Official Languages Committee on Nov. 21st, 2024

[Yvon Laberge]

With regard to early childhood education, I repeat that all our college programs are offered remotely. So space is not a problem.

In terms of our capacity to take in more students, we could easily double the number of enrolments, which wouldn't be too much, because we could add a few educators to train students.

As to our operating budget, next year we could easily use an additional $1 million in core funding. That would allow us to consolidate our activities.

Finally, in terms of infrastructure, we have a number of projects under way, including a very technical program that we want to deliver in Victoria. For this one, we would need about $2.5 million.

[Marc Serré, Liberal, Nickel Belt, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Laberge.

Ms. Maisonneuve, thank you for the work you do in the early childhood field and at the Conseil scolaire du Nord‑Ouest. I myself was a school board trustee in northern Ontario, so I understand the challenges associated with large geographic areas, the shortage of teachers and funding based on the number of students, which penalizes you.

I would also like to hear what you have to say about training early childhood educators. What is your capacity? What are your challenges? How can the federal government help you to have more teachers and more francophone students in early childhood centres?

[Sylvianne Maisonneuve]

This is not directly related to your question, but I will start by mentioning a challenge we have regarding space. We can access complementary federal funding for infrastructure projects, which is fantastic for new construction. However, communication between the two levels of government is choppy and their announcements are not always made at the same time. In addition, when it comes to existing buildings, nothing can be changed or added, because funds are only granted for new construction.

As for training educators, I will let Ms. Kropielnicki answer your question.

[Brigitte Kropielnicki]

Our biggest challenge, when it comes to recruitment, is tuition. Most of our educators are mothers who want to take the training, but don't necessarily have the means to do so. So, at the moment, the school board subsidizes some of our educators with funding from the official languages in education program, but it's not enough.

[Marc Serré, Liberal, Nickel Belt, ON]

Thank you.

Ms. Maisonneuve, can you send the committee more details and examples on the challenges you face? For example, you mentioned twice the lack of coordination between the provinces and the federal government when it comes to funding. If you could provide that in writing to the committee, it would be greatly appreciated.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Thank you, Mr. Serré.

Mr. Beaulieu, you have the floor for two and a half minutes.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Mr. Laberge, you said earlier that you weren't able to provide services, that you weren't able to meet the demand from high school graduates in British Columbia. Can you expand on that?

[Yvon Laberge]

Yes.

One of the challenges is attracting young people to our institutions, because we only have six college‑level programs. So we are responding to a limited need in that regard. We would like to offer more programs.

I mentioned earlier an infrastructure project that we would like to get going in Victoria. The idea would be to jointly offer a sound technology program with the Collège d'Alma. This project requires building a studio and acquiring equipment for students, and it would attract a new demographic. The majority of our students right now are female, but we would like to attract more male students. The school board has expressed its intent to make such a request.

The other thing is that we've created a partnership with the Conseil scolaire francophone de la Colombie-Britannique to offer dual credit programs, like they do Alberta. That initiative is starting to take shape.

We have also started offering courses towards the dogwood diploma for adults, in conjunction with the Conseil scolaire francophone de la Colombie-Britannique. The dogwood diploma is granted to adults who have taken grade 12 equivalency courses. Students would like to attend college, but they have to finish high school before they can come to our programs.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

When we look at the overall situation, the fact that there is no public college and the fact that the provincial government stubbornly refuses to grant you the status of public college is scandalous, in my opinion. Shouldn't there be a campaign to denounce this fact?

We could take a look at that, because it doesn't make sense.

[Yvon Laberge]

Indeed.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Please answer in 10 seconds, Mr. Laberge.

[Yvon Laberge]

I think I'll use those 10 seconds later.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

It could be a long answer, is that it? Two and a half minutes go by quickly.

Thank you very much, Mr. Laberge.

Madam Dance, the floor is yours for two and a half minutes.

[Leila Dance, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

Thank you.

I would like to go back to the labour shortage they're seeing in specifically northern Alberta. I'm sure it's exactly what is happening across the country in many remote or rural communities, and I'm sure it's being seen in some of the city centres as well. Are we missing teachers at a specific level? Is it at the day care level, or is it in the early or middle years?

As well, do you have any recommendations as to what the government could do very specifically on that, whether it involves helping with tuition, access to courses or those types of specific items?

[Sylvianne Maisonneuve]

I think it's across the board.

I will allow Madam Kropielnicki to answer this question.

[Brigitte Kropielnicki]

Yes, it's across the board. In the past it was mainly high school, but now we're seeing the shortage trickling into elementary. If teachers had a bursary for working in remote areas, the way doctors do, I believe that would probably encourage them to come up north.

I just want to add that right now the biggest challenge we have is that a lot of the students we're getting are from immigration, and they don't want to leave the big cities. A lot of teachers are not working in the big cities but are subbing, and they refuse to come up north. If they had a little incentive money-wise to come up north, they might come.

[Leila Dance, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

That's very interesting. I hadn't even thought about stuff like that.

I have 45 seconds left. Is there anything you don't feel you had a chance to speak to in all the questions you were asked? You can quickly touch on that right now.

[Sylvianne Maisonneuve]

I just want to touch quickly on another problem we have. If we do succeed in attracting labour to our area, there's a housing issue as well. That becomes a bit of a challenge. Some school boards in our area own their own houses and can accommodate their employees, but we don't have the financial capacity to do that.

[Leila Dance, NDP, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

Perfect. Thank you very much.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Thank you, Ms. Dance.

As we have just under two minutes left before the end of the first hour of the meeting, I'm going to take advantage of my privilege as chair to ask questions.

Mr. Laberge, in your presentation, you said that in your opinion, the federal government should make funding envelopes for post‑secondary education permanent. You also stated that the federal government should take action when the provinces shirk their responsibilities. That's my understanding.

When you use the words “in our opinion”, is it because you received a notice to that effect?

[Yvon Laberge]

That's our analysis of the situation. A precedent has been set with the Université de l'Ontario français. In that case, the federal government provided the full amount with the understanding that the provincial government would invest later in the five‑year cycle. I think it's possible to do something like that.

There would have to be a—

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Mr. Laberge, is it possible to send that analysis to the committee? I'm asking the question because it touches on everyone's questions to some extent, and certainly those asked earlier by Mr. Beaulieu.

Can that analysis be made public? I don't want to force your hand, but it's something that committee members could read and take on board as part of our study.

[Yvon Laberge]

I would have to draft it. I have bits and pieces here and there. These are arguments we use in our advocacy strategy with the Department of Canadian Heritage. We only launched this strategy this fall.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Okay. In any case, if you want to submit a brief, feel free to do so and send it to the clerk, who will distribute it to committee members. It's really important.

I have one last question, with 30 seconds left on the clock.

In studies that have been done since I have been a member, witnesses have often described the kind of situation you find yourselves in. Doesn't that encourage the provinces and territories to disengage from the work they have to do? It seems so easy to say that if the provinces don't deliver what they should, the federal government will take care of it. Isn't that really the message that would be sent to the provinces and territories that aren't very disciplined when it comes to official languages?

[Yvon Laberge]

You're absolutely right in that assessment. That's why I said that the federal government would have to look at the possibility of offering some kind of legal recourse. The provinces sign agreements with the federal government for official languages programs in education. If the provinces do not comply with the agreements, there should be some sort of legal recourse.