work.

For those two reasons, I will be voting against the motion put forward by my colleague, of whom I'm very fond.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Mr. Lightbound, go ahead.

[Joël Lightbound, Liberal, Louis-Hébert, QC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

I'll start by saying that I'm glad to be participating in this committee for the first time, but Mr. Samson is a tough act to follow. He set the bar high. I'll echo what he said.

First of all, it's inconceivable to me that the Governor General still doesn't speak French after three years. I definitely think the appointment was regrettable. A Governor General must speak both official languages at the very least. I don't know if I've said that publicly before, but there you have it. I truly believe that.

Now, as to the function of the Governor General, I may not be quite as attached to that as my Conservative colleagues, who would undoubtedly rename this committee the “Royal Committee on Official Languages” if they could. I myself no longer subscribe to Mr. Beaulieu's school of thought. In fact, I voted with the Bloc Québécois—as did you, Mr. Chair—to cut ties with the monarchy so we no longer have to swear an oath to the king. I don't see the Governor General as having a very important role, but I do understand the symbolic importance. In essence, that's why I share Mr. Samson's sentiments about the fact that the Governor General doesn't speak French, as expressed in the motion before us.

Nevertheless, I will vote against the motion because we just heard from witnesses who told us that only 20% of rights holders in Canada have access to early learning services in French. They also told us that, when francophones don't have access to early learning services and child care in French, that alters their entire linguistic trajectory for the rest of their lives. The stats are clear. We're talking thousands of children across Canada. The committee can bring this situation to the fore and make recommendations to the government. Instead of focusing on that, some people want to dedicate no fewer than five meetings to talking about the Governor General's French.

I think the fact that the francophone population is losing thousands of Canadian children a year because they don't have access to early learning services in French is far more important than Mary Simon's language.

That's why I'll be voting against the motion.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Thank you, Mr. Lightbound.

I see you, Mr. Boulerice, but I'll go to Mr. Beaulieu first.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

I think those are just excuses. Everyone says they're against the appointment. If people are against the appointment, I think they need to walk the talk.

I think this study would give us a chance to examine the mechanisms that led to this situation. This is a symptom of a bigger problem. That's what Mr. Godin said earlier, and there are all kinds of examples. Even the Supreme Court refuses to translate many of its rulings into French.

There's no date specified in this motion. You can't say it'll delay the study on the French education continuum. That will depend on when we decide to do it.

I see no reason not to support this motion.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Thank you.

Mr. Godin, go ahead.

[Joël Godin, Conservative, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

Folks on the other side of the room suspect we're trying to waste time.

Mr. Chair, it's important to understand that our purpose as parliamentarians is to do our job. As politicians, we're always going to be doing politics.

That said, no matter what we do from this point on, the Liberal government will always accuse us of trying to waste time and playing politics. All the members over there, or at least most of them, have said they weren't in favour of the Governor General that their Prime Minister, their government, appointed. I think it's important for us to study that appointment so we can understand what happened and fix the process for future appointments. We need to have a vision.

As my colleague, Mr. Beaulieu, said, we won't be taking this time away from the study on the education continuum, which just started today, because there's no date in the motion. We have to approach this with the right intention.

I like the folks over there well enough outside of our parliamentary debates, but, unfortunately, I find this attitude on the part of the government and its representatives unacceptable. They agree with the motion, but they won't support it. That's not logical.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Thank you, Mr. Godin.

Mr. Boulerice, go ahead.

[Alexandre Boulerice, NDP, Rosemont—La Petite-Patrie, QC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

I found the Bloc and Conservative members' position really appalling.They're doggedly pursuing this and wasting the committee's time. I don't agree with Mr. Godin. The Conservatives are wasting the House of Commons' time in general. Parliament is at a standstill right now, but they want a debate about one single person, one individual.

I agree that Canada's Governors General should speak both official languages, which means they should speak French. I don't agree with having Governors General at all, because I'm not in favour of the monarchy, but that's another debate.

Allocating five of the Standing Committee on Official Languages' meetings to talking about one person is nonsensical. Witnesses just told us that they need more early learning and child care in French, that they need more funding for community groups and more resources for the francophonie across the country, but the Conservatives are using the committee's time to talk about one person, one individual.

I personally refuse to be part of this farce, because it's sad. I'll let the Bloc and the Conservative Party play their little political games. Obviously, I'll vote against the motion.

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

Mr. Chair, I would ask for a vote.

[Joël Godin, Conservative, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

Mr. Chair, I can't stay. My schedule is packed, and I have to go to the Confederation Building at 1 p.m.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

I'm going to use the same technique I used last winter. I'm going to adjourn the meeting instead of suspending it.

Everyone, please note that Mr. Samson asked for a vote. On Thursday morning, I'm going to pick up where we left off even though the meeting was adjourned. Otherwise, it's too complicated.

I'm therefore adjourning the meeting, but, on Thursday morning, we're going to resume debate as though the meeting had been suspended.

Meeting adjourned.