Official Languages Committee on Feb. 24th, 2026

[The Chair, Liberal, Yvan Baker]

Excuse me. The time is up.

[Joël Godin, Conservative, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

We'll come back to that, Ms. Martin‑Laforge.

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Yvan Baker]

I'll now pass the floor to Madame Chenette.

Ms. Chenette, the floor is yours for six minutes.

[Madeleine Chenette, Liberal, Thérèse-De Blainville, QC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

Thank you very much, Ms. Martin-Laforge and Ms. Sandilands, for being here with us today.

I want to emphasize what you just said on the importance of being fair and respectful of all the minorities in this country. At the same time, we are in a world where Canada needs to leverage the two official languages and the importance of bilingualism, as my colleague was mentioning, which is very important.

I'm listening to you say that it is hard to measure outcomes, and I would agree with that. Knowing that the government is so diversified that it is very hard to put in real outcomes for all to start, I'd like to hear about whether we have the proper data to start with. In order to set outcomes, we need to have data on our minorities for so many topics. At the same time, for the data, we need to identify the gaps, set objectives, put forward the action plan and then bring in the indicators.

When you say that we want indicators, do you think we have sufficient data? Is that what we need to emphasize to get the data of all the minorities in our country? A trade-off that you want to emphasize here is that data will allow us to know where the gaps are and where we need to take proper action.

[Sylvia Martin-Laforge]

The vitality framework that Canadian Heritage has had for years gives us elements, check marks, where we can look at vitality and institutions can look at vitality. For example, for cultural and economic representation in the province, that vitality framework is the basis for what we are working on in Quebec.

From that vitality framework, measures are already there—the number of this, the number of that, the importance of this, the importance of that, how many schools and how many museums. It's not only numeric indicators. You have to look at the outcomes as well.

It's about teasing out from that framework, both for the francophones outside of Quebec and for the English-speaking community in Quebec. I'm not sure this framework will work in Quebec for the majority of francophones in Quebec. I don't know how that's going to work, but if both minority communities are working from a framework, and institutions are looking at that framework, they will be able to tease out measures to see if it's working. They will consult, and we will base ourselves on that framework.

That's where what we've been doing for years has to change in Quebec, because the landscape has changed. How will the federal government and institutions work that into how they treat the English-speaking community in Quebec?

[Madeleine Chenette, Liberal, Thérèse-De Blainville, QC]

Since you were about to share a complaint, an example for us to understand, I'd like to hear what you have to say about that.

[Sylvia Martin-Laforge]

Would you like to answer that question?

[Marion Sandilands, Lawyer, Talking. Advocating. Living in Quebec.]

Are you referring to the complaint?

[Madeleine Chenette, Liberal, Thérèse-De Blainville, QC]

You were about to explain a complaint, and then we paused, so I want to hear the story.

[Marion Sandilands]

Sure. I can read you the script we were going to read.

The complaint that was filed by TALQ to the Commissioner of Official Languages highlights the shortcomings of the application of part VII. This is crystallized in the Canada-Québec Agreement on the Implementation of the Action Plan for Official Languages.

The problems with that agreement, which TALQ was complaining about to the commissioner, are the absence of a documented impact analysis specific to English-speaking Quebeckers in that agreement; the limited consultation with the English-speaking community of Quebec in the creation of that agreement; a lack of binding safeguards in that agreement to ensure benefits to the English-speaking community of Quebec; and, similarly, insufficient transparency in the design of the agreement.

If you look at the agreement, you see it's a transfer of federal money from Canada to Quebec under the rubric of the action plan for official languages, but it does not contain, in TALQ's view, any of the requirements under part VII of the Official Languages Act in terms of transparency and accountability for that money.

[Madeleine Chenette, Liberal, Thérèse-De Blainville, QC]

You said the documented impact was missing, and when I said we needed data, you said we have the framework. Where is the link here?

[Marion Sandilands]

There is no link. The agreement doesn't mention anything about measuring the impacts of federal money on the vitality of the English-speaking community, and that's one of the key pieces of the complaint that was made to the Commissioner of Official Languages.

[Madeleine Chenette, Liberal, Thérèse-De Blainville, QC]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Yvan Baker]

Thank you, Ms. Chenette.

Mr. Beaulieu, you have the floor for six minutes.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Welcome to our guests.

Ms. Martin‑Laforge, in your brief, you say that the concepts aren't defined, and I tend to agree. You say that Quebec is the only province at the intersection of two official minority language dynamics. On the one hand, we're talking about protecting and promoting French as a minority language in Canada, since it's understood that francophones in Quebec are part of the Canadian linguistic minority. On the other hand, we're talking about protecting English-speaking Quebeckers. You say that this asymmetry could lead to an erosion of the vitality of the English-speaking community or undermine the institutional vitality of English-speaking Quebeckers.

What would lead to that outcome?

[Sylvia Martin-Laforge]

As a minority, we don't want to compete with another minority. We recognize the francophone majority in Quebec, and we recognize the francophone minority outside Quebec. The English-speaking community has to find its place within this dynamic. It's not easy to find a place when Quebec has a government that doesn't recognize us as a credible linguistic minority, at least not for the moment.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

That's your position.

I want to quickly get to the heart of this. Basically, do you think Quebec francophones are part of the Canadian linguistic minority?

[Sylvia Martin-Laforge]

Absolutely.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

Should Quebec francophones also be consulted?

[Sylvia Martin-Laforge]

Well, we'll see. The draft regulations don't specify how this will be implemented. If we're worried, it's because there's no clarity. We don't see how this is going to be done under the regulations and part VII.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

It's ambiguous. Would you agree that there should also be positive measures for French in Quebec?

[Sylvia Martin-Laforge]

There are already positive measures for French in Quebec.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

Yes, but it's really minimal: It's money for teaching French.

[Sylvia Martin-Laforge]

I don't know what it is, but I know that the Government of Quebec has implemented measures for the vitality of French in Quebec.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

I'm talking about the federal government.